compare and contrast--HRB/AWEB versus two legitimate agencies

[Rubicon]

since the thread critisizing HRB is locked I thought I would start a new thread with my own observations:

Compare and Contrast

HRB/Aweb                          versus     Kiev Connections and A Mordinson Introduction

large middlemen agencies,                   you are dealing with the source--Ukraine.
they are located in USA.    

they will not let u contact                   you are in direct contact w/agency in Ukraine.
the actual agencies in Ukraine.

you are bombarded with 400                you must contact ladies first, no chat.
letters and chat requests ea. wk.

ladies as young as 20 contact men        the ladies have reasonable age gaps
up to 70 years of age.

you cannot obtain owners name            they are proud of their name/reputation
of the agencies, or contact info
ie... they are not proud of their
name or reputation

agencies in Ukraine come and go.           in business for many yrs and there to stay

agency girls may receive cash in            girls actually rec. flowers gifts from ea. client
lieu of receiving flowers, gifts.
(client A sends flowers, clients
B, C , D, etc. rec. photo of girl
receiving flowers from clien A.

cost of 11 flowers $200.00 or more.       Mordinson charges $105 for 11 roses and choc.

high percentage of non legitimate          high percentage of legitimate women.
women
                                                       www.kievconnections.com
                                                       www.mordinson.com/

[knighta]

On Aweb I did 11 red roses $15 each came up to $165 then the delivery with the photo was $25 for a total of $190.  Where is the extra $10 coming from?

[Kuna]

On Aweb I did 11 red roses $15 each came up to $165 then the delivery with the photo was $25 for a total of $190.  Where is the extra $10 coming from?

 


Happy paying $190 for sending flowers to a girl who probably doesn't exist???

No wonder so many guys fail to find an honest compatible partner!

[knighta]

Happy paying $190 for sending flowers to a girl who probably doesn't exist???

No wonder so many guys fail to find an honest compatible partner!

No I was asking a legitimate question.  I have used Aweb before and I haven't had an account for a couple and yes I met a couple of these girls and they do exist.  I met my fiance here.

Here Kuna this is for you. You need it more than I do.  

Wanted to add I believe it was Kievstar who used Aweb website to meet his now wife and he didn't pay a dime.
Here is a trip report from Muckraker http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=1976.0

She had written to me six months earlier via Anastasiaweb, and we had been corresponding and speaking on the telephone consistently since that time (she speaks English).  Later on in the thread Oxana went to the Naturalization oath ceremony today, and traded in her green card for her Certificate of Naturalization on the spot so now she is a US citizen.

[viking]

If you went to www.roses.ru 11 stems goes for $87. The girl may now be your fiance but you waaaay overpaid for the flowers.

[knighta]

The 11 roses was what the OP had posted.  I didn't pay for 11 roses at all. 

[kievstar]

I could easily find a sincere woman on HRB and Anastiaweb with little payment. I married my wife and I saw her first on Aweb and I have never paid a dime to Aweb. 

Men need to improve themselves so they have a larger league to  date from.  Stay away from women under 26 years old.  Visit often.

The scam is the men not Aweb or HRB.

[facetrock]

 I agree with Kievstar but only if you live in Ukraine. Didnt you use Aweb while you were living in Ukraine? You had the time to figure out who the feeder agencys were and how to use them. Its a great way to do things but few men have the luxury of living there. You could end up spending a lot more money sitting in the USA chatting on HRB than on EM or Russian Euro and still end up with zilch. At least on EM if there not interested they wont respond and on Russian Euro the chat is included with the monthly fee.

[Rubicon]

On Aweb I did 11 red roses $15 each came up to $165 then the delivery with the photo was $25 for a total of $190.  Where is the extra $10 coming from?

plus $20 for chocolates comes up to $210.00 for Aweb--twice the price of Mordinson, and whether or not the lady is legitimately looking to get married is highly quesionable, and whether or not she opts to receive the roses and chocolate or get paid cash in lieu of them is also questionable.

[knighta]

plus $20 for chocolates comes up to $210.00 for Aweb--twice the price of Mordinson, and whether or not the lady is legitimately looking to get married is highly quesionable, and whether or not she opts to receive the roses and chocolate or get paid cash in lieu of them is also questionable.

