ML and Ukrainian Women.

[ML]

I am looking at american women and most of them do not care, so I figured, why should I?

Ask yourself (and then tell yourself the truth) about why your man chose you over an AW . . . then you will have the 'why.'

[Hammer2722]

Ask yourself (and then tell yourself the truth) about why your man chose you over an AW . . . then you will have the 'why.'

+10!!! 

[Donna_Pedro]

Ask yourself (and then tell yourself the truth) about . . . then you will have the 'why.'

Lets see.. World War 2, alcoholism, wars and crime of 1990s have made the demographics in my country rather unfavorable for women. Demographics, in its turn, have deepen historically chauvinistic mentality in Russian men, which together with comparatively poor economy makes it rather hard for women to become professionally successful and independent. In these conditions women are forced to go above and beyond to stay competitive in a poor market conditions and beauty becomes, for the lack of a better word, - a valuable commodity. And beauty needs constant attention as it tends to go away rather quickly. American women, to the other hand, are confident and independent. Thanks to good economy and demographics the playfield here is leveled.  AW successfully compete with men professionally. Beauty is still important, of course, but American women, unlike their Russian counterparts, are not desperate to get married, making it hard for average middleclass men to compete on “marriage market”. An average 50yo often bolding and overweight western man with average income stands no chance with a 20 yo woman here. In Ukraine they line up to meet him. Pardon my French, I don’t give a flying f.ck why AM choose RW. Reality defines mentality. And reality is – I am a fully independent successful female and I will do what I want.

[Muzh]

Lets see.. World War 2, alcoholism, wars and crime of 1990s have made the demographics in my country rather unfavorable for women. Demographics, in its turn, have deepen historically chauvinistic mentality in Russian men, which together with comparatively poor economy makes it rather hard for women to become professionally successful and independent. In these conditions women are forced to go above and beyond to stay competitive in a poor market conditions and beauty becomes, for the lack of a better word, - a valuable commodity. And beauty needs constant attention as it tends to go away rather quickly. American women, to the other hand, are confident and independent. Thanks to good economy and demographics the playfield here is leveled.  AW successfully compete with men professionally. Beauty is still important, of course, but American women, unlike their Russian counterparts, are not desperate to get married, making it hard for average middleclass men to compete on “marriage market”. An average 50yo often bolding and overweight western man with average income stands no chance with a 20 yo woman here. In Ukraine they line up to meet him. Pardon my French, I don’t give a flying f.ck why AM choose RW. Reality defines mentality. And reality is – I am a fully independent successful female and I will do what I want.

 

[vwrw]

First, it is a pleasure to read your posts Donna_Pedro! Although we have some extremely intelligent ladies participating in discussion here, since putting ban on Helen’s account, we are lacking your kind of mentality and enthusiasm to make this place interesting.
I agree if keeping a "pretty" weight takes too much efforts AND having a "pretty" weight brings too little joy, then there is no point of torturing yourself.

[vwrw]

 I am a fully independent successful female and I will do what I want.

You certainly can do what you want IF your wants fall within your reach.
The problem is that overweight people are somewhat ostracized  and discriminated against, albeit indirectly. For example,  nice overweight women usually do not have a line of people wanting their companionship (even desperate 50yo bolding and overweight western men often do not seek it). So if an overweight woman wants a hot man as a life partner, then she would unlikely be able to get what she wants locally. I guess what I am trying to say is that our weight determines what we can do successfully. 

[Donna_Pedro]

trying to say is that our weight determines what we can do successfully. 

A hot man is not a measure of success.  My husband has little chance of being on the front page of Mens Health magazine, but he is all I ever wanted. And you are right  - being fat is not prestigious. Most rich and successful people are slim and fit. But I am past caring for prestige as well. I have lived my life caring about sht like this. Finally I can afford not to.

[vwrw]

A hot man is not a measure of success. 

Definitely not. However, having a hot man might be one of many unreachable wants for the majority of overweight ladies.
Except for your husband, what else do you care about... if it is not a secret?

