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Author Topic: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM  (Read 71995 times)

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Offline Manny

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Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« on: November 12, 2010, 02:44:27 AM »
So what does this mean,

Perhaps it means that HRB/RLM are not a "scam agency" as some quarters of the industry find it convenient to paint them? Perhaps the lack of evidence, and the anti-scam systems in place as discovered by those who visited, were not newsworthy enough to keep repeating. After all, who wants to go around shouting "ABC agency is not so bad after all"? Far easier to repeat a few rumours from some blokes who thought they were "scammed" video chatting with a woman thirty years their junior, which is what happens with many so called "scam" agencies.

The facts often get in the way of the rumours. Many prefer to ignore inconvenient facts and continue to perpetuate rumours. I wonder how many people who howl about "scam" agencies have actually used the agency they caution others not to use.

Some blokes think spending anything over $50 represents being scammed.

Offline Jooky

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #1 on: November 12, 2010, 04:17:10 AM »
Quote
Far easier to repeat a few rumours from some blokes who thought they were "scammed" video chatting with a woman thirty years their junior, which is what happens with many so called "scam" agencies.


So are you saying the girls video chatting with men 30 years older than them are legitimately interested in marrying them?

If not, how is that not a scam? :-\

Offline BC

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #2 on: November 12, 2010, 05:05:42 AM »
Jooky,

Nothing wrong with entertainment.

But it's not a scam.  Remember it's usually the men clicking the button to chat with these hotties with unrealistic expectations.

Offline Chelseaboy

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #3 on: November 12, 2010, 05:40:11 AM »
Only 20% of the "girls" online at HRB/RLM are showing on webcam at any one time.The ones that are not showing on webcam still invite you to chat.
Why are these "girls" not showing on webcam ? When asked this question,they come out with excuses like they are at work,so cannot put their webcam on..yeah right,so they chat for hours every day on HRB/RLM while they are at work ?
Their work seems to be chatting on HRB/RLM,but they don't switch their webcam on,i wonder why ? Could it be the person chatting,is not the girl in the alluring photo's...surely not ? : ))))
How about the "girls" that are online chatting from midnight,right through to after 5am,most nights ,who also never appear on webcam,and there are many.
Who knows who you are chatting with,if you are naive enough to chat with a photo ?
This situation is a scam,but not a site scam in my opinion,PROVIDED the site is acting on this situation when they receive a complaint,as the CEO claimed they do on another forum.
The scam is with the local Ukrainian agencies,but what can you expect when dealing with such a corrupt society ,rivalled only by Nigeria in their lack of morals.
By the way,this is not hearsay,i speak from personal experience of using HRB.
Just saying it like it is.

Offline Jooky

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #4 on: November 12, 2010, 05:50:19 AM »
So, if I'm sold 'beatiful vacation property in Florida' for dirt cheap prices, advertised using photos of beaches in Florida, is that a scam? Or it ok because I had 'unrealistic expectations'?

I know these guys are unrealistic suckers. It doesn't alleviate the fact that there are girls on the other side getting paid to chat that have no interest in these men, and that's not what the sites portray.

Offline BC

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2010, 06:55:24 AM »
Jooky,

The terms and conditions of these sites is what rules.  Are they violating their own terms?

Remember no tangible property is being sold so the Florida property is a bit of apple/orange.

As always buyer beware, regardless of product and especially service.

Offline Jooky

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #6 on: November 12, 2010, 07:08:10 AM »
I'm not saying what they are doing is illegal. Nobody reads Terms and Conditions and they can be contested in court. And sure, 'buyer beware'.

That doesn't excuse these sites for taking advantage of suckers and just because their asses are covered legally it doesn't make them good sites for men actually looking to find a Russian wife.

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2010, 07:52:00 AM »
Perhaps it means that HRB/RLM are not a "scam agency" as some quarters of the industry find it convenient to paint them? 

Would you recommend HRB to a friend new to the RW endeavor?

