Another statistic

[JR]

Sorry to hear it Scott, Maxx-Dude-2 said it best! And I quote:

Hello Wayne

This happened to me 5 years ago. Since then I have educated myself to the in's and out's of the process. I and another fellow created a website for this sort of problem, www.immigrationfraudvictims.com Here is some advice I have given in regard to people in your situation.


http://www.immigrationfraudvictims.us/faq4.html

4) I am a victim! What should I do now?

a. Get a good divorce attorney! If you can afford it, get a good immigration attorney too.
b. Do not confront your spouse regarding your suspicions. Do not speak to mutual friends about your suspicions. Talk to your lawyer!
c. Keep your legal strategy between you and your lawyer. If you need to talk to someone, do so only to a trusted friend or family member.
d. Do not allow your spouse to provoke you, and do not react to his/her provocations.
e. Do not under any circumstances talk to your spouse, or friends of your spouse, whether on the phone or in person, without a witness present. Do not post any specific information regarding your spouse on the web.
f. If possible, move out of the marital home, and have witnesses available for verification. It is best to establish a temporary residence somewhere else. Do not let your spouse know where you are living. Do not return to the home or your spouse could twist this into a stalking charge.
g. If your spouse has already moved out of the marital home, change the locks. Check with your lawyer about the legality of this first.
h. Secure the bank accounts. Move money ASAP. Get legal advice about possible 50% rule. Get all valuable documents that might be of use in an immigration or divorce case out of your house and locate them to a safe deposit box at a bank or someplace else that is safe.
i. Keep written copies of your exit plan such as an attorney's brief with you at all times. The attorney's brief should stress the need to separate and make no contact with your spouse, as well as steps that have been taken. These papers can be shown to the police if they show up at your new residence on some false charges made up by your spouse, as well as in court.
j. Keep a paper trail of your exit plan. These are useful at an abuse trial to show your rational and legal reaction to a marriage that needs to be ended. Abusive people do not use rational legal means to exit a marriage. They use intimidation or force to keep a hold on their victim. Act like a law abiding citizen. Do not waiver with your heart, but keep advancing forward using your head.
k. Don't sign anything for your spouse.
l. Record and document everything. If it is legal in your state, carry a tape recorder!
m. Check your state laws regarding legal grounds for an annulment. If allowed, an annulment shows the USCIS that you were defrauded. Follow up with a letter and proof that you've filed for annulment and the final decree of annulment.
n. You must withdraw sponsorship of your spouse as soon as it is evident that things are not right. If you and your spouse have applied for a change of status, and your spouse has not received the 2 year green card, withdraw your application immediately! Send a notarized letter to the USCIS and include as much information as possible. Write a very detailed synopsis of your relationship with your spouse from the first time you got in touch until the present. Be sure to send it so that someone has to sign for your letter. If your spouse's change of status has already been approved, you can still withdraw your support, but this unfortunately does not end your financial obligations.
o. Write your local US Representative and US Senators. Have them send a letter to the USCIS on your behalf.
p. Try to get a contact person at your USCIS local office, and be persistent in forcing them to do something about your claim, with investigation.
q. Do not hide, destroy, damage or take your spouse's immigration documents, passport, etc. This could be used against you in a court of law or with the police.
r. Google your spouse. You would be surprised at what is out there on the web about people.
s. Do a background check on your spouse. It's worth the money.
t. Report any suspicious activity to the FBI or USCIS.

I also add that if you have any guns in your house arrange to have a licensed gun dealer to hold them for you for a specified period of time. Why? the reason is that a gun in the house if your wife knows about it is an almost guarantee that a restraining order will be issued. Judges do not want to take any chances. If you can prove that your guns where removed and are held under a contract you might avoid this. Also if a restraining order is issued then it is a Federal crime to have in your possession any guns, rifles, ammunition, explosives or swords until the restraining order expires. Restraining orders are one of the first things these women ask for as they are considered "primary evidence" in granting an I-360 spousal abuse petition. So I would go over all of this and the above with your lawyer and do it very quickly.


Maxx

http://www.russian-detective.com/scams/gcg.htm

[JR]

Now my two $:

I agree with Maxx as to her resorting to a DV in order to stay.

Change the damn locks!

