Trip Report to Kiev

[ambach123]

I believe it was about 1 a.m.

I noticed someone leaning over me, it was M "  I want to talk  to you some more". I am somewhat startled, she was wearing a bath robe.

I get up.

" Let us go to the bedroom ", M says.

She gets into the bed, it was obvious that she had more on her mind than talking.

What we did for the next five or so hours, I have to leave to your imgination. If I described it, the mods would have to censor it.

Suffice to say that we did not talk about the weather.

This was my first taste, literally, of a slavic woman.

I can say that she was gentle, patient, unhurried, and very energetic. She had a body most of us dream about.

It was quite an experience for me, and I have been around.

We went to sleep at about 6 a.m.

[topofthekey]

glad you didn't get bitten by any obvious sharks ambach. So is this a trip report or a Dear Penthouse?

I'm just surprised how fast you all "hooked up" so to speak. I do have my concerns at this point- but hey I'll let you finish up your report here. Hell who am I to judge. Anyways I'm just hoping she was on the up and up.

[Shadow]

Not surprised about the meetings of the agency women, but I am surprised you let them get that far that they ordered dinner.
You might have forgotten the 15 min over coffee tactic. 

Keep it coming.

[IAmZon]

Quiet Key!  123 did not brag or give details.

Two adults with a significant investment in time have expectations.  The behavior was respectful and natural -  anything else would be cause for alarm.

Please continue

[topofthekey]

Quiet Key!  123 did not brag or give details.

Two adults with a significant investment in time have expectations.  The behavior was respectful and natural -  anything else would be cause for alarm.

Please continue

Hey Rivardco, once I heard about the latin discussion I went on over there and I believe I've read some of your posts. That being said I don't think I'll take your word for what is respectful and natural.

... when a guy brings up Dear Penthouse... that isn't an insult. Hopefully this won't turn into a petty argument. But having sex with someone you just met a few hours ago face to face isn't considered the norm by all. That anything else would be cause for alarm statement would go against any couple that has a successful relationship that didn't have sex with each other within the first hours of meeting.

either your just not understanding what i wrote or you are rude. don't know which it is. but i'm entitled to my opinion regardless.

[viking]

I am waiting for M to drop the other shoe. ALthough Ambach is having a good time with her, I think the hook has been set and its time to reel in the catch. She came to Kiev "on her own dime" (personally I have little respect for a man to do this to a woman) so if she does get a little pay back, more power to her.

[ambach123]

The next four days we spent glued to each other, literally.

It was raining most of the time, so we stayed indoors a lot. Kiev has very nice cafes, these are full service cafes which serve complete array of foods. Paris has them too. In USA we have a lot of Starbucks, but not many full serive cafes. In any case we walked around the Independance Square, and visited several of the cafes every day.

I offered M reimbursements for her travels, she refused. When I insisted, she looked at me tersely and said " I am not poor, I can take care of myself". I did not push it any further.
Actually on one of the nights, she treated me to a dinner. It was my impression that her family was well off, and they help her.

One thing I learned, that M was blunt and direct, and nothing is gained from arguing with her.

UW are very caring, at least to those they like. M cared for little things for me, like I would be protected from rain under her umbrella, or that she would watch for the puddles while walking on the street. That my shirt would be ironed. I like hot coffee, she would taste the coffee to make sure it was hot, and send it back if not hot. She almost always shared her food with me. She always touched me, held my hands, and kissed me on the cheeks in public almost all the time.  She cooked breakfast for us everyday.

In private she was even more so, I would leave it at that without more details, except that we took a bath every day, together, where she pampered me. After the bath, she would dry me and then rub some lotion lightly all over.

We discussed a lot of things, M had deep roots in Ukraine with family and friends, and it would appear to me that breaking those ties may be quite difficult.

[topofthekey]

In private she was even more so, I would leave it at that without more details, except that we took a bath every day, together, where she pampered me. After the bath, she would dry me and then rub some lotion lightly all over.