Would you recommend a restaurant with glorious items on the menu yet the prices are high and the kitchen frequently serves imitation lobster meat?  Actually, it is worse than that.

Whether a scam or not,
 
That doesn't excuse these sites for taking advantage of suckers and just because their asses are covered legally it doesn't make them good sites for men actually looking to find a Russian wife.

Exactly.

I will always recommend a newbie should use agencies that do not reek of such.   

Offline HRB/RLM CEO

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2010, 12:44:08 PM »
I'm not saying what they are doing is illegal. Nobody reads Terms and Conditions and they can be contested in court.

Not after agreeing to them every single time you enter the site.  This method (and lessor ones) have  already been sucessfully defended (enforced) numerous times in US courts.

That doesn't excuse these sites for taking advantage of suckers and just because their asses are covered legally it doesn't make them good sites for men actually looking to find a Russian wife.

Jooky:

I'd be curious to know if you really believe that you can hold yourself to the same "standards" that you expect others to achieve.  Let's compare first what we're REALLY talking about....

YOU = Have complete control over your own actions and ethics

ME = Must rely on 42 domestic employees, 150 independent foreign Agencies, with who knows how many independent employees as well as literally tens of thousands of "free-spirited" ladies that are always ever-changing (coming and going).

Now... it's VERY easy to criticize, and point a "finger" at others, but not nearly as easy to undergo the exact same "scrutiny".  For instance: You would insinuate, that it is not enough to...

1.) Create the most unforgiving SOP in the Industry with, by far, the tightest restrictions on Agencies and their expected/allowable conduct.

2.) Introduce Video Conferencing to this Industry (7 years ago) and revolutionize it (for the better) so that men can instantly "validate" ladies on-the-fly.

3.) Shift the primary commission structure (for the Agencies) from translating letters, to video (validated) chat.  So much so, that Agencies openly complained about not being able to do what they're encouraged to do on ALL other sites!  We said... "then leave"!

4.) Have established a documented history of "enforcing" the strictest policies in the entire Industry (easily proven in a courtroom) and having a list of more than 700 Agencies that have been refused, banned, fined and are no longer allowed on HRB/RLM!  

Yet, you would now insinuate that I should do what exactly? ...
  
A.) Monitor EVERY single chat (even MORE than we do now) to ensure that we enforce/regulate (through hypnosis or lie-detection) the "sincerity" of EVERY lady that is more than "X" years younger than the man attempting to chat with her?  OR;

B.) Just outlaw communication between male members (the men who don't lie about their age) and ladies over 10 years their junior?  OR;

C.) Take the word of every middle-aged (or older) member, caught chasing "barely-20-something" females at his word (like NONE of them are EVER unrealistic) that the lady was "leading him on" because...
 i) SHE didn't decline to chat with him immediately, because she somehow should have known (in advance) that she had NO intention of marrying him?
Totally ignoring the possibilities that;
ii) She was possibly bored and looking for some company, when HER (and ALL RW's) believe that all Americans are rich and after all, it IS only pennies-a-minute to chat.  and;
iii) Assuming also that it has NOTHING to do with HIS selected topics of conversation, rudeness, unrealistic expectations, or possible lack of personality?  OR;

D.)  (My personal favorite)  -  Hire many private investigative firms across the entire FSU, to "infiltrate" all 150 independent  Agencies (that we work with) in order to attempt to "catch" them (knowingly) engaged in "unethical" (covering a wide range of opinions regarding "ethics") but not necessarily illegal, behavior?  Sure, because we all know how non self-serving FSU private investigative firms would prove to be!

Let's skip the first three and jump to the fourth...

I would propose (not even knowing what it is that you do for a living) that if I suggested that I had reason to believe that you were not totally living up to your employer's  "expectations" because you could probably be FAR more conscientious (ethical) in your "time management" and probably get far more work done.  And, that you should hire a private investigator (at YOUR expense) to infiltrate your employer's organization, and attempt to uncover any activity (or lack of) that may prove my "theory" that you were acting in an unethical fashion (because *I* believe your employer is not getting 100% from you, every minute, of every day) ...that you might not pass your OWN test!  