Get the name/s of the cops who showed up for the initial move out. They can testify (I had a Sheriffs Captian and a Deputy on the stand, you can't imagine how that FALLS in your corner) as to your behavior during this time and that there were NO allegations made while they were there. That is important. If they thought you had abuse her or threatened her they would have been obligated to arrest you.

Never, EVER from this point forward be alone with her.

Never, EVER so much as raise your voice to her again.

Get legal seperation NOW ! !

I don't think I'd bother with pursueing a restraining order (unless it is to keep her from selling community property) of any kind. Too hard to prove and it may just be wasting your resources.

I saw a lot of my X in what you wrote. My circumstances are different but the mentality seems to run along parallel lines. I hope you get everything sorted out for the best.

[Vaughn]

Aw crap, I just finished the first two pages of this thread - and feel sick to my stomach.

Scott, you do what you have to do, as distasteful as it may be to your core values.

Vaughn

[JR]

As I'm climbing into my fire-suit:

I have to say that as far as the pre-nup goes I am with ambach123...I believe he makes a valid point regarding it's importance. I can't say I agree with much else I have read from him but on this matter I do.
In the courtroom the Judge decides. If you give him enough evidence in your favor he may just decide you are right.

Peeks out to see if it is OK...

I did not have one with my X. But going forward I will. I will have one drawn up in her country, in her language and one in mine. If she won't sign both, no deal.

In my marriage/divorce it was just me. I made my choices and I live with the life I have forged. Now I have a daughter to care for. I won't be giving her future to any changeling.

[Sculpto]

Scott,
I am so sorry this is happening to you.  Even if we have not always agreed on things I know you are a good man and do not deserve this misery.  I also want to thank you for sharing so openly on the forum.  Your comments illuminate very well some of the things you have been pointing out in my current situation and I will give deeper consideration because of what you are going through. 

I do think you can hold your head high though.  You have done things the right way with an open heart and lofty goal and demeanor.  From what you have written I think you are most likely better off and I think you will find the final resolution of this to be a big relief.

I am an expert on breaking up and recovering.  If you feel the need you can PM me for some expert advice. 

[Maxx2]

There is considerable downsides in delaying a divorce.

1) Longer divorce is not filed the longer she has to run up debt.

2) Longer the divorce is not filed the more chance of being required to pay spousal support. Immigrant women get special treatment with that as they are portrayed as being helpless plus the I-864 affidavit of support is used to support this argument.

3) Much more likely an abuse allegation will be made. To make an abuse charge after a divorce filing by the husband it can seem like revenge by her to the courts or if the court is educated as a means to her getting a green card.

4) Looks better to file first.

5) The divorce petitioner has more control with the court dates etc.

6) Sooner the whole ugly mess will be over.


Thanks again JollyRats. All those steps are drawn from conversations I had with those in the trenches and from lawyers who know the games. 
 

[JR]

Well Maxx,
I like to joke around but everything you say, AND I MEAN EVERYTHING is spot on. In the last three years since my divorce and subsequent birth of my daughter I have spend the better part of seventy thousand dollars in attorneys fees dealing with court issues related to women. I have learned A LOT. I have been slandered and accused of everything including affiliations with terrorist groups. It has not be easy nor cheap to clear and keep my name clear. But I have learned. I have had three different judges turn down requests for restraining orders five separate times. I kept notes, I took video (270 hours worth), I produced witness (Sheriffs Captians and a Deputy), nurses and other professionals. All testified in my favor. I produced statements from doctors and councilors. I made it easy for the judges to side with me. If left to the letter of the law with just "He Said, She Said" to go by, Judges will tend to fall on the side of caution and issue a restraining order.
But I digress,

Listen to Maxx, he speak heap big truth.

Get legal separation NOW!

File for divorce NOW!

Do NOT go back to this woman!

Step back, emotionally divest yourself from the situation and treat it in a businesslike manner. Your past is messed up, don't let your future be that way too...

[jj]

Scott, sorry to hear about your situation.  I hope it can be worked out for your best. No matter what country they are from, some women are just hard to figure out.  Hang in there, look forward. -jj

[Turboguy]

could be worse,

Check this out

[Zmejka]

The other issue is that my wife is here on a conditional visa that expires in September.  Apparently she has no intentions of returning to Ukraine.  I've tried to explain to her the consequences of overstaying her visa and that she won't be able to work here on an expired visa, but she says it's not my problem.

