Tips on Donest'k

[JR]

  All in all a pretty rough place, akin to Oakland or Compton but maybe even rougher.  Some of that crap spills over into Donetsk on occasion, so, don't be a dork and keep your eyes open.

Thanks Eric. But I stood on the corner of Crenshaw and Imperial Hwy for 3 days during the L.A. riots with a loaded M-16. Came close to having to shoot a guy at a roadblock, stopped a riot at a check cashing place when they ran out of money, I bench press over 230 lbs, I can run back to back 6 minute miles and well I'm just an overall amazing guy. I haven't had a serious contender since SuperMan died. Oh yeah and I'm modest too

But seriously, thanks for the heads up. I'll use what little smarts I've got and simply not bother with Makeevka.

[Sculpto]

Thanks Eric. But I stood on the corner of Crenshaw and Imperial Hwy for 3 days during the L.A. riots with a loaded M-16. Came close to having to shoot a guy at a roadblock, stopped a riot at a check cashing place when they ran out of money, I bench press over 230 lbs, I can run back to back 6 minute miles and well I'm just an overall amazing guy. I haven't had a serious contender since SuperMan died. Oh yeah and I'm modest too

Actually JR.. that is EXACTLY why I brought it up.  You are not superman.  Not that I wish anything negative to happen, on the contrary, but in some respects Donetsk can be a rough and tumble kind of place.  I love it there, will gladly visit again one day.. but it is not a place to think you are invincible.

[JR]

Actually JR.. that is EXACTLY why I brought it up.  You are not superman.  Not that I wish anything negative to happen, on the contrary, but in some respects Donetsk can be a rough and tumble kind of place.  I love it there, will gladly visit again one day.. but it is not a place to think you are invincible.

Did you not understand that was a joke? I am confident and capable but I am not stupid. I know the value of avoidance.

[Daveman]

Actually JR.. that is EXACTLY why I brought it up.  You are not superman.  Not that I wish anything negative to happen, on the contrary, but in some respects Donetsk can be a rough and tumble kind of place.  I love it there, will gladly visit again one day.. but it is not a place to think you are invincible.

Maybe so, but it didn't come across that way to me. I spent quite a bit of time walking the streets, even after dark, etc., and I saw nothing which would differentiate donetsk from any other Ukrainian city in terms of roughness or whatever.  Mobs of people in the center for the summer holiday celebrations (city anniversary, Ukrainian independence day, and one other which I can't remember what it was for).  Not a single incident that I witnessed. I don't doubt there is mischief to be had if one goes looking for it, but the general "you're in a foreign country, so act like it" approach should be enough to keep anyone safe there -- common sense, mind your own business type thing.

[Alex from Ukraine]

Here are some photos of a monastery mentioned...

[Sculpto]

Maybe so, but it didn't come across that way to me. I spent quite a bit of time walking the streets, even after dark, etc., and I saw nothing which would differentiate donetsk from any other Ukrainian city in terms of roughness or whatever.  Mobs of people in the center for the summer holiday celebrations (city anniversary, Ukrainian independence day, and one other which I can't remember what it was for).  Not a single incident that I witnessed. I don't doubt there is mischief to be had if one goes looking for it, but the general "you're in a foreign country, so act like it" approach should be enough to keep anyone safe there -- common sense, mind your own business type thing.

Dave.. thats what I saw also.. yet my friends were always on the lookout.. the Nigerians and the Ukrainians.  And, what I saw in Makeevka was real.  But, I ultimately do agree.. donetsk is a nice place.

[GlobalEuphoria]

Hi there. If you like soccer, i advise you to go to the stadium and watch a game. There is a beautiful stadium, the best in Ukraine, which was opened recently and i think it is worth seeing. Even Beyonce was singing there  Also, if you will have some free time, you could go to Svyatogorsk. Beautiful town, close to Donetsk (Donetsk region) with nice, old churches, some of them located in the hills(chalk hills). Very quiet and peaceful place. I think, you will enjoy Good luck!

  Yet another reason to love Mila.... giving some respect to soccer. 

  To the OP, you should give it a go...especially if you've never been to a European match. There is also Metalurh Stadium which hosts the other team from the city. Stadium is small and cozy, great place.