Not to mention, you might be a bit upset after you spent SO much money to enforce someone else's unrealistic "idealism" and you're now out of work!  Especially, if you already KNEW that YOU were the most conscientious employee in the entire company!   But, regardless of that simple fact, you should be expected to hold yourself to a much higher "standard" going far beyond what is considered by society (well-defined in our laws) because *I* am unrealistic as to what you *I* think you should be required to do and more importantly, with complete disregard as to what others around you are currently producing (by comparison)?   Sure, I'll pay to have YOU investigated!    

The "line" I have chosen to draw in the sand is more ethical than any other site.  Not perfect mind you, but closer than anyone else.  And, as someone who I suspect  is not willing to shell out the cost of a site like ours already, I doubt you would want to assume the added cost of such unrealistic "self-policing" tactics.  We currently police far more (and better) than anyone else in the entire dating Industry...domestic and international combined!  

But.... having said THAT ... Not to worry, I have finally come up with a way to solve ALL these "idealistic" issues!    

Stay-tuned...



« Last Edit: November 12, 2010, 03:19:31 PM by HRB/RLM CEO »

Offline Jooky

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2010, 04:58:53 PM »
CEO, like I stated on RUA, I don't see that your operation in the states does anything illegal or directly 'scams' people. Your affiliates definitely do and you are unable to control them. In fact, you benefit from them misleading men, and you know it.

You're in a business that takes advantage of gullible men. If you can't see that, you are extremely naive (and I don't think you are).

I find that unethical. I would and do hold myself up to my own standards. I would not engage in a business that relies on taking advantage of suckers.

Offline Jooky

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #10 on: November 12, 2010, 06:03:50 PM »
PS: CEO, just read your own post above.

Restrictions. Allowable conduct. Validating. Monitoring. Enforcing policies...

Do you think this is a normal and good way to meet a lady that could potentially be your wife?

Would YOU go through this type of bs 'process' to find a wife?

I don't and I wouldn't, so I don't recommend it. The more 'policing' you have to do just tells me it's not a good system to begin with.

On the other hand, I can use a normal dating or social site where men and women are on an equal level and give no thought to restrictions, validating, monitoring or any of that nonsense. I can talk to ladies directly and have no worries about getting scammed. I can chat on Skype where I can see them and they can see me if I want to. The only bother is an occasional obvious spam message.

Online Gator

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #11 on: November 12, 2010, 08:51:52 PM »

Have established a documented history of "enforcing" the strictest policies in the entire Industry (easily proven in a courtroom)


That is excellent, if true.  If true, why would you have a list of:
 
Quote
... more than 700 Agencies that have been refused, banned, fined and are no longer allowed on HRB/RLM!


That is a huge number!  It begs the question - What does it take to be no longer allowed on HRB/RLM? 

I do not need exact statistics, yet how many such bans were precipitated by complaints from men such as the following two?

http://russianlovematchscams.wordpress.com/2008/07/14/russianlovematch-tell-your-story/


Quote
Not to worry, I have finally come up with a way to solve ALL these "idealistic" 

Stay-tuned...

Okay.

Offline HRB/RLM CEO

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #12 on: November 12, 2010, 09:19:45 PM »
Do you think this is a normal and good way to meet a lady that could potentially be your wife?

Well, it HAS become the normal (and accepted) way in the new millenium.

Would YOU go through this type of bs 'process' to find a wife?

Absolutely!  And it wouldn't take me that long either!

I don't and I wouldn't, so I don't recommend it. The more 'policing' you have to do just tells me it's not a good system to begin with.

Well, unfortunately the "system" was already in place LONG before I got here.  However I DO agree that's it's not a good system, so I have been hard at work developing a much better one!

