Mexico Visa?

[spectris]

Anyone have an opinion on how hard (or even possible) it would be for a 40 year old Ukrainian woman to vacation in Mexico for a couple of weeks?  In the past 5 years she's made 3 trips (one to the US as a translator for her superior so some sort of work visa), one to the Caribbean and 1 to Prague.  She has a good job, supports her mother and teenage child - has a good job, most of the things I read here that are required in most places.  Not much information specific to Mexico though or I couldn't find it.

All the arrangements, of course, would be made by a Ukrainian travel company which seems to expedite things...

[ECOCKS]

Sounds like a distinct possibility to me.

[Sculpto]

They have opened it up significantly for Russians.  I am not sure if the same has happened for Ukrainians.  However.. if it is a tour through a legit company and she has all the normal stuff.. job.. apartment and money in the bank.. there should be no problems.

If Link is reading he might have more detailed information since he actually lives in Mexico.

[Admin]

Anyone have an opinion on how hard (or even possible) it would be for a 40 year old Ukrainian woman to vacation in Mexico for a couple of weeks?  In the past 5 years she's made 3 trips (one to the US as a translator for her superior so some sort of work visa), one to the Caribbean and 1 to Prague.  She has a good job, supports her mother and teenage child - has a good job, most of the things I read here that are required in most places.  Not much information specific to Mexico though or I couldn't find it.

All the arrangements, of course, would be made by a Ukrainian travel company which seems to expedite things...

From the Delta Airlines Visa Site (stickied in this forum):

/ 23AUG10 / 0350 UTC

National Ukraine (UA)           /Destination Mexico (MX)

 Mexico (MX)

Passport required.
- Passport and/or passport replacing documents must be valid   on arrival.
- Warning: if departing from the USA (regardless of any destination passport exemptions), a valid passport and/or accepted departure document (TIRULES/R9) is required by the US immigration authorities.

Visa required, except for A stay of max. 180 days:
 - for holders of a valid visa for the USA, traveling with the purpose ot tourism, business or transit.

Minors:
- Minors under 14 years of age, when travelling alone, should be met by an adult.

Additional Information:

- Visitor must hold a FMM form issued to each passenger free of charge by airlines, travel agencies or on arrival.
- A valid Mexican visa in an expired passport is accepted, provided also carrying a valid passport.

Warning:
- Non-compliance with entry regulations will result in fines

[Sculpto]

Dan and everyone.. I advise caution with the Delta site.. it is this very site that nearly got me into trouble last year.. we cancelled Mexico anyway.. but.. the info posted at that time was erroneous especially in regards to transit via Atlanta.  If we had followed Delta's info she would have gotten stuck in Atlanta or fined..

If it was me.. I would be looking at Iberia with transfer in Madrid.  Lot less hassle and no visa required for transfer in Madrid.. at least for Russians as of one year ago.  Check with Iberia for the latest info.

[Admin]

Dan and everyone.. I advise caution with the Delta site.. it is this very site that nearly got me into trouble last year.. we cancelled Mexico anyway.. but.. the info posted at that time was erroneous especially in regards to transit via Atlanta.  If we had followed Delta's info she would have gotten stuck in Atlanta or fined..

If it was me.. I would be looking at Iberia with transfer in Madrid.  Lot less hassle and no visa required for transfer in Madrid.. at least for Russians as of one year ago.  Check with Iberia for the latest info.

Since the Delta site contains the very same information the airlines use to determine boarding eligibility, it seems to be the most definitive source of information available anywhere. While I can imagine there being potential fallibility with a complex travel scenario, to "advise caution" makes little sense - unless you have some superior source somewhere.

What were YOUR specifics that led to the Delta information being unreliable?

- Dan

[acctBill]

spectris assuming what you say is correct she should have no problems, especially if the trip is being done through a competent Ukrainian travel agency.  A good place to find information such as needed travel documents to foreign countries is the Iata Travel Centre.  The Iata site also provides information about import/export regulations, currency, International Airport Departure Tax/Tourism Tax and other important items travellers should know about when travelling or moving abroad.

http://www.iatatravelcentre.com/home.htm

[Seeker]

Since the Delta site contains the very same information the airlines use to determine boarding eligibility, it seems to be the most definitive source of information available anywhere. While I can imagine there being potential fallibility with a complex travel scenario, to "advise caution" makes little sense - unless you have some superior source somewhere.