Yes if you add the chocolates it would be more than $200 but you specifically said $200 or more when in reality it is not $200+ for just 11 roses.

[Rubicon]

I could easily find a sincere woman on HRB and Anastiaweb with little payment. I married my wife and I saw her first on Aweb and I have never paid a dime to Aweb. 

Men need to improve themselves so they have a larger league to  date from.  Stay away from women under 26 years old.  Visit often.

The scam is the men not Aweb or HRB.

Kievstar you jest.  in your trip report to Kharkov you admit that you wrote your future wife 4 letters.  4 letters sent and 4 letter received at $10 a pop is $80.  you recommend plying the agency girls with chocolate so add at least $20.  apparently your wife is tall slender and very attractive.  she was probably a big money maker for the agency.  I doubt if they allowed you to be introduced to her for less than $100.  than of course there is your airfare and hotel, flowers gifts for her and restaurant bar.  you got very lucky and met a legitimate woman who became the love of your life.

the real question is how many thousands of dollars did you spend in order to learn your techniques prior to selecting her.  as has been noted you lived in Ukraine for years so you had the chance to gain knowledge from your experience.  you also say you paid 25K to help a prior girlfriend purchase an apartment.  so your overall investment is very large.

most guys to not live in Ukraine or have the option to jet there on a whim to find out if one lady is legitimate.  better to deal with a legitimate agency and meet 5 or more women.

for example with Mordinson for a flat fee of $2250. a man can write to as many as he wants for one month prior to going.  once there he is met at the airport and taken to a luxury apartment.  the airport transfers and one week at the apartment are included in the fee.
each meeting with a lady lasts an average of 1.5 hours and includes the interpreter of either Michael Mordinson or his sister.  Michael received english certificate from Cambridge and his sister Darya Mordinson has a masters in English and German.  I doubt if many agency interpreters are that qualified.  if after meeting your chosen five ladies you do not make a match, you can meet more ladies at no additional charge.  $2500.00 for ten days.  there is no agency I know of who has such a high quality of prospective ladies and includes everything in one flat fee.  Mordinson has a very good reputation.  once you meet your chosen lady she is removed from the website for no fee and no hassle.  compare the above to Aweb and HRB.

[Rubicon]

Yes if you add the chocolates it would be more than $200 but you specifically said $200 or more when in reality it is not $200+ for just 11 roses.

I am comparing apples to apples.  Mordinson includes chocolate with 11 roses and a greeting card.  even if you just want to send the 11 roses $190. is a very high fee, coupled with the fact that the woman is likely just getting paid to have fun, and not really interested in marriage at all.  who gets the extra $105. ??  if you want to deal with a dishonest high priced fantasy type of agency that is your decision.

[Gator]

The scam is the men not Aweb or HRB.

You have the mentality of many Russian businessmen.  If a man is stupid enough to be fleeced, it is not wrong to fleece him.

Nevertheless, I think you are close to characterizing this transaction:

AM   = John
UW  = Whore
HRB =  Pimp

All are culpable.

[knighta]

I am comparing apples to apples.  Mordinson includes chocolate with 11 roses and a greeting card.  even if you just want to send the 11 roses $190. is a very high fee, coupled with the fact that the woman is likely just getting paid to have fun, and not really interested in marriage at all.  who gets the extra $105. ??  if you want to deal with a dishonest high priced fantasy type of agency that is your decision.

If you are going to state something state it with fact.  As I proved in your first post you were incorrect.  About being bombarded with 400 letters and chat requests each.  Well, damn you must make Brad Pitt look like the hunchback of Notre Dame.  About the women not being really interested in marriage at all and getting paid to have fun you could probably say this about a lot of agencies. 

[Rubicon]

If you are going to state something state it with fact.  As I proved in your first post you were incorrect.  About being bombarded with 400 letters and chat requests each.  Well, damn you must make Brad Pitt look like the hunchback of Notre Dame.  About the women not being really interested in marriage at all and getting paid to have fun you could probably say this about a lot of agencies. 

if you want to split hairs over facts that is your problem, not mine.  at $190 or at $210 the price is too high and the reputation of the agency in question (Aweb) is too low.  an apples to apples comparison shows that Aweb is over $200., as I initially stated.  while you are at it why don't you go over each and every one of my points, or do you agree with me on all of my other points??