Do you mean she has her conditional Green Card not conditional visa? If she has conditional GC DV is not the only way for her to stay in the US. If she proves the marriage in good faith (for that she would need her name and yours together on different bills, photos, may be witnesses, letters of her friends, any relatives that they saw you living as a couple etc.) she can remove her conditions on her own and het a permanent GC.

[ScottinCrimea]

She has her conditional green card and what you say is not exactly correct.  If we are divorced, she can apply on her own.  If we are still married, it must be a joint application with the following exceptions:

You may request a waiver of the joint petitioning requirements if you:
   
  •      Entered into the marriage in good faith, but your spouse subsequently died
 
•      Entered into the marriage in good faith, but the marriage was later terminated due to divorce or annulment
 
•      Entered into the marriage in good faith, and remain married, but have been battered or subjected to extreme cruelty by your U.S. citizen or permanent resident spouse, or
 
•      Can prove that the termination of your status and removal would result in extreme hardship to you


I'm thinking that even though we are separated now, there is enough evidence that the marriage was entered into in good faith and I'm perfectly willing to be included on the petition and provide the necessary documentation and support.

[WmGO]

Scott,

I am sorry to hear of your situation. I hope everything works out
for your best interests as soon as possible.

Your situation does have me wondering though as it is particularly
disturbing given all that you have done for your wife -  and it seems/sounds
like she was planning (in my book plotting) on leaving you even before she left Ukraine to join you in the States. It sounds like she was prepping both her daughter (that you were very good to) and her mother for such an event even
before she left Ukraine to come to America.

I know in the past you have (in my opinion) had a tendency to white wash
certain realities about the FSU and FSUW, and by my asking now please do not
interpret this as any kind of criticism as I firmly believe that it is grossly improper
for anyone to dump on someone who is down....and I know you have to be hurting despite your efforts to put a strong face on it.......

I think that your situation is a major learning opportunity for everyone, especially WM who are pursuing FSUW.....so that is the only reason I am inquiring into these things:

I recall that your wife was the only FSUW that you ever met,
that there was an event during the dating process where she pocketed
money that you had given to her for transportation (to me deceit/dishonesty to
you just being "clever"), that you gave her financial support before marriage and, that she did not work and earn her own living before your marriage (or during marriage in Ukraine also I think?)........you also mentioned that she has a sense of entitlement and did not properly respect her mother who supported her......my questions are similar to the one(s) Dave asked up thread where he asked if you had seen this coming (splitting with her daughter as soon as her daughter arrived)(which in my book is rank betrayal).

Did you ever suspect or feel that there was a problem?
Do you still feel that overlooking an act of dishonesty was the right decision?
Is there anything about your wife's character or conduct before marriage that you
can look back on now and say that it should not have been overlooked or rationalized away?  Same question but as it relates to a woman who is not working - I don't mean temporary unemployment, I mean just does not work
at all period and lives off of others completely?

I am interested in your reflective
analysis of these things. Surely there are some things to be learned here for
all of those thousands of WM fishing in FSU waters.

Scott, please remember that I ask not to judge you or to put down. I don't believe in it. I just see your situation as a particularly important learning opportunity for others as it appears that you were a VERY good man and husband, always faithful and providing....and then, as soon as your wife and daughter are in the States, BAM -  Betrayal!  CERTAINLY, you deserved better that you have been treated. I hate it for you. And I would hate it for anybody in a similar situation. I pray that everthing works out quickly and for the best.

Good luck.

William

[ScottinCrimea]

William,

I'll need a day or two to answer your questions as I do think it might provide some insight for others, but I want to think about it so that I can present it in a way that is positive and not just bashing my wife, which I refuse to do.

I will comment on one thing, though.  I don't recall specifically saying that my wife pocketed money that I gave her for transportation.  In fact, if my wife was dishonest, she had at her disposable thousands of dollars in cash, particularly when she was buying and remodeling our apartment before my arrival, and did not misuse this money or misrepresent its use in any way.  She is very honest, in some ways much too honest.  I did say that I can understand the mentality and don't see it as merely black and white.  For example, I see a difference between a woman asking a man for a certain amount of money for cab fare or telling him an inflated price and then pocketing the difference and a case where a man of his own accord insists on giving her a set amount of money and she chooses to take a more economical way home.  I'm sure we won't agree on this issue, but no need to debate it here.

