manny's thread

[Eduard]

Lets see who'll be the first to throw more mud into the wind....

do you actually have to ask?

[Daveman]

Well, aside from my own morbid curiosity to see how this one plays out:

Jack - I'll make you a public bet of $50,000 that there is not [nor has there ever been] any such photo in the Russian Bride Guide. Time to put your money where your over-sized mouth is. Do you accept?

YES!


Hey, now what about some of those "disreputable sites" you have claimed I am in cahoots with, can you please name some of them.

The thread does seem to have run its course of circular logic.  There appear to be primarily old grievances that needed some air time.  Unlikely admissions or apologies are forthcoming in any event. 

[Vinnvinny]

The usual protocol for such 'bets' is for both parties to lodge their bets with an independent 3rd party. Until such time Manny and Jack have deposited their $50k's then this is all really very childish. I can sympathise though, I was often in 'bet ya' mode when I was younger. I think I grew out of it when I was about 6.

[Eduard]

The usual protocol is such 'bets' is for both parties to lodge their bets with an independent 3rd party. Until such time Manny and Jack have deposited their $50k's then this is all really very childish. I can sympathise though, I was often in 'bet ya' mode when I was younger. I think I grew out of it when I was about 6.

because at that time you decided to start saving for your trips to Ukraine, Vinn? 

[BC]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/marshall-goldsmith/are-you-addicted-to-winni_b_307924.html

[Vinnvinny]

because at that time you decided to start saving for your trips to Ukraine, Vinn? 

In my dreams Eddie, in my dreams. Fortunately or unfortunately, whichever way you look at it, I don’t currently have a life so my percentage of expendable income is probably higher than most peoples.

If somebody would like to enter into a little wager with me as to if I will eventually marry a lady from the FSU within the next 10 years (or before I trot off to meet my creator, whichever is the sooner) then I would be happy to place a crisp £15 note in the safe and capable hands of my local vicar ... or one of his very handsome choir boys.

[SANDRO43]

I would be happy to place a crisp £15 note in the safe and capable hands of my local vicar ... or one of his very handsome choir boys.

Hand-crafted by yourself ? IINM, the Bank of England has never issued such a denomination, you should change your bet to a tenner + a fiver to find any takers .

[Vinnvinny]

Hand-crafted by yourself ? IINM, the Bank of England has never issued such a denomination, you should change your bet to a tenner + a fiver to find any takers .

Shhhhhh. 

(I only look stupid)

[Shadow]

I am more than happy to hold the money for both Jack and Manny until such time as they settle the bet.
Should I provide my bank account ?   

[Voyager36]

I can sympathise though, I was often in 'bet ya' mode when I was younger. I think I grew out of it when I was about 6.

I'll bet you a £15 note that you didn't.... 

[Donhollio]

 Is it too late for me to make a wager of my own?
I'd like to bet my home (free tittle) and my 2010 sportscar that this is the most ridiculous thread I have ever come across! Since I made this bet on the internet I know it will hold up in any cyber court   Not sure what book Jack got , but my complimentary copy of Manny's book has only one photo and that's the cover.
 Now since Manny won't post what 'disreputable sites' Jack apparently uses ( not Brides of Ukraine, Jack? Shame on you... Seniors and uni students they always make a good pairing on the streets of Odessa... well that is as long as the old man is tossing out the UAH by the hour.

[Turboguy]

The book didn't say "Don't go on Jack's tours" (IIRC) but Manny's opinion is that going on a tour is not a good way to look for a wife. Why did Manny come to that conclusion?
Probably the same way that most of the forum members have. We had a topic about this some time ago, the majority of RW said that a tour wasn't a good place to find a wife. Of the married non-commercial members here, how many of the wives would recommend tours as a good way for a WM to go?

That being said, Turboguy (a mod here) went on Jack's tour IIRC and didn't give it a negative review. (again IIRC) Vinny you also went on the tour, and as one of the most savvy (western) Russian travellers, if you thought the tour was worthwile that's a pretty good recommendation.

