Terrified to apply for a job :(

[Aloe]

I'm scared crapless to apply for a job! What to do?? I've never had a real job before, and i suspect it would be scary enough to apply for a first job back home, let alone in some strange land
I feel like the only job i'm qualified to do is a cleaning lady. I know that is not true, but that is how i feelllllll. Every time i open a job ad, and see a trillion and two requirements for a candidate that i may or may not possess (i'm not sure if i have those qualities they list in such abundance), i just feel so useless and unqualified to do anything.
Add on top that i'm still at the stage where you are too shy to talk in a language, cuz you feel it's so crappy (and i do make a lot of mistakes when talking, so it's not ungrounded shyness), sigh.
Worst thing that can happen i won't get a job, but if i don't apply i won't get it for sure, that's what hubby says. But really, worst nightmare that is a paralyzing image in my head is getting hired and messing up so badly and being such a horrible unqualified employee and being ashamed, not knowing what to do in half of the situations and having nobody to ask what to do and HOW to do it! Sigh

[Steamer]

Good luck to you Aloe. You're a smart woman, I'm sure that you'll do ok.

When my wife was applying for jobs in the US, the hardest thing for her was being turned down after the interview. She took it as a personal rejection and would become very discouraged and depressed. I told her to keep trying; that learning how to apply and interview was a skill that comes with practice. After about 11 interviews she got her job and is now happy that she persisted.

[Faux Pas]

Aloe

If the qualifications are a long list, likely they don't expect to find anyone with all the qualifications. Finding some with enough and teachable for the rest is normally the goal. My advice is to not sweat it. If you meet most of the criteria or even half, apply for the job. You're young, intelligent and (seemingly) trainable. That is a powerful virtue all it's own. Many employers do not want too experienced as many time they may have bad or annoying habits as it pertains to the job. Don't let the qualifications listed scared you as long as you have some basic education or other fundamentals pertaining to the position.

I hire many people on a regular basis for some specific trained positions and few meet all the criteria  

[GoodOlBoy]

Thank you for opening this topic Aloe.
I have always wanted to post this story somewhere, but the opportunity never arose.
I really don't know if this story can help you in your particular situation, BUT...Maybe it can help some other married Newbie out there.

When I first met my wife, she and I talked about a lot of different topics.
One was children, which thank God, neither one of us wanted (I already have an adult daughter).
Another topic was "working".
Marina insisted on not "sitting" at home.
I said OK, then she wanted to know if I would help her look for work.
I told her of course I would.
After she landed here in the GoodOl' USA and married GOB in Las Vegas, she reminded me about my promise to help her.
I smiled and said "no problem".
We use to live in a gated "private" community in South Florida (Homestead) and I was pretty good friends with the property manager and the office staff.
To make a long story short, I asked the property manager if he needed a "volunteer" to answer the telephones and maybe do some of the office work (filing, copying paperwork, delivering notices to the residents, etc.).
He jumped on the idea and said "sure" (free help).
Now you have to understand that my Marina had never heard of working for free (volunteer work) in Russia, but she quickly realised why I had done this for her.

In a matter of month's she was answering the telephones, learning to speak fluent English, doing some of the accounting postings (computer programs), mastering all of the office equipment (copying machine, fax machine, etc.), learning American office lingo (slang) and of course meeting all of the residents (socializing).

In short, free on the job work experience here in the GoodOl' USA!!

BUT....NO MONEY!!

So several month's after she started,  I talked to the office Manager and he said she was doing very well.

I then approached a friend of mine who is the branch Manager of our local bank and told him about my wife's education and work experience. He told me to have her submit her resume'.

So, GoodOl' Boy helped his wife compose a resume'. Marina submitted it to the banks human resources department and bingo she had a job interview for bank teller and voila!.....she was hired as a bank teller$$

GOB

PS....Marina now works for a major manufacturing firm here in Miami and her title is Asst. Comptroller/Sr. Accountant and in our spare time we both "volunteer" at the Miami Humane Society (caring for homeless animals).

[GQBlues]

Man, I like this subject and thanks for opening it up Aloe. I have much I believe I can share with you based on my wife's recent experience and progression. You're in the same age range, more or less...

I have deadlines to meet today so I'll definitely come back to this thread.

Also....

