Caution1 Your FSUW is most likely infected with the H. Pylori Bacteria

[Ronnie]

According to our Russian-trained gastroenterologist, nearly 3 in 4 immigrants from Eastern Europe have the H Pylori bacterium.  This seems to be born out by data reporting that half the world's population have it as well. 

H Pylori is often the cause of ulcers and can increase the risk of stomach cancer as well as be the source of chronic stomach discomfort.  The bacterium is picked up usually in childhood from unclean water and fresh vegetables.

Please ask your doctor to check using a stool analysis or other effective test.  FWIW our Doctor said he himself had it when he immigrated and my wife tested positive today herself and will begin two-week treatment regime that is about 85% effective in eradicating it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helicobacter_pylori

[beachcomber556]

Thanks for the heads-up. 

[Tamara]

Ronnie,

Thanks for sharing.

Tamara

[ScottinCrimea]

Ronnie, While not intending to discount what you are reporting, I think there needs to be some clarification so people aren't panicking and running out demanding the test for fear of cancder or something.

H. Pylori has been known about for a long time, and, while the percentage of those having it isn't as high as in the FSU, it is still failrly high in the US.  So why isn't everyone here running to their doctor insisting on being tested and why isn't the medical community or government putting out the word to get the test done?  Because the reality is that only about 15% of those who have it will have any symptoms or disorders related to it.  With a very small percentage, it can increase the risk of cancer, but only because the signs and symptoms go untreated. Even, for example, with ulcers caused by other causes, if left untreated they can develop into cancers in a small percentage.

So my recommendation should be that if she is having recurrent or chronic problems with her stomach (not intestines or uterus) such as indigestion or sharp pains, such that it is bad enough to see a doctor, it would be an appropriate test to request.  Also, given the high incidence in the FSU, it would seem appropriate to have it tested during a regular check up.  It's now a simple breath test.  I wouldn't recommend making an appointment just to have the test done, though, and I wouldn't recommend being overly paranoid about it.

[Wraith]

Generally if you see a doctor with stomach/abdominal related pain they will order a blood panel anyhow to check for the presence of the bateria. The breath test is also good and is about 98% accurate.

[mies]

I've read awhile ago about North-American "self-educated doctor" - in reality his professions was very far from medicine, who brought wife from FSU with ulcer, read Wikipedia about this bacteria, tested wife in hospital lab, the bacteria was found, and he suddenly felt like he was a Botkin or maybe even Koch himself - so instead of following the doctor's prescription about antibiotics - he was giving wife double or triple doze of antibiotics, for the full month instead of 1 week. 
On the forum he was bragging for having saved her life with his "highly scientific and medical" approach, with knowledge he found via wikipedia and internet. Even though she was refusing - he was forcing her to take medications.

I guess poor woman was lucky the guy didn't decide to perform surgery of her ulcer, and just was poisoning her with highly toxic antibiotics for the whole month.

Ronnie, I hope this person wasn't you.

[Ronnie]

I've read awhile ago about North-American "self-educated doctor" - in reality his professions was very far from medicine, who brought wife from FSU with ulcer, read Wikipedia about this bacteria, tested wife in hospital lab, the bacteria was found, and he suddenly felt like he was a Botkin or maybe even Koch himself - so instead of following the doctor's prescription about antibiotics - he was giving wife double or triple doze of antibiotics, for the full month instead of 1 week. 
On the forum he was bragging for having saved her life with his "highly scientific and medical" approach, with knowledge he found via wikipedia and internet. Even though she was refusing - he was forcing her to take medications.

I guess poor woman was lucky the guy didn't decide to perform surgery of her ulcer, and just was poisoning her with highly toxic antibiotics for the whole month.

Ronnie, I hope this person wasn't you.

Why in the world would anyone write such a thing?
Please re-read what I posted here.  I'm passing on information that some have found helpful.  You apparently are offended.   God only know why you would take offense at something so simple and straightforward.

I did ask the doctor about the blood tests that my wife has had over the years.  He said the blood only reveals the presence of antibodies to bacteria.  The bacteria itself is not in the blood.  He never mentioned the breath test.  The stool analysis is apparently DNA related.  I don't know how that makes it more accurate but this RUSSIAN gastroenterologist prefers it and prescribes it for every new patient he gets who come from Eastern Europe.  As I said, he himself was found to have it.

