Meeting with a Pro-Dater. My Story.

[SANDRO43]

Now back to topic, I put some photos on here too. I do have photos the interpreter and her friend Kristina too, if people would like them on here aswell.links to the girls Profiles:
http://www.natashaclub.com/Tenderisme.html
http://www.a-pretty.com/lady/46305.html
http://www.anastasiadate.com/profile-free-sexy-Russian-woman-Anastasia-1112734.htm

She's listed as being 19 y.o. . How old are YOU, Handycam72 ?

[Handycam72]

She's listed as being 19 y.o. . How old are YOU, Handycam72 ?

I'm 36, I was aware of the age gap in the beginning, but in our correspondence that soon vanished. Also my parents have 16 year age gap and they been together 50 years next year, so not done them any harm

[SANDRO43]

I'm 36, I was aware of the age gap in the beginning, but in our correspondence that soon vanished.

Which means either she's very mature for her age - fleecing you to the tune of $2,431+ (not counting travel, etc.) - OR you're very immature (to use a gentle word) for yours . You're lucky GoodOlBoy hasn't been around for a while here, he'd have had VERY scathing words for your expedition .

Also my parents have 16 year age gap and they been together 50 years next year, so not done them any harm

And was you mother 19 when she met your father ?

[ECOCKS]

I'm 36, I was aware of the age gap in the beginning, but in our correspondence that soon vanished. Also my parents have 16 year age gap and they been together 50 years next year, so not done them any harm

36 and 19? Right.

Denial and rationalization rears its ugly head....again.

Best of luck to you.

[remiel6]

I think I will run and hide before the age gap bullets start flying again 

[valence]

Notwithstanding the age gap, she weighs in at a minimum of a solid 8.  Lighting and ambience could yield a 9, but call it an 8 to be on the safe side.  That basically means the guy has to weigh in at about a 6.  Possibly a 5 if he's seriously minted and/or athletic.  But I doubt a 19 yo would go less than a 5. 

At 30 over 8, certainly, but not 19 over 8. 

Handycam, you're not seriously minted, so do you weigh in at 6+?  I don't know the answer, but if not, then you're punching above your weight; and that means ding ding ding ding, bee bah, bee bah, bee bah, bzzzzzzzt.

[Faux Pas]

She is a Hammer but c'mon man, she's 19. I have underwear that old. She is obviously a pro-dater from your description and quite frankly Handycam, you got what you asked for. Besides the fleecing aspect, did you learn anything about chasing 19 yr old skirts?

[UTRO]

Svetlana and I are 16 years appart too Handy..... but there is a huge difference between me being 46 and her 30, vs you being 36 and Nasty 19!
It has been said over and over and over again on this Forum that a girl younger than, at least, 25 is way too immature for an older man. A 19 year old has barely finished high school. She's still discovering herself and hasn't lived life as an adult yet.

[Handycam72]

And was you mother 19 when she met your father ?

She was 18, not that it matters.

I had the impression this site was a friendly place, now I mention my age and her age, all of a sudden I'm being judged as "immature", "way out of my league" and also it seems my financial position is being judged on what little imfo you have about me.

I would not normally go after a 19 year old, yes they are still discovering about life. But I take each person on their individual merits and do not pre-judge, or put labels on people. I met many 18 -24 year olds for example that have more intelligence and more muture than people I know in there 40's and 50's.

As for the actual cash outlay, I do not care for it. It concerns me that people who can ill afford it will fall into this trap. Although now I am thinking why should I bother.

[Turboguy]

Don't let any negative comments bother you.  Most of us get them from time to time.   Actually you got off pretty cheap.   I had one gal I took out to dinner in Moscow.  The bill was $ 650 and my dinner was about $  60.   I made a follow up trip to St. Petersburg to see a gal I met on a European Connections tour and every lunch and dinner tab hit over $ 200.   I spent $ 3500 on the ground (no air or hotel) in 5 days.  I was giving her $ 65.00 each way for taxi and when I followed her one evening I found she was taking the metro.   Might have been worth it if I was getting more than a good night kiss but no.   It happens and we all can get it.

Just to take a little pressure off you some of the most sincere gals I dated in the early part of my search were 19 years old and I was a lot older than you.  The two gals I talked about in the first paragraph were in their 30's 

[UTRO]

Handy, I don't think you're being judged. Guys are simply giving you free advice. Everyone's different here and how they express this advice varies from 'kid gloves' to 'tough love'. I would say that you were tought a good and valuable lesson on your Trip. Now learn from that lesson.
I learned from my own!
It takes a Big Man to write the Report you did. You pointed out all of the Red Flags and you know what went wrong. Don't make excuses for what happened. Accept what happened. Great advice from yourself to others!
My two cents..... English speaking girl, no Agencies, Educated ( that means above 24 ) and Working. Someone who is open to the idea of giving up all to be with her Man in the West
Most impotant of all, don't give up.