On the other hand, I can use a normal dating or social site where men and women are on an equal level and give no thought to restrictions, validating, monitoring or any of that nonsense. I can talk to ladies directly and have no worries about getting scammed. I can chat on Skype where I can see them and they can see me if I want to. The only bother is an occasional obvious spam message.

And how's THAT been working for you lately?  What's a normal dating site... match.com? 
I was on match.com (and other so-called normal sites) doing research 8 years ago and was approached mainly by prostitutes with literally hundreds of Profiles (each had nearly one Profile for each city in the US) and professionals (not even sure if they were women) trying to lure me to their websites (that their younger sisters made for them) where I might be tempted to pull out my credit card (needed to gain entry) for a glimpse of their racier photos.  You can sign-up as Humpty Dumpty or Mickey Mouse, and scams are rampant on those sites!  Eight years ago match.com had over 180,000 RW Profiles!  Even the so-called "normal" members  lie about their age (and looks).  Of the so-called 4,000,000 Profiles they had back then, I would estimate that over 1 Million were professionals looking for suckers!  And THERE it's fair game!  No Validation, No policing, No monitoring, etc., etc.   Just a great place for professional con artists to find unsuspecting victims!  Word to the wise.... if you have "no worries about getting scammed", then you're probably bound to fall victim sooner or later.

Bottom line: The Industry, and primarily those in government, are about to change how you go about "interacting" online everywhere.  There aren't going to be any more "normal" sites.

Offline HRB/RLM CEO

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #13 on: November 12, 2010, 09:31:53 PM »
That is a huge number!  It begs the question - What does it take to be no longer allowed on HRB/RLM?
 

Just real evidence, not accusations.

I do not need exact statistics, yet how many such bans were precipitated by complaints from men such as the following two?

There is NO Stan Jensen ... it's a competitor falsely accusing and defaming... we have an action filed and we'll get to the bottom of it soon enough.  We have enjoyed 1/10th of 1% chargebacks for 6 years solid!  That's a 99.9% customer satisfaction rate... higher than all the dating sites in the entire Industry (so I'm told).  We've looked for these so-called dissatisfied "customers" in an effort to satisfy them.  Most don't exist! 

Don't believe everything you read online (posted anonymously) or written by customers that we've fully refunded and banned from the site for inappropriate behavior.

Offline Jooky

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #14 on: November 12, 2010, 10:21:12 PM »
Using sites that mediate and monitor your conversations is not the normal and accepted way of meeting people and never will be. Thank God for that.

Quote
And how's THAT been working for you lately?

If you didn't resort to exaggerations (I know what it's like to use match.com, hardly as bad as you described and I'm not dumb or desperate enough for an obvious spam mail to lure me to a porn site) and personal insinuations that just show you know nothing about me we might actually be able to have a conversation.

As it is, I'm not interested.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2010, 02:56:39 AM by Jooky »

Offline Kuna

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #15 on: November 13, 2010, 02:05:08 AM »
 We have enjoyed 1/10th of 1% chargebacks for 6 years solid!  That's a 99.9% customer satisfaction rate... higher than all the dating sites in the entire Industry (so I'm told). 

NO, that is not 99.9% Csat... that's just 1/10th of 1% of your customers were able to get their money back via their banks.

It's a big difference from what customer satisfaction actually is. Might mean there's some room for improvement in your business if you haven't worked out what a satisfied customer is yet.


Offline Jooky

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #16 on: November 13, 2010, 03:00:35 AM »
Yup Kuna... and you probably also know that it's easy for a business to prevent a chargeback by showing that they did provide the services promised in their terms. That shouldn't be too hard for these type of sites to do.

Offline BC

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #17 on: November 13, 2010, 03:51:03 AM »
Kuna,

In all fairness (and I'm not the type to jump on agency bandwagons) do you have personal experience with this organization?  Second hand? Any hand?

Jooky,

You've mentioned several times that the gullible guys are getting harmed.  From the looks of it can I assume this is a pretty big organization you are talking about?  Haven't a clue how many customers they have, but are all those customers gullible?