It rubs the lotion on the skin, or else it gets the hose again. 

IDK what to think. Personally I like to shower alone. Hope you found a keeper.

[Faux Pas]

It rubs the lotion on the skin, or else it gets the hose again. 

IDK what to think. Personally I like to shower alone. Hope you found a keeper.

LOL....Hilarious! Thats the line from Silence of the Lambs?

BTW Top....I agree with Rivardco. There is nothing immoral or unhealthy for two grown adults to enjoy each other whom recently met. Nothing to be ashamed of.

[kievstar]

Ambach, not sure if a lot of us know how to react to your post so far.  Glad you seem happy.

[Faux Pas]

Almost forgot....... Ambach Great TP...keep it coming

[topofthekey]

LOL....Hilarious! Thats the line from Silence of the Lambs?

BTW Top....I agree with Rivardco. There is nothing immoral or unhealthy for two grown adults to enjoy each other whom recently met. Nothing to be ashamed of.

yea its buffalo bill. as for the whole deal about when things should get phsyical. I'm not the one to pass any judgement on that... I just wanted to point out for folks reading this forum that its far from the norm as early as they started. I thought Dear Penthouse was a compliment regardless. As for Rivardco he did apologize for telling me to be quiet- so everythings cool.

I'm not comfortable with adult relations so soon in the process if I'm seriously looking for a long term relationship. BUT thats just me. My only point was to throw up the caution flag for anyone reading. I do hope things work out for ambach.

[ambach123]

As I have described, the sexual activity was not initiated by me; though I did not refuse it either.

Sex is a very important part of any relationship.
Whether initial sexual chemistry can last for lifetime, I don't have the answer for that. I do know that if there is no sexual chemistry from the get go, it does not change with time.

So I thought it was positive that M was physically attracted and sexually charged with me. If she did not have any such feelings, I would not have seen any point in continuing.

I have omitted most of details, because that would have made the TR very racy.

In any case, we exchanged gifts.

I gave her a box of American chocolates, and a set of American perfume. She gave me a set of Coffee Cups made of bone China, since she knew I loved coffee.

We both don't smoke, and rarely drink alcohol.

She was to leave on Saturday; time had flown by. Our nights and days of joy were coming to an end.

[Sculpto]

I see only one small potential risk for fast intimacy..

For some women.. while on vacation.. especially with a charming foreigner.. they might take advantage of the moment to physically enjoy themselves, especially when no one they know is present to notice and possibly make a judgement or comment about their behavior.. 

[ambach123]

Sculpto, this meeting took place after months of writing, and cost M a pretty penny. She also refused to accept any money from me.

I am sure M did not take this as a fling.

[Faux Pas]

yea its buffalo bill. as for the whole deal about when things should get phsyical. I'm not the one to pass any judgement on that... I just wanted to point out for folks reading this forum that its far from the norm as early as they started. I thought Dear Penthouse was a compliment regardless. As for Rivardco he did apologize for telling me to be quiet- so everythings cool.

I'm not comfortable with adult relations so soon in the process if I'm seriously looking for a long term relationship. BUT thats just me. My only point was to throw up the caution flag for anyone reading. I do hope things work out for ambach.

It is most certainly a personal preference. Physical intimacy earlier rather than later has both advantages and disadvantages. I wouldn't go so far as to say that it isn't the norm either. After months of phone calls and letter writing sexual energy can and does develop. Acting on that energy earlier after meeting does not cheapen the act or the participants. It is a natural human response for both the man and the woman. I would preface that statement with as long as this is what they both desired and neither was pressured but acted to fulfill both they're needs, it is completely understandable.

I realize on the RWD there will be the sexual liberated that will agree and the more sexually conservative that might disagree and thats okay. But what a man and a woman choose to do with and for each other, wait or not is A-okay with me. It is a matter of preference of two consenting adults.