[knighta]

if you want to split hairs over facts that is your problem, not mine.  at $190 or at $210 the price is too high and the reputation of the agency in question (Aweb) is too low.  an apples to apples comparison shows that Aweb is over $200., as I initially stated.  while you are at it why don't you go over each and every one of my points, or do you agree with me on all of my other points??

I can't disagree or agree with your points.  As I don't have the facts to back up my claim.  I don't pull numbers out of my ass like you do such as the 400.  Perhaps you pulled the other points out of your ass as well.  If I am mistaken show me.  I will admit when I am wrong.  Can you do the same?

[BC]

You have the mentality of many Russian businessmen.  If a man is stupid enough to be fleeced, it is not wrong to fleece him.

Gator,

Maybe the streets are still paved with gold?

http://www.cockeyed.com/citizen/kirby/kirby.html

So... it's not only RU businessmen with this mentality, in fact it prevails even 'at home'.. what about those hour long TV advertisement shows (infomercials?) selling just about everything imaginable?  How can they exist?.. because people want what they sell for whatever reason.

Goto http://www.infomercial.com/

Is a $149.95 steel cable bracelet with gold plated balls your desire? - if  yes then buy it!  These things cost about 10 cents to produce and another 50 cents to ship to the USA full container load.  Packaging and postage another 5 bucks and the vendor puts 100 bucks in his pocket after paying marketing overhead.  Enough folks buy these bracelets to pay for a roof over someone's head, a car payment and some food in the fridge if not more.  Who am I to argue?

Sheep are born to be shorn and sooner or later slaughtered and eaten - that's life.  If anything, folks in FSU have learned this from us.. - hardly something to brag about.

With all respect (and it is certainly due) you might want to re-evaluate your statement.

Folks come here to be informed and that's quite all right.  I believe they are presented enough information at RWD to make an informed choice - and bottom line I think that is exactly what RWD stands for... not wrong or right but informed choice.

That choice may not be one you or I may like, but that's life.  Those that don't get here I won't worry about.  It simply is not my problem, nor will I make it my problem.  This may sound arrogant but there is only so much I or you can do for those that exist outside this forum.

[Rubicon]

No I was asking a legitimate question.  I have used Aweb before and I haven't had an account for a couple and yes I met a couple of these girls and they do exist.  I met my fiance here.

Here Kuna this is for you. You need it more than I do.  

Wanted to add I believe it was Kievstar who used Aweb website to meet his now wife and he didn't pay a dime.
Here is a trip report from Muckraker http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=1976.0

She had written to me six months earlier via Anastasiaweb, and we had been corresponding and speaking on the telephone consistently since that time (she speaks English).  Later on in the thread Oxana went to the Naturalization oath ceremony today, and traded in her green card for her Certificate of Naturalization on the spot so now she is a US citizen.

it is not completely clear to me, Knighta--are you actually Muckraker??  if you are Muckraker, than why have you changed your name to Knighta??  I suspect that you are Muckraker because he makes a reference to Brad Pitt in his thread, and you make a reference to Brad Pitt in your diatribe here.

[Rubicon]

If you are going to state something state it with fact.  As I proved in your first post you were incorrect.  About being bombarded with 400 letters and chat requests each.  Well, damn you must make Brad Pitt look like the hunchback of Notre Dame.  About the women not being really interested in marriage at all and getting paid to have fun you could probably say this about a lot of agencies. 

I did not say 400 letters and chat requests each.  I stated 400 letters and chat requests each WEEK.  in other words a combined total of at least 400.  in 3 days I received 296 unsolicited letters and over 120 unsolicited requests for chats.  most of the letters and chat requests were by women who were younger than the minimum age I requested.  at this rate I will easily exceed 400.  I am similar height and weight to Brad Pitt but do not claim to be better looking.  beauty is in the eye of the beholder.  on the other hand I am clean shaven.  Brad Pitt might not do so well if he posted a photo of himself with his scruffy beard.  Russian women like men to be clean shaven, IMO.  plenty of other men have also received 400 combined letter and chat requests within a week.  do a little bit of research before acting incredulous.

