Choosing an Agency

[Misha]

It is FAR more common to see age and league gap relationships abroad than in the USA.  The entire valuation of age is different.

Not in Russia. Most young women, marry young men, usually no more than 5 years older. The "valuation" of age is pretty much the same based on all the women that I know is pretty much what it is here Canada: all things being equal, young attractive women, will prefer young attractive men. The idea that RW are somehow different is merely agency hype IMHO. Sure, some women will marry much older men, but they are by far the exceptionю

[RussianWind]

Sure, some women will marry much older women, but they are by far the exceptionț

Unisexual marriages are not legal in Russia  but agree with the rest.

[Misha]

Unisexual marriages are not legal in Russia  but agree with the rest.

That is why a woman marrying a woman from Russia will come to Canada  But, I have corrected my typo 

[kievstar]

An American owner of an agency in Kiev told me once that it is hard to know of all the marriages his agency helped discover.  The reason is the girl drops out of the agency after meeting someone and she does not come back to share what happens.  I think this happens all the time.

Try this - take a sample of women from 27 to 31 who are attractive in Anastiaweb.  In 18 months most of them are gone. Take another sample of attractive 21 to 24 women and in 18 months most of them are still there.  I have done this and at least on women I selected this is what happens.  Anastasia is a good resource to identify women but the serious ones go fast.  Target the older ones still young enough to have children.  If you do not want children, than you need to go somewhere else as Anastasia does not have a good population of attractive 38 to 50 year old women.

Also, never write letters in Anastiaweb.  Use it to identify women and than search for the women in her local city in a local agency.  Get on a plane and go.  But check the mirror first if she is in your league.  Otherwise 10 years from now you will be divorced.

[Bruce]

Ravens basic tenents make sense.   However, I still think a guy could get a younger prettier just as intelligent girl in the FSU than he could attract here.

If I was looking today starting from scratch I would ask the recently successful guys how they went about it.   My search has long been over and I am a married older guy with a 19 year age difference who has conceived one child and we have our second child well on the way.    I like to think I was one of the better 43 year old guys marrying a 24 year old just as tall as me, blond blue eyed pretty to all observers Russian girl, but maybe I was and maybe I was not.   Did I have a middle to above average career, yes.   Do I now, yes.    Meeting, attracting, courting, marrying and having a successful marriage are different things.   Yes, marriage takes work every day, immigration is a huge pain in the a$$, but marriage does get easier as the wife adapts, ages and matures, though when our second child arrives I will be darn too busy to post here again.   Yes, she is a beautiful girl and we are a beautiful couple but you will never see photos of us posted on the internet though I have sent pictures to friends out there.   Privacy is extremely important and its best for private things to remain private.   

So, what would I do if I started from scratch.   To me looking back a must is learning as much about the culture and studying the language.   The next is to concentrate on translators and English speaking or at a minium English studying girls.   The next is to get on the plane and start meeting as many girls as a guy can as quickly as possible ie. see if foreign dating in Russia really is for you.   I would concentrate on cities where many men have met and married girls in Russia.   I would concentrate on Russia based on past experience but would not rule out Belarus because I like blond hair / definitely blue or green eyed gals.   I would concentrate on girls with character from families with both parents.   Lifetime partners was a great start for me after a waste of a tour but times may have changed.   Then again, the more things change the more they remain the same.   

[Dave13]

Bruce, When did you first use Lifetime Partners, I was in Tver in 2002 & 2003. Your right, times have changed but it's still true whats important with agency's " can your trust the staff".

[Bruce]

2000. 2001. 2002, 2003 and 2004 searching / visiting /dating etc.   2005, 2006, 2007 and 2008 visiting relatives etc.   Lifetimepartners was super primarily because of Marc Dayton and their staff tried their best for you.   Behappy2day ultimately worked out for me because I did not ultimately have good luck with LTP, liked the owner and he worked with me to meet all the girls I was seeking who met my criteria (luckily for me Rvwnd was also working with him (yaroslav) at the time).    One has to persist, try different things and be lucky if he is as discriminating as I was.  Still, knowing what I know about my wife's girlfriends etc. many of them are now divorced and or divorced with one child now in Tver.   There are many extremely high quality girls in that city - though in reality only a small proportion of them want a foreign guy.   If Lifetimepartners was as I remember it, then it is a good start.   They were about as good an agency as I could imagine in Russia.   Perhaps they were too good for their own good for a while ie. too many successful marriages and their ability to recruit the quality girls outstripped the supply.   By now, they probably have reloaded.   I would definitely recommend talking to Marc if he even still is their US representative if I was single and looking.