...and in our spare time we both "volunteer" at the Miami Humane Society (caring for homeless animals)....

Elated to hear this about you GOB. I had been involved in the like where I'm at for years and my wife had followed my passion for it. 

[Zmejka]

I had (and actually still have) the same kind of problems and worries. I was just 1 year after university then i came here and had little work experience, mostly internships i did during studies and then i was doing the job that wasn't according to my speciality (working with xerox), so nobody here took anything from my CV serious.
At firlst i tried to apply for jobs when i finished my language courses here, so 1,5 year after my arrival (i went to 1-year course 6 months after my arrival). First i hoped to get office job like working with clients - no way. After raising my hopes every time high and then - getting dissappointed, for some objective reasons (like not enough work experience, still nobody wanted to take and teach me even when i showed that i can learn quickly), but sometimes - stranger reasons like i was "too eager" or "they wanted people who live exactly in their city" (and that my city is in 15 km. didn't matter for them) etc. Finally after several months i got the job in sales in duty free department at the airport. Unfortunatelly after 3,5 months they fired all temporary workers including me. I got another job - post deliverer, but that's another story.
Now i don't work for already a long time and only the thought to begin getting again through these agencies, interwies and denials make me almost sick. But i have no choice. Still i think to go first to work voluntarily because may be this way i will make some contacts that help me in the future. Because i don't consider interviews as "new experience"', i know all the rules how to pass the interviews well (like getting prepared to common questions, learning about the company, dress code, giving feed back after interview etc.) and i get stressed and depressed after each fail, so i would like the least stress possible in this direction.
Aloe, I wish you good luck in your search! I hope you'll get both lucky and appreciated at your future interviews and work.

[Shostakovich]

Interesting topic to which I hope I can add a helpful perspective.  I'm responsible for hiring also and conduct many interviews, manage etc.  In any event I would think that most anyone who thinks seriously to bring someone over on a K1 will have to contend with finding employment for the lady.  That is essential, and seems to go under appreciated here.  I know of at least one K1 that went South because the lady was couped up all day without a thing to do in a remote location.

1. If you do not need the money then volunteer work is a great choice.  You learn the ropes and gain important experience in communications with a wider circle of native speakers, improving your language skills. 

2. If you do need the money then do not be afraid to start at the bottom.  Most foreign born workers must eventually contend with the fact that they will not be able to achieve as high ranking a position in a foreign country than as at home.  Many great careers started in the mail room.

3. Do not forget also, however, that as a Russian you have assets that nationals do not have.  This is especially true for women.  I am thinking about work involving contact with the public, like shoe sales, where a Russian accent and way or being will attract a certain clientele.  If you work in sales then the men will find the accent intriguing and the women, especially if you are elegant in the way that many Russian women are, will want to emulate you, which you can leverage to your success.

There are many websites that offer advice about how to conduct yourself in the interview and how to create a resume using non-professional experience.  The fact that you have run this WM-RW gauntlet is something that could be used, for example, shows you are not afraid of the unknown.  In any event, best luck. 

[dbneeley]

PS....Marina now works for a major manufacturing firm here in Miami and her title is Asst. Comptroller/Sr. Accountant and in our spare time we both "volunteer" at the Miami Humane Society (caring for homeless animals).

GOB--

You and your lady were obviously very wise in the route you took. I congratulate her on her success--and it is obvious that you care for each other deeply, which is always heartwarming for me to see. I thank you for your story.

By the way, I visited several high-end department stores in Texas last Summer, looking for a particular perfume for my wife. I met three FSUW working in the perfume and cosmetics departments in two of the stores. One of them was introduced to me by her manager after I commented that my wife could not try the perfume samples herself as she was back in Ukraine--she said "My top sales person is a Ukrainian--let me introduce you!" Let me tell you--a top-notch sales person in a Neiman Marcus does very well indeed. Apparently, the accent was not a liability for her at all--just the opposite.

David

[GoodOlBoy]

1. If you do not need the money then volunteer work is a great choice.  You learn the ropes and gain important experience in communications with a wider circle of native speakers, improving your language skills. 

Agree.

And if you happen to screw up on something, it's really no big deal because there is no "money pressures" involved (you are not a "paid" employee and volunteers are easily forgiven for their transgressions).