[Rubicon]

I can't disagree or agree with your points.  As I don't have the facts to back up my claim.  I don't pull numbers out of my ass like you do such as the 400.  Perhaps you pulled the other points out of your ass as well.  If I am mistaken show me.  I will admit when I am wrong.  Can you do the same?

I will be just slightly more elegant than you.  I did not pull the facts out of thin air.  the facts I list are easy to verify if your eyes are open.  for example it is common knowledge that Anastasia Web is located in Maine USA, and that they are a large middleman agency.  you can go to their website to verify this.  it is common knowledge that Hot Russian Brides is located in Florida USA, and that they are a large middleman agency.  you can also go to their website to verify this.  I posted the link to two agencies in Ukraine to compare and contrast with Aweb/HRB.  you can go to the website of Kiev connections and Mordinson to verify their owners names, address in Ukraine, phone numbers and email contact information.  I prefer to deal with source agencies, if I deal with an agency at all.  that was the reason for my original post, to allow men a chance to compare and contrast.  if you prefer Anastasia, after looking at all available research/facts and opinions that is your choice.  I already showed you that in an apple to apple comparison Aweb charges double what Mordinson charges for 11 roses and chocolate.  I have just proved to you other facts in my post.  rather than being rude and attacking the messenger, can you look at the message and argue for or against the points which I have made?  can you do that??

[Muckraker]

No, he isn't Muckraker. 

Muckraker

[knighta]

I do not have a clue who Muckraker nor did I know he used Brad Pitt.

You stated you are bombarded with 400 letters and chat requests ea. wk .  I and other people who I know received nowhere near this.  So once again damn you must make Brad Pitt look like the hunchback of Notre Dame.  I also was never part of the chat requests as I left this agency before this happened.  Additionally my amount per week was maybe 50 with the exception of when I first joined then it was a tad higher.   My fiancé prefers me to not be clean shaven.  She has seen me in person with and without being shaved. Actually I did my research what I have stated is all true. 

You weren’t elegant, you were rude.  Sounds to me like you pull facts out your ass especially when I have to correct you. 
You stated in your first post - cost of 11 flowers $200.00 or more.  Aweb is cheaper than this.  There was no mention of anything related to chocolate whatsoever about chocolate for Aweb.  If you are going to post something post it correctly.  If you had posted something like cost of 11 flowers plus chocolates $200.00 or more you would be right but you didn’t so you were wrong.  I guess you can’t admit when you are wrong.   
You stated large middlemen agencies they are located in USA.  Yes , however Aweb also has offices in Russia.  14/10 Tatarskaya Ulitsa, Moscow, Russia. 
You stated cannot obtain owners names of the agencies.  Actually their names are David and Elena Besuden.  I guess you missed this to.  You seem to miss a lot of things.  Here it is from their website - Our owners, David and Elena Besuden met in 1992 through an introduction service and were married that same year.  http://www.anastasiaweb.com/Default.aspx?page=About But you actually got something right you can’t obtain their contact info.  Would you like a cookie or maybe a gold star?
You stated  agencies in Ukraine come and go and stated on the other side of the column  in business for many yrs and there to stay.  For Aweb has existed since 1993 looks like they have been in business for many years and are they are here to stay to. 
You should follow your advice - do a little bit of research before acting incredulous.  I did my research yet you seem to not to. 

[Jumper]

I do not have a clue who Muckraker nor did I know he used Brad Pitt.

You stated you are bombarded with 400 letters and chat requests ea. wk .  I and other people who I know received nowhere near this.  So once again damn you must make Brad Pitt look like the hunchback of Notre Dame.  I also was never part of the chat requests as I left this agency before this happened.  Additionally my amount per week was maybe 50 with the exception of when I first joined then it was a tad higher.   My fiancé prefers me to not be clean shaven.  She has seen me in person with and without being shaved. Actually I did my research what I have stated is all true.  

