US Presidential Elections

[BC]

Stayed up most of the night watching the coverage.

Interesting that over 65 and groups called 'new born christian' type were the vast majority of folks that voted against Obama.

Quite understandable from their point of view since their views 'n ways have long solidified to concrete.

[Jack]

Yea, Russian press very vocal today.

Some quotes,...



the people of the USA have voted out the Bush regime and the odious mass-murdering thugs which controlled it and saw Washington vying with Nazi Germany for a place on the Podium of Horror. Himmler and Rumsfeld the Torturers, Goebbels and Rice the propaganda machines, Hitler and Bush the Fuhrers,


Those of us in the international community who predicted eight long years ago what would happen if Bush were elected must do two things. First, never forget the damage done by George W. Bush and his minions of evil and make sure that, like the generations after Hitler, history does not pardon these criminals as well-meaning politicians


just yesterday we were witnessing segregation on buses and the KKK performing its evil and demonic deeds. The racists within US society have been silenced and relegated to insignificance and made to look as absurd as those who spend all summer trying to get a tan and then speak badly about negroes or people with dark skin during the winter.


The new President will learn very soon that the rest of the world does not want the US missile shield in eastern Europe


the US President was elected by his people to govern America, (North America, the United States of America) and nowhere else.








Interesting, also in Russian news today,....


Russia sets new record with arms export in 2008

The volume of arms export has been growing steadily during the recent years, we cooperate with several dozens of countries,” Mikhail Petukhov, a senior official with the FSMTC said.


Russia has considerably increased the amount of its arms deliveries to the countries of Latin America during the recent 15 years. Russia is currently in talks with Venezuela about the delivery of T-72M tanks.

Moscow also expects to receive a package of defense orders from Libya. Libya is interested in purchasing up-to-date S-300 PMU-2 Favorit missile systems, about two dozens of Tor-M1 anti-aircraft complexes and several Buk-M1-2 missile systems. In addition, the country would like to acquire MiG-29 and Su-30 fighter jets, several dozens of Mi-17, Mi-35 and Ka-52 choppers, as well as about 50 T-90S tanks, a diesel-powered submarine and other hardware.





It is worthy of note that Russia cooperates with the countries included in the Collective Security Treaty Organization (Armenia, Belarus, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan, Uzbekistan), which allows them to purchase arms at Russia’s local prices.



(side note to above: notice, no Ukraine)

[msmoby_ru]

No, light-hearted.Sorry to disappoint you, what specific part is bothering you, but apparently not our US friends ?

Come on Sandro  - it NOT "light hearted", any more -  and you know it ...

BC may say you weren't being "PC" but that's a weak excuse...

[wxman]

Jack,

When mouthpieces (government controlled press) of Russia write such things, you know that is the words of the government itself. Unfortunately this is a very common practice to rip another country, to divert attention from it's own major problems. With George Bush soon to be gone, who will the Russian mouthpieces attack? Will they finally see themselves in the mirror, or better yet, will the citizens see their government for what it is?

[OlgaH]

Perhaps America is truly changing. The old guard of white bigotry is finally waning, perhaps to be replaced by an America that does not judge based on the color of skin.

From Magazine Time:

It is a place, finally, where the content of our President's character is more important than the color of his skin. 

Travailing and working with Robert I had an opportunity to meet many people (attorneys, mediators, clients, office workers...) and of course on the eve of elections  the main subject to discuss during the coffee breaks was the elections. There were democrats for Obama, and republicans for McCain and republicans for Obama... many different opinions but one general hope... that was expressed even by republicans - hope that if Obama win he will not screw the country up, but lead to the positive changes... 

When such hopes are expressed by oppositions you really can be proud by people of your country - people who do not try to play the political games of Power but have one primary concern for the good of their country.

[Jack]

who will the Russian mouthpieces attack? Will they finally see themselves in the mirror,

No wxman, I do not think the current Russian government will see themselves in the mirror.

I think being just a little paranoid of their current military status and financial conditions will not allow those in power to see anything other than what they would like portrayed.

or better yet, will the citizens see their government for what it is?

Again, only my opinion, MANY people do see their government for what it is. Unfortunately you have an aging population whose pensions do almost nothing to help with their survival and of course who lived better under the Communist regime, and you have a youthful, not necessarily wise, but a youthful population that just loves Putin and see's the suppression of news, truth, as a part of Russian history and are not so taken by the many "mysterious" deaths of unfavorable journalist who seem to die.

Much of the population between these two, the elder and the youth, do see their goverment for what it is, but have to speak softly.