[Jack]

David, was in Tver as well in 02 and 03. What time of year were you there?  Bruce and I missed seeing each other in 04 and 05 by a few days. Once I think by half a day.

Hello Bruce, how are you doing?  Bruce is one of the real classy guys around here.

About Marc. He's working in another industry at this time. He misses his time with LTP.  I have tried to get him to post.   LTP is going through a slow period now, but then so are a lot of agencies. I will say this, it is a good time for any man to go to this site, see if any ladies interest him, and write the lady, or several ladies. Women will be interested, support staff should be able to give good service.

I have talked with the owner of LTP, Dennis, for several years. Dennis had never been to Ukraine and was wondering why so many men were going to Ukraine. I said "Dennis, let me show you".  This past fall, or was it spring, damn it's a bitch getting old, anyway this past year Dennis joined me for his first trip to Ukraine. Dennis fell in love with Ukraine, and I think a few of it's women.

[Gator]

A single factor can not capture my thought process.  It was a combination of:

1) quality of the women (quality addressed many parameters),

2) ability to communicate directly with women without going through the agency.



Fee structure was important only to the degree that services were not grossly expensive (compared with other agencies).   Also, a fair reputation helped; however, in the beginning I had no RWD from whom to get a recommendation.

[Dave13]

Jack, I was in Tver in Oct. 2002 and Sept. 2003, Marc is a great guy. In 2002, had some fun times at the Zebra club with the office staff, Steve was a wild man, but he knows the business.During each of my trips, I did meet some very beautiful ladies, but fate has a way of playing with us, during my second trip I became engaged to Anna, she worked for the agency as a corresponding coordinator. Were both very happy!

[Bruce]

Ah, Jack is still around.    Can never hurt to speak with Jack as well, especially since he still has his hands around the pulse of the seekers, especially if you are interested in Ukraine.    Classy?    As long as I keep my politicial views to myself I'll agree.   Best of luck to all.

[JohnDearGreen]

ED, if you are looking for a model, from my experience the best one out there is Elena's.

Looking at the EM site, they appear to be based in LA. 

I preferred an agency that was based in a Ukraine city, where over half of their ladies were from that same city. This indicated that many of those ladies were probably "walk ins" and the manager in the office had probably met many of them in person.  That made all the other services a lot easier.

Most of the men here seem to look for the 25-35 age range.  But I never looked for a lady under 35, and there was a smaller quantity of those available, so it usually was "Seeing one particular woman's profile". 

I only "walked in" to 2 agencies in person.  At one, a small agency called "Excellence" in Kiev,  I found only 3 ladies i was interested in meeting.   The other turned out to be a regional office of a large internet site, and I had already contacted several ladies from that site.  They had zero other local ladies that I wanted to meet, as most of the ladies were in other remote cities.

[UTRO]

By the way girls are very surprised that you like Elena's M. They say this site is dead for them (and these are words of really stylish young girls). Yet men in their adverts look dissapointing

Which isn't a bad thing for the good lookin' guys, RussianWind!

[UTRO]

Looking at the EM site, they appear to be based in LA. 

I preferred an agency that was based in a Ukraine city, where over half of their ladies were from that same city. This indicated that many of those ladies were probably "walk ins" and the manager in the office had probably met many of them in person.  That made all the other services a lot easier.

 

I don't know if I'd call EM and Agency? At least that isn't what Citizenship and Immigration Canada considers them.
They regard AM as an "Internet Meeting/Dating Site" and a very legitimate one at that.
So much so that when Svetlana was going through the Immigration Process, to join me in Canada, she was never subjected to an interview. Never asked. Zero.
That speaks more than words to me.... and is the Best Testimonial period!

[ECOCKS]

EM remains the best dating site as far as I am concerned. They have a volume-based model and I can see that she does pretty well for herself with that system.

[kievstar]

EM has agencies all over Ukraine and Russia (maybe other countries).  Have any of you ever been physically in an EM agency in Ukraine or Russia?

I have.  There is one in Kiev I have been too and the owner also has an anastiaweb local agency in Kiev.  Aweb has more than 5 local agencies in Kiev.

People like EM since the women tend to know English and easier for direct contact.  But many men do get scammed in EM since the men with little experience have no one to help them.

Amazes me how many women in EM after 5 years are still their and looking and are very attractive.  There are many insincere women in Kiev on EM.  Can not speak for other cities but just be careful in Kiev. 