[Faux Pas]

She was 18, not that it matters.

I had the impression this site was a friendly place, now I mention my age and her age, all of a sudden I'm being judged as "immature", "way out of my league" and also it seems my financial position is being judged on what little imfo you have about me.

It is a friendly place. But that has no bearing on members speaking their mind just as you have yours. Everyone here are all ages, shapes and sizes and with different opinions. That doesn't make them right or wrong or you either.

I would not normally go after a 19 year old, yes they are still discovering about life. But I take each person on their individual merits and do not pre-judge, or put labels on people. I met many 18 -24 year olds for example that have more intelligence and more muture than people I know in there 40's and 50's.

Then why did you go after this 19 year old? I concur with some of what you are saying here. I hang out from time to time with my kids and their friends. Most of them think I am a pretty cool old guy. I find many of them interesting and fun and very intellectual, I wouldn't date any of them though. They're older than your Nastya and I am older than you.

Handycam, you were scammed no doubt about it. You were the mark, the prey and the fish. They saw you coming and it doesn't seem that you yet, realize why? I emphasize "they"

As for the actual cash outlay, I do not care for it. It concerns me that people who can ill afford it will fall into this trap. Although now I am thinking why should I bother.

The cash outlay is really immaterial isn't it? IMO you got what you deserved chasing a pipe dream and a 19 year old at your age. You were not realistic. Your reasons are your own. Would you have deserved it if she were 28-36? IMO no.

FWIW you could have tossed that kind of money out at most any 19 year old in your country and she would have removed you from it too.

[Handycam72]

I agree it is more "they" than her. She is just the bait to pull you in. I kind of wonder what they tell her and others like her.
"Don't worry they will sooner vanish than say anything once they realise what is happening, you will make some good money"
Of course it his her photo and details that get published not the people who manage the whole thing, so they can happily carry on.

Like I said earlier, all this goes in the folder marked Experience, and it has in no way made me give up.

[groovlstk]

I had the impression this site was a friendly place, now I mention my age and her age, all of a sudden I'm being judged as "immature", "way out of my league" and also it seems my financial position is being judged on what little imfo you have about me.

Handycam, it's natural in the wake of a story like this that people will try to frame it up and figure out where you went wrong. Some guys will try to find fault with you because it bothers them on some level that such sharks are swimming in the same pool where they are looking for romance, and this makes them uncomfortable. Others will take you to task for feeding the sharks (and they have a valid point).

Regardless, I'd guess any unkind comments you get here are nothing compared to the beating you gave yourself when you realized you were used and then tossed away, so don't sweat it.

[remiel6]

The age comments will come. I'm glad you have not decided to give up. I agree with you about not putting everyone into the same folder. Each person should be judged on who they are. I think the warning that needs to be made is that sometimes some girls just have the ability to make you put them in one folder when the only folder they belong in is the trash bin. I make no excuses for people who engage in the activities you describe. The girl knows what she is doing, and she knows its wrong on every level. Now how to avoid them, that is the million dollar question. To some here they will tell you that you can avoid a lot them by avoiding the 19 year olds, and they have a very valid point. At least you know what to look for.

[Faux Pas]

I agree it is more "they" than her. She is just the bait to pull you in. I kind of wonder what they tell her and others like her.
"Don't worry they will sooner vanish than say anything once they realise what is happening, you will make some good money"
Of course it his her photo and details that get published not the people who manage the whole thing, so they can happily carry on.

Like I said earlier, all this goes in the folder marked Experience, and it has in no way made me give up.

To them you are just another sap. An older guy with money to burn and loins longing for the fresh 19 year old. I too am glad you are not letting this experience take you out of the game. I caution you to be realistic. You don't have any business chasing 19 year olds unless you are 19. They have the scent and attraction of a woman but, they're not. She's not a woman. She was a pretty picture

I realize much of the attraction of this caper to many guys that do it is purely bagging a woman much younger and more attractive than they could get back home. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that as long as they remain realistic. Handycam, you really have to take a long look in the mirror and ask the man you see, is this realistic? Not what you want it to be or hope it to be but really, is it realistic? Most of all you have to answer with complete honesty. Thats not the easiest thing to do for many people.

