New guy here, questions on dating sites Ukrainedate and russiancupid

[Anotherkiwi]

From the people who have been to both countries, is there a completely different vibe when crossing the borders from Russia to Ukraine? Is one generally more welcoming, friendlier, and /or  more hospitable than the other?

I honestly didn't notice any real difference, but that's pretty much the case wherever in the world you go.  As I've written many times before I'm an architecture buff - I love looking at beautiful buildings, so cities normally win hands down over small towns or villages.  For me St Petersburg is number one of those that I've visited, followed by Kyiv, Moscow, Kazan and Rostov-na-Donu.  Apart from one Police Registration official in Naberezhnye Chelny, and an Aeroflot staff member at Sheremetyevo airport who screamed at me incomprehensibly simply because I had followed another staff member's instructions about where to wait, the people that I met were always welcoming (in both countries).  In many cases they were able to tell me about the buildings or area that I was visiting.
 
I always felt that it was an advantage that I do speak a little bit of Russian - not much, but enough to "survive" as my night school teacher described it.  I even got smiles from shop-keepers and street stall-holders - a very rare event, so we're told  !  If you avoid western Ukraine, where speaking Russian (according to this forum) seems to be bad form, I honestly believe that it will pay you in the long run to learn at least the basics of the language.  It's absolutely imperative that you learn the alphabet, so that at least you can figure out where you are by looking at the street signs when you get lost!

[Shadow]

From the people who have been to both countries, is there a completely different vibe when crossing the borders from Russia to Ukraine? Is one generally more welcoming, friendlier, and /or  more hospitable than the other?

In my courting time I visited both Kiev and Moscow to date women that lived there. Strange enough they were all sincere and not spoiled. However they did have options with wealthy local guys they denied, which is why I mentioned that if you need to impress with anything else as yourself you may avoid them.

At the time the main difference between Kiev and Moscow was the state of the infrastructure and public areas. In Moscow they obviously had more money to spend on it.

The center of Kiev actually seemed quite small, as walking around all main places was a possibility. As for the people, they are more close as they wish to admit.

[Faux Pas]

Gator,
Out of those four cities, did you develop a liking for any of them in particular?

All are great cities but have little to do with your quest, no? If you're looking to relocate perhaps dissecting the quality of the cities makes sense. Otherwise, not so much. Are you over looking the fact that there are quality women in all cities?

[cc3]

  If you avoid western Ukraine, where speaking Russian (according to this forum) seems to be bad form, I honestly believe that it will pay you in the long run to learn at least the basics of the language. 

If you avoid western Ukraine, especially L'viv, you will be missing one of the best parts of Ukraine.

...and ...they won't bite your head off there if you speak Russian. L'viv gets thousands of Russian tourists every year.

[Boethius]

Kiwi is right, though.  It is not about whether the locals will respond to you.  It is bad form to use Russian in a region where everyone speaks Ukrainian, not Russian.

[Daveman]

Kiwi is right, though.  It is not about whether the locals will respond to you.  It is bad form to use Russian in a region where everyone speaks Ukrainian, not Russian.

Yes. It probably is bad form, but they generally do speak Russian more and better than English, so one should communicate however he/she can in whatever language both understand.


If they didn't understand English, which was always my first try, I explained that I can't speak Ukrainian and asked if we could speak in Russian.. That was always met with an enthusiastic YES... Then we could communicate... I can't recall even one being slightly offended by communicating with me in Russian..

[Boethius]

Dollars make the difference here.   

[Daveman]

Dollars make the difference here.   

 


Indeed!

[GQBlues]

Kiwi is right, though.  It is not about whether the locals will respond to you.  It is bad form to use Russian in a region where everyone speaks Ukrainian, not Russian.

Ha-hah! Yet it isn't bad form to speak Russian when everyone else speaks English? 

[Boethius]

Seriously, it is just a matter of respect to learn a few simple phrases in the local language, such as "hello", "thank you", "please", "good day", "good evening", and "good bye".  I wouldn't speak Ukrainian in Russia.

[Daveman]

Seriously, it is just a matter of respect to learn a few simple phrases in the local language, such as "hello", "thank you", "please", "good day", "good evening", and "good bye".  I wouldn't speak Ukrainian in Russia.