What were YOUR specifics that led to the Delta information being unreliable?

- Dan

None of us are perfect, and just give advice based on our own experience.

We all have our travel warnings based on what we have dealt with before.  Delta has not been my friend either.  Oh well, live and learn.

[Admin]

None of us are perfect, and just give advice based on our own experience.

We all have our travel warnings based on what we have dealt with before.  Delta has not been my friend either.  Oh well, live and learn.

And the BEST way to handle that is to offer the specifics of the travel situation that occurred.

I have yet to see anyone describe their itinerary AND experience alongside the Delta information, so that is might be plainly seen how the information was in error.

As I wrote, I have little doubt errors are made - but to blare a warning with no evidence to support the fallibility and to not offer a purported superior alternative seems a bit irresponsible.

- Dan

[ConnerVT]

The Delta site uses the IATA database for its information.

[Seeker]

And the BEST way to handle that is to offer the specifics of the travel situation that occurred.

I have yet to see anyone describe their itinerary AND experience alongside the Delta information, so that is might be plainly seen how the information was in error.

As I wrote, I have little doubt errors are made - but to blare a warning with no evidence to support the fallibility and to not offer a purported superior alternative seems a bit irresponsible.

- Dan

Okay.. good point.

Okay... going to step on, if not over the line here...

So when I (or anyone) posts an opinion, do they need to have documents to back it up?

Dan... I am sorry... but I think the best thing to realize is this is an eclectic community.  Your fault not mine.     Things said are of course to be taken with a grain of salt... but off hand comments, that are universal in some ways, should not require back-up documentation.  Come on... who hasn't had a bad experience on almost any airline?

[Admin]

Okay.. good point.

Okay... going to step on, if not over the line here...

So when I (or anyone) posts an opinion, do they need to have documents to back it up?

Dan... I am sorry... but I think the best thing to realize is this is an eclectic community.  Your fault not mine.     Things said are of course to be taken with a grain of salt... but off hand comments, that are universal in some ways, should not require back-up documentation.  Come on... who hasn't had a bad experience on almost any airline?

Well, this is one area in which there exists a rather definitive source. Because it is definitive, and because the airlines make use of the very same information, it only makes sense to consider it THE definitive source of information.

How does it help anyone for someone to "advise caution" against using the very same datasource that will be used by the airlines in determining if they will allow a traveler to board the airplane?

Now, if they were to describe their complex itinerary and identify exactly where the problem occurred and why (if they know it) - AND - put it up against the Delta information that was contradictory or erroneous - THEN we'd have information that might be helpful to our readers. That has not occurred. Until it does, it strikes me that it is downright irresponsible to tell guys they should not follow the information on the Delta site.

I guess I don't understand the issue. It is black-and-white - at least, in this rare instance.

- Dan

[Sculpto]

Last year when I purchased a ticket for "A" to go Moscow - Atlanta - Mexico City I reviewed the Delta site and spoke with two different agents that all assured me there would be no problem and there was no transit visa required.  

Later.. about 3 weeks before travel I was still nervous about it because we still did not have a visa from the Mexican Embassy and I happened to call Delta to double check at which time they told me I had gotten erroneous and dated material from their site and that a transit visa through the US would be required.  

I knew it would be impossible to get a transit visa for her, especially on such short notice and doubly since the Mexican Embassy had not approved her tourist visa yet.

I was able to get a refund for the full amount from Delta at which time I pursued other alternatives.. which turned out to be the Iberia flight.. which also happened to be about $300 less than the Delta flight.

As it turned out that ticket got returned as well because she was not able to get the Mexico visa.. the reasons for that have less to do with Mexico than with a stubborn Russian who insisted on waiting to the last minute for everything and only then discovered she didn't have her ducks in a row.

