Need advice, suggestions, or personal experiences.

[bleau]

Hi everyone. I've been a lurker to the forum and now need some advice, suggestions or personal experiences.
I'm not new to dating and being engaged to a RW and more or less been at this for several years. I ended an engagement with a lady from Russia a year ago because of..more wrong things out weighing the right things in a serious relationship.

Several months ago I met a lady in Ukraine on a free site. I actually contacted her to wish her a Happy Birthday as I did several other ladies above the ages of 40..just being nice to them. They all responded with a thank you being nice and polite.
This one lady from Ukraine is 44 and I'm 64 and I think actually took the time to read my profile at the time and responded back with would I like to communicate with her.

So, we started flopping messages back and forth in the site on a daily basis with me expecting nothing more than a penpal.I got a message from her one night asking me if we could talk in Skype with messages first then use the phone, She said my English is about like having my Russian language dog move to America and not understanding English. She said she was tired of the site and all the games being played on her and no promises being fulfilled by any man that was talking with her, liked my profile and sounded more serious than the...hey baby come and get me type boys in there.
I liked her humor but also knew where she was coming from so I said to myself why not.

Seeing no red flags here, and enjoying our talks which were and are intelligent conversations, I said I would like to give you a call on the phone just to hear your voice and we'll have a good laugh together about our language barrier. She thought it would be fun and gave me both her home and cell numbers and asked me to call her right then if possible.
I called her and we did have some laughs for a few minutes and she wrote in Skype..shut your phone before my brain crashes and laughed. Still didn't see a red flag, she did give me her numbers and told me to call anytime except when she was asleep and we would have more laughs and maybe could understand each other one day.

Now after a about 2 months of talking in Skype daily and on the phone several times a week she pops me a question. She said I know you have visited Russia and  I know you were engaged to a Russian lady there so I think you are a real man of your word....would you come to Ukraine to visit me?  She said I like you a lot and our age difference does not matter to me. She said I want someone like you that can carry an intelligent conversation with me and be strong enough to settle with one woman only. I told her certainly I would go to Ukraine to visit her and would late September be ok because this is the beginning of my busy season. She said that would be fine as I've started taking some English lessons in hopes I can learn enough not to have brain crashes when you call me on the phone. I could tell she was excited when I told her yes I would fly to visit her. I also sent her a shot of my plane tickets. I received and email back from her saying...you have made me a very happy lady.

I've seen no red flags here, she owns her on shop and has sent me photos of her in her shop, her kids, grandkid, parents, dog, inside her apartment and has never asked me for anything but my time with her. After a few weeks she pulled her profile from the site and never asked me to pull mine which I did anyway.
I also asked her for her address so I could send her some flowers...done in a few minutes in an email. I sent the flowers and she seemed very excited to receive them. No red flags there.

Am I missing something here or do you think this lady is for real? Se's not drop dead gorgeous, not a model type but still a beautiful lady with a beautiful smile.

I would welcome your input....thanks...Bleu

[Daveman]

Welcome to RWD!

From what you have posted, nothing sounds out of the ordinary.  She seems like a normal lady looking for a normal relationship. 

Do you feel something might be amiss?  Is something specific bothering you?  I mean, why *might* she not be for real?  Going by your synopsis, nothing strikes me as odd at all.

[Rubicon]

I see no red flags whatsoever.  it seems to me that the lady is very real, and that you should go through with your plan to visit her.  (unless she asks you for money before you meet her!!)  it seems like you have nothing to lose and everything to gain.  at the very least you will gain more experience in this type of endeavor.  Good Luck!!

[bleau]

Thanks for your fast responses guys. No, this lady has asked me for nothing what so ever especially money.
I told her I would pay all of her expenses to and from her city, rent us an apartment in Kiev for my first night there and my last night here. I would also have someone meet her at the train station and transfer her to the airport to meet me.
She said no, I can pay my own way to Kiev and I will stay with my uncle and aunt first night there and then meet you at the airport. You can either rent us an apartment while in Kiev or we can stay with my relatives.
When we come to my city you can stay with me or one of my kids, no need to waste money on a hotel or apartment here but I would you prefer to stay with me so we can have some serious talks.

I think all this has shocked me more than anything especially with the age difference. I'm extremely active in my business and not sitting behind a desk all the time. I told her I have no desire to retire because I love my work to much and don't won't to be wasting away doing nothing. She laughed and said...sounds ok with me whatever makes you happy.

Like I said...I think maybe I'm in shock especially after my last ordeal in Russia and what I read on the forums.

Thanks again
Bleau

[Ade]

Thanks for your fast responses guys. No, this lady has asked me for nothing what so ever especially money.
I told her I would pay all of her expenses to and from her city, rent us an apartment in Kiev for my first night there and my last night here. I would also have someone meet her at the train station and transfer her to the airport to meet me.
She said no, I can pay my own way to Kiev and I will stay with my uncle and aunt first night there and then meet you at the airport. You can either rent us an apartment while in Kiev or we can stay with my relatives.
When we come to my city you can stay with me or one of my kids, no need to waste money on a hotel or apartment here but I would you prefer to stay with me so we can have some serious talks.

I think all this has shocked me more than anything especially with the age difference. I'm extremely active in my business and not sitting behind a desk all the time. I told her I have no desire to retire because I love my work to much and don't won't to be wasting away doing nothing. She laughed and said...sounds ok with me whatever makes you happy.