[Shostakovich]

Places to see in Donetsk!

In a nutshell, the train-station, leaving Donetsk.   

Sights of Donetsk: slag-heaps, air-pollution, girls carring bags with names of designers whose clothes they can not afford, run-down buildings from the '50s made during the soviet era when workers pilfered cement for their own projects.  Still there is a rather nice promenade in downtown.  There is the obligatory statue of Lenin.  The memorial commemorating when they kicked out the Germans is worthwhile - can see the pall of smoke from the smelting factories that hangs in the air.  Being from Chicago I thought the Chicago nightclub was an entertaining sight.  I did not go in.  I could only imagine the tedious gangster & blues-man theme.  Oksana took me to a restaurant for 'food of the Kings' -- basically lox and bagels. 

I did enjoy the Ukraine but Donetsk is an arm-pit, the Gary, IN of the Ukraine.  And what do you do in Gary?  Go to Chicago - at least you have the real one there.

But it's interesting from the sociological point of view.  Interesting to see what the girls are trying to get away from.  Lots of shady characters in Donetsk.  Do watch your step.

Sh.

 

[Sculpto]

Interesting to see what the girls are trying to get away from. 

Strange comment considering the MOB is barely in existence in Donetsk.  I don't see people in a hurry to leave.  Just about everyone I talked to liked living there.. its quiet and relatively peaceful.. not a hard place to live.

I was there for the entire month of August.  Air quality was not an issue.  Outside of the cleaned up part of town it is pretty dumpy, but, why leave the center at all?  Its nice.

[kievstar]

I like Donetsk but I will tell you I have never met a person in Ukraine outside of Donetsk who would live there.

August not a good month to judge on air quality as industry is not running full steam do to the vacation period.

There is a lot of money in Donetsk.  I know my wife will not live there and I really wanted to live there but she told me not good for family there. 

[Nat]

August not a good month to judge on air quality as industry is not running full steam do to the vacation period.

Our industry is ALWAYS running full steam So if it didn't bother you, than it wasn't so bad comparing with other cities. Well, of course air condition is not very good in Donetsk - but you know, when I was in Krakow, I could smell metallurgical plant with the same scent like it has here, so it depends which city you compare with

As for the rest of Shostakovich's post - well, pretty weird post to tell the truth. Shostakovich, may be you visited Donetsk a very long time ago?

[Sculpto]

I like Donetsk but I will tell you I have never met a person in Ukraine outside of Donetsk who would live there.

August not a good month to judge on air quality as industry is not running full steam do to the vacation period.

There is a lot of money in Donetsk.  I know my wife will not live there and I really wanted to live there but she told me not good for family there. 

I was wondering about the August thing.. not many smokestacks were belching.  I am curious though, why would your wife think it is a bad place for a family?  I saw so many young families there everywhere I went. 

I also suspect there is bias against Donetsk in other places in Ukraine because of Yanukovich and the image of being anti Ukraine/ pro Russia.  When I was there an encampment against the Orange Revolution had been in place on the square for months.  Those guys were promoting a return to communism.  Most young people walking by just ignored them, but, you could see lots of old people at their tables signing petitions.

[Sculpto]

Our industry is ALWAYS running full steam So if it didn't bother you, than it wasn't so bad comparing with other cities. Well, of course air condition is not very good in Donetsk - but you know, when I was in Krakow, I could smell metallurgical plant with the same scent like it has here, so it depends which city you compare with

As for the rest of Shostakovich's post - well, pretty weird post to tell the truth. Shostakovich, may be you visited Donetsk a very long time ago?

Nat.. I was surprised that the air DID NOT stink.  My friends told me it is because there are so many trees planted in Donetsk.. they clean the air...

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[Shostakovich]

My trip to Donetsk?  Aug. 2004.  Can't believe it has changed much since then.  The pollution was terrible, from the War memorial you could see it weaving through the city like a yellow-brown fog.  Because of the mining the water table is polluted with PCBs, often the hot water to the Soviet era apartment blocs did not work, the stairs to my apartment had unequal risers and unlevel treads: made climbing them fun.  Buses were rusted out - looked like from the '60s, the parks I went through were strewn with bottles, unmowed.  Oksana said there are more wealthy people in Donetsk than in Kiev - who control what is left of the mining and smelting industries, perhaps it's a rich and poor city.  I'll always remember the sad little pineapples in the market below my apartment, all withered and dried out, the merchant hoping someone would still buy them.  And then the public market, with the meats on display, covered in flies.  Crikey.