[GQBlues]

Lets see.. World War 2, alcoholism, wars and crime of 1990s have made the demographics in my country rather unfavorable for women. Demographics, in its turn, have deepen historically chauvinistic mentality in Russian men, which together with comparatively poor economy makes it rather hard for women to become professionally successful and independent. In these conditions women are forced to go above and beyond to stay competitive in a poor market conditions and beauty becomes, for the lack of a better word, - a valuable commodity. And beauty needs constant attention as it tends to go away rather quickly. American women, to the other hand, are confident and independent. Thanks to good economy and demographics the playfield here is leveled.  AW successfully compete with men professionally. Beauty is still important, of course, but American women, unlike their Russian counterparts, are not desperate to get married, making it hard for average middleclass men to compete on “marriage market”. An average 50yo often bolding and overweight western man with average income stands no chance with a 20 yo woman here. In Ukraine they line up to meet him. Pardon my French, I don’t give a flying f.ck why AM choose RW. Reality defines mentality. And reality is – I am a fully independent successful female and I will do what I want.

...and that my friends...is saying it like it is.
 

... For example,  nice overweight women usually do not have a line of people wanting their companionship (even desperate 50yo bolding and overweight western men often do not seek it). So if an overweight woman wants a hot man as a life partner, then she would unlikely be able to get what she wants locally. I guess what I am trying to say is that our weight determines what we can do successfully.

The acronym BBW (Big Beautiful Women) was coined by men who do in fact prefer and chase overweight women.

[pitbull]

A hot man is not a measure of success.  My husband has little chance of being on the front page of Mens Health magazine, but he is all I ever wanted. And you are right  - being fat is not prestigious. Most rich and successful people are slim and fit. But I am past caring for prestige as well. I have lived my life caring about sht like this. Finally I can afford not to.

The question is whether your husband cares about your weight. Does he want a wife in "pretty weight"? Were you in "pretty" weight when you got married? I believe there is a number of AM on this very forum that dumped their successful independent fat AW wives and went to FSU. Precisely because "skinny body" is what they want 

[Donna_Pedro]

The question is whether your husband cares about your weight.

Oh, you are saying its not important what I think about it, Its only important what my husband thinks about it, because he might go away ? Sounds like an abc example of controlling behavior. These jedi mind tricks dont work on me anymore.   Fortunately this is not the way problems are discussed in my family. We are partners. We dont control each other. And I am not scared of losing a husband. Never been. Certainly not now. If a skinny body is all he wants - he is free to go for a second helping.
 

[pitbull]

Oh, you are saying its not important what I think about it, Its only important what my husband thinks about it, because he might go away ? Sounds like an abc example of controlling behavior. These jedi mind tricks dont work on me anymore.   Fortunately this is not the way problems are discussed in my family. We are partners. We dont control each other. And I am not scared of losing a husband. Never been. Certainly not now. If a skinny body is all he wants - he is free to go for a second helping.

Nope. I am saying that as long as 1) for both of you weight is either unimportant or secondary to other things or 2) You don't care if your husband stays or goes over the weight issue - everything is totally fine 

[Faux Pas]

Oh, you are saying its not important what I think about it, Its only important what my husband thinks about it, because he might go away ? Sounds like an abc example of controlling behavior. These jedi mind tricks dont work on me anymore.   Fortunately this is not the way problems are discussed in my family. We are partners. We dont control each other. And I am not scared of losing a husband. Never been. Certainly not now. If a skinny body is all he wants - he is free to go for a second helping.

Very refreshing. I glad you posted it. It is an excellent POV that often gets overlooked even when stated in lieu of slender hot 20 year old bodies and other pretentious wants.


Just a question though. Has this particular attitude of yours compounded, decreased or remained the same since you have been in the US?

[Donna_Pedro]

Very refreshing. I glad you posted it. It is an excellent POV that often gets overlooked even when stated in lieu of slender hot 20 year old bodies and other pretentious wants.


Just a question though. Has this particular attitude of yours compounded, decreased or remained the same since you have been in the US?

Thanks. Pretty much the same. After all I am only 6 years younger than my husband.

