Moscow Night Life

[BC]

Beavers .....Russian women.....a great example of a dichotomy.

Would 'Legs' make a trichotomy?  I'd go there instead..

[Mir]

Don't think you have to be fluent enough to read Tolstoy in Russian before you get on an airplane

Not sure what you mean.
I think one can be quite good at conversational Russian and yet reading Russian literature will be well beyond his/her capabilities.
A much higher level of Russian is needed to read literature and understand it then being able to speak it.

[BC]

Not sure what you mean.
I think one can be quite good at conversational Russian and yet reading Russian literature will be well beyond his/her capabilities.
A much higher level of Russian is needed to read literature and understand it then being able to speak it.

My wife reads Tolstoy and says it's quite difficult to get through.

[shakespear]

Not sure what you mean.
I think one can be quite good at conversational Russian and yet reading Russian literature will be well beyond his/her capabilities.
A much higher level of Russian is needed to read literature and understand it then being able to speak it.

Of course you're right.  Obviously you're not a native speaker so you might have misinterpreted my comment.  Most Americans will understand that I was using the humor technique of understatement to make my point.  The point being it's not a requirment that you be fluent enough in Russia to read and understand Tolstoy in the original Russian text in order to get on an airplane to visit the country.

Hope that makes more sense to you now.      

[Mir]

BC

Exactly.
Even native Russians find Tolstoy taxing.
Much more fun to read Chekhov, Gogol or Bulgakov (in English as well).
Then maybe Tolstoy reads better after a night out in Moscow

[shakespear]

My wife reads Tolstoy and says it's quite difficult to get through.

Probably as hard as Melville is in the english language.  I got the "Call me Ishmael" part but the rest was a blur.  

[Jooky]

This thread is too funny.  

Just the thought of taking the metro all the way out to Mariyno for some Buffalo Wings while you're in Moscow is ridiculous for the audience on this forum. If I was stuck in Moscow for a month or so and craving a good pizza and boobies, sure, but for most of the men on this forum? :noidea:

Shakes, I've been to most of the places you've listed. I think they're ok suggestions for guys that want contact with the expat community or are just looking to get laid. I wouldn't take a date, especially one that I was just getting to know to most of these joints. There are many far more romantic, comfortable and enjoyable spots in my opinion.

Do you have any recommendations for romantic night life that's appopriate for a man taking his potential bride out on dates?

[shakespear]

Just the thought of taking the metro all the way out to Mariyno for some Buffalo Wings while you're in Moscow is ridiculous for the audience on this forum. If I was stuck in Moscow for a month or so and craving a good pizza and boobies, sure, but for most of the men on this forum? :noidea: 

20 minutes each way tops from Chkalovskaya Metro.  Most guys who live outside the center spend more time on the Metro just getting into the center a couple time each day.  I just inform.  BTW, I'd call it a good "casual date place". 

Do you have any recommendations for romantic night life that's appropriate for a man taking his potential bride out on dates? 

Sure.

Cafe Pushkin

If you're looking for a place to really impress a date, or for a place that serves classic Russian cuisine in czarist style and are not too cheap to pay the price, then I can highly recommend dinner at Cafe Pushkin (26a Tverskoi Bulvar 229-5590)

Imagine traveling back in time to 19th-century Moscow. Staff members dress like 19th-century servants.  The menu is written in old church Slavonic lettering.  All the favorite classic Russian dishes can be found here -- blini, caviar, pelmeni.  The food is delicious.  Menu prices are definitely on the high end, especially for Russian food.  Prices rise with each floor (there are three) of the restaurant; you can dine on the roof in summertime and it is a very pleasant experience.

Here is a recent review from the expat underground newspaper "the eXile":

"THE place to take visiting relatives footing the bill for a taste of passable Roosky food. Schreck described breaded veal as closest thing to Sublime in months. Two babes dining alone at the next table were a close second. If you've got the dough, all-in-all the most impressive "haute rus" cuisine. Black caviar with bliny
($23) melts in your mouth. Excellent solyanka ($9), pelmeni, and main courses."

Personally while the food was excellent, I found the experience a bit haughty and pretentious.  I'm not really into paying $15 for a plate of simple Russian pelmeni, no matter how well prepared.  The place was filled with tourists and overdressed wide-eyed deyvs with their western boyfriends.  But it's definitely one of those places you need to visit, if for nothing else just top say you've been there; ESPECIALLY if somebody else is paying the bill. 