[OlgaH]

Jack, I guess you read Pravda.ru 

http://english.pravda.ru/topic/elections-608/

04.11.2008
Only Satan would have been worse than the Bush regime
Hitler and Bush the Fuhrers...

and Pravda.ru reads and repeats :   

04-30-2007
A Christian based group known as the Christian’s Liberation Movement has concluded that George W. Bush is a fake Christian and worships Satan.
http://www.roguegovernment.com/news.php?id=1845

22 June 2002
Both the Bush administration and Hitler’s regime benefited from a wave of recriminatory nationalism. Both regimes benefited from a catalytic event to rally the masses to their respective causes. Hitler’s repression of opposition and dissent began in the same subtle manner as Bush’s. Both leaders presided over mass military re-armament; both acted with massive militarily force on behalf of their class’s predatory designs; both scapegoated and persecuted subsets of their populations (to say the least); and finally, both Hitler and Bush became chancellor and president respectively, in spite of losing presidential elections.
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0206/S00131.htm

[SANDRO43]

Come on Sandro - it NOT "light hearted", any more -  and you know it ...

I submit that my interpretation of the intention of my own words can be more accurate than yours . Anyway, your privilege to read more into them than I intended.

[Makkin]

 Obama has less than two years to do anything for the country as Bill Clinton found out. If he does not make a significant contribution then he will lose the senate and congress as "Bill" did and have the remainer of office without being able to do much of anything.
  Clinton still holds the record for putting an administration together as it took 18 months to do so and the first six months after sealed the loss of both houses with the health care issue and the gays in the military.
   From the speed of things these days it won't be much accompishment in the next 18 months as we shall see it's not so easy to be President when almost all the Republicans and many Democrats are gunning for a piece of the pie in every bill imaginable.

  My guess is it's business as always with a slight twist of trying to tax the wealthy again and also "TRYING" to tax the middle class..lol

Makkin

[BC]

Russia says "Congratulations Barack"

BTW, my Russian family was very intrigued by Russia’s slap this morning to the face of America.  Welcome to your new job, Barack!

What slap?  The RU state-of-the-nation speech?

I get the feeling there will be plenty of time to congratulate and make up after Obama gets a full briefing on what really happened over the last several months.

[wxman]

What slap?  The RU state-of-the-nation speech?

Slapstick comedy. It's coming back. The Farleys have been given permission to create a new "Three Stooges" movie. They were a big hit during the last great depression and perhaps they know something about our economic future that we don't. Nyuck nyuck nyuck. 

[Ronnie]

My hope is that Obama will show his true colors, screw up big time, and Republicans will retake House and Senate in two years.  Hopefully they'll also come up with a decent presidential candidate in four.

------------
Before I comment, let's not blame Russia for the nutty rants of a deranged British songwriter.. Timothy Bancroft-Hinchey.   Granted, Pravda has made him a full-time journalist, undoubtedly because of his outrageous defenses of Putin and criticisms of the west, but still, he's a Brit, not Russian.
 
Blues Fairy, I understand your sentiment and the odds are high that is exactly what will happen.  However, it's not my hope.  My country comes first, that's why I refuse to join a party.  Thomas Jefferson was afraid that party loyalty would override the public good.  Certainly some, the party leaders, are already fulfilling Jefferson's nightmare.  Had the founding fathers had perfect foresight they likely would have made parties unlawful under the constitution.

I was fishing off San Diego's Shelter Island pier last Saturday and met a man visiting from Florida.  We struck up a conversation and I learned he is the mayor of a mid-sized city there.  We talked politics and he voiced a wish that all citizens would vote for the person and not the party as is done in municipal elections.   I could not have agreed more.

For those of us who preferred a man whose loyalty to country is unquestioned, let's hope that Barack Obama will sever his ties with the likes of Rev. Wright, Billy Ayers and Rashid Khalidi.  His socialist ideals are likely to be tempered with reality.  If the truth be told, we need to move (a la Teddy Roosevelt) more toward dismantling the powerful and often corrupt mega corporations and offer mom and pop businesses a chance again to compete.

I want to say one thing to our European friends.  Be careful what you wish for as you might just get it ...and so you have.  Now, if Obama is good to his word, you will see the decline of American military presence in your part of the world and the KGB Kingdom will respond by expansion.  Already today, Russia has announce it will deploy offensive short-range missiles in the Baltic region of Kaliningrad. 

Medvedev is trying to increase the term of president from 4 to 6 years, obviously to pave the way for 12 additional years of Putin who will be installed again as president (dictator) when Dmitry's little marionette show is over.

Also, who will the Europeans (and others) demonize when they can't blame the American president for every problem in the world and be politically correct and at the same time?   Ooops!

Did America elect Obama because of his race?  No.  Would he have become president were it not for his race?  Also no. 

Why the paradox? 

Obama would not have become a viable candidate were it not for his Harvard Law Degree and being the first black editor of the Harvard Law Review. 

