New to the board, but sort of an "old salt" to this endeavor TR

[Doll]

IMO this is the very definition of what a RW means when she says she seeks someone who is 'careful'.

 
There is nothing about RW in particular- any woman would see something else in it.
"Careful" is not the word.
Again, sorry, Chris.

[Doll]

The situation that I am about to find myself in, literally brought a grown man to tears.....

What do you mean?

[myrddin]

Yeah, I guess I am careful to a fault. I can admit, I have other issues as well when it comes to thinking about making a committment. You might even say that I'm a bit of a pessimist when it comes to life. I haven't caught many breaks in life, and always tend to see things in a less-than-optimistic point of view. That's just me. :::shrugs:::

I see some interesting parallels with myself, which is one reason I find your TR so fascinating.  I wrote every day on the first trip and most days on subsequent trips. 

I also have a strong pessimistic streak, but I've recently discovered to my surprise an even deeper streak of optimism, perhaps long dormant to some of those "breaks in life" you mention.  Definitely a strange experience.  It can lead to giving some people too much benefit of doubt, but pessimism definitely doesn't serve us in seeking a good relationship.

While this portion of the report does focus more on the past, by the time we get to the end (in the year 2510), there will be some focus on the present and the future as well. Afterall, if I am to move forward personally, I will have to analyze the past, and see what I can and should do differently to improve myself.

Whenever we look back at previous experience, the lens is colored by what's happened since.  And those lenses change each time you look back.  How long (before this thread) had it been since you reviewed your reports?

I do not consider myself a womanizer, a two-timer, a playboy or anything of the sort. I wrote and visited 2 women in St. Petersburg, Russia, and it has now gotten me into a bind. I am not comfortable with this situation at this point of my story at all. It is not who I am, and I am completely out of my element.

You're not the only one who knows that feeling!

Any of you guys who go over, only you can determine what the best method of contacting ladies is for you. I am a very consciencious guy and I do not want to hurt anybodys feelings.

Visit Many was brutal on my psyche (there was a time I thought I could never do it), even if it seemed necessary.  For some of us, it's not a simple matter of choosing between different strategies, but any pursuit requires focus, honesty, and self-awareness (and a "failed" Visit One can become a VM).

Honesty is also crucial to telling a good story.  Thanks for sharing, Chris, and keep it comin'!

[Chris59]

The situation that I am about to find myself in, literally brought a grown man to tears.....

What do you mean?

Doll, I would think that the "situation" should be obvious. At some point, I'm going to have to choose a lady. Then, in all likelyhood, the other lady may have hurt feelings, and that isn't going to make me very happy either.

=========================================================================================

I see some interesting parallels with myself, which is one reason I find your TR so fascinating.

 

Thank you! I knew that there would be other guys with "parallels" similiar to mine. That's really the people who I am trying to connect with here. After this story plays out, then I will be able to compare notes and observations with guys who had similiar experiences to mine, and maybe even have some of the same hesitations that I have had. [/quote]

I also have a strong pessimistic streak, but pessimism definitely doesn't serve us in seeking a good relationship.

I actually thought that my pessimism comment would bring out more of the critics. You know like,..."Well, that's your entire problem, you're never going to marry anybody with that attitude,..blah, blah..."!
However my pessimism comes from life experiences I have witnessed (such as that my own parents didn't have a successful marriage, my sister didn't have a successful marriage, and many friends I know who are now either divorced 2-3 times, or admittedly miserable in their present marriages), and my professional career path, which has changed several times over the course of my lifetime. One of the biggest factors holding me back is that I am just not comfortable enough in my career position to make that next step. Don't get me wrong, I have a decent job (for now?), as a software analyst/ instructor at my company. I test software and provide support of such, and have recently been made an instructor to teach the seasonal technicians that were hire every year. However, the company is not doing well financially, and the future is quite uncertain. I love my job, and considering the lack of technical positions in SW Florida, I feel lucky to have it. The salary, while decent for a single guy, is presently not adequate enough to consider bringing a lady over from the FSU. The man should expect to take full financial responsibility for his lady for the first several years, until she is either ready to get a job of her own, or the two of you have mutually decided that she would prefer to stay home, and be a housewife. Guys, this is HUGE,....and should not be underestimated!!! So, for me, this is a major concern of mine, and the present economy has not made me feel any more optimistic. My company has already shed a ton of jobs, all around me, but fortunately for me, due to my conscienceness and work ethic, I have pretty much avoided this economic downturn (for now?). Any change in jobs would probably require relocation to another region of the country, which I am ok with, but the thought of selling my house in SW Florida right now is a joke, at best. So there! That is a major concern of mine, that transcends more than just my emotional involvement with these women. Guys, don't underestimate the financial commitment that you will be required to make, when considering bringing home a foreign bride.