As a side note, my wife was taught a lot of different things at a very rapid pace when she was "volunteering" her time at our community office.

I personally believe it was because the other employees there did not feel threatened by her presence. In fact, they knew she was a volunteer and would be "moving on" eventually, subsequently she was never perceived as a "threat" to their positions in the company.

GOB

[Ranetka]

What is your education Aloe?

I think for me starting at the bottom was a big mistake. I found there are more competiotion amongst unqualified work force then  amongst qualified. Once I stopped applying for silly jobs and went for the positions similar to what I did in Russia I started getting interviews and eventually got my first "propler" job. The time I spent (nearly two years) doing unqualified jobs was wasted, gave me nothing but shattered confidence.


If I to do the same again I would

1. REgister in all employment agencies (the one supplying temp stuff) and WOULD DROP EVERYITNG IMMEDIATELY if got a phone call, would be ready to start tomorrow if required.

2. Tried to get a volonteer position close to the job I wanted

3. For the laguage practice would try to get a job as a waitress.

4. Would apply for the same jobs as back home or step below, for you any starting position will be fine :-) Are you a graduate? Do they have graduate programms in Belgium?

[SANDRO43]

If the qualifications are a long list, likely they don't expect to find anyone with all the qualifications. Finding some with enough and teachable for the rest is normally the goal.

Quite so. I replied to this ad back in late 1968, frankly specifying that the only qualification I had resulted from being a technical translator, and was eventually hired.

This was the start of my 30-year career with that anonymous "Large International Company" (IBM Italy). Of course, I knew absolutely nothing about computers back then .

[pitbull]

Aloe,

Are there any temp agencies in the area? If yes, they can be very helpful, a great way to "set foot in the door" and try different options. In the US temp agencies often have "temp-to-hire" positions, eleiminates the whole interview process.

I got my first job in the US through a temp agency, and am still with the same employer with a very promising career outlook.

[vwrw]

Buy or take in library a book about how successfully pass job interview in your country. Formulate answer to the most common questions ahead and practice answering them with your husband in the role of employer. 

Offering yourself as a volunteer is also a good idea. It will provide you with opportunities to learn necessary terminology and to get references which many potential employers may ask for.

[GQBlues]

Add on top that i'm still at the stage where you are too shy to talk in a language, cuz you feel it's so crappy (and i do make a lot of mistakes when talking, so it's not ungrounded shyness), sigh.

Immigrant's 'new' society's work acclimation anxiety 101:

One of the things we decided to do before was have my wife get a part time job. She worked for Armani Ex (retail) and at a resturant called Charthouse as a hostess. It wasn't for the money nor for her to spend 'idle' time on but to 'add' into her future resume showing US employment experience. As an immigrant myself, I found this was more important than many give it credit for. Giving a company a source of references is of a major, major significance in the way your future employer will base their decision on what to do with you. At the stage she was in at the time, a full time University student, generating some form of work experience was very crucial when she gets an interview as most students here do work while still in school.

Lastly, PT work is a great way to experience, and be constantly around, the English ( country language)-speaking public at large (without me in the picture). Having a 'little bit of a feel' of what it's like to be around other folks 'working in the US' is a huge boost for her conversational skills and social interaction skills ( There's also one more reason why this is crucial and I'll explain below).

Seeking Employment from an Immigrant's POV:

The very best compliment I can give RWs/FSUWs is that they're just as good as any AWs in their respective ages. I say that as complimentary because I think very highly of AWs (unlike the usual suspects in the MOB). But one thing I believe, from an immigrant's POV, that FSUWs have an advantage over the native born is, carrying the belief that they are 'functioning from a disadvantaged position' because they're fresh off the boat (FOB). But actually, and maybe because of it, they tend to explore, strive and extend a bit 'more' effort and diligence in everything they do. Generally anyway...

So don't let your 'status' be your burden but rather a motivation. If you, even for a moment, begin to believe it's a burden, it will bog down and squash your ambition and aspirations.

Interview Anxieties:

Interview is technically competition between candidates. The 'better' qualified applicant/s ( notice I didn't say the 'best') usually gets the offer first, IME. You'd want to be in the best position you can muster for yourself.  Armed with both a degree AND work (field) experience (w/ references) is generally a slam dunk for level entry applicants as they are for upper level positions.

