Expensive gift question...

[Lily]

Aloe, the girl in question told 'consciously', not 'conscience', if I correctly remember. To me the word 'consciously' in given context would mean 'сознательно'. You know what the meaning of this word is, don't you?

As far as 'совесть' is concern, IMO it is a really complicated thing. But of course, she might have used this, why not. I find it however a bit strange how someone in Oz would exhibit some 'совесть' toward a girl in Russia. Совесть would require some existing duty toward the girl in Russia, which he apparently failed to fulfill, and therefore, to compensate for what he owes her, he sends money. Something like that.

But we can only guess what was meant by this word now.

[Aloe]

Aloe, the girl in question told 'consciously', not 'conscience', if I correctly remember. To me the word 'consciously' in given context would mean 'сознательно'. You know what the meaning of this word is, don't you?

As far as 'совесть' is concern, IMO it is a really complicated thing. But of course, she might have used this, why not. I find it however a bit strange how someone in Oz would exhibit some 'совесть' toward a girl in Russia. Совесть would require some existing duty toward the girl in Russia, which he apparently failed to fulfill, and therefore, to compensate for what he owes her, he sends money. Something like that.

But we can only guess what was meant by this word now.

Here is what he wrote:

I saw the laptop in a video taped with her mobile phone, she told me it's not hers but of another girl. I didn't suspect a thing. After some 30 minutes, without any reason, question, pressure or suspicion, she announced this to me. I asked her why she told me, she said "consciousness"... She is 20 years old so it holds true as I see and feel it. Also, this happened after I met her mother, which is a serious move by both of us...

then Gator wrote:

If she meant conscience,  that is a good sign.

Then the original author wrote in reply to Gator:

It was "conscience"...

Conclusion: The author misspelled conscience in his first post, got corrected by Gator, he read back and realized he made a mistake and corrected himself that she really said conscience, look in Lingvo, the translation is совесть.

As for how its applicable to that specific situation, here is what the OP wrote, plus the correction he made in his next post:

I saw the laptop in a video taped with her mobile phone, she told me it's not hers but of another girl. I didn't suspect a thing. After some 30 minutes, without any reason, question, pressure or suspicion, she announced this to me. I asked her why she told me, she said "conscience"... She is 20 years old so it holds true as I see and feel it. Also, this happened after I met her mother, which is a serious move by both of us...

So he is asking her: "why did you tell me?", and her answer is "conscience", because at first, 30 minutes before that, she lied to him, so why did she tell him?? Because her conscience was bothering her.

Again, what could possibly be unclear there?

[Aloe]

So to clear it up, in case somebody got confused from this bizarre conversation;
Conscience most definitely has a russian counterpart, a normal, widely used word, a great quality of a human being, the ability to distinguish between right and wrong and worry when you do something wrong, and it is called совесть.

[Lily]

 Okay, I must have confused between consciousness and conscience, sorry about that.

To my Russian understanding, совесть would mean that someone owes something to another person, isn't it right? that someone should have done something toward someone else, but failed to do it, and now wants to compensate for it?

[Aloe]

Okay, I must have confused between consciousness and conscience, sorry about that.

To my Russian understanding, совесть would mean that someone owes something to another person, isn't it right? that someone should have done something toward someone else, but failed to do it, and now wants to compensate for it?

I don't think so. If an otherwise polite person who is having a bad day says something rude to someone or yells or something, then he will feel later "угрызения совести", because he was rude. Doesn't mean he owes someone, he just acted rude and feels bad about it, совесть мучает. Or a person whose children are starving, goes and steals money somewhere, he will also feel very bad, совесть замучает, not because he owes anyone, but because he did something very bad and completely against his moral set, because his child is hungry. Of course he will also suffer from his совесть if he doesn't provide for his child, and in that case he does owe the child some food and shelter. So it is for both cases when you owe and fail to provide, and for when you do something bad and feel bad about it.

[Aloe]

However the case of owing someone something and failing to provide and feeling bad about it falls into the big category of doing something wrong and feeling bad about it. So really it is doing something wrong and feeling bad about it, and owing+failing+feelingbad is a small part of the big category of wrong doings.
A person who owes and fails may NOT feel bad about it, and that means he has no совесть. According to your definition he does have a conscience, because he owes and failed and maybe compensated, but THE important component is feeling bad about it. Without feeling bad there is no совесть. You may owe and fail all you want and not feel a damn bit sorry if you are a bastard, that doesn't mean you have a conscience, altho the 3 parts you named - owing and failing and compensating(for a wrong reason) are present.
The same bastard who owed and failed and wants to compensate (because he realizes that in the eyes of humanity he did something wrong), but in his own eyes he did nothing wrong, he is only compensating for another reason, he still has no совесть then. He may have compensated because the court ruled so, for all we know, it doesn't mean he has a совесть

[Aloe]

So to sum it up, совесть has more to do with having the ability to FEEL that you did something wrong, rather than actions themselves.