How long (before this thread) had it been since you reviewed your reports?

Ehhh, maybe a couple years, but I had read them so many times, that I practically remember every detail from my first two trips, day by day.

Visit Many was brutal on my psyche (there was a time I thought I could never do it), even if it seemed necessary.  For some of us, it's not a simple matter of choosing between different strategies, but any pursuit requires focus, honesty, and self-awareness (and a "failed" Visit One can become a VM).

During all my years of reading RW-type boards, many of the guys advocated having some type of backup strategy,...I.E., phone numbers of other women, write two, or write three and visit them all, or at the very least, have a good agency that you can immediately inquire to, or have a membership with, in the event that things don't work out with the ladies you've been writing to.
"myrddin", I thank you for coming forward, and I DO look forward to reading YOUR trip report(s)!

Despite the criticism that I have taken here, I really do not think that my situation is all that unusual. Afterall, I traveled to St. Petersburg,, Russia, met only 3 ladies, and to this point, I just didn't feel quite right about each and every one of them. As "JR" stated, I have probably passed on many good ladies, and these were all "good ladies" in a sense, and I'm sure they'd all make great wives for someone, but I just didn't feel that I was that someone.

Thanks to everyone for their comments!

[Doll]

Look, you are just planning your failures!
 "I am not having the "right" job, I am not going to support my family, I am not going to find the ideal lady, she is not going to be happy with me, she will hurt my feelings, etc."
Man, it is time to deal with life - take a risk. Take a risk like ALL people do and stop whining. Make the best of what you have. Come on, buddy, you're 50.
You're just stuffed with fears!

[Doll]

Look. My present husband was raised in poverty with no father (he never saw him),
had to start working when he was 11, was in Vietnam, got through college, got married, two kids, an UGLY divorce after 15 years of marriage (his ex took his kids away). Sounds like the end of the world (and it was in a way). Yet he tried again and again. Finally went to Russia to search for a wife. He was your age (50) when we got married again. He is one stubborn guy! He was not looking for the excuses- just kept going. He had to support two kids and pay his ex a lot for the house. Lost money and kids!
See the difference? The only difference is that he does not fear to deal with life.
We've been married for almost 8 years. Is it one ideal family? No way. Do we sometimes hurt each others feelings? We do. So what? Nothing, life is going on- kids are growing ( he actually got one more- my son), job is still there, I work. Did he have any guarantees? No. Did he know it would be tough sometimes? Yes , he did. Did he whine? Nooooooooooooooo!
How is he different from you? Same age (when he remarried), more responsibilities.
Same country!
Ohhhhhhhhh, don't tell me he was not serious about marriage and commitments!
He did not fear- this is the thing.

[JR]

I don't think your situation is all the unusual either. My first and only trip to the FSU to "meet" I met five. You certainly aren't in a position to be called a sex tourist or anything like that.

But I do think you need to look at yourself and ask why it is that you are still without a significant other. Being picky isn't a bad thing. Neither is having high standards. But my guess (educated...as in been there, done that) is that you are always holding out for "something else." I won't say more since I think you've got enough on the ball to attract some decent women. However I do think you may have commitment phobia. Have you had any LTRs?

Another thing. Don't use the "I don't have enough........(fill in the blank) to get married to an FSUW." It doesn't wash unless you're after gold diggers. There are plenty of women out there that have had to make due with a lot less than you can provide for them.

[JR]

Look, you are just planning your failures!
 "I am not having the "right" job, I am not going to support my family, I am not going to find the ideal lady, she is not going to be happy with me, she will hurt my feelings, etc."
Man, it is time to deal with life - take a risk. Take a risk like ALL people do and stop whining. Make the best of what you have. Come on, buddy, you're 50.
You're just stuffed with fears!

OMG Doll, you and I are SOOOOOOO on the same page And yes it's scary LOL!