Actually voyager, I gave Jack's tours something beween excellent reviews and rave reviews.  I will talk more about this in a minute.

I have never read Manny's book.  I did talk to someone who did and who had also read two other books on the topic and who said, Manny's was the best of the lot.   I belive Jack's comments were that the book was basically cut and paste from a few years of forum topics.  Even if it was that would still save someone a lot of research and reading and could still be worthwhile.   The only book on the subject I have read is Elana's which was a waste.  I actually thought I got one usable idea from it and tried it on one lady I was writing and never heard from her again.   Personally, from the commments I have heard I think Manny's book is probably pretty good.

Based on the comments here I do think the information on tours in the book may be a weak point.  It is probably about suppertime where Manny is and if he is reading this on his laptop as he is eating his dinner he might want to stop eating until he finishes because one comment I will make would probably cause him to choke on his dinner if he has a mouthful as he reads it.

Personally Manny, when your first printing sells out and it is time for a second revised edition you may want to rewrite what you wrote about tours.  Just based on the comments here that part of your book could use some improvement.  I have taken three big agency tours.  Back when women were desperate to leave the FSU and when tours started it was probably a quick and easy way to marry a beautiful, desperate woman who would likely leave you once she gets established but today the big agency tours are not a good choice for men or women, but not at all for the reasons the comments say are in your book. 

Jack's tours are done very differently from the big agency tours.  Most of the negative comments about tours come from guys who have never taken a tour or have only taken a big agency tour.  I can't say I have ever seen a bad comment about Jack's tours and I have seen a lot of good comments about Jack's tours both here and on RUA.  Personally for your book to be factual and as helpful and infomative as it should be and as you would want it to be it should outline the real reasons big agency tours are bad, the differences and it should, based on the many good comments here and on your forum it should recommend Jack's tours as a good option, particularly for someone's first trip.  (that is the part that I would not want you to have a mouthful of food as you read.)   If you ever do want to do a revised second edition down the road I would think that either Vinny or I would be happy to help with an inside view of a tour and the real reasons big agency tours are a long shot on the path to happiness.

I don't know if your book mentions Eduard but he would also make a good topic in the book with his services that are also perfect for a newbie.   There are a lot of guys whose biggest trip of their life was done in their car and who don't know much about how to persue a RW other than the hype they read on the AFA website that can really benefit from someone like Jack or Eduard.  Even someone who has made a few trips can benefit from either Ed or Jack. 

[Manny]

Based on the comments here I do think the information on tours in the book may be a weak point.  It is probably about suppertime where Manny is and if he is reading this on his laptop as he is eating his dinner he might want to stop eating until he finishes because one comment I will make would probably cause him to choke on his dinner if he has a mouthful as he reads it.

Personally Manny, when your first printing sells out and it is time for a second revised edition you may want to rewrite what you wrote about tours.  Just based on the comments here that part of your book could use some improvement.  I have taken three big agency tours.  Back when women were desperate to leave the FSU and when tours started it was probably a quick and easy way to marry a beautiful, desperate woman who would likely leave you once she gets established but today the big agency tours are not a good choice for men or women, but not at all for the reasons the comments say are in your book. 

As you helped out with the K1 section Turbo, it was very remiss of me not to send you a copy (I thought I had actually). I will gladly do so now if you want to shoot me an address by PM. There is much rumour building up here about what I may, or may not, have said about tours. For anyone with a copy to hand, pages 71-73 are where you will find mention of tours.

Jack's tours are done very differently from the big agency tours.  Most of the negative comments about tours come from guys who have never taken a tour or have only taken a big agency tour.  I can't say I have ever seen a bad comment about Jack's tours and I have seen a lot of good comments about Jack's tours both here and on RUA.  Personally for your book to be factual and as helpful and infomative as it should be and as you would want it to be it should outline the real reasons big agency tours are bad, the differences and it should, based on the many good comments here and on your forum it should recommend Jack's tours as a good option, particularly for someone's first trip.  (that is the part that I would not want you to have a mouthful of food as you read.)   If you ever do want to do a revised second edition down the road I would think that either Vinny or I would be happy to help with an inside view of a tour and the real reasons big agency tours are a long shot on the path to happiness.