[UTRO]

EM has agencies all over Ukraine and Russia (maybe other countries).  Have any of you ever been physically in an EM agency in Ukraine or Russia?

I didn't know EM used Agencies. No, never used an Agency. Always did my own thing, by meeting Women directly through EM.

People like EM since the women tend to know English and easier for direct contact.  But many men do get scammed in EM since the men with little experience have no one to help them.

Men can and do get Scammed everywhere. I believe that Elena's lessens the chance. Elena's is more thorough and diligent with Women who add Profiles. Direct contact is the Key. For example, Anastasia doesn't use direct contact and who knows if woman ever get your email address' or phone numbers that you send?
I was also not impressed when my wife's Profile from another dating site showed up on Anastasia. To add to that, I received a letter from my wife through Anastasia's that she Never wrote.

Amazes me how many women in EM after 5 years are still their and looking and are very attractive.  There are many insincere women in Kiev on EM.  Can not speak for other cities but just be careful in Kiev. 

Although it's obvious I'm a fan of EM, it wouldn't surprise me if some of the 'long time' Profiles on there are 'Seeders'. Used to attract men.

[kievstar]

At least in Kiev the EM agency will answer letters on behalf of the women.  The very attractive ones get to many mails and they have to outsource it to friends or agency workers.  Sometimes friends and agency workers are the same person.   EM is over in the Podol area of Kiev. The agency operates same as the Aweb ones in Kiev only difference is EM allows direct contact easier. 

Problem with Aweb is that 99% of the men just write letters and never visit.  So does it really matter who is answering the letters? 

Another thing about EM is the verification of a girl means the local agency met the girl once.  Knows nothing more.  EM also advertises in local papers to get women to join. 

Just be careful of what you use.  I know people have done well with EM but people have done well with Aweb.  I think it is not the agency but the man who makes his success.  A street smart man who is dating in his league can go into most agencies and do very well.  I personally liked Aweb - every girl I wanted to meet showed up last minute in most cases.  My experience is on Kiev.  Can not speak about other cities. I also liked EM but the agency workers in EM were just as crafty as Aweb.

If you get to know agency workers (not owners) they will tell you very few men date in their league.  There chasing a fanasty and we know what happens within 10 years of that. 

[ECOCKS]

Personally, I don't believe the "agency" staff have anything to do with it. At least, not of the majority of the "agencies" out there.

The strength of EM is their database. With so many gals it is possible for the informed WM, IF he is rational and realistic, to screen out the obvious scammers and then continue the weeding out process through their system of EOI's and in-house email. Smart guys get this done smoothly and then move quickly to direct contact and voice communications. EM is good at that, you have a fixed cost which enables plenty of contacts and emails to get the job done. Marriage agency(?), no. Dating service with a percentage of serious women looking for international relationships(?), yes.

Unfortunately, too many guys decide the rules don't apply to them and they will never be scammed or "played" anyway since they are so smart. There's a reason the stereotypes exist on both sides you know. For every scammer, there's a dupe. For every player, there's someone getting played. For every GCG, there's a mule who a short time ago was bragging about his manhood and his loving bride. For every old geezer recapturing his youth, there's a "smokinhotkova" willing to do the deed in order to have her new home, some gifts and a new playing field for the next round, an unsophisticated girl who thinks trading her favors for stability and a new lifestyle will work for her.

While there appear to be many guys out there who profess to want a RW, few seem to be realistic in their search, hoping for a woman "out of their league" who will so appreciate the rescue that they will feel indebted to stay forever. Reminds me of that movie where Jennifer Anniston gives Ben Stiller the "pity f---". Lotsa' guys are hoping that "pf" lasts a long time.

[UTRO]

ECOCKS, Very good Point(s) 

Kievstar, I've asked a few times on various Threads, "who's had success with Anastasia"? Nobody has replied positively, although, I'm sure there are.
In contrast, there are quite a few Men here on RWD who have had success on EM.

[myrddin]

Kievstar, I've asked a few times on various Threads, "who's had success with Anastasia"? Nobody has replied positively, although, I'm sure there are.
In contrast, there are quite a few Men here on RWD who have had success on EM.

"I know a guy".   Actually, I know of a few guys, but only one case where I met the guy and his wife in person.

Nonetheless, I would use and recommend EM and not even consider A-web.

[Turboguy]

EM has agencies all over Ukraine and Russia (maybe other countries).  Have any of you ever been physically in an EM agency in Ukraine or Russia?

As far as I know EM only has one agency that is actually EM and that is the one in the Impressa hotel in Kiev.  The work with other agencies and use them as feeders for their website but the ownership is seperate.