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Well, yeah. Perhaps I assume the obvious too often.  That is, that regardless of where one travels, taking a few minutes to memorize a few polite words and phrases in the local language or dialect is a given..  I consider those phrases "polite", but not really meaningful (other than showing a bit of respect) communication.

Ha-hah! Yet it isn't bad form to speak Russian when everyone else speaks English? 

Funny how that seems to work out that way, isn't it??    I just glad we have no scientific experiments growing on our counter tops here yet.

[ML]

As I understood it . . . the people in Western Ukraine don't mind at all if you speak to them in Russian . . . provided you are not a Russian.

Once they know you are a westerner, they are happy to speak to you in any language that the two of you can converse in.

[Boethius]

I think a decade ago, maybe even five years ago, that was true.  I don't think that is the case anymore because of economic conditions.  I read one comment in a Russian paper from a tourist who was in L'viv, and was stopped by the police.  He said "Oh, he didn't understand me at all, until I pulled out some rubles.  He was fine with taking the rubles, and his Russian language comprehension moved from zero to full fluency."

[cc3]

I took my native Russian speaking fiancee (from Luhansk) and future stepdaughter to L'viv this summer (for their first ever visit). As educated people they are also fluent in Ukrainian. My fiancee continues to study Ukrainian at the university level. When we arrived in L'viv, they immediately switched to speaking in Ukrainian, easily and fluidly.

[2tallbill]

I am planning to go with the write many visit few (WMVF) method.

If you go WMVF you should NOT get exchange more than a couple of letters
before you get on a plane. You are just establishing enough to get a date
to have a cup of coffee. If you exchange many letters and skype then the
the girl has an time and emotional investment in you and will not be ok with
you meeting other girls.


If you are going WOVO then you write and skype extensively before meeting.
Exchange life stories, get to know her family, pets, favorite songs, books and
everything you can about her (and her about you) before flying over no more
than 3 months from first skype.


What you are doing is using WOVO strategy pretrip for a WMVF trip which is
a big mistake in my opinion.


The next part of globe trotting around Russia and Ukraine on mini WOVOs
for a period of weeks is a bad idea in my opinion as well, because it will be
impossible to keep the various girls in the dark about what you are doing
and you will be spending large amounts of time and money on trains,
planes and automobiles and not in front of a girl.


So here is my advice if you want to do a WMVF trip.


1. Pick a city 


2. Get a brand new email account


3. With this new email account get a new Facebook page without any
friends or family on it.


3. Join Mamba with this Facebook page.


4. Write up a nice profile with some current photos


5. Become a premium or VIP member and put $25 on your account


6. Cruise every girl who speaks some English who isn't married that
seems interesting.


7. Wait until 10 days before you leave and write each of these girls and
ask if they would like to meet you for coffee or tea.


8. Arrive in your chosen city and buy a local phone for $35 or so and
put some minutes on it (maybe another $25)


9. Start making dates with any girl who answers your coffee letter and
start writing more.


10. If there isn't chemistry then DON'T date them again.


11. If you don't think that she would be an excellent candidate to
marry then don't date them again. No matter how beautiful or sexy
she is.


12. Shortly you will find a girl who likes you that you find head and
shoulders above the others. It probably will not be the girl you thought
it would be from seeing her photos and profile and E interaction.


13. Date that girl until either she becomes your excellent girl friend with
future marriage possibilities or if she becomes not an excellent candidate
then stop dating her immediately and don't recycle through the other girls
find new ones.


14. The others were 2nd place girls and you need a first place
girl. So start writing new girls. The 2nd place girls will not want to be 2nd
place either so don't do it. Most WMVM guys recycle girls I highly recommend
that there was a reason that she was second place and DON'T do it. 


Don't use a WOVO strategy when you are going WMVM. Don't be globe trotter


OR


Go WOVO with my 14 step plan above as a back up






Udachi!


Bill

[Shadow]

As I understood it . . . the people in Western Ukraine don't mind at all if you speak to them in Russian . . . provided you are not a Russian.

Once they know you are a westerner, they are happy to speak to you in any language that the two of you can converse in.

It is the same thing you encounter in the French part of Belgium. They pretend not to speak Dutch (though all education is bilingual) however once they hear you are Dutch instead of Flemish from the accent in French they suddenly develop language skills.

Having said that, Ukrainian is not so far removed from Russian that people can not understand each other each speaking their native language.