I can tell you something that may surprise you here Turbo. Here is a quote from the book:

If the idea of a tour appeals to you, it should be with a provider that allows you access to the underlying sub-agencies and who assists you to get acquainted with the women by correspondence and telephone prior. I only know of one agency that operates this way with tours, you will find their link on our resources website.

The agency I refer to is Jack. Despite my personal feelings about the man, I did speak to someone acquainted with him and his operation on the telephone at length during my research period. That was me throwing him a bone (a bone he later threw back in my face). Who would have thought it?

I don't know if your book mentions Eduard but he would also make a good topic in the book with his services that are also perfect for a newbie

I didn't know of Ed at the time we were writing. However, his banner features on the resources website for the reasons stated.

You mention an update. There are one or two small things I would like to update, and a few subjects I would like to expand further on. I have toyed with the idea of a new edition, and early 2011 was the plan. However, I recently heard that some changes were coming to IMBRA that would impact the existing [US and those who serve it] industry considerably, so I have decided to hang on until I know more about that. I am fortunate that I have a source very well-versed in what is coming, but I have yet to actually sit down with him face-to-face and find out all the details.

As the US Kindle market is just opening up to UK publishers, I also intend to do some homework on that too. A new edition involves much more work than one may imagine. Writing the words only represents a fraction of the work involved. Editing into US English, assigning the ISBN, creating the barcode, proof prints, the various registrations required, making sure it gets listed in the right places to be available to chain buyers and the various networks that feed the big websites, etc., is all time and work.

[Voyager36]

Actually voyager, I gave Jack's tours something beween excellent reviews and rave reviews.  I will talk more about this in a minute.

That's what I thought, but I didn't want to put words in your mouth.

I have never read Manny's book.  I did talk to someone who did and who had also read two other books on the topic and who said, Manny's was the best of the lot.   I belive Jack's comments were that the book was basically cut and paste from a few years of forum topics.  Even if it was that would still save someone a lot of research and reading and could still be worthwhile.   The only book on the subject I have read is Elana's which was a waste.  I actually thought I got one usable idea from it and tried it on one lady I was writing and never heard from her again.   Personally, from the commments I have heard I think Manny's book is probably pretty good.

That's why i asked if anyone had read all the books and could compare them.
I read Elena's bbok too, it was written from a woman's PoV, not automatically the best help for a guy looking for advice on how to choose a RW. The "A Russian woman will go for any employed, sober guy who is better looking than a monkey" wasn't exactly the best advice either, IMO

[Jack]

I owe manny an apology.

The photo in question was NOT in manny's book.

I was wrong and apoligize to manny for making the false representation that I did.

[Manny]

I owe manny an apology.

The photo in question was NOT in manny's book.

I was wrong and apoligize to manny for making the false representation that I did.

I am glad you cleared that up Jack.

Does that mean you will be editing your Amazon review?

[Jack]

Does that mean you will be editing your Amazon review?

Of course not manny.  I feel my expressed opinion on your book is quite adequate needs no editing at all. 

[Jack]

I realize their are RWD members who are not interested in this thread and to those of you who are in this category I expect you won't even be reading what I am writing now, but if you are one of those, and by chance are reading, I would encourage you not to read beyond this post, I think you will consider it more of the same ole- same ole and if it disturbs you their is no sense in you getting more disturbed.

For those of you RWD members who are amused over this thread I would encourage you to keep reading while at the same time support and respect those who have no interest in this thread and as such try to keep your comments of the going on's here contained to this thread so we don't offend those not interested

Members of RWD who are interested in this thread I also think I will be able to prove time and time again who is the master of spreading false and misleading statements and out right lies and who has been doing so for several years. I know this person does and hopefully will be able to show and prove to those who do not know this person, or those who are "on the fence" about this individual.