At any rate.. if it was me.. I wouldn't trust an airline site NO MATTER WHERE they get their information.  Mexico is if anything more screwed up than Russia or Ukraine and rules can change on a dime and it is also entirely possible that rules will not be enforced at all.  The easiest immigration checks I have ever experienced in 20+ countries has been Mexico entered at Mexico City.  They really don't seem to care very much.  

anyway.. this might be helpful..

http://www.inm.gob.mx/index.php?page/Paises_visa

[Admin]

Last year when I purchased a ticket for "A" to go Moscow - Atlanta - Mexico City I reviewed the Delta site and spoke with two different agents that all assured me there would be no problem and there was no transit visa required.  

Later.. about 3 weeks before travel I was still nervous about it because we still did not have a visa from the Mexican Embassy and I happened to call Delta to double check at which time they told me I had gotten erroneous and dated material from their site and that a transit visa through the US would be required.  

I knew it would be impossible to get a transit visa for her, especially on such short notice and doubly since the Mexican Embassy had not approved her tourist visa yet.

I was able to get a refund for the full amount from Delta at which time I pursued other alternatives.. which turned out to be the Iberia flight.. which also happened to be about $300 less than the Delta flight.

As it turned out that ticket got returned as well because she was not able to get the Mexico visa.. the reasons for that have less to do with Mexico than with a stubborn Russian who insisted on waiting to the last minute for everything and only then discovered she didn't have her ducks in a row.

At any rate.. if it was me.. I wouldn't trust an airline site NO MATTER WHERE they get their information.  Mexico is if anything more screwed up than Russia or Ukraine and rules can change on a dime and it is also entirely possible that rules will not be enforced at all.  The easiest immigration checks I have ever experienced in 20+ countries has been Mexico entered at Mexico City.  They really don't seem to care very much.  

anyway.. this might be helpful..

http://www.inm.gob.mx/index.php?page/Paises_visa

Your scenario from the Delta site:

/ 23AUG10 / 0500 UTC



National Russian Federation (RU)/Transit U.S.A. (US)
Destination Mexico (MX)         
ALSO CHECK DESTINATION INFORMATION BELOW


 U.S.A. (US)


Visa required.

TWOV (Transit Without Visa):
- If flying Cathay Pacific (CX) between Hong Kong and Toronto, via Anchorage, Alaska: For details, click here
- On August 2, 2003 the US Department of Homeland Security, US Customs and Border Protection (CBP) suspended both the US Transit Without Visa (TWOV) and International-to-International (ITI) programs until further notice. All aliens travelling to or through the United States must be in possession of a valid visa.
  This regulation does not apply to For details, click here

Additional Information:

- Passengers not having proof of sufficient funds for length of stay For details, click here
- Transit visas: those entering on a C1-transit visa are allowed to transit the USA to a third country as long as this trip is 29 days or less and then enter again to transit, as long as this trip also takes 29 days or less.

Warning:
- Non-compliance with entry/transit requirements will result in:For details, click here


 Mexico (MX)

Passport required.
- Passport and/or passport replacing documents must be valid on arrival.
- Warning: if departing from the USA (regardless of any destination passport exemptions), a valid passport and/or accepted departure document (TIRULES/R9) is required by the US immigration authorities.

Visa required, except for A stay of max. 180 days:
 - for holders of a valid visa for the USA, traveling with the purpose ot tourism, business or transit.
Minors:
- Minors under 14 years of age, when travelling alone, should be met by an adult.

Additional Information:

- Visitor must hold a FMM form issued to each passenger free of charge by airlines, travel agencies or on arrival.
- A valid Mexican visa in an expired passport is accepted, provided also carrying a valid passport.
Warning:
- Non-compliance with entry regulations will result in fines

FWIW

- Dan

[Sculpto]

then there is this...

 April 20, 2010
 
Mexico Eases Visa Requirements for Tourists to Mexico
 
In order to make it easier for international tourists to come to Mexico and to increase tourism, the federal government has launched a new visa policy that will come into effect on May 1, 2010. It has two main provisions:
 
1.      Tourists, business travelers and individuals in transit (traveling through Mexico to another country) of all nationalities who currently require a Mexican visa and are in possession of a visa issued by the United States of America, can enter Mexico at any established border crossing point or port of entry with a passport from their country of origin. They will not need to present a Mexican visa, although Mexican visas continue to be valid documents for entering Mexico. In all cases, the documents presented to the immigration officers must be valid and unexpired.
 