[Chris59]

Sorry Doll, but I think you have a way of exaggerating my situation. Have I made a few excuses? Yeah, I have, and I think that anybody who has read this far gets that! You seem to find a way to criticize everything about my story, at every twist and turn. I would just prefer to have my ducks in a row before I ever choose to get married. Different strokes for different folks! Everybody has their own priorities in life and to varying degrees. Marriage isn't a HUGE priority for me! I don't absolutely HAVE to have someone in my life everyday. Many people fear the thought of being alone. They will get married to the first reasonably decent person that comes along. Being single is something that I do not fear. I'm ok with being single,....in fact it's going to take a special lady to change that for me. I've always been of the belief that you get married when you meet someone that you cannot live without. I'm not going to just settle for somebody who does not make me feel that way. I know many men my age who are single, so my situation is not all that unusual.

Isn't it a bit ironic that my most vocal critic here is a female? Afterall, you even admitted you would've dumped me too after only 7 days together. It seems like even you were expecting me to make a committment to Nina S. after only spending 7 days together. Sorry, that's just not enough time for me! So, do I have concerns and excuses, yes I do! We all understand that! We don't need someone driving that home with a hammer!

Ok, Doll,....I apologize for my rant,....your husband is a remarkable man having achieved everything he has in his life, and despite my previous comments, I'm sure he's lucky to have you.    

[Chris59]

So, Nina S. asked me what I did yesterday, on the day that we had no contact. I wasn't certain exactly how I was going to answer that question, but I knew that the only option I had was to tell her the truth. At first, I told her that I hung around the apartment for most of the morning, then went down to Nevsky Prospekt for a couple hours. I also told her that I had dinner with another lady that night too.I explained that when she walked out on Sunday night without an explanation, and didn't call by late morning, what was I to assume? Afterall, Nina S. and I still do not know each other that well, so how was I supposed to know what her intentions were? In retrospect, I probably should've called her Monday morning, but in all honesty, I was a bit upset at her, considering that she didn't even want to stay and talk about it.

Nina S. then inquired about the lady that I had met. I told her that I had just met her for dinner last night, and that she seemed like a very nice lady. I then told Nina S. that Elena had invited me to attend a show with her at the Mariinsky Theatre, to which I had already accepted. Nina S. said that I would enjoy the theatre, and I asked her if she enjoyed attending the theatre, and she responded that she did not. Neither one of us seemed to want to discuss whatever was the root of the problem on Sunday, and I certainly didn't want to try and pry any information from her. If it was truely just "little things" as she had said earlier, then I saw no reason to bring it up anymore. Nina S. had at least returned to her normal self, and was even somewhat understanding that I had decided to meet Elena.

Nina S. and I only spent a few hours together on this day. She was tired and still a bit sore. She also needed to cook something for her son, so we did not spend much time together that day. The entire time that we did spend together, was cordial, but somewhat awkward. I sensed that we both had some guilt for each of our actions the previous 2 days. Since I would not be going to the theatre with Elena until Wednesday evening, I invited Nina S. to call me Wednesday morning, and we could spend some time together.

[Doll]

OMG Doll, you and I are SOOOOOOO on the same page Smiley And yes it's scary LOL!

It is OK- full moon 

[Doll]

your husband is a remarkable man

No, he is not. 90% men are like him.

[Doll]

Sorry Doll, but I think you have a way of exaggerating my situation.

Me?
 
Who said this?

The situation that I am about to find myself in, literally brought a grown man to tears.....

You did.

I

sn't it a bit ironic that my most vocal critic here is a female?

Nothing ironic because one of your problems IS women and how to deal with them.

After all, you even admitted you would've dumped me too after only 7 days together. It seems like even you were expecting me to make a commitment to Nina S. after only spending 7 days together. Sorry,

Me too. I mean I am sorry either. It is not 7 days "together", it is 7 days plus 8 months and some time before.

[Doll]

Another thing. Don't use the "I don't have enough........(fill in the blank) to get married to an FSUW." It doesn't wash unless you're after gold diggers. There are plenty of women out there that have had to make due with a lot less than you can provide for them.

Agree 100%

[SMS60]

Chris

Very interesting read. Lots of information to digest.

What would you hope men who are reading this would take from your report? If any?

Your report is more about the interactions or relationships with the women than say the logistics.

Do as you?
Dont do as you?

What message are you trying to convey?

[AnastassiaAsh]

This is a very interesting read, Chris! Thanks for your story. Brings lots of memories.