First let me say I have been quite busy over the past week traveling from Ukraine, a few days in Amsterdam, and preparing for a board meeting that was held earlier today. Now with that behind me I will be addressing many of the false statements manny has made.  Their is so much BS it is going to take me a few days to reply to everything.

manny I was mistaken saying I saw a photo of a girlfriend in your book. I knew I had saw where you had used her photo, I just forget where. I was in error for saying your "book", I would not have been in error saying your "book marketing".

Now manny I am going to address all your questions, have always addressed guys questions, I am not one to shy or run away, it's just going to take a few days to address everything.  But I do have one question I would like to ask you now and hope you will reply with a straight forward answer instead of one of your many, and mostly, beat around the bush and never answer the question answer.

It took a while but I found the photo of Helen you used on your website for your book   http://russianwifebook.org      manny, where did you get that photo?

[Manny]

Jack, that photo was originally posted by a member at RUA. I assume that member was you from your comments. It was chosen at random and used without malice.

More to the point, it was used quite legitimately in accordance with out TOS that you agreed to when you signed up. My usage of that photo is covered extensively in section four of our TOS.

Had you have ever identified it to me, explained it offended you, I would have substituted it, despite my absolute legal right to use it however I wish. However, you prefer to tell lies and spread false rumour -- as is your way.

Now that's cleared up, there is the matter of the $50,000 you owe me. The terms of the bet were quite clear and you accepted my wager in public. You have a debt. A debt incurred purely as a result of your lies and big mouth.

Can you outline your intention to discharge your debt please?

[Boethius]

Your terms of service apply only to those posting at your site.  They do not affect the rights of third parties, such as professional photographers, who usually have a copyright on all their photos.

[Manny]

Your terms of service apply only to those posting at your site.  They do not affect the rights of third parties, such as professional photographers, who usually have a copyright on all their photos.

Boethius, the solitary photo he objects to (dunno why he posted the other two) was posted at my site. Which part of the below is unclear?

you hereby grant to the company royalty-free, perpetual, irrevocable, worldwide, non-exclusive right and license to use, reproduce, modify, adapt, publish, translate, create derivative works from, distribute, perform, and display all content, remarks, suggestions, ideas, graphics, or other information submitted, to the site owner through this site and to incorporate any submission in other works in any form, media, or technology now known or later developed.  The company will not be required to treat any submission as confidential, and may use any submission in its business (including without limitation, for products or advertising) without incurring any liability for royalties or any other consideration of any kind, and will not incur any liability as a result of any similarities that may appear in future company operations.

This is pretty standard stuff on any forum. I am sure the RWD TOS say something pretty similar.

[Boethius]

Whether it is in your TOS or not is irrelevant.  If someone posted Coca Cola's secret formula on your site, you wouldn't have the legal right to reproduce it.

Your TOS apply only to posters, not to third parties whose rights have been infringed.

[Manny]

Whether it is in your TOS or not is irrelevant.  If someone posted Coca Cola's secret formula on your site, you wouldn't have the legal right to reproduce it.

You would if Coca Cola posted it and they agreed the TOS during sign up.

Jack claims to have taken said picture. Jack posted it. Really, is this so hard to grasp?

[Boethius]

Jack didn't post that he took the photo.  He only posted that it was a photo of a former girlfriend.

[tim 360]

Your terms of service apply only to those posting at your site.  They do not affect the rights of third parties, such as professional photographers, who usually have a copyright on all their photos.

Boethius is 100% correct.  Internet TOS does not supercede laws.  Using someones photo, image etc lifted off a website for commercial purposes is not legal in most states or countries.  Usually a legitmate ad agency will have the subject sign an ironclad "photographers release", a "commercial release" which stipulates how and where and for how long said photo will be used and...the ad agency will pay the photographed subject.  Simply lifting someones photo off a website without their express written permission is tacky in the 1st degree.  Most companies and ad agencies, and production companies know this quite well.