Would he have been accepted to Harvard were it not for his race?  Doubtful, and if he'd release his undergrad transcripts we would see he was admitted (like Teddy Kennedy), as a "special case," not qualified academically.

Having said that, I think America can feel a measure of pride in having BHO as our president.  He's a gifted public speaker and often the world measures competence in a person based on how well he reads a teleprompter and controls his voice.  Maybe it's time we had a good Reaganesque speaker out front as long as the ideas he voices are a reflection of the superb collective wisdom of the American people.

[Gator]

What slap?  The RU state-of-the-nation speech?

Yes. I do not consider the following made by Medvedev himself (and not a crazed journalist) to be diplomatic.  A country's president does not say such about another country if he is interested in developing a cordial relationship. 

Excerpts from BBC:

Missiles

In his first state-of-the nation address, Mr Medvedev said Moscow would deploy the Iskander missile system in the Kaliningrad region - between Nato members Lithuania and Poland - to "neutralise - if necessary - the [US] anti-missile system".

Georgia War

In his speech to lawmakers, the Russian leader also said the August war in Georgia had resulted from a "conceited" US foreign policy.
He said "the conflict in the Caucasus was used as a pretext for sending Nato warships to the Black Sea and also for the foisting on Europe of America's anti-missile systems".
Mr Medvedev, who succeeded Vladimir Putin in May, vowed that Russia "won't retreat in the Caucasus".

Economic Crises

Mr Medvedev also blamed Washington for the global financial crisis, but said Russia would "overcome" the challenge.

What does Medvedev expect Obama to say?  "Yes, Mr. Medvedev, you are correct.  It was entirely Bush's fault.  To get us started on a new path, please accept my olive branch.  We will not deploy an anti-missile system, we will reimburse Russia for its costs in defending its 'territory' inside Georgia, and we will send your banks some of our $700 billion bailout fund."

These comments sound like something Ahmadinejad or Chavez would say.  However, they had the good sense to restrain themselves, although I doubt Iran will remain silent.

BC, congratulations on your complete metamorphosis to Euro thinking.  What's next on your list of socialism?

[OlgaH]

 What does Medvedev expect Obama to say?  "Yes, Mr. Medvedev, you are correct.  It was entirely Bush's fault. 

Medvedev expects from Obama the same that the others expect : 

Thursday, November 06, 2008
“He must learn from the mistakes of the previous administrations, including that of Bush which has destroyed Afghanistan, Iraq, Lebanon and Palestine,” said Hamas spokesman Fawzi Barhum. “He must improve US ties with the rest of the world rather than wave the big American stick,” Barhum told AFP".

[wxman]

Fawzi Barhum is good at blaming others for the mess in Palestine and Lebanon. Of course Hamas is never the blame for any cross border battles with Israel, oppressing their own people by having a bloody battle with Fatah and so on. Nope, Hamas can't be held responsible for any of their actions. It's all Bush's fault.  Until that part of the world, including Israel, can stand up and take responsibilities for their own actions, their own mistakes, their own crimes against humanity, they will NEVER progress as nations, or people.

[deccie]

My hope is that Obama will show his true colors, screw up big time, and Republicans will retake House and Senate in two years.  Hopefully they'll also come up with a decent presidential candidate in four.

Why would anyone want any political party to screw up the country just to gain power at some later date?
Is power what is important rahter than the state of the nation? Seems to be what you are implying.

Would not the better hope be for either political party who had power to actually do a good job?

It might not be likely but you are speaking of *hopes* here.

[OlgaH]

Fawzi Barhum is good at blaming others for the mess in Palestine and Lebanon. Of course Hamas is never the blame for any cross border battles with Israel, oppressing their own people by having a bloody battle with Fatah and so on. Nope, Hamas can't be held responsible for any of their actions. It's all Bush's fault.  Until that part of the world, including Israel, can stand up and take responsibilities for their own actions, their own mistakes, their own crimes against humanity, they will NEVER progress as nations, or people.

wxman,

I agree with you Hamas is not God's gift to the World, or who knows maybe a "special gift" as Pandora's box. But Bush with his paranoiac "democratization" made his  contribution... and the victory of Hamas after elections just showed a failure of Bush's Middle East politics, when even Condolisa Rice made a helpless gesture  "how we could miss it?"... The lessons of "democratization" of Algeria in 90s unfortunately were not so useful for Bush & Co... 

за что боролись, на то и напоролись or their efforts backfired on them

[BC]

BC, congratulations on your complete metamorphosis to Euro thinking.  What's next on your list of socialism?

Gator, I don't think there is anything at all socialist about looking at things that don't work and being courageous enough to try something different.

Living here in Euroland I am able to see directly the reactions of those around me.  The reactions are like watching a huge black cloud disappear, a sense of relief and an appreciation of the American people who voted decisively against the directions the US was going.  Think tears of joy were shed only in the US? - wrong.