My 'interview' experiences seem to be much different than what my wife's experiences are/were. It could well be because of the industries we're respectively involved in. My interviews have all been very informal and were with Owners, P/VPs, CEOs...and they generally happened an hour before lunch, during lunch, and one more hour after. It usually ends with a handshake and followed up by a written agreement detailing offers given during the interview. I've been fortunate as I never had an interview that ended with a parting sentence saying...We'll let you know of our decision!".

The first full time job interview she went through she got lucky on because she went in somewhat 'relaxed' since her intent was to simply get an 'internship' experience (work without pay). I kept telling her to just relax since there's no money involved. She apparently did better than expected because they gave her a paid position plus benefits. Later, she told me that helped her a great deal was her past 'work experiences' (see above). The company obviously understood she was an undergraduate, but the fact she already had 'work experiences' AND 'sources of references', put her above all the other applicants.

After she graduated, and was armed with an acquired credentials and merit, I told her to shoot for the top. Send resumes to as many companies but also concentrate on her industries' top companies by sending more than one resume and make more than one phonecall of inquiries. It worked as those companies were the very first to respond.

Interviews were scheduled and before each one, she and I sat down and went over how she should handle certain scenarios and certain ways she should be presenting herself to every level of management. Then we went over her past 'working experiences' to help shape her psyche and prepare her for the IQ/Stress examinations. I showed her how to power-package up her resumes and credentials, and how to directly address questions void of any personal fluff.

Post-interviews, she was driven and very diligent with her follow-ups. There were a few days (weeks) of silence, no news, no developments that were beginning to bother her (this is where a good hubby needing to be a great hubby comes into the equation). Then the offers started pouring in...watching my wife surf through these offer sheets was definitely one of the happiest days of my life and marriage. She deserved every bit of this moment.

In just a very few short years, I am satisfied to know my wife life is limitless in her opportunities at this time. As a person, she is now fully independent and more than capable as a person, so yeah, she's doing okeydokey...

But really, worst nightmare that is a paralyzing image in my head is getting hired and messing up so badly and being such a horrible unqualified employee and being ashamed, not knowing what to do in half of the situations and having nobody to ask what to do and HOW to do it! Sigh

During the early stages of my career, that was a normal state I found myself in in the first couple of months when starting a new job. My wife today apparently goes/went through the very same anxieties. I have a feeling most folks do....

I'll just tell you what I told my wife that seemed to ease her fear a bit...block out the noise and simply dig your head into your work to the very best of your ability. Do not let uncertainties pester your thought process with the job at hand. If you're not sure how to proceed with your current load, do not hesitate to ask questions. Think nothing but the task on hand. Produce, produce, produce. A month will pass by so quickly and you'll be surprised at how well you look from your superior/s and peers' POV.

By then, you'll be safely in a familiar and comfortable environment. It's Ok to be mindful or uncomfortable during times of transitional changes. That's very normal.

Also, understand that in any given working environment, office politics can be used to your advantage, but it can also be the cause of your demise. Always note the proverbial separation line.

Without knowing what your skill sets are, your ambitions and your strenght, I'll just say any 'decent' work you do today should help build your personal credibility pool that will be your own inspirational pool in the future. That first step will be worth far more to yourself than you'll ever realize....

I hope some of this helps...

[Nat]

Aloe, don't forget a Russian proverb: "Наглость - второе счастье" Be confident in yourself! You are a good specialist, besides, you're young - which means you catch on quick, learn new things easily, which makes you a great employee. They should be happy to have you, not you - them

[Aloe]

Wow, what great responses, thanks everyone I actually don't have a degree yet, but my computer skills are aplenty   Definitely enough for an administrative worker busy with documentation and so, but need to improve my language, cuz they all want you to talk to customers as well. Although i have seen a couple ads where they only want you to speak perfect english, mother tongue russian and only good dutch, but i was too chickenchit to apply, maybe i'll find the strength one of thse days   Although if i honestly had to grade my dutch, i'd rate it satisfactory, not "good". Although on paper it's "very good" and enough to pass the language requrements for a dutch language university program enrollment, which i'm going to do next school year. Just was thinking of a job until studying starts in october. It is hard to say if your language level is "good" or "very good" or what not. I had my english skills listed as "good" on EM for years, cuz i didn't find my english fluent enough to honestly call it "fluent", but then i looked at some other women's profiles with broken english and their level listed as "fluent", so i changed mine to fluent towards the end  

[GQBlues]

Aloe-

FWIW, I'm not sure about Belgium, but I do know in the US bi-lingual speakers are a huge plus. I reckon there's got to be companies where you are that may find your Russian persuasion be of huge marketable advantage.