It's unfortunate about Donetsk.  I don't see any reason to paint the place with some sort of halo, because they have a nice but unremarkable downtown.  Detroit has some nice buildings too.  It's like one of our rust-belt cities.  Was once an engine of Soviet expansion.  Got hit double with the fall of the SU and when Ukraine declared independence - lost its biggest customer.  In any event Russia found more gas and oil.  Oksana said that when the miners lost their employment they went to work anyway - did not know what else to do.   

As for the people, well, I did not have close contact with many.  I saw shady characters, but plenty of what seemed to be regular folk, like anywhere - gray mostly, some happy, some miserable.  Oksana was afraid for me - said I was brave for coming to the Ukraine.  I did not feel threatened but she was very keen to hide my American nationality.  In fact the family visit to Oksana's turned out to be something of a bust.  They put on a big deal for me but her mother is not a great cook and so I had to try to choke down rather hearty fare at what, for me was about 2 a.m.  All the while her sister was trying to sabotage it by turning on some Eminem music video while eating - Oksana slapped her down and put on Tchaikovsky.  Another meeting at my apt. turned out much better.  Oksana, as it turns out was quite a good cook.  Had some fish dish that was quite yummy.  Her friend and family was over too.  Very well behaved and sweet boy her friend had - understood English perfectly.  Her friend's husband did the Ukrainian thing, deadbeat Dad for awhile but eventually got back on to the program.  Seemed like a happy family.  I was quite impressed by the quality of tailoring and press of the clothing.  It's a big deal in the Ukraine and they evaluate you by what you wear.

Anyway, it's just a perspective.  I spent all of two days there, so I am hardly an expert.  It was an interesting tour nevertheless but it is always that way when a tourist.   

     

[Nat]

Nat.. I was surprised that the air DID NOT stink.  My friends told me it is because there are so many trees planted in Donetsk.. they clean the air...

But it really stinks rarely - it depends on the wind Sometimes cars stink 10 times more than the plant And besides, it depends on which part of the city you're in. The city center is the area where you can sometimes smell the plant. But if you're in the area closer to the airport, the air is better there. Residential area has the best air but I personally wouldn't like to live there
Anyway we had Japanese children here, who came on a tour, and they said "Wow, you air is sooooo clean, not like in our city", which was very very weird, because to be fair our air is way far from perfect 

Shostakovich, well of course the city has changed since 2004 - a lot of streets in the center were rebuilt, a lot of buildings were renewed, but I think that if you didn't like it for the first time, you won't like it next times It can happen with any city

[Shostakovich]

 

Rack it up to the wind.  Maybe I was there on an unlucky day.  Looked pretty bad though.  Anyway, apart from the girl, Donetsk did not strike me as a destination. 

[JR]

Rack it up to the wind.  Maybe I was there on an unlucky day.  Looked pretty bad though.  Anyway, apart from the girl, Donetsk did not strike me as a destination. 

It strikes me that Donetsk isn't a destination for vacation as much as it is a place to leave for vacation

[Sculpto]

Donetsk did not strike me as a destination. 

That is exactly what made it attractive to me.  No hordes of bride seekers like in Odessa.. in fact.. hardly any foreign people at all.  Made it a really awesome experience and created lifelong friendships because of it.

Not for everyone though... one needs to be a bit more independent and adaptable and perhaps with a higher risk acceptance level.

[Shostakovich]

Are there hordes of bride seekers in Odessa?  It seems that is where I am headed next.  So I'll have to duke it out with winsome Stephan, hipster from LA or perhaps jolly Bob, 'just plain folks'  from Dubuque for the lovely hand of the beautiful Ludmilla.   Woe is me.

Ah, yes: Donetsk for the adventurous few.  Ahem.

[Sculpto]

Biggest industry in Odessa is tourism of bride seekers and the scammers that live off them.  Despite that, its a pretty awesome small city.  I would go there just for fun.  Get away from the MOB industry and the people are pretty cool.  Great alt music scene there and a decent art scene.