[JR]

I see a difference between a woman asking a man for a certain amount of money for cab fare or telling him an inflated price and then pocketing the difference and a case where a man of his own accord insists on giving her a set amount of money and she chooses to take a more economical way home.  I'm sure we won't agree on this issue, but no need to debate it here.

You are right here Scott. There is a VAST difference. Unless you gave her an amount for a specific purpose with explicit instructions "this money is for a cab and only for a cab, if you take a bus you must return the difference." she has broken no rules or trust. If she had stated that she wanted to take a cab and that the fare was X amount which you gave her then she took a bus for the lesser Y amount pocketing the differnce and not telling you she would be guilty of dishonesty.
I hope your telling the story is somehow healing for you. Sometimes it helps to get it out.

[ECOCKS]

While I have not agreed with everything Scott says or his interpretations, this distinction is right on the mark.

If the guy insists his date take a cab when she protests that she can walk I find it commendable that she takes the money and adds it to her family budget.  It may be pennies to us but it is a whole number percentage increase for many Ukrainian households. No one is buying a new pair of stilettos by saving 35 hryvnia per date.

Any woman who ever insisted that she had to have airfare would have been a red flag for me.  I can't get my MIL to take a taxi from Troeschina at 10PM when the temp is -2 unless I call the taxi myself and tell her I will meet them downstairs. The emergency money usually goes towards a bag of 2-3 dozen eggs at the rhynok or buying me a new over-sized coffee cup. Taxis are only for lazy westerners and rich people in the real world of Ukraine.

I recall one woman I dated who was very embarrassed when I rode in the cab to take her home and saw where she lived. She seemed convinced that we didn't work out because I felt she wasn't high enough class and the look on her face the last time I took her home is a picture I recall whenever my humility needs to be adjusted back to normal levels.

Anyone who applies this sort of judgment without consideration of how this part of the world functions is probably in for a real disappointment. Be careful.

[Diplomacy]

I agree with the taxi issue.  I also would caution applying American ethics to the Ukraine. 

I just do not see them as poor people. The only thing I did not like, was going into a dark entrance way to get to the flat.  I can not see so well in the dark, and I guess it is not cool to run around with a flashlight.

I could not even pretend I was talking on my cell to see, I did not know enough Russian.

Oh, and meat with gelatin.  I do not like it.

I equate it to promoting someone to a new job.  The power goes to some of their heads, and they are no longer the person I would have chosen to promote. 

Think about it, how many guys here.  Say they feel like a kid in the candy store, when they are in the FSU?  Not much better really, still seeing them for the beauty first, versus people.



 

[WmGO]

You are right here Scott. There is a VAST difference. Unless you gave her an amount for a specific purpose with explicit instructions "this money is for a cab and only for a cab, if you take a bus you must return the difference." she has broken no rules or trust.

If she had stated that she wanted to take a cab and that the fare was X amount which you gave her then she took a bus for the lesser Y amount pocketing the differnce and not telling you she would be guilty of dishonesty.

I agree with that. My recollection is apparently incorrect - I was thinking
Scott's situation entailed the latter of the two scenarios.

Anyways, I look forward to Scott's insights.

[GoodOlBoy]

I recall one woman I dated who was very embarrassed when I rode in the cab to take her home and saw where she lived. She seemed convinced that we didn't work out because I felt she wasn't high enough class and the look on her face the last time I took her home is a picture I recall whenever my humility needs to be adjusted back to normal levels.

Man ECOCKS, I can definitely remember this happening to me in Russia. It really can be a humbling experience.

But, I learned very quickly "not to judge a book by it's cover".

I have been in several flats in Russia that looked from the outside like some God awful abandoned buildings from the ghetto's of America, BUT...once I got inside, WOW, FSU ladies really know how to make a flat look and feel "cozy". 


GOB

[ECOCKS]

Communism and government ownership in practice.  The comon areas look like crap while the privately owned areas are decent because someone has "ownership" and accountability/responsibility.