Ambach, thank you for bring this subject up in your TP
 

[roykirk]

The next four days we spent glued to each other, literally.

It was raining most of the time, so we stayed indoors a lot. Kiev has very nice cafes, these are full service cafes which serve complete array of foods. Paris has them too. In USA we have a lot of Starbucks, but not many full serive cafes. In any case we walked around the Independance Square, and visited several of the cafes every day.

I offered M reimbursements for her travels, she refused. When I insisted, she looked at me tersely and said " I am not poor, I can take care of myself". I did not push it any further.
Actually on one of the nights, she treated me to a dinner. It was my impression that her family was well off, and they help her.

One thing I learned, that M was blunt and direct, and nothing is gained from arguing with her.

UW are very caring, at least to those they like. M cared for little things for me, like I would be protected from rain under her umbrella, or that she would watch for the puddles while walking on the street. That my shirt would be ironed. I like hot coffee, she would taste the coffee to make sure it was hot, and send it back if not hot. She almost always shared her food with me. She always touched me, held my hands, and kissed me on the cheeks in public almost all the time.  She cooked breakfast for us everyday.

In private she was even more so, I would leave it at that without more details, except that we took a bath every day, together, where she pampered me. After the bath, she would dry me and then rub some lotion lightly all over.

We discussed a lot of things, M had deep roots in Ukraine with family and friends, and it would appear to me that breaking those ties may be quite difficult.

A lot of this rings very close to home from my early experiences with my fiancee'.  She always refused my attempts to pay for anything, for the same reasons.  The few times she let me pay for a taxi (like when I was visiting her city the first time), it took a lot of arguing.  She also did touching things that meant a lot to me, like arguing with a waitress about why they didn't have an English menu for me and telling me we should leave because obviously such a restaurant wasn't very professional.  Although I realize this is an ongoing report, I think he's found a keeper.

[ambach123]

Thanks for the comments FP.

There is so much discussion on this Board that UW/ RW are only interested in WM because:

1. They want better life,  and money.

2. They want to immigrate to USA.

I went to Ukraine completely believing that. While this may be true for at least some if not most of the women there, but not all of them.

In my interactions with M,  I can say categorically that she was not meeting me because she had any specific desire to immigrate to USA.

About better life and money, I am sure every woman in the world anywhere wants that, but I did not see any overt dispaly of such a desire.

She wanted to enjoy the company in and out of the bedroom, just as I did.

I have the impression that if UW likes you, she would be sexually charged early on. They appear to me  to be very open and direct about how they feel.

Conversely, I would think that if one meets for a week, and she was not physically affectionate and responsive, one should look elsewhere.

[Gator]

I depise a woman gulping down food with both hands,  as if someone from Bangla Desh  or Biafra who has  been hungry for ages.

Does not say much for your selection process.  Sounds as if you were dating uneducated, village girls.

Afterwards, I wisen  up, I would  talk to them at the agency office, if something developed I would set up a dinner date. If they wanted to go to a restaurant immediately, they can go there -  alone. Two of them did just that, in other words were asked to leave.

If you liked them, why not go to dinner?  If you felt nothing, yes it is time for them to leave.

One woman after the meeting volunteered to help me shop for food. I  took  her up on the offer, we went to a grocery store, all of a sudden in my cart I see ten bottles of beauty product.

You did right.  Sounds like a pro-dater.

I have the impression that if UW likes you, she would be sexually charged early on. They appear to me  to be very open and direct about how they feel.

Some are, some are not.  Not every woman is really into sex.  Then again, some are and things happen quickly dependent upon the mood and circumstances. 

You seem to like M, or at least favor her over the others.  These feelings started during your correspondence.  I do not know why you dwelt on sex, particularly with someone who may become part of your life.    Ample disclosure about  intimacy with a specific woman adds nothing to a report IMO.  Better to read between the lines.