2.      Tourists, business travelers and individuals in transit of all nationalities who currently require a Mexican visa and who arrive in Mexico on flights from the United States of America and are not covered by the provisions of the preceding paragraph, can enter the country by presenting their valid, unexpired passport and their boarding pass to the immigration officer. The boarding pass must show that the passenger arrived in Mexico on a flight from the United States of America.
 
These measures strengthen Mexico?s international competitiveness vis-à-vis other tourist destinations and are part of the strategy of President Felipe Calderón?s administration to confirm tourism as a national priority for Mexico?s economic development.

http://www.cptm.com.mx/wb/CPTM/NuevasMedidas_Migratorias_y_Testimonial

[Sculpto]

this pdf could be useful also.. its all the rules in english

http://www.sectur.gob.mx/work/sites/secturing/resources/LocalContent/14119/3/ingles.pdf

[Turboguy]

Sculpto, nice post and it raises some interesting questions, however it seems to me that your problems were not so much with the Delta website as it was with a couple of Delta agents who didn't know what they were talking about.

I am not saying that things can't change in a few years but back when VWRW and I were waiting for our visa I researched transiting through the USA to another destination such as Mexico or in our case Grenada and it can't be done.  Transit visas were done away with after 9/11.  This is not the easiest thing to research because there are a lot of references on the internet that date before the change and they can give you the wrong impression. 

As far as a Visa to visit Mexico the impression I have is that it is possible and has a fairly high rate of sucess.  As long as you document the funds to travel there and the plan to exit Mexico at the end of the stay there should be little problem.

[Gator]

I have traveled with RW to many countries where they had to apply for and obtain a visa prior to departure:   EU (4), Morocco, Viet Nam (maybe I was the only one requiring a visa), Costa Rica and Mexico. 

Only one country created a problem. You guessed it - Mexico in 2005.  My experience is clearly dated and hopefully travel visas are simpler now.  Besides jumping through hoops (e. g., documenting funds), the embassy delayed the application with no reason given.  The delay required me to rebook flights and hotels.

Once there, the RW loved Mexico.  We traveled independently to Isla Mujeres, Guanajuoto, Guadalajara etc.  The Mexican buses are super.  Five years later I still have not recovered fully from the day on the tequila train.

[Sculpto]

Turbo..

At the time I bought that ticket the info on the Delta site was different than it is now.. what the agents told me at that time was congruent with what was posted on the Delta site.

The reason I advise caution is because Delta is an airline.. not a government nor an immigration office.  It is not Delta's responsibility to make or enforce rules and given the distances and expenses involved one would think it is worth it to do due dilligence and verify everything.

Getting a transit visa through the US is as difficult as getting a tourist visa To the US.  There is no sense to even try if there is any doubt about eligibility.

[Gator]

Getting a transit visa through the US is as difficult as getting a tourist visa To the US.  There is no sense to even try if there is any doubt about eligibility.

What are the procedures for a transit visa at a US airport?  When debarking from an international flight at a US airport, I never see signs such as "Transit Visa To the Left."   Every US arrival must clear through the same immigration as tourist visa, etc. and then claim their luggage and go through customs.

European airports allow you to go directly to your connecting flight (no passport control, no luggage inspection, etc.).  Transit visa signs are posted prominently at SVO and other airports to enable avoiding entry lines. 

[Sculpto]

What are the procedures for a transit visa at a US airport?  When debarking from an international flight at a US airport, I never see signs such as "Transit Visa To the Left."   Every US arrival must clear through the same immigration as tourist visa, etc. and then claim their luggage and go through customs.

European airports allow you to go directly to your connecting flight (no passport control, no luggage inspection, etc.).  Transit visa signs are posted prominently at SVO and other airports to enable avoiding entry lines. 

Good question Gator.. I have no idea. 