As to why you are still single, this is why:

I would just prefer to have my ducks in a row before I ever choose to get married. Different strokes for different folks! Everybody has their own priorities in life and to varying degrees. Marriage isn't a HUGE priority for me! I don't absolutely HAVE to have someone in my life everyday. Many people fear the thought of being alone. They will get married to the first reasonably decent person that comes along. Being single is something that I do not fear. I'm ok with being single,....in fact it's going to take a special lady to change that for me. I've always been of the belief that you get married when you meet someone that you cannot live without. I'm not going to just settle for somebody who does not make me feel that way. I know many men my age who are single, so my situation is not all that unusual.

Having all ducks in a row won't help as your priorities are not right. A lady shouldn't change your view, it's ridiculous, it's you who should pursue a lady actually and convince her! Both of you absolutely HAVE to really want to marry FIRST, in general, be ready for this step in your heart and mind, then all other circumstances will come into place too. I personally think with this kind of thinking you don't have a right even to start corresponding with anybody, you are not ready for so many reasons. How sad and at the same time unfair to yourself and other women! You think that finding that perfect woman will change your mind. No, not at all, only you can and only you should BEFORE corresponding and traveling. You have to analyze why you are ok being single... Do you agree?

[Chris59]

Very interesting read. Lots of information to digest.
What would you hope men who are reading this would take from your report? If any?
Your report is more about the interactions or relationships with the women than say the logistics.
Do as you?
Dont do as you?
What message are you trying to convey?

We are all individuals, what works for some, isn't necessarily what works for others. I guess the message I'm trying to convey is:

1. Go to the FSU and enjoy the culture there with someone in that area. For the first trip, don't even think about marriage. Don't become a "1-week wonder". Just enjoy the company of the person(s) that you met, and allow her to play hostess to you in her country. Always be a polite guest,....to her and anybody else she may introduce you to. Their opinions will weigh heavily on her opinion.

2. Upon returning home, step back and evaluate. Your head will return from out of the clouds. THEN, start to evaluate whether or not the lady(ies) you spent time with might make a good life partner for you. Keep in touch with her, if you believe such might be the case. The time spent in the FSU can be a very emotional time, and your judgement could become clouded. As "JR" stated, "evaluate and re-evaluate"

3. If you believe you have interest in the lady there, travel there again soon, hopefully much sooner than I did. This will allow you to be sure that the person hasn't changed, or hopefully you will learn more about her on your second visit. You MUST spend more time together. Letters don't cut it in the long run.

4. Don't be in a hurry to get married. Personally, I would prefer to take the time to really get to know the lady.

5. Whether you interpret my trip report as "Do as I do" or "Don't do as I do",....only YOU can know what's right for you. Personally, I'm comfortable waiting for the right one to come along. I've even pushed the envelope by traveling to a region of the world, where I perceive that a higher percentage of the females fall into that "right one" for me category. Ok, I met 3 ladies in the FSU, and one of them proved very close to being "right" for me,....probably even closer than I had expected. It actually caught me by surprise. So, if you travel to the FSU, you might very well fall in love,.....just be ready for it when it happens, cause it may have even happened to me,....yes ME!

[Doll]

Doll is being quiet (so far)- taped her mouth 

[Phil dAmore]

We are all individuals, what works for some, isn't necessarily what works for others. I guess the message I'm trying to convey is:

1. Go to the FSU and enjoy the culture there with someone in that area. For the first trip, don't even think about marriage. Don't become a "1-week wonder". Just enjoy the company of the person(s) that you met, and allow her to play hostess to you in her country. Always be a polite guest,....to her and anybody else she may introduce you to. Their opinions will weigh heavily on her opinion.

2. Upon returning home, step back and evaluate. Your head will return from out of the clouds. THEN, start to evaluate whether or not the lady(ies) you spent time with might make a good life partner for you. Keep in touch with her, if you believe such might be the case. The time spent in the FSU can be a very emotional time, and your judgement could become clouded. As "JR" stated, "evaluate and re-evaluate"

3. If you believe you have interest in the lady there, travel there again soon, hopefully much sooner than I did. This will allow you to be sure that the person hasn't changed, or hopefully you will learn more about her on your second visit. You MUST spend more time together. Letters don't cut it in the long run.