[GoodOlBoy]

So to sum it up, совесть has more to do with having the ability to FEEL that you did something wrong, rather than actions themselves.

Your explanation of the word Aloe makes it sound like the best applicable word given the OP's version of the story, HOWEVER....I personally don't believe conscience, morality or anything else caused her to suddenly "tell the truth". I believe she got "busted" by the OP, plain and simple.

And if the OP decides to stay with this 20 year old (which I don't suggest), he had better keep his eyes wide open for more expensive items (jewelery, perfume, electronics, etc.) that might "mysteriously" appear in his girlfriends room/flat and of course any future "free holidays" that she might attend.


GOB

[Misha]

And if the OP decides to stay with this 20 year old (which I don't suggest), he had better keep his eyes wide open for more expensive items (jewelery, perfume, electronics, etc.) that might "mysteriously" appear in his girlfriends room/flat and of course any future "free holidays" that she might attend.

I agree with you there. I liked the way that Groovlstk phrased it:

Someone smarter than me once pointed out that lies are like cockroaches. If you see a few, you can be pretty sure you're place is infested w/them behind the walls

[JR]

33-20 not an overwhelming age gap, but she almost certainly has much growing up yet to do. 

and now, you need to sacrifice a chicken to the Goddess of Fortune... so that she doesn't use that computer to find you here.  :evil:

That would probably spawn some interesting posts on her RW forum! 

I can say AMEN to that!!!

[acrzybear]

I agree with you there. I liked the way that Groovlstk phrased it:

Walter Scott; Marmion, Canto VI. Stanza 17:

Oh! what a tangled web we weave
When first we practise to deceive!

[SFandEE]

This situation just affirms the intrigue of being in a long-distance relationship with a woman from FSU.

Relationships with someone familiar and with strong local associations that are familiar are complicated enough--throw in all of the other challenges and it creates and image for me of a bit of a circus act.   One of the positive things about RWD is those posts from men and women who have been able to create a relationship (short to long standing) that works.

Hopefully the expertise in getting there is coming through in our contributions to this forum.

[Shadow]

After readong a bit some thougths come to mind.

1. It is perfectly possible for a girl to meet a guy for 2 days and not have sex.
Especially as I very much doubt someone from Australia would fly to Kiev for 2 days meet one woman and fly back, it is very likely she was one of a WMVM trip.

2. As they have been meeting frequently over the past 5 months, she would understand that this lie would not last, as why would her friend constantly lend her a laptop ? There for she needed a better explanation.

As for the downside, she was continuing to write him, meaning she might not be fully convinced awarerwd is her perfect guy.

So some questions for the OP:

1. Did you meet only her mother, or more family/friends ?
2. Did you visit where she lives ?
3. What are your plans for the future of the relationship, and have you mentioned them to her ?

[Zmejka]

Or just how does one HIDE $600 in a postcard from OZ to Ukraine?  Maybe a greeting card in an envelope?  Maybe 6 $100 bills?  I dunno.  I'm trying to think of a guy just putting $600 into the UA mail system and thinking it will arrive intact

Once 2 girls sent an envelope with $5 in it in a postcard to Russia (one from Ukraine, another from France) - neither arrived. So i also doubt that such amount of money arrived intact in an envelope.
About notebooks - a virtual correspondent once offered to send a notebook to my friend just after 2 weeks of correspondence. She denied it, but that offers can happen.
I think that girl is still playing around and discovering her options on "foreign market" at this age. But i don't say she can't become (or already not) serious. I was 22 when meeting my current friend, i was not serious first but he made me change my mind. So i wish the OP luck!

[mies]

we are both discussing seriously about having some future if we try first to live together for a rather long period of time...

Was it your idea? or hers?

I do not see what a 20yo girl can potentially benefit from living with a 32yo guy together for a very long period of time.
You've got to either marry her, or she will keep looking around until she meets a man serious enough to be ready to commit.