I mean there are a lot of 'get rich quick', 'get laid in 24 hour' books along with 'make your penis larger in a week' products out there.  Just about anyone with an IQ greater than their age sorta knows what's going on.. and of course there are the RW related sites.. Yes, there are a few that may believe they can login and order a bride, but I think there is not much one can do to help them.  Some may even have a little success trying to improve their self image or walk around with weights hanging from their penis - who really knows.

The word 'scam' is being used way too much, too often and too broadly - now days it includes anyone that even feels the slightest infringement of their rights or pocketbook.  You don't really hear 'I was not impressed', 'I was deluded', 'It did not work for me', 'I paid too much', or 'my expectations were too high or not met'.. They all scream 'SCAM' instead.

Based on the popular definition, scammers in my life are:

The government
The electric company
The telephone company
The car salesman
The electrician
The plumber
The friend I loaned 20 bucks
etc etc..

Regarding all this webcam stuff, it's getting very popular.. My wife finally installed skype to chat with mother and friends, I broke down and installed face time and my most frequent caller is my little son on his ipod in the next room.  That some man desires to chat with a woman to see where the chat leads is quite all right for both parties.  The chances of marriage whether via physical agency, organized meetings in smoky cafe's, speed dating, going on vacation or simply visiting your local grocers is quite slim already so what can really be wrong, less effective or worse off with webchatting?

The only true scam I could think of with webchatting is if instead of a live woman, your computer is fed with a recorded video stream.

Is that happening?
« Last Edit: November 13, 2010, 03:53:56 AM by BC »

Offline Jooky

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #18 on: November 13, 2010, 04:25:33 AM »
Quote
The only true scam I could think of with webchatting is if instead of a live woman, your computer is fed with a recorded video stream.

Is that happening?

What's been told is that at some agencies women are paid to sit at the camera while a translator juggles various conversations with that woman. The women are not part of the conversation unless the translator tells them to do something specific for the camera.

In addition: Women paid to pretend to be interested when they're not. Women paid to go on dates. Women required to respond to all messages when they're not interested. etc. etc. Come on. You've read these forums for years and have seen all the complaints.

Why have we heard so many complaints about HRB and AWeb yet not about Elena's Models, FreePersonals, Lucky Lovers, bride.ru, Russian personals sites and so on?

Regardless, I don't think that a one way web cam 'chat' mediated by a third party is a good way to meet someone. So, I'm not going to recommend it. I don't buy that it's the way of the future.

I recommend direct contact and meeting women you can directly communicate with ... if you plan to marry someone it kind of makes sense, no?
« Last Edit: November 13, 2010, 04:30:16 AM by Jooky »

Offline Jooky

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2010, 05:01:18 AM »
PS: To BC, you should sign up with HRB and tell me what you think of the legitimacy of the women sending you chat requests. You will get a TON. Tell me those ladies are sincerly looking to chat with you as a marriage prospect.

Sure you can call it an entertainment site. I'll agree with that. It should be billed as a purely entertainment site.

As such, when men come here looking to find a serious relationship should we direct them to sites that are primarily for entertainment only?

Offline Kuna

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #20 on: November 13, 2010, 05:23:31 AM »
Kuna,

In all fairness (and I'm not the type to jump on agency bandwagons) do you have personal experience with this organization?  Second hand? Any hand?


None at all... but any idiot knows .1% chargeback on CC transactions doesn't translate to a 99.9% customer satisfaction rating...

I've also never:

- Used Eduard's service, but I don't believe his claims of a 100% success rate for his clients;

- Stuck my foot in a bear trap, but I know it hurts, and;

- Opened a door on a moving jet plane, but know you shouldn't do it.

So you're point is?


Offline Shadow

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #21 on: November 13, 2010, 05:40:34 AM »
What's been told is that at some agencies women are paid to sit at the camera while a translator juggles various conversations with that woman. The women are not part of the conversation unless the translator tells them to do something specific for the camera.