I would guess that if on has had it for most of their lives, they might take as normal certain abnormal symptoms.  One Ukrainian lady wrote me from Florida that she was treated 3 years ago and the treatment was successful.  She's very pleased and says she feels better that she ever has.

[mies]

Ronnie, your information is helpful.
The reason I react to it as I do - because you stress so much on the information, and you immediately brought in my memory recollection of another guy from another board who was poisoning his wife because he read "useful information" on the internet and ran into wrong amateur's conclusions. He was giving exactly same advice as you make here "test your FSU wives and cure them from deadly disease!"
I am not offended by your nice post, yet I am still furious about this other guy and feel pity about his wife. Frankly speaking I do not know what's worse - to suffer from ulcer, or to be eating unnecessary "elephant's" dozes of antibiotics.   

If I were you - I would not necessarily claim that the cause of your wife's vomiting was the H pylori bacteria. It might be a food poisoning. Or some other reasons.

[Ronnie]

Ronnie, your information is helpful.
The reason I react to it as I do - because you stress so much on the information, and you immediately brought in my memory recollection of another guy from another board who was poisoning his wife because he read "useful information" on the internet and ran into wrong amateur's conclusions. He was giving exactly same advice as you make here "test your FSU wives and cure them from deadly disease!"
I am not offended by your nice post, yet I am still furious about this other guy and feel pity about his wife. Frankly speaking I do not know what's worse - to suffer from ulcer, or to be eating unnecessary "elephant's" dozes of antibiotics.   

If I were you - I would not necessarily claim that the cause of your wife's vomiting was the H pylori bacteria. It might be a food poisoning. Or some other reasons.

I never called it a deadly disease. 

Further, did I say "You should cure them"? 
I also did not say anything about vomiting though my wife has suffered from what she calls "episodes" thoughout her life.

I suspect you are exaggerating the situation from the other forum just as you have exaggerated what I said here.  No man will bring his wife to his home then poison even if he saw some twisted advantage is attempting that.  He would soon be arrested and spend a long time in prison. 

Listen, if I knew I had the probability of having a harmful bacterium in my stomach, I would want to eradicate it.  Wouldn't you?  So why then are our wives less important that we should not be concerned for them when a doctor who specializes in this field advises testing and treatment.  You should not quarrel with me, I'm only carrying the message for one of your doctors.

[mies]

Further, did I say "You should cure them"? 
I also did not say anything about vomiting though my wife has suffered from what she calls "episodes" thoughout her life.
 

1 moment - let me find the quote from your other post.
Here it is:

I was shocked to learn the high incidence of the condition in Eastern European immigrants and it doesn't go away unless treated with antibiotics apparently.  My wife has had intermittent episodes of vomiting that last two-three days over the years.  Hopefully she can enjoy better health after the treatments. 

unless you made a connection between the bacteria and vomiting - why should you expect that your wife would get better after the treatments?
I do not even discuss how representative is the sample of your wife's doctor. The internet does say that this condition is common, and it is more common in third-world countries with lower sanitary norms, plus people in developed countries may be using too much antibiotics. However, I disagree that the observations of your doctor about disease incidence can be generalized to the whole population of the Eastern European emigrants. The real frequency may be even higher than 75%, but it is scientifically and statistically wrong to make such judgment as you do based on the opinion of one doctor.

I suspect you are exaggerating the situation from the other forum just as you have exaggerated what I said here.  No man will bring his wife to his home then poison even if he saw some twisted advantage is attempting that.  He would soon be arrested and spend a long time in prison. 

 of course he wasn't intentionally poisoning her. He was "curing her", only he lacked the knowledge, and felt too much responsible for the "russian helpless clueless wife". People in barbaric world had many interesting ways to cure diseases, with the best intent. It was unfortunate for the patients that many of those methods were lethal for the patient.