Conversely, I would think that if one meets for a week, and she was not physically affectionate and responsive, one should look elsewhere.

A 3-day rule is a more accurate guideline if you sincerely like the woman, dependent upon circumstances.

[topofthekey]

It is most certainly a personal preference. Physical intimacy earlier rather than later has both advantages and disadvantages. I wouldn't go so far as to say that it isn't the norm either.

I can't honestly say I fall into the conservative category. The only credit I do give myself is only as far as being safe about it. The research is out there that says those that wait to have sex (even til marriage) have relationships that are more likely to last.

Now on a micro level I really don't buy into waiting a really long time. I'm not even suggesting anything about Ambach or his new lady. But for those reading (especially if they just happened to click on the website and this is their first trip report) lets at least put up the caution flag here.

I don't think it would be great for international dating in general if the perception was that physical relationships day one are anywhere near the norm. I'm not saying red flag here. Just procede with caution... and if you aren't comfortable... slow down. Yea damn... I'm advising guys to slow down. Doubt I get much support on that. 

[msmoby_ru]

  Ample disclosure about  intimacy with a specific woman adds nothing to a report IMO.  Better to read between the lines.

A 3-day rule is a more accurate guideline if you sincerely like the woman, dependent upon circumstances.

Ambach thess are wise words .... if you like this M and hope there's a future.. *I* think you'll regret posting some of your TR

As *I* suspected you seem to be more keen to demonstrate something about yourself to us, rather than your ability to be a caring long-term partner.

Honestly, this is meant to "wake you up" - not to have a dig ... YES, I'd like you to prove me wrong and find a good woman...

"M" may be JUST that, but you've (IMHO) told us too much ( do you think she would respect you?!) and it seems you already started to "make excuses" to yourself ( and us) about WHY "M" won't leave UA.....

I hope you take this on board, and find the happiness you seek.

[Shadow]

There is so much discussion on this Board that UW/ RW are only interested in WM because:
1. They want better life,  and money.
2. They want to immigrate to USA.
I went to Ukraine completely believing that. While this may be true for at least some if not most of the women there, but not all of them.

I am one of those who tried to convince you and others of the opposite, but you had to find it out for yourself.
Waiting for the comments after return..

[ScottinCrimea]

I'm with msmoby and Gator on this one.  While what a couple chooses to do sexually and when they choose to do it is their own business, I see no reason to share the details with others.  While ambach states that he would limit the details, in my personal opinion he went a bit too far.  I think this sentence is the one that really raised my eyebrows: "This was my first taste, literally, of a slavic woman."  Not something I would comment about regarding someone who I respect and could possibly be my future wife.

I also noticed that he provided very limited details about anything with this woman other than the sexual issues.  I would rather hear more about what they did day to day, how she responded to the various experiences, what they discussed, etc., than the details of how they keep clean together.

I also hope ambach finds what he is looking for and for now he seems to think there is a real possibility.  There is still a long way to go, but at least he has gotten on the plane, spent some time there and learned some things he didn't know before and that's a great first step.

[Fogged]

Tasteless tales of sexual conquest. What happens behind closed doors with your lady should stay behind closed doors, not for the internet public to read. It also shows the lack of respect for your lady and I doubt very much she would enjoy reading about it here.

[topofthekey]

I also noticed that he provided very limited details about anything with this woman other than the sexual issues.  I would rather hear more about what they did day to day, how she responded to the various experiences, what they discussed, etc., than the details of how they keep clean together.

Yes! when i first found this site I read the report on Vladivostok and KenCs report when he went to Tver. So in comparison this trip report really doesn't tell us anything... other than Slavic women taste good, they put the lotion on the skin, and well we hope Ambach found a "keeper" during the trip.

Now I was chalking it up to me just not liking Ambach's writing style (which would be my problem)- but I just don't know what to say about this TR. He is telling us he found his lady... but I'm getting a weird vibe here.