In addition: Women paid to pretend to be interested when they're not. Women paid to go on dates. Women required to respond to all messages when they're not interested. etc. etc. Come on. You've read these forums for years and have seen all the complaints.

Why have we heard so many complaints about HRB and AWeb yet not about Elena's Models, FreePersonals, Lucky Lovers, bride.ru, Russian personals sites and so on?

Regardless, I don't think that a one way web cam 'chat' mediated by a third party is a good way to meet someone. So, I'm not going to recommend it. I don't buy that it's the way of the future.

I recommend direct contact and meeting women you can directly communicate with ... if you plan to marry someone it kind of makes sense, no?
Perhaps you should register on RHB and get proof about what you are told, might clean up another couple of agencies if CEO keeps his guidelines.

We are monitored in our conversations anywhere, as long as they are not direct. And even in direct conversatons you will find women who hve no intent of marrying, but just keep things going because of the nice feelings.
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Offline facetrock

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #22 on: November 13, 2010, 05:54:28 AM »
  A lot of people read this board. In the past we had posters who basically made stupid profiles(one guy even used a picture of a monkey) on agencys similar to HRB. They would still get hundreds if not thousands of responses. Now I'm sure there is nothing illegal about it but it would make any sane man question integrity of the site if not call it a down right scam. You have to pay to open the emails.

  So, any of you 50 plus guys out there who get hundreds of letters from early knockout 20 something girls from HRB care to comment?
Again nothing illegal about doing business this way but any companies reputation will suffer because of it.

Offline Jooky

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RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #23 on: November 13, 2010, 06:04:50 AM »
I am a member of HRB, Shadow.

I see no difference between it and AWeb. I have a bunch of emails piled up from all kinds of hotties. I sign in and the Live Chat requests from babes are waiting as if all these young thangs were waiting for the moment I logged on. I have some smoking hot supermodels that added me to their 'Admire list'.

Try it out. You can be a stud like me too!

About 'proof' of what actually goes on in these agencies, forgetaboutit. No woman in her right mind is going to put herself in jeopardy to post here or any other board.

How about you sign up with HRB and tell me if you think all those first contacts that you have to pay for are initiated by women that are even remotely interested in you?

I know this forum is mostly for entertainment, but there's one thing that I take seriously. That's when guys sincerely looking for a wife come here seeking serious advice. We may disagree on things but I think it's our duty to not mislead them just because we don't agree with the definition of a scam or some other nonsense.

So I challenge you, Manny and BC. Sign up for HRB. Don't post a photo. Get back to us in a week and tell us if you think that the many women that make first contact with you are really interested in meeting you are if they have some other reason to initiate contact. You'll get a bunch the moment you sign on.

Tell us then if you would recommend this site to newbies as a place to find a wife without being misled into wasting time and money on women that are there just for entertainment.

Offline Jooky

  • Full Member
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  • Posts: 969
  • Gender: Male
RE: Review/Critique/Roast of HRB/RLM
« Reply #24 on: November 13, 2010, 06:09:34 AM »
HRB's Chargeback Policy. Do I even need to say anything about this?

Quote
By using the Website or Services, users hereby acknowledge and agree that the purchase of any gift delivery service listed on the Website, and subsequent confirmation of delivery, constitutes value received. RTI specifically prohibits the solicitation of gifts by FNCs. However, RTI assumes no responsibility or liability for the actions, either online or offline, of Members, FNCs, or Agencies whatsoever. All users use the Website at their own risk. RTI strongly recommends that if an FNC solicits a Member for a gift, the Member should not send it.

Furthermore, all users covenant and agree that they will not initiate any cardholder chargebacks in an attempt to secure a refund, as any attempt to do so would constitute a violation of the terms of the purchase. Having acknowledged value received, users hereby agree that any effort to initiate such a chargeback would be a misrepresentation of fact and could be construed as an act of fraud.

 

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