You weren’t elegant, you were rude.  Sounds to me like you pull facts out your ass especially when I have to correct you.  
You stated in your first post - cost of 11 flowers $200.00 or more.  Aweb is cheaper than this.  There was no mention of anything related to chocolate whatsoever about chocolate for Aweb.  If you are going to post something post it correctly.  If you had posted something like cost of 11 flowers plus chocolates $200.00 or more you would be right but you didn’t so you were wrong.  I guess you can’t admit when you are wrong.  
You stated large middlemen agencies they are located in USA.  Yes , however Aweb also has offices in Russia.  14/10 Tatarskaya Ulitsa, Moscow, Russia.  
You stated cannot obtain owners names of the agencies.  Actually their names are David and Elena Besuden.  I guess you missed this to.  You seem to miss a lot of things.  Here it is from their website - Our owners, David and Elena Besuden met in 1992 through an introduction service and were married that same year.  http://www.anastasiaweb.com/Default.aspx?page=About But you actually got something right you can’t obtain their contact info.  Would you like a cookie or maybe a gold star?
You stated  agencies in Ukraine come and go and stated on the other side of the column  in business for many yrs and there to stay.  For Aweb has existed since 1993 looks like they have been in business for many years and are they are here to stay to.  
You should follow your advice - do a little bit of research before acting incredulous.  I did my research yet you seem to not to.  

have YOU used  both types of agencies ?
using OTHER sites , and comparing your experinces?

those that have typically see a difference is like night and day.
I've never seen one  man that argued the valuie of such places,  if they had used any other means to compare.
Visiting locally as kievstar suggested is likely the best policy if you werr t o use theses places.

Knighta-
 I received at least that many letters and chat requests in a week..
 so Rubicon isn't exaggeratting the numbers in my experince at all.
you can put up a blank profile with no photo and get 100..!!
I know several  men who got 400 per week..
 Your experience is before the chat feature??? (or these type agencies  hiring girls to chat)

So your own *research* might just be a bit dated.
 mine's this year. and i was seriouisly researching them from my own curiosity...


Yes I certainly know there are sincere women at such agencies, and have met them.
I'm not a disgruntled customer at all. In fact i'm happy. I'm just a realist,and to wade thru the smioke and mirrors at such agencies is a tribulation for most sincere guys.They are bertter off doing most anything else.

These big agencies  have a horrible reputations ,where there is smoke there IS fire.
sure some of it could be built on jilted men ,sour grapes?
but I feel plenty of the bad reputation  is based on rational mens real expereinces there.

I feel ruibicons assement is fairly accurate.. GENERALLY speaking ,which is waht he was putting out there ,a general assesment.
i have a bad vibe about some local agencies as well.. even mordinsons,and don't believe any FSU agency is spotless  
but generally speaking ,I feel if a man is going to use an agency,
then he is better off going thru a *reputable* local agency, rather than the big middleman conglomerates.
Finding a reputable local one might be a task,,but worth doing so.

bickering over whether ,one or the other, overcharges more for flowers seems really pointless.

It's the business model of the big ones that reeks..and
 encourages sham in the affiliate local agencies.

put up a profile on any one  of these type agencies  today, you will have well over 100 replies by tomorrow ..
and a ton of additional chat requests.Other members here have tried it ,not one I know of failed to get this type of
high responce.

[Jumper]

by the way . just opened  thier website for the heck of it.. too funny!

(the one ending with .com.ua )

7 chat requests in 3 minutes , 18 seconds..


i do not have a profile there now .. and am not a member.

So that's simply *chat invites* coming to any one randomly  browsing that website.

and you find 400 per week an exagerration?


 

and those invites , if  you join and pay at the prompt , the women are there live and willing to chat with you.



Look i'm glad you found happiness..

but finding a girl there, doesnt nessarily   make you well informed on the subject of Aweb/HRB or similar agencies  current practices ,methods , or how they compare to other agencies.. with diffrent business models.

[knighta]

I have never used HRB so I can’t comment on them with my own experiences.    If I had I would already posted something about them.  Yes my experiences are before the chat feature all of that is already stated.  About the 400 I have already stated my experiences it wasn’t current.  I had left that site a couple of years ago. But yes I did find 400 a week to be an exaggeration. Nowhere did I say I was well informed.  I am only stating my experiences and correctly Rubiconne.  A 350 difference a week is too much an exaggeration.  One person’s profile will have more qualities then another person but that seems too large for me.  About the flowers if you are going to post something post it correctly.  I might at as well say that Belarus is in South America or there have been a total of 59899 presidents in the USA.  Besides the 400 all the other statements I had said you can’t argue with it which he made many mistakes on.