I am saying that as long as 1) for both of you weight is either unimportant or secondary to other things or 2) You don't care if your husband stays or goes over the weight issue - everything is totally fin

My husband would like me to stay  slim. He would like me to stay young too, no doubt. But we both are trying not to impose unreasonable expectations on each other. If this becomes a problem (for him, I mean, because I am comfortable with myself)), he will have to cough up for a lipo.

[Gator]

The question is whether your husband cares about your weight. Does he want a wife in "pretty weight"? Were you in "pretty" weight when you got married? I believe there is a number of AM on this very forum that dumped their successful independent fat AW wives and went to FSU. Precisely because "skinny body" is what they want 

Pitbull, I thought you had progressed beyond such shallow values. 
 
I met DonnaPedro about 7+ years ago.  She is a fine looking blond.  Even more impressive is her intellect.  And based on her posts in this thread, we can add "well adjusted."
 
Her husband interacted a few times at the RWG forum.  He did not impress me as someone with shallow values.   

[Gator]

DonnaPedro,
 
Anyone who has traveled the FSU will wonder what happens to those Slavic stick figures of the teens.   Slavic women like many women become shorter and wider with age but not as bad as some other tribes.

It is natural.  With age women's metabolism changes more than men's.  Keeping weight off becomes a real struggle.  Also, some weight gain is beneficial for women health reasons.  Maybe the slender babushkas are too frail to walk about and thus are not seen.
 
My Cossack woman wears a larger dress size now at age 46, yet still looks great to me - far better than I deserve.   Yet my attraction to her is more about her substance, her inner beauty.   

You know what is best for you.  You seem to have lowered your expectations, and that  is a mature step.  Further, you are mentally comfortable with the fact.   However, knowing you I very much doubt that you have let yourself go.   

[Faux Pas]

Thanks. Pretty much the same. After all I am only 6 years younger than my husband.



My husband would like me to stay  slim. He would like me to stay young too, no doubt. But we both are trying not to impose unreasonable expectations on each other. If this becomes a problem (for him, I mean, because I am comfortable with myself)), he will have to cough up for a lipo.

I would like for my wife to stay young and slim too. While we're discussing it, I'd like her to be rich and own a liquor store    but that probably isn't happening either.


I can appreciate you and your husbands attitude. It's a healthy one IMHO and a vital ingredient to a long lasting relationship. I like to think my wife and I share it. There's enough struggles and demands just being in a cross cultural relationship that one can't dictate. It doesn't make much sense to burden it with those that one can.

[pitbull]

Pitbull, I thought you had progressed beyond such shallow values. 
 

Where did i say those are my values? Just stating the values of the majority of RW-seekers, from this forum primarily. To refresh your memory, please refer to the "Why do AM choose to not date AW, but RW", or some such

[Jack]

Stopped in for a minute this afternoon, busy busy.

Saw all these new threads on Kharkiv trip report.  Ohhh boy, bound to be some new interesting facts about Kharkov or this trip to Kharkov.     

But darn,....  not recently.   

[Gator]

Jack makes a good point that we are derailing ML's thread.  So I expect a mod will divert this.
 

Where did i say those are my values? Just stating the values of the majority of RW-seekers, from this forum primarily. To refresh your memory, please refer to the "Why do AM choose to not date AW, but RW", or some such

Glad to know that you do not attach ultimate value to how you look.  I imagine you are a pretty woman as well as smart, and I imagine you take pride in how you look.  That is good; however, RW seem to take it to the extreme where their physical beauty is the largest measure of their worth.  I believe this reflects their history with RM and the attitude of many RM towards young dyevs in general.  Your questions to DonnaPedro suggested that you are concerned with this.
 
 
Argue with me please. 
 
 
 
 

[pitbull]

RW seem to take it to the extreme where their physical beauty is the largest measure of their worth.  I believe this reflects their history with RM and the attitude of many RM towards young dyevs in general.   
Argue with me please.