Elevator closets used as bathrooms, stairways for bedrooms, entry areas with burned out light bulbs, broken mailboxes and dingy paint jobs.......

 

[OlgaH]

Elevator closets used as bathrooms, stairways for bedrooms, entry areas with burned out light bulbs, broken mailboxes and dingy paint jobs.......

Last year when I visited my relatives I again saw already became famous hand written sign "Ladies and gentlemen, please don't urinate in entrance and elevators"

But I also remember (back to the Soviet time) our entrance was very clean with flowers and curtains on the windows, because our neighbors - babushkas vigilantly kept their eyes on our place and always were on the alert  and after...  the bars on the windows and metal doors started to appear.

[ECOCKS]

True, when private ownership is implemented it has a definite focusing and prioritizing effect. Still the stories of how difficult it was to get home repairs, elevators working and so on were prevalent from that day as well as the present problems we experience with the Zhek.

[OlgaH]

True, when private ownership is implemented it has a definite focusing and prioritizing effect. Still the stories of how difficult it was to get home repairs, elevators working and so on were prevalent from that day as well as the present problems we experience with the Zhek.

Probably it depends on area and of course on people. From my Soviet childhood I remember that our house and entrances were repaired by Zhek every year usually in April. And every April on Lenin's birthday we had so called Lenin's community work day - Subbotnik. We had subbotniks periodically.   

Subbotniks still exist in Russia 

[ScottinCrimea]

Scott,

I am sorry to hear of your situation. I hope everything works out
for your best interests as soon as possible.

Your situation does have me wondering though as it is particularly
disturbing given all that you have done for your wife -  and it seems/sounds
like she was planning (in my book plotting) on leaving you even before she left Ukraine to join you in the States. It sounds like she was prepping both her daughter (that you were very good to) and her mother for such an event even
before she left Ukraine to come to America.

I know in the past you have (in my opinion) had a tendency to white wash
certain realities about the FSU and FSUW, and by my asking now please do not
interpret this as any kind of criticism as I firmly believe that it is grossly improper
for anyone to dump on someone who is down....and I know you have to be hurting despite your efforts to put a strong face on it.......

I think that your situation is a major learning opportunity for everyone, especially WM who are pursuing FSUW.....so that is the only reason I am inquiring into these things:

I recall that your wife was the only FSUW that you ever met,
that there was an event during the dating process where she pocketed
money that you had given to her for transportation (to me deceit/dishonesty to
you just being "clever"), that you gave her financial support before marriage and, that she did not work and earn her own living before your marriage (or during marriage in Ukraine also I think?)........you also mentioned that she has a sense of entitlement and did not properly respect her mother who supported her......my questions are similar to the one(s) Dave asked up thread where he asked if you had seen this coming (splitting with her daughter as soon as her daughter arrived)(which in my book is rank betrayal).

Did you ever suspect or feel that there was a problem?
Do you still feel that overlooking an act of dishonesty was the right decision?
Is there anything about your wife's character or conduct before marriage that you
can look back on now and say that it should not have been overlooked or rationalized away?  Same question but as it relates to a woman who is not working - I don't mean temporary unemployment, I mean just does not work
at all period and lives off of others completely?

I am interested in your reflective
analysis of these things. Surely there are some things to be learned here for
all of those thousands of WM fishing in FSU waters.

Scott, please remember that I ask not to judge you or to put down. I don't believe in it. I just see your situation as a particularly important learning opportunity for others as it appears that you were a VERY good man and husband, always faithful and providing....and then, as soon as your wife and daughter are in the States, BAM -  Betrayal!  CERTAINLY, you deserved better that you have been treated. I hate it for you. And I would hate it for anybody in a similar situation. I pray that everthing works out quickly and for the best.

Good luck.

William

Okay, I'm going to try to have a go at answering your questions.  I really want to avoid any character analysis of my wife as much as possible, but some will be necessary as a means for others to look for similar character traits in others.  It's also important to understand that these same character traits might be just fine in a different relationship.