Your date will definitely be impressed if you take her there.  When you tell her you're taking her there be prepared that she will "dress to the nines" for the occasion.  Men,that will mean sport coat, dockers, collared shirt and tie for you at the minimum.  Oh, and since she's so dressed up, she'll probably expect for you to take her to one of those pretentious elitny clubs I've talked about in previous post.  Get ready for the wallet to take a serious hit.     

[Jooky]

Cafe Pushkin

Any others? Come on, there's got to be a lot in between Pushkin and 'Hooters'.  

Also, what do you think the chances are for an average foreigner 40+ (a typical reader here) of getting into a high 'Feis Control' club, without connections?

For a guy on a first or second trip to Moscow, bringing a date to a club just to stand in line for an hour to eventually get turned away is a huge waste of time and perfect way to ruin an evening.

[Gator]

Any others? Come on, there's got to be a lot in between Pushkin and 'Hooters'. 

I.  My favorites for the in-between:  

1.  Correa's (just south of central Moscow, about one km or so south of the Baltchug Kempinski Hotel) http://www.correas.ru/en/

2.  Courvoisier (mentioned in Reply 42 and 45 of this thread) http://www.waytorussia.net/Moscow/ClubsChill.html (which says that it has declined and all the beautiful people moved next door to Ogni).

3.  City Grill (California rolls) http://www.citygrill.ru/

My wife loves Sushi and there were a couple places that served excellent preparations not costing $$$.  Sushi is so popular among Muscovites that the Sushi places are not only competitive, they must stay on their toes.

We also ate frequently at a Moroccan restaurant in a mall west of Prospekt Mira near the third ring.  If interested, I can get an address.  No English menus, which is a good sign IMO.

II.  A level above the Pushkin to avoid the tourists) and celebrate something special such as becoming engaged, and wanting European food:


1.  Mario $$$$ (west of central Moscow, between garden and third rings,  on a small street and not easily found) very romantic  http://www.fodors.com/world/europe/russia/moscow/review-37468.html

2.  Vanil' $$$$ (near Christ the Saviour, in fact nice view)

Warning, you can get hurt.  I made the mistake of suggesting a fresh lobster at Mario. The lobster was perfect and cost $200.  But there are moderately priced (by comparison) pasta dishes and the setting is romantic.  Not a good place to take a young date if you are an old goat because the place is filled with wealthy old goats and young women wearing jewels and fashions that may give your date wrong ideas.   

Caveat:  Shakespear thinks I don't get out enough.  And this information is 2 years old at best.

 

[Phil dAmore]

Not sure what you mean.
I think one can be quite good at conversational Russian and yet reading Russian literature will be well beyond his/her capabilities.
A much higher level of Russian is needed to read literature and understand it then being able to speak it.

I read 'Anna Karinina' in Russian... It took over a year and I wore out two highlighters and a dictionary to do it. 

The impression left upon me was that as an author, Tolstoy is vastly over-rated.  'AK' would have been a much better book if it had been half the length.  Any author that takes 3 paragraphs to describe what a dog is thinking is, IMO, padding the storyline.

Anna was a despicable woman.  By the end of the book I was ready to throw her under that damn train myself!

[Sculpto]

Why would anyone travel halfway around the world to a country with a highly evolved cuisine and limit themselves to seeking out chicken wings and pizza?  God, there is a ton of good food in Moscow.. shewarma street stands.. all the different Georgian and Armenian places.. the BEST Russian food.. and all the interesting mashup places that come and go from the scene quite rapidly. 

Ricardo.. I was half teasing when I said you were hedging.. and I totally understand the allure of Latin women and the complexities you have encountered.  However, if I understand what the "turn off" is correctly, you may end up feeling the same in the FSU.  As one forum member has often described to me there is a missing moral compass that goes back to the USSR and the destruction of old fashioned moral values, plus, a very strong survival instinct.  I advise caution in your quest in this regard.