Not gonna argue, since this statement is largerly true. My point was that this  extreme attention that RW pay to their appearance and staying slim is precisely what attracts 99% of AM who seek RW wives. I may be mistaken, but i believe that donna pedro is married to an AM. If he belongs to the 1% of AM who didn't go for a "slim young body", good for her If not, her not staying slim may cause marital issues.

[Gator]

Not gonna argue, since this statement is largerly true. My point was that this  extreme attention that RW pay to their appearance and staying slim is precisely what attracts 99% of AM who seek RW wives. I may be mistaken, but i believe that donna pedro is married to an AM. If he belongs to the 1% of AM who didn't go for a "slim young body", good for her If not, her not staying slim may cause marital issues.

You believe that 99% of the AM stop at "slim young body" and propose marriage.  I can refute that easily with this logic: Such a man is stupid, and a RW who would marry him is also stupid.   RW are not stupid, certainly not 99% of them. 
 
Would your husband stress his marriage if you gained weight?
 
Let me elaborate.   Physical attrraction certainly plays a key part in the beginning of a relationship.  Probably moreso with RW because of the emphasis on photos in profiles.  We have grown up meeting the opposite sex in unplanned face-to-face encounters such as at a store, a large party, etc.   Gazing at photos of RW is odd (but quite pleasurable) 
 
I would worry about the depth of a relationship if there were no physical attraction.   Nevertheless, I assert for many men that physical attraction only gets part of the way.  With conventional dating in America, physical attraction is maybe only good for a weekend.  Development of a relationship should depend upon far more such as having fun together, aligned goals, etc. 
 
Dating RW introduces the complexity of cultural differences and language barriers.  Hence, an AM should take even longer to develop a relationship with a RW (my path).  Instead, the geographic separation, travel limitations, etc. tend to compress time.  So maybe in the absence of good information about a woman's inner beauty, the man goes for for a young slim body and hopes for the best.  But surely not 99% of the men. 
 
Keep in mind that there is a certain set of men who are attracted foremost to breasts.  God is fair, he rarely gives slim hips to women with large breasts.  Gaining weight just makes those щенки even bigger. 
 
The amount of weight gain is an issue.  Yet, I think few men would be upset if the woman they loved gained 10-15 kg.  99% would be concerned if their woman gained 50 kg, but many would be more concerned about her health.   
 
 
 

[Jack]

Keep in mind that there is a certain set of men who are attracted foremost to breasts. 

alright Gator, we don't need to go there.  I know some wonderful, caring, really nice men who are attracted to contour, ample, copious shaped breasts.       

[pitbull]

You believe that 99% of the AM stop at "slim young body" and propose marriage.  .   

Gator,
 
Please do not ascribe "beliefs" to me that I haven't pronounced. What I have learned from reading numerous topics on RWD, such as "Why RW, not AW", 99% of men says they go for RW because they are slim and care a lot for their appearance, while most AW are fat and don't care. Though certainly named the major reason, the "slim and beautiful" is not the only one - of course everyone hopes to find a soulmate that posseses a host of other compatible qualities.

[JR]

Lets see.. World War 2, alcoholism, wars and crime of 1990s have made the demographics in my country rather unfavorable for women. Demographics, in its turn, have deepen historically chauvinistic mentality in Russian men, which together with comparatively poor economy makes it rather hard for women to become professionally successful and independent. In these conditions women are forced to go above and beyond to stay competitive in a poor market conditions and beauty becomes, for the lack of a better word, - a valuable commodity. And beauty needs constant attention as it tends to go away rather quickly. American women, to the other hand, are confident and independent. Thanks to good economy and demographics the playfield here is leveled.  AW successfully compete with men professionally. Beauty is still important, of course, but American women, unlike their Russian counterparts, are not desperate to get married, making it hard for average middleclass men to compete on “marriage market”. An average 50yo often bolding and overweight western man with average income stands no chance with a 20 yo woman here. In Ukraine they line up to meet him. Pardon my French, I don’t give a flying f.ck why AM choose RW. Reality defines mentality. And reality is – I am a fully independent successful female and I will do what I want.

Preach it Sista!!!!!!!!