As far as any pre-planning on her part with the arrival of the daughter as the jump off point, I don't think this was the case.  She had expressed unhappiness before, but I think her daughter served more as a catalyst. She now had someone to "support" her so didn't have to do it alone.  I also think her daughter was very aggressive in pushing her to leave as she didn't like the idea of a father figure pushing her to do things that she didn't want to do.  She knew she could manipulate her mother but not me, so with me out of the picture she was free to do what she wanted as her mother would never cross her.  This shouldn't be taken as a blanket statement that one should avoid women with teenagers.  My wife felt guilty both because her daughter's husband had died and because we had left her in Ukraine to finish school before bringing her here.  Her daughter knows very well how to play on this guilt.

Although my wife was the only FSUW I dated, I met many while living there and I did notice differences that bothered me.  Her sense of entitlement was certainly much more developed along with the idea that it was the responsibility of others to take care of her and give her what she needed.  She was basically more egocentric.  I think I should have paid more attention to how she treated others, especially those who had nothing that she wanted or needed.  Even her closest friends she would use as the need arose.  Her concern is not in how to care for others, but in how others can care for her.

I think work ethic and how the woman approaches the idea of work is something that needs to be considered.  I've seen her at times work as hard as anyone I know, but she would always express resentment about it and express her displeasure that someone would require this of her.  When she decides to do something, she does it very well and meticulously, and she has no patience with anyone elses's work, convinced that she can do better at everything.

I think that all boils down to an issue of self esteem, and how exactly one can measure this and the final effects is difficult to judge.  She would repeatedly say that she doesn't need anyone, that she can do everything for herself, but the reality was quite different.  While she is certainly an intelligent woman with many talents, but do to circumstances both in and out of her control, she has never been required to demonstrate this.

She married very young, at age 17 and had her daughter a year later.  She was really totally dependent on her husband. It couldn't have been too great as I know they lived with her grandmother in a tiny one room apartment for two years. After her divorce, she made her one effort at independence.  She moved to St Petersburg and worked for three years in an outdoor kiosk, which she admits was miserable.  Still, she claims that she made good money and did just fine. Ultimately though, she became destitute and was forced to ask her mother for money to bring her home.  From that point she returned to college while her mother paid for that and her living expenses.  I know she held a couple of jobs during that time, but nothing that paid much or for very long.  She spent five years at this and graduated just about the time that I came along.  She had been working for a short time at a bank but quit this job to do her final college work just before I met her.

My thinking was that I would be making several trips to visit her and it didn't make sense for her to get a new job where she wouldn't have any time off to spend with me, so I started sending her a small amount each month to cover her living expenses while we pursued our relationship.  It's possible that this had an impact on our relationship where she chose to continue rather than lose the financial support when otherwise she might have made a different choice.

My belief is that, although she claimed to have the ability to be independent, she never had proved that to herself and I think that really bothered her and put a real psychological dent in her superiority complex.  Rather than appreciate those who supported her, she resented them as by taking care of her, they reinforced her self doubts.  To thank someone for meeting her needs just reinforced the feeling in her mind that she wasn't capable of caring for herself.  That's why she never told her parents, me, or anyone else thank you.

Coming to the US aggravated her internal struggle significantly because she found herself even more dependent on me, not just financially, but with the activities of everyday life.  Her self esteem really took a nosedive and nothing I did seemed to help.  In fact, the more I tried to help her, the more she resented me for it.  I really worked to give her independence in every way, teaching her the system, giving her a car, helping her find work she enjoyed, etc., but she still understood that my help was needed.

Apparently the time came when she thought she could make it on her own and she set out to prove it to herself.  She is still dependent on the womens shelter where she is staying now, so the realities of how difficult this will be really haven't set in yet.  She has and will make mistakes that will cost her in effort and money because she refuses to accept any of the help or advice that I offer.  I think she can earn enough and learn the system here well enough to be on her own; not comfortably, but adequately.  She will never have her dream of a comfortable future unless she finds someone else to care for her, but then she would have to admit to herself that she needs someone else, and she is way too stubborn to admit that.  Unfortunately, she has a ticking time bomb in the removal of conditions on her visa that is due in five months.  She seems to refuse to look at what this requires and any effort on my part to explain it to her or to convince her that I am 100% willing to help her with this falls on deaf ears.  Also, for no reason that she can explain, she opposes the idea of a simple uncontested divorce.  I think in both cases it would involve her having to work together with me, and that would negate her efforts to be independent.