Once in a while I see someone talk about thier success with Aweb.  It is rare but it does happen.  Most everyone who has worked with Elena's seems happy with the service.  The only ones I see who complain about lack of results had a free membership.   

When it comes down to AWeb vs Elenas, AWeb, like Global Ladies and many of the others we don't like are pay per letter.   I guess the plus would be that the letters get translated.   The minus would be there is too much motivation to fake letters to generate cash flow. 

Personally I don't know why anyone would want to pay 8 bucks or so a letter sent or recieved when for the price of one letter turnaround you can get the girls address and never have to pay again.  I had one friend who was paying $ 800.00 a month for his correspendence on GL.   For what he was paying in one month I could have a years worth of Platinum membership on Elena's and get priority access to every listing on the site and write as many ladies as I wanted as often as I wanted.   

I never tried Aweb but tried a lot of different things over the years from many agencies including a brief stint with GL and 4 tours and Elenas was the best service I ever used and I would feel comfortable recommending them to anyone and have. 

Of the things I tried the two I would recommend the highest are Elena's and Jack's Tours. 

[kievstar]

I have some real good friends now in the USA who met their wives on Aweb tour. I technically met my wife through Aweb as well.  Have met some other people I have met recently through Aweb and happily married.  None of these guys have ever heard of this forum or would participate in one so I did not question them on VOWO, etc.  I wonder if the EM crowd tends to hang out here more since EM works more for men into long distance relations where as Aweb works for men who fly. Forums are going to attract letter writers, etc.

My wife is very sociable and we probably have met more than 200 RW / AM couples the past 6 months (was at a party with more than 50 recently).  We have lived several places.  We seem to meet a new one each day whether at mall, cinema, gas station, party etc.  Meet even more RW / RM couples in USA since I work now in the oil and gas industry with gazprom a big client. 

I know personally people who work in the agencies in Kiev (really just franchises) at EM and Aweb.   I see no difference in the actual agency once you physically enter it and how it works.  The difference is method of  initial contact and type of women.  Aweb is going to have younger women who are not interested in foreign men as letter writing keeps the agencies going and the agency knows most men do not visit.  EM's business model is a little different and focuses on 1 time fees mainly. The women in EM also are usually in AWeb.

Aweb will get more men and less money per man where as EM will have less men and more money spent per man.  However, Aweb will have some men who go crazy on the spending.  EM it is impossible to go crazy on the spending. 

Both models will work but I think most will agree that letter writing is a waste of time in today's environment.  Meaning 2010 and not 2009.  Phone, sms, is the way to go.  EM is easier to go the phone method. 

My experience is only in Kiev.  I am sure every city is different.  Even the Aweb agencies in Kiev (there are a bunch of them) are a little different. 


Just walk into any Aweb or EM agency in Kiev with some gifts for the agency workers (talking $10 chocolate box) and slip the workers some money and you will get the low down on the best girls.  Make sure the dirt bag owner is not around.  Build the face to face with the agency workers.  Just like any business relationship need to make the relationship first to get the best service.  You will find your the only man who does that.  Majority of men complain about $50 meeting fees, etc.  They get the meetings with the girls no one wants.

Agencies work but focus on making the face to face with the agency than find the woman you want.  Men are doing this all wrong and not making the contact with the agency workers first.  Get on a plane to do this. 

A way to get the agency worker away from the owner is to meet a girl who speaks no English and use the agency worker for tramsalting.  Go to the bar and get them both drunk.  They will spill their guts on everything.  Make sure you pick a girl your not interested in and one closer to 25 years old. 

[Jooky]

Aweb will get more men and less money per man where as EM will have less men and more money spent per man.

Kievstar,

Do you know how agencies working with Elena's Models get paid?

With A-Web, it's clear to me. The local agencies charge high fees per letter, for phone calls and for web cam chats (often with uninterested or not real girls).

But what about an agency with Elena's Models? The customer pays a flat or monthly fee. Do agencies working with Elena's get a cut based on traffic to their agency? Do they get a commission per letter, or contact, or what?

I think a major difference between the sites is that the Elena's database contains many women that sign up themselves, without any agency involved. A-Web works only with local agencies. Right?

[Gylden]

Turbo,
The Hotel Impressa?  Funny, because I stayed there and my impression is that they are so much a mafia style outfit. It was the place I felt tried to scam us the most. Is there an agency working out of the hotel?

Kievstar,
Now here is some good advice IMO, you hit the nail on the head.