Shake.. if you read Ricardo's posting, he was very specific about NOT wanting to frequent the kinds of places you have described.  So, you radvice about staying inside the ring because thats the "real" Moscow is misguided.  And frankly, stinks of the elitism and tunnel vision you have expressed in your other posts.  Tell me Einstein, how could a night club at the end of a subway line in an area where foreign people almost never go be any less "real" than some stuffy trend spot inside the ring road?  On the contrary, such places are populated by people who live in said area and who do not often go "downtown" and that in and of itself made my experience in said club that much richer as no one was expecting a foreign person to be there and as such I got a lot of positive attention.  At downtown spots no one cared one way or the other..

[Sculpto]

Any others? Come on, there's got to be a lot in between Pushkin and 'Hooters'.  

LOL.. I doubt he knows.

[OlgaH]

I read 'Anna Karinina' in Russian... It took over a year and I wore out two highlighters and a dictionary to do it.  

The impression left upon me was that as an author, Tolstoy is vastly over-rated.  'AK' would have been a much better book if it had been half the length.  Any author that takes 3 paragraphs to describe what a dog is thinking is, IMO, padding the storyline.

Anna was a despicable woman.  By the end of the book I was ready to throw her under that damn train myself!

Dear Phil, a thinking dog in "Anna Karenina"? I think you have misunderstood something   Yes, dogs are a "part" of the people life in the novel. A hunting scene is interesting to read. But there are no thinking dogs    Probably there are some parallels  

Quote from "Anna Karenina"

"He felt that men would crush him as dogs strangle a torn dog yelping with pain. He knew that his sole means of security against people was to hide his wounds from them... "

[shakespear]

Why would anyone travel halfway around the world to a country with a highly evolved cuisine and limit themselves to seeking out chicken wings and pizza? 

Why would anyone go all the way to Moscow and eat at a frickin' McDonalds?  But western men do it everyday.  Why?  Because it's familiar.

Russian food is "highly evolved cuisine"?  You're kidding right?

[Phil dAmore]

"He felt that men would crush him as dogs strangle a torn dog yelping with pain. He knew that his sole means of security against people was to hide his wounds from them... "

It is highly possible that I misunderstood that passage Olga.  Thank you for the clarification.   

[OlgaH]

It is highly possible that I misunderstood that passage Olga.  Thank you for the clarification.  

Phil, you are welcome. There some scenes that are devoted to Levin's old dog Laska in the novel. But all that lyrical digressions mostly characterize the Levin's nature through the relation with his dog.   And I think it is also important for understanding of the novel's heroes.
As you have been learning Russian and I hope you are still interested to continue there is another passage regarding a  dog in the novel that probably could be misunderstood during translation of a dialog

    

Старая Ласка, еще не совсем переварившая радость его приезда и бегавшая, чтобы полаять на дворе, вернулась, махая хвостом и внося с собой запах воздуха, подошла к нему, подсунула голову под его руку, жалобно подвизгивая и требуя, чтоб он поласкал ее.
   - Только не говорит, - сказала Агафья Михайловна. - А пес... Ведь понимает же, что хозяин приехал и ему скучно.
   - Отчего же скучно?
   - Да разве я не вижу, батюшка? Пора мне господ знать. Сызмальства в господах выросла. Ничего, батюшка. Было бы здоровье да совесть чиста.
   Левин пристально смотрел на нее, удивляясь тому, как она поняла его мысли.

Old Laska, who had not yet fully digested her delight at his return, and had run out into the yard to bark, came back wagging her tail, and crept up to him, bringing in the scent of fresh air, put her head under his hand, and whined plaintively, asking to be stroked.
"There, who'd have thought it?" said Agafea Mihalovna. "The dog now...why, she understands that her master's come home, and that he's low-spirited."
"Why low-spirited?"
"Do you suppose I don't see it, sir? It's high time I should know the gentry. Why, I've grown up from a little thing with them. It's nothing, sir, so long as there's health and a clear conscience."
Levin looked intently at her, surprised at how well she knew his thought.

[Gator]

Russian food is "highly evolved cuisine"?  You're kidding right?

Eric, I think Shake got you.  Evolved?  Russian kitchen has evolved to 101 ways of serving sour cream.  McDonald's burgers ( I admit to dining once with the kids) are loaded with even more mayonnaise than in America.  

What are the highlights:

-  Borscht, and it does hit the spot on a cold day.  However that would be like declaring Cincinnati cuisine outstanding because of its chili.

-  Caviar.  Hmmmmm!  How Slavs discovered caviar beats me.  The Vikings trading on the Volga must have taught them.