4. Don't be in a hurry to get married. Personally, I would prefer to take the time to really get to know the lady.

5. Whether you interpret my trip report as "Do as I do" or "Don't do as I do",....only YOU can know what's right for you. Personally, I'm comfortable waiting for the right one to come along. I've even pushed the envelope by traveling to a region of the world, where I perceive that a higher percentage of the females fall into that "right one" for me category. Ok, I met 3 ladies in the FSU, and one of them proved very close to being "right" for me,....probably even closer than I had expected. It actually caught me by surprise. So, if you travel to the FSU, you might very well fall in love,.....just be ready for it when it happens, cause it may have even happened to me,....yes ME!

1a) On your first trip, keep a journal so that when you return home you are able to better sift through your experiences.  Many men on their first trip suffer from a type of stimulation overload that prevents them from remembering the more important details of the trip.

So many lovely women, classic architecture, museums, theater, history... all of it can be overwhelming. 

Take notes on every trip people... you will need them later if for no other reason than it will help you write a thrilling, detailed trip report and you are NOT going remember everything.

[Makkin]

Chris59,


   You make some good points and interesting points about things and situations in your life and I'm hoping everything goes well for you.


    Maybe that "leap of Faith" awaits you in future and pieces will come together in a way that leaves you happy,married,with children,and most importantly it will having you looking fondly towards your happy life of the future.

Yours,

Makkin

[myrddin]

1a) On your first trip, keep a journal so that when you return home you are able to better sift through your experiences.  Many men on their first trip suffer from a type of stimulation overload that prevents them from remembering the more important details of the trip.

Take notes on every trip people... you will need them later if for no other reason than it will help you write a thrilling, detailed trip report and you are NOT going remember everything.

Some excellent advice there.  Write things down as soon as you can!  I was absolutely shocked at what "unforgettable" things I managed to forget on that first trip.  If you ever think, "Oh, I'll remember *that*!", write it down immediately.

On later trips, "in the field" reflections about ladies I met were indispensible parts of my quest.

[BillyB]

So many lovely women, classic architecture, museums, theater, history... all of it can be overwhelming. 

If a guy was just going to pick a city in the FSU to look for ladies, I'd say St. Petersburg is the best place. It's got everything, museums, tourist attractions, history, culture, beauty, and the highest percentage of beautiful women that I've seen. An excellent place to search for romance. The only problem there is they have a high percentage of women who smoke which turns me off.

Take notes on every trip people... you will need them later if for no other reason than it will help you write a thrilling, detailed trip report and you are NOT going remember everything.

No kidding. I'm trying to remember 3 of my past trips in my thread because I didn't take notes. My brain hurts. Another reason to take notes is if you find your special lady, you want to hang on to the memories.

[JR]

Doll is being quiet (so far)- taped her mouth 

Ohhhhhh I'm not gonna be able to do that..............

[JR]

Chris, if you don't have this verbage in your first few emails to the ladies you write to then you are not being honest with them the way you are to us. To do any less than include the following statement is misleading them because your true intentios are:

"I would just prefer to have my ducks in a row before I ever choose to get married. Different strokes for different folks! Everybody has their own priorities in life and to varying degrees. Marriage isn't a HUGE priority for me! I don't absolutely HAVE to have someone in my life everyday. Many people fear the thought of being alone. They will get married to the first reasonably decent person that comes along. Being single is something that I do not fear. I'm ok with being single,....in fact it's going to take a special lady to change that for me. I've always been of the belief that you get married when you meet someone that you cannot live without. I'm not going to just settle for somebody who does not make me feel that way. I know many men my age who are single, so my situation is not all that unusual."

This probably sounds famaliar to you. It should, they are your words. I will wager that none of the ladies you wrote/visited understood this about you before agreeing to correspond/meet you.

[Doll]

This probably sounds familiar to you. It should, they are your words. I will wager that none of the ladies you wrote/visited understood this about you before agreeing to correspond/meet you.

I am pretty sure Nina did understand it so it explains the way she acted.
If I understand it after I read a couple of chapters of Chris then she definitely did it after 8 months. RW are very smart (AW too though)
 So far I have two questions to Chris: had you have LTR before you started searching in Russia and another question is why did you look abroad? You were 42 by that time, so what happened before? Why Russia? Trips to Russia are expensive, you say you're not that wealthy (something like that).
I hope to not hear again about "fulfilling relationships with RW" because women are women everywhere. There are millions of smart, pretty, intelligent AW. I meet them every single day here.