Listen, if I knew I had the probability of having a harmful bacterium in my stomach, I would want to eradicate it.  Wouldn't you? 

some people used to "eradicate" their tonsils, and before that - quite many people used to go through appendoectomia as a prophylactic measure of appendicitis. They believed that appendix is harmful for the body, and can cause death if inflammation isn't treated, so less trouble would be to cut it out beforehand.
As for bacteria - I will not want to treat the condition unless i have problems with stomach. I do not have any at the moment, so why would I start eating antibiotics and poisoning my body, and killing useful bacteria in my stomach?   
Moreover - the wikipedia does not say much about the repeated transmission of bacteria. Probably there are scientific articles which do, I did not specifically look for them. Do you cure yourself from this bacteria once and then you are good? Have a life-long immunity from ever getting infected with bacteria again? Or, for example - you have less aggressive stamm of bacteria in your stomach which occasionally may be causing mild discomfort. You eradicate it with antibiotics, kill (at least partially) the microflora of your stomach, make your liver and kidneys clean your blood from antibiotics, then trying to restore the normal balance in your stomach, and suddenly - you contract in the restaurant or fastfood chain much more aggressive stamm of bacteria. You think you are cured from H Pyreli, but you have it again. And because the newly contracted stamm is more aggressive - this time you develop ulcer, while before you used to have occasional mild discomfort.

(I am writing a science fiction script above, but you got my idea)

You should not quarrel with me, I'm only carrying the message for one of your doctors.

I am not quarreling with you. I am expressing my opinion in response to your "beware" post. I am too young and luckily too healthy to be using "many doctors"


You know - I've heard on a radio a talk of american physician, who told that 3 out of 4 americans in big cities are carrying the genital herpes virus. Do you want to enlighten RWs on this topic too?
 

[Ronnie]

"Piece of work" comes to mind.

[mies]

"Piece of work" comes to mind.

 

[Ade]

As far as I'm aware, the H Pylori bacterium is not universally considered to be "bad" and there are some researchers suggesting that it's just a normal part of the stomach flora.

I think mies has a very valid point in suggesting that you shouldn't try to fix something that ain't broke and having gone through many, many months of antibiotic treatments I can say that unless you really need it, don't take it.

[Ronnie]

Causes and Risk Factors of Ulcer
The stomach defends itself from hydrochloric acid and pepsin by creating a mucus coating (that shields stomach tissue), by producing bicarbonate and by circulating blood to the stomach lining to aid in cell renewal and repair. If any of these functions are impaired it can lead to the formation of an ulcer.

The primary cause of ulcers is the bacterium called Helicobacter pylori (H. pylori). H. pylori is a spiral-shaped bacterium found in the stomach. Unlike other bacterium, H. pylori is able to twist through the layer of mucous that protects the stomach cavity and attach to cells on the surface of the stomach wall, where it produces urease, an enzyme that generates ammonia.

Urease generates substances that neutralize the stomach's acid and allows H. pylori to thrive. H. pylori weakens the stomach's defenses by thinning the mucous coating of the stomach, making it more susceptible to the damaging effects of acid and pepsin; inflaming the area; poisoning nearby cells and producing more stomach acid.


Although H. pylori is the primary cause of ulcers, there are other factors that play a role in ulcer development. These factors are the use of nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs (NSAIDs), a person's lifestyle and the stomach's inability to defend itself against digestive fluids, hydrochloric acid and pepsin.

Source....
http://www.healthscout.com/ency/68/119/main.html

[ScottinCrimea]

Ronnie, A nice little quote from a consumer oriented website certainly doesn't enlighten those of us who have some education in this. A big problem I have with these websites is that they can be easily misinterpreted by those who have limited or no medical education. I find that often these sites do more harm than good, especially in the hands of those who just don't have the background to fully understand them or filter out what is important and what isn't.  Now I'm not saying that you are wrong in trying to educate us here, I'm just saying that maybe you are not the one to be doing it.

I know that some here are busting your chops, and maybe their approach is not the best, but I have to ask, before I make any other comments.  Is there anything about my original post that you disagree with?

[Ronnie]

Ronnie, A nice little quote from a consumer oriented website certainly doesn't enlighten those of us who have some education in this. A big problem I have with these websites is that they can be easily misinterpreted by those who have limited or no medical education. I find that often these sites do more harm than good, especially in the hands of those who just don't have the background to fully understand them or filter out what is important and what isn't.  Now I'm not saying that you are wrong in trying to educate us here, I'm just saying that maybe you are not the one to be doing it.

I know that some here are busting your chops, and maybe their approach is not the best, but I have to ask, before I make any other comments.  Is there anything about my original post that you disagree with?

I am not the source of anything here except to tell you what our doctor said.  If you disagree  and believe the bacterium to be harmless then you certainly have every right and the training to do so.  I can't disagree with your opinion nor have I.  As to consumer oriented websites, I'm sure you are not disputing the content as the responsible ones are careful to get experts to write the content.  It seems your quarrel is that non-doctors are unable to properly interpret the big words.  Nice.  Lawyers have the same attitude.