[Aloe]

Aloe-

FWIW, I'm not sure about Belgium, but I do know in the US bi-lingual speakers are a huge plus. I reckon there's got to be companies where you are that may find your Russian persuasion be of huge marketable advantage.

GQ, here if you aren't bilingual, you are hardly employable, seeing how the country has 3 official languages: dutch, french and german. While german part is small enough to neglect for a non-international business, french and dutch are essential for most any job, as the respective language populatons are represented by millions. Many companies, however, work internationally as well, especially with germany, so we already established that vast majority of job ads want you to speak dutch and french, plus many will throw in german and english, and quite a few require other european languages as well.
All in all, from my experience communicating with people, i'd say the dutch speaking population of the country can explain itself in minimum 3 languages, and that includes low schooled factory workers, hairdressers, bus drivers and so, they all speak dutch, english and french. So to stand out of the crowd, you need to speak minimum 4 languages, otherwise you are nothing out of the ordinary. Also there is a very big russian population here, so there is a lot of competition for the spots requiring russian language

[BC]

Aloe-

FWIW, I'm not sure about Belgium, but I do know in the US bi-lingual speakers are a huge plus. I reckon there's got to be companies where you are that may find your Russian persuasion be of huge marketable advantage.

GQ,

Belgium is one of those countries where multiple languages is the norm.. Dutch, French and German.. plus English. Russian probably doesn't give much added value unless directly related to business with RU and very solid skill in most, if not all the other languages.

As far as business mentality goes, from what I've seen it's work hard followed by party hard.

Enjoy visiting several times a year on business but don't think I could settle there.

Edit: cross post with Aloe..

[Aloe]

Belgium is one of those countries where multiple languages is the norm.. Dutch, French and German.. plus English. Russian probably doesn't give much added value unless directly related to business with RU and very solid skill in most, if not all the other languages.

You are right, the number of jobs requiring russian is extremely small and only in companies working with FSU, and it does require dutch and french plus a very specific education in most cases, that's why it's so rare that i found a job ad for a regular administrative worker with only russian english and dutch, i better go apply tomorrow Although it is like 2 hours drive, not sure i can manage such long commute, that's basically the other end of the country.. hmmm
see, i'm making obstacles again. Altho i do hate long commutes

[BC]

see, i'm making obstacles again. Altho i do hate long commutes

Aloe,

You really have nothing to loose and everything to gain.  It seems your necessities are covered so think about it all as 'icing on the cake' instead.

Something will surely come around but don't stress over it.

[GQBlues]

Aloe / BC -

Of course, I should've known that. The whole of Europe for the most part, even with the exclusion of English, is understandbly multi-lingual. The US however, by and large, isn't, but because of having a large Spanish-speaking folks, makes it quasi-bilingual. Not counting pidgen (pigeon), pig latin, and ebonics of course  

What prompted my post was largely because of what happened with my wife. There were 2 companies that offerred her employment for no other reason than she is Russian and spoke Russian. One of the company actually sends a staff to St Pete twice each year. Apparently a Russian company is one of their bigger clients and training their staff is a major part of their business relationship. My wife heavily considered it for no other reason than the prospect of actually travelling and working IN Russia while being employed by a US-based company, was just too tough to pass up. In the end however, and after careful consideration, including being persuaded by her folks who were against it, she decided it wasn't in our best interest.

Ironically enough, one of her current employer's client is supposedly an Orligarch's GF who also happens to currently be working as a fashion model ( I don't recall the names). Her employer is already planning to make her part of their team that travels to New York when meeting with this gal. Again, simply because my wife's Russian.

Aloe, if your Dutch is half as good as your English - dang girl! WhatUworriedabout? You speak (write) English better than I can. Chickensh!t and all...LOL.

But seriously...start somewhere, even part-time. If your apprehension is your lack of fluency, look at from another angle - getting the job will actually improve it. Worry about crossing bridges when you get there, not before.