You know what was strange in Helsinki was we had to clear security even though we had just gotten off a plane and never left the international section of the airport.

[Admin]

Turbo..

At the time I bought that ticket the info on the Delta site was different than it is now.. what the agents told me at that time was congruent with what was posted on the Delta site.

The reason I advise caution is because Delta is an airline.. not a government nor an immigration office.  It is not Delta's responsibility to make or enforce rules and given the distances and expenses involved one would think it is worth it to do due dilligence and verify everything.

Getting a transit visa through the US is as difficult as getting a tourist visa To the US.  There is no sense to even try if there is any doubt about eligibility.

>>The reason I advise caution is because Delta is an airline.. not a government nor an immigration office.<<

Well, here's the rub - Delta uses, as ConnerVT pointed out, the IATA system. That is the same system used by ALL major airlines. The airlines check that system PRIOR to allowing a passenger to board the aircraft. Why? Again using the Delta system (which uses IATA's system), here is the information shown:

 U.S.A. (US)

 Warning:
- Non-compliance with entry/transit requirements will result in:
  Fines varying between USD 2,000.- and USD 3,300.- per passenger.
  Fines of USD 1,000.- will be levied:
  - (where applicable) if information on the (white) I-94 Form (for entry) or the I-94W Form (for V.W.P. and transit) is
  not filled in properly;
  - in case of failure to submit timely the Departure Record of the I-94 or I-94W Form to US Immigration; and

  Either transportation at carrier's expense to country of origin, or indefinite delay for passenger at entry/transit point (detention costs at carrier's expense).

You see, the airline faces fines and sanctions if they allow a passenger to board who does not meet all the requirements of the inbound country.

So even though the airline is "not a government nor an immigration office" - they hold the prerogative of not allowing the passenger to board the airplane.

My counsel is for a traveler to review the Delta pages and follow the instructions carefully. If there is some doubt as to that information, contact the airline which is to provide passage and insure they, and you, are clear on the requirements.

Failure to heed the information used by the airlines strikes me as an unnecessarily risky decision.

- Dan

[facetrock]

  Ok, so lets say you want to fly your gal to somewhere in the Carib from Moscow. Most flights seem to connect through the USA. So then you need a transit visa.To much of a pain.
   I am sure there are some flights that go from Europe to the Carib without going through the US. So what airports in Europe does a Russian babe not need a transit visa? Or do they need one everywhere?

[Admin]

And BTW - to the OP 'spectris', it seems certain your lady friend, being from Ukraine, DOES require a visa to visit Mexico. If you determine otherwise and are able to get her there sans visa, PLEASE report back to us.

- Dan

[Admin]

  Ok, so lets say you want to fly your gal to somewhere in the Carib from Moscow. Most flights seem to connect through the USA. So then you need a transit visa.To much of a pain.
   I am sure there are some flights that go from Europe to the Carib without going through the US. So what airports in Europe does a Russian babe not need a transit visa? Or do they need one everywhere?

The Delta page (I know, I am sounding like a broken record), has a couple of optional drop-downs. Of course you must specify the citizenship of the passenger and the destination country. There are two other influencing factors - and those are:

Connecting through [country drop-down list], and
Alien Resident of [country drop-down list]

You could use a site like Expedia or Kayak to see what routes different airlines might take, and then use the Delta system to determine what visas might be required. In many European countries, they have a Transit Without Visa process so long as certain rules are met. For example, my MIL was transiting Munich on one of her trips here. We checked with the airline (United, in this case) and were confirmed that she did not require a transit visa for Germany so long as she was connecting and remained in the secured section of the airport. What they failed to tell us is that there is also a time consideration - that is, the passenger must be arriving and departing the same day. My MIL was returning to Ukraine, and had arrived late on one day, and was catching an early AM flight the next day - about a 6 hour layover, but it crossed midnight. Officially, she was in violation of the Transit Without Visa rules in Germany, but since she was already in Germany, they waived the rule.

We have experienced a couple of these situations - with CDG (Paris) being the absolute worst. Still, in general, FSU residents transiting through Europe does not require near the hassle transiting the USA has become.

I hope this helps.

- Dan