Obama and the US have a great opportunity.  A mandate in the US Government, decisive choice by it's citizens, and overwhelming support of the world - almost overnight.  If he can use that momentum (in my book a once in a lifetime thing), and catch the huge wave behind him a lot can be accomplished.

[kievstar]

I think the World needs to realize Obama got around 52% of the vote in a 2 party election.  Was not a convincing victory.  Bush got 51% in 2004. 

Union auto industry states changed from Republican to Democrat as Obama promised to bail them out and put tougher restrictions on Japanese and European car models.  Also, the growing Mexican population became more Democrat as 75% voted that way.  This was your difference.  But if America feels scared again you will have another pro war President like Bush.  But I have met Obama and he has a lot of pride and do not think he is going to be pushed around by other countries.   He will deal better with Middle East and Russia but expect him to take a harder stance with the EU on free trade.  Obama does not want to be the next Carter.  And first country who tests him he may make an example of.  I have a feeling it will be Russia.

 

[BC]

I think the World needs to realize Obama got around 52% of the vote in a 2 party election.  Was not a convincing victory.  Bush got 51% in 2004. 

53 to 46 is a quite good margin for the popular vote. www.cbsnews.com  Much more convincing than the lasts couple, even decisive.

[kievstar]

Take out California and New York votes and redo your math.  Also, if you put 100 people in a room and 46 people do not like you it is not a friendly room.  BC, Not sure where your flag is from but have you ever lived in the USA? 

[I/O]

He's a gifted public speaker

Hitler and Stalin were also two of the most talented speakers of all time. Their message was flawed but the ability to deliver it was almost unequalled. Heres hoping the USA population gets a more pliable bang for it's buck than Russia and Germany did.

I notice Wall street gave it's resounding endorsement by dumping 5%. Me thinks BO zo has more on his plate than he is capable of fixing anytime soon. If he had achieved a 60/40 popular vote I'd agree America is behind him and that IMO would give him a better than even chance of achieving real change. The numbers don't smell quite that sweet to me. I'd love to be proven wrong but I suspect there'll more written about the divisions a few years hence than will be written about the unity.

Great leaders are oft born in times of adversity. Now is certainly one of those times. America, and indeed the world will be blessed if he becomes a great leader because there is a distinct absence of personnel in the "Great Leaders" room of the world right now. It is rather a boring group when one looks around.

I/O 

[msmoby_ru]

I submit that my interpretation of the intention of my own words can be more accurate than yours . Anyway, your privilege to read more into them than I intended.

Just in case you forgot, or posters can't be bothered to look back! ..you said...

Well, fellow Americans, seems like you're getting a deeply-tanned President, from the early looks of it .

and I submit that you know very well, that in the case of careless remarks ( which can be perceived as racist) - it is very much down to you to be careful as to how they can be perceived..

I VERY much doubt you would say this in a room with Black or coloured colleagues or in  Brixton or Harlem ! ... Why is is all right to say it here... ?

1/ As  you well know it isn't a deep sun tan... Sun tans are aquired from exposure to the sun

2/ This pigmentation is from birth.


Nope... not even "witty".. just offensive to some..

Like I said, you should know better....

[Gator]

Gator, I don't think there is anything at all socialist about looking at things that don't work and being courageous enough to try something different.

Agree that things were not working, principally the failure of the regulatory system.  Some changes were needed.  Some fine tuning and enforcement would suffice, at most some evolutionary change. 

Will we get that or wholesale revolutionary changes?  As you say, he has a mandate so it is largely up to Obama what direction we take.  Unfortunately, in every litmus test he has taken, he came out red for liberal socialism.  Not to be forgotten, the US has already made some large strides towards socialism as part of the remedies to the economic peril of today.

Obama and the US have a great opportunity.  A mandate in the US Government, decisive choice by it's citizens, and overwhelming support of the world - almost overnight. 

Glad to know that Europe is behind Obama and while he is busy correcting the wrongs with America, Italy and France and Germany will stand up to the big bad Russian bear roaming in your backyard.

[kievstar]

I will just post the numbers so far.  Obama 52.45%, McCain 46.26%, and Other 1.28%.  Take out 2 states of New York and California and you have 50.97% Obama, 47.79% McCain, and 1.28% Other.  

Another thing is more people voted in 2004 than 2008.  Could change as more votes are counted but the media saying they never seen so many people vote is misleading.  So overall % of eligible voters who voted actually declined from 2004 to 2008.

42% of the States in USA went to McCain.  Biden is first Roman Catholic VP ever elected.  Nice move by Obama for the midwest auto union states.  

USA is still a divided country.  

Mexicans, blacks, criminals, non religious, people who do not work, people younger than 30 years old tend to vote Democrat.
Millionaires, whites, and religious tend to vote Republican.