Okay, that was a lot more of character analysis than I intended, and this is a description of one woman, not FSUW in general, but it does bring up some issues that men here need to look at in their own relationships.

While there is much to discuss here, a couple of things stand out.  As several others have mentioned, it is very important to watch how your woman treats others, both those she considers above her and those she considers below her.  Pay attention to her interactions with family and friends.  If you will be family, expect to be treated the same.

Be very careful with the idea of wanting to take care of her.  While ideally both partners should have this thought, if it is overdone, no matter your good intentions, she may come to resent it.  You need to see that she has a clear desire to take care of you out of love and not just a feeling of the need to reciprocate what you do for her.

Be sure you both are clear on your expectations of each other and your roles in a marriage.  You should each make a list of what you feel are your responsibilities and what are your expectations of your partner, then go over it and make adjustments so that you both are comfortable.  And write it down.  If you find that you aren't in agreement on these things, then don't assume that it will all work out later, because it won't.

It's not an easy thing to do such a close examination of the issues of a failed marriage, and if not for the support of the members here, I probably wouldn't be doing it, but if it saves one other relationship, then I will consider it worth it.

[Kuna]

Scott,

I've PM'ed you but I think this is my first post in the open thread.

Firstly, it is very painful for me to read what you've written above because of the respect I have for you - and my hope that everything is resolved for you quicklyand as painlessly as possible.

I know this can't be easy even with the strength you're showing.

Second,  I want to thank you very much for your level headed posts as I think it is of the highest value for all men, whether we are searching or now living with our wonderful RW.  Your character allows you to produce clear thought for us to consider and understand.

May I ask some questions...  and please do not feel obliged to answer.

Obviously you've heard of/from your wife.  I wonder if you've asked or whether she has told you what the compelling event was for her? I can't help but wonder what she feels the reason was.

When I was reading the early part of this thread I wondered if she was simply determined NOT to leave the US and return to Ukraine, especially as she would be hearing of the deteriorating economy there.  These were my early thoughts about your breakup because I knew you'd always intended to return...  and I wasn't sure if it'd played any role in her actions.

Second,  your divorce laws sound different to ours here.  What difference or impact will her unwillingness to agree to an uncontested divorce have for you?  For me (in my first marriage) my wife simply wanted the satisfaction of having papers served on me.  None the less she told me she wanted to do this at my workplace to embarrass me.  Strangely enough when the documents were served on me my workmates all cheered (they weren't fond of my snobby first wife) and we all went out for a blinder of a night out.  The difference for us was increased lawyer bills.  I am curious about the differences her choices will make on you or her...

Third,  I image you're still planning on moving back to Ukraine.  I hope this happens for you and you have the apartment back there to settle into.  When you are ready - if ready - I think it'll be the highest value information to share your thoughts, feelings and actions.  That is a BIG ASK, but if and/or when you are willing I think you will be sharing something very special.

I wish you the best no matter what you do.

Finally,  there are aspects of your wife's behaviour that I can't understand because they are so foreign to me.  I really appreciated your comments early in your post to the effect that her personality traits may have worked better simply in a different relationship.  It'd be interesting to revisit some of the old threads where we talked about RW and how they are different in light some of the new perspectives we see through member experiences.  My wife is most certainly different to the other women around me and I adore her for those differences...  Still your comments have broadened my thought process and piqued my curiousity.

Thanks for this post...  I hope things continue to get easier for you.

Kuna

[Gator]

My wife is most certainly different to the other women around me and I adore her for those differences... 

Hear!  Hear!

This reflects three variables:

1.  You - Another man may/would not have brought out her best.  "You" includes you as a man plus everything around you (country, family, financial security, social life, etc.).
2.  Inherited psyche - some elements of behavior and personality are ingrained at birth from one's gene pool.
3.  History -  family, past relationships,  culture, education, etc.

Of these, only the last relates to Russia (or Ukraine in your case).  And within that, there is so much variability.  Can never use a broad brush to project how a RW will behave.  A RW raised in a happy connected family will probably differ from one with a dysfunctional family.  However, life is replete with examples of two siblings as different as night and day.