[ScottinCrimea]

  As to consumer oriented websites, I'm sure you are not disputing the content as the responsible ones are careful to get experts to write the content.  It seems your quarrel is that non-doctors are unable to properly interpret the big words.  Nice.  Lawyers have the same attitude.

I've seen far to many examples to think otherwise.  It's not a quarrel, just a statement, and has nothing to do with big words, just understanding everything in the proper context.

I find your attempts to incite some sort of argument by using phrases such as "big words", "quarrel" and "attitude" to be counterproductive.

[ecr844]

According to our Russian-trained gastroenterologist, nearly 3 in 4 immigrants from Eastern Europe have the H Pylori bacterium.  This seems to be born out by data reporting that half the world's population have it as well. 

H Pylori is often the cause of ulcers and can increase the risk of stomach cancer as well as be the source of chronic stomach discomfort.  The bacterium is picked up usually in childhood from unclean water and fresh vegetables.

Please ask your doctor to check using a stool analysis or other effective test.  FWIW our Doctor said he himself had it when he immigrated and my wife tested positive today herself and will begin two-week treatment regime that is about 85% effective in eradicating it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helicobacter_pylori

I hate to be the bearer of bad news for you but we all have H. Pylori living in our bodies and GI tract...

[ECOCKS]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news for you but we all have H. Pylori living in our bodies and GI tract...

You have a citation for that? I only see 50% mentioned as a number for worldwide infection.

[Markus]

Ronnie,

Thanks for the information. It appears that your intent is only to provide information. I don't find anything offensive
in what you have said. I think it does provide a path of analysis especially if a person from the FSU is experiencing
problems.

I can say that my wife complained of stomach problems a ways back and I finally took her to the doctor. My wife
had an out patient biospy in her stomach and was confirmed to have some redness. The doctor did attribute the
redness to bacteria, but I can't recall the name of it. She took some anti-biotics for it, continued to have the
problem, and then had a stool test done. The stool test was clear of bacteria. Well, my wife got pregnant and
that stopped the tests. But, she is still having the same discomfort so I will mention this information to our
doctor. Thanks for the info.

Mark

[Wild Orchid*]

According to our Russian-trained gastroenterologist, nearly 3 in 4 immigrants from Eastern Europe have the H Pylori bacterium.  This seems to be born out by data reporting that half the world's population have it as well. 

H Pylori is often the cause of ulcers and can increase the risk of stomach cancer as well as be the source of chronic stomach discomfort.  The bacterium is picked up usually in childhood from unclean water and fresh vegetables.

Please ask your doctor to check using a stool analysis or other effective test.  FWIW our Doctor said he himself had it when he immigrated and my wife tested positive today herself and will begin two-week treatment regime that is about 85% effective in eradicating it.

I was diagnosed with this bacteria and I know for a fact that I got it after leaving Russia and i didn't have while I was living there. I've read somewhere that around 70% of population could be suffering from it. There are symptoms that let you know some other members in the family might have it when you know what it is...

My bacteria was diagnosed via blood test. After I finished 1 week treatment I asked how can I be sure it is really gone, I was told that only breath test can reveal that.

[mies]

Ronnie,

Thanks for the information. It appears that your intent is only to provide information. I don't find anything offensive
in what you have said.

I find Ronnie's approach offensive because of the way he named topic "Caution1 Your FSUW is most likely infected with the H. Pylori Bacteria "

He didn't write "Caution1 You and your family are likely to be infected with the H. Pylori Bacteria".

I find his formulation both discriminative and offensive.

[ECOCKS]

Well, it's a forum on FSUW and the infection incidence rate is higher in that region than in the states so it seems fine to me. We aren't WebMD.com here so it needed to be relevant unless he wanted to put it down in Anything Goes.

[mies]

Well, it's a forum on FSUW and the infection incidence rate is higher in that region than in the states so it seems fine to me. We aren't WebMD.com here so it needed to be relevant unless he wanted to put it down in Anything Goes.

sure it's a public forum. Ronnie expressed his views, I expressed mine.
I am not offended by the fact he presents this information here - I also think this info is valuable and thankful that Ronnie shared it. I am offended by the format he'd chosen to share the information.

[ECOCKS]

sure it's a public forum. Ronnie expressed his views, I expressed mine.

Yep, then I expressed mine. Ta da! The system works!