-  Pimeni.  But that is nothing more than a glorified potsticker.  However, when the kids complain that they are hungry it is a miracle.  Mama yells, "Take some Pimini from the freezer and boil it."

-  Blini.  Yes but I prefer the fried sour cheese.  My stepkids now eat it with maple syrup rather than sour cream.

-  Salty fish.  Please!!! How can such beautiful women eat such vile stuff,  their glorious eyes shining and their lustrous soft hair hanging past their face as they lean their head to partake.

-  Sunflower seeds or whatever the babushkas chew and spit while sitting on the bench outside their apartment building.

-  Ice cream.  OK, the world's best.

My wife does not cook much and she never measures.  All done by taste.  She makes an excellent solyanka.  And when she makes mashed potatoes my younger son, who lives here, alerts his brother and friends.  Oddly, my wife threw out my American potato masher and had her mother mail her one from Russia.


I trust I have not offended too many RW; however, I have problems with it.  My wife rarely cooks and when she does  it I recall writing such to a UW who evidently prided herself on preparing lard (salo).  She sent me a blistering reply telling me to jump into the river.

[OlgaH]

My wife does not cook much and she never measures.  All done by taste.  She makes an excellent solyanka.  And when she makes mashed potatoes my younger son, who lives here, alerts his brother and friends.  Oddly, my wife threw out my American potato masher and had her mother mail her one from Russia.

Gator, I don't measure either. When we have a party with our relatives or friends they always ask me to cook borsch. A funny thing was when our doctor (we had a big party at her home) told me that my borsch was the best hangover remedy in the morning. After one thanksgiving with our relatives I said that next time I would like to cook mashed potato. Our papa of course agreed right away as he tried my mashed potato before. I cook it with milk, butter, some spices and greens (sometimes I add mushrooms and cheese). We have an electric masher but I prefer to use a wooden masher.     

[Shadow]

I have never really understood the ' highly evolved cuisine'  part. Maybe because I have a lot of experience knowing how the restaurant business works.

Basicly what is called 'highly evolved cuisine' compares to art. In 90% of the cases its not the work being special, but that someone manages to get people pay so much money for it.

[shakespear]

What are the highlights:

Don't forget when the recipe calls for beef or pork, parboiling the meat until it is completely a tasteless blob of unrecognizable something.

And odorless, colorless and tasteless boiled potatoes with everything.

And oily cold water sea fish and freshwater salmonoids that would be inedible in the west.

And for you Ukrainians, who could possibly eat salo?

However, sereneke (spelling wrong I'm sure)  blini with tovorok is a tasty alternative to pancakes, especially with a bit of maple syrup

For my tastes, most caviar is too fishy tasting to be consumed; even with chopped hard boilled egg and onion, except of course, the expensive beluga caviar, which is too expensive to eat. 

Yes, "highly evolved" is not the words I'd use to describe Russian cuisine.

[BC]

Yes, "highly evolved" is not the words I'd use to describe Russian cuisine.

There is a workaround.. marry a cook like I did.

French, Italian, Russian each can be a treat in the right hands.

We're having sushi tonight.  Homemade and very authentic.. we're quite good at it now.

There is a LOT more than borscht and salanka.. but yes lots of mayo.

My favorite is a clear simple broth.. I always steal some before the borscht is made.

[Shadow]

Half-cooked products are faster to create (more money in less time) and as they are 'supposed to be'  tasting like raw products a chef can get away with anything except the freshness of the product.

To make fully cooked products tasty, you need to bring quality products and dedicated time to cooking them to the corect point. Both are hard to find in many restaurants, which are about making money, not making quality products.

[Gator]

We're having sushi tonight.  Homemade and very authentic.. we're quite good at it now.

Now that is an art, using Shadow's terminology, especially in presentation which accounts for over half of the equation.

[Gator]

We have an electric masher but I prefer to use a wooden masher.     

Another RW and her industrial grade potato masher.     I like watching her muscles ripple as she mashes away.

I cook it with milk, butter, some spices and greens (sometimes I add mushrooms and cheese)

Sounds yummy!  Did you say "spices?"  In a Russian kitchen?  The smallest spice cabinets in the world are found in Russia, while a whole shelf is reserved in the fridge for sour cream, mayonnaise, sour cheese, kefir and butter.