[Misha]

http://www.a-pretty.com/lady/46305.html

According to this profile, she is 19, a lawyer by profession and in her education profile she notes "graduate school." This is perhaps a good example of how in reading a profile can sometimes provide useful information as to whether a woman is authentic. Yes, students in Russia usually start their university studies a bit earlier, but there is no way that she could somehow have gotten a 4, let alone 5, year degree and then started her graduate studies all by the age of 19.  

[remiel6]

You are correct Misha, I think, not always, but often a person with Ill intent will let you know of their ill intent. They won't come out and say that "hey, I am going to scam money out of you", but they will say something that does not quite add up. To me these numbers do not add up. I do not know if Law is an advanced degree in the Ukraine. I know it is not in all countries, which might offer some explanation, but I doubt it.

[TwoBitBandit]

I had the impression this site was a friendly place, now I mention my age and her age, all of a sudden I'm being judged as "immature", "way out of my league" and also it seems my financial position is being judged on what little imfo you have about me.

Handy, the thing you have to realize is that most of the membership here does have your best interest in heart: some people just deliver it with a different tone than others.

The worst, bluntest, most direct tongue-lashing from the most vile guy here is nothing compared to the meat grinder that "the system" can put you through if you bring the wrong one over.  If you can't take the heat in this environment, you're really not going to like what our legal system can do to you.

I've been flamed on these boards a couple of times.  Despite the occasional obnoxiousness of their delivery, my fellow posters are often making a valid point.  If you can't put on a thick skin and try to "get" the content of the posting regardless of the tone, you don't have the right mentality for this endeavor. 

In a way, I admire your honesty here.  I've certainly made mistakes, and I've gone home and licked my wounds in private instead of posting them on this board.  We've all made mistakes in this endeavor.  Yet, the degree you got taken was extreme. You should have figured out this scam on day 1 or day 2, but instead you let it run its course.  Really, really, think through what you're doing and how you're going about it.

The risks to you are real.  Choose carefully.

[Misha]

To me these numbers do not add up.

No, they don't. Young women would usually start their degree when 17 years old (give or take a year) and study 5 years (21-22 years) before starting their graduate studies. She couldn't have gotten into a graduate program with only a two year college degree. Somehow, she allegedly got her degree and then went off to graduate studies by the tender age of 19.... I don't think so Men should pay more attention to these things.

[CallMeSasha]

According to this profile, she is 19, a lawyer by profession and in her education profile she notes "graduate school." This is perhaps a good example of how in reading a profile can sometimes provide useful information as to whether a woman is authentic.

at first i wanted to point this out but i refrained incase the scammers ever drop by this site

[RussianWind]

No, they don't. Young women would usually start their degree when 17 years old (give or take a year) and study 5 years (21-22 years) before starting their graduate studies. She couldn't have gotten into a graduate program with only a two year college degree. Somehow, she allegedly got her degree and then went off to graduate studies by the tender age of 19.... I don't think so Men should pay more attention to these things.

Misha right. But let me remind you two things (not about this girl but in general). Girls' English is normally not brilliant and the educational system on the east is something completely different from the west, I mean we understand different things saying "bachelor" or "master" etc.

Look at French profiles, they are all masters. Do they have higher education? Not of course, they just have different understanding of master degree.

I also do not believe in professors at the age of 30

[Handycam72]

Hello to you all, and thank you for your comments so far, including the direct and forthright, I still love ya 

We did talk about her education very early on in our correspondence and during my visit, and there was nothing suspect at all.
She is now just starting her 3rd year of her degree then she has another 2 years study for her Masters. I made the comment that she would then become a high flying lawyer, she told me that it would be about another 8 years before she could practice law on her own, in other words, have her own Law Practice.

From my experience, profiles on dating sites are never the most honest.

[Johnny2009]

All three websites she is featured on look pretty awful (All three look like little gold mines for the owners with very little thought into providing success for male users, just preying on lonely mens dreams), has anybody ever had success from these sites?
Bottom line is, she is a very, very good looking girl (and "girl" is the operative word) at very least an "8" maybe "9" on the scale, unfortunately until people "date in their own league" this kind of thing will always happen.
Regardless of any criticism, I certainly respect the OP for telling the story, but most would have bailed out on this girl after day 1.

[Misha]

Look at French profiles, they are all masters. Do they have higher education? Not of course, they just have different understanding of master degree.

Maybe, but in Russia and Ukraine you would do a five year degree ("diplom") before doing graduate studies ("kandidatura"). In Russia they only recently introduced 4-year bachelor's degrees. I can't see translation being an issue here. 

Yes, people lie on dating profile, but I would add that little lies you can easily spot are usually a good indicator of the existence of other bigger lies that are harder to catch until it is too late