Like I said...I think maybe I'm in shock especially after my last ordeal in Russia and what I read on the forums.

Thanks again
Bleau

From what you've written it seems to me that you've managed to find a sincere lady and if she has the resources that you say she shouldn't have much trouble coming to visit you on a tourist visa to experience life in your home town; that is always an advantage. And, in my opinion, very large age gaps won't help a relationships chances but when a woman is out of her 30's, I don't think there will be any age related maturity or life experience issues that could get in the way. Good luck and enjoy the ride - no pun intended.

[Shadow]

Go for it, and do not even worry about seeing red flags.
At her age, finding a good man is not going to be easy, and your appearance will not be much worse than local men with a lower age gap as possibly more problems.

The sheer fact that she wishes you to stay with her family shows that she is not afraid to let you in to her surroundings and life, meaning that she likes you.

[Chicagoguy]

Sounds pretty good to me. Sometimes when you read everything on this board you can become paranoid.

[Turboguy]

To me it all sounds like you have found a great lady.  Sometimes bad experiences of the past can make us a little paranoid and reading some of the disasters that do occur to others can reinforce that.  Worrying too much for no reason can be a bad thing and harm a potentially good relationship.  I see no real reason for concern and suggest you take her at face value until she gives you a good reason to feel otherwise.  Good luck.  I think you will be fine.

[GregfromGa]

So when are you leaving for Ukraine? If I were you, I wouldnt wait 6 months before I went to see the lady. You say you were engaged before to a Russian lady. What prompted the breakup? Hope everything works out well for you.

[SMS60]

I will give you an opinion from a different perspective. Something to think about.

With your age I would go about this with a "no marriage" type relationship as the plan. Better yet forget about finding a foreign woman.

At 64  you would be close to 70 by the time your "future wife" gets her Green Card. I think if you are honest with yourself you can see some issues. You are going to invest a lot of money, time and energy into this process. It will consume all your spare time.

My point is there is more to life than marriage. Especially at your age.

Whatever you do good luck.

[Turboguy]

There is nothing wrong with looking at any aspects that might be important.  Sometimes however 64 seems a lot younger when you are 64 than it does when you are a few decades short of that mark and sometimes not. 

I think SMS brings up a valid point however when I was 64 I had not yet met or started to correspond with my wife of 3 1/2 years.   I know of another member your age who is heading out of the country this week to meet what he hopes might be his woman so there is nothing wrong with wanting to find a good woman to marry at 64.  Others have done it.  At 64 you could well end up with a marriage that lasts 20 years or more.  Many who marry in their 20's don't have that happen.  Do what feels right to you.

[Jumper]

There's nothing at all amiss here as far as what you have presented,
so don't let past experience jade you.


The only caveat i would say , is in line with SMS's slant,
be sure that you WANT a serious relationship leading to marriage,
she has taken the initiative, invited you to visit, and to stay with her family..
she is likely taking english courses on her own to work towards this and is likely very serious about the situation.
So if this is also something you truly want to build and work towards, then i'd advise going as quickly as you can reasonably arrange it.If that's 6 months, so be it.. but if you can manage sooner, I would, as only a face to face meeting will really let you both know where you stand.


Good luck!

[Muzh]

Hey, no one has mentioned the obvious; a much older man trying to snake a girl twenty years younger. Shame.

Ok, joke out of the way. Bleau, you sound familiar (in a good sense). From what you've said it looks like this woman wants to be your soulmate. I say this because at her age she is in no mood to play games, it seems. Go and enjoy your stay. Maybe you'll end up a married man with a beautiful RW like some of us.

Also, I'm pretty sure you are at an age where age is inmaterial so I wouldn't sweat it regarding her green card if it gets to that point. I'd say if you get to that point you are doing damned good.

Don't sweat it, stick to your plan. Actually, her plan.

[The Natural]

I don't see how his age (64) should be a big issue. Although not in the US and I don't know how easy/difficult it is or how long it takes for the wife to get permanent residence in the US. But a guy exactly the same age in my area married my ex-mother-in-law last summer. Her permission to move to Norway is now granted and she will be here in June. Now, she's 60, but I wouldn't think age has anything to do with it.

So go for it bleau. Best of luck.

[ML]

if we could talk in Skype with messages first then use the phone,

I don't quite understand this.  You can talk through Skype for free, so why the switching to a phone after some Skype messages.

I also sent her a shot of my plane tickets.

You really bought plane tickets nearly 6 months in advance?  The world might not even exist by then!!   

I've seen no red flags here,

A real pro would keep the red flags well hidden.  But I wouldn't be thinking so much about red flags . . . until they appear.

Am I missing something here or do you think this lady is for real?

You seem a little too worried about women for a man your age.  Perhaps because you got burned once.

Se's not drop dead gorgeous,

This is probably a plus, for any gal you might bring back home.

[Faux Pas]

bleau

I see nothing but green flags. It would appear you've got nothing to lose.

On the age thing. It doesn't take 6 years for your wife to get a green card and even if it did, what possible difference could that make? Actually, while thinking ahead is a good idea, the cart is way before the horse in that line of thought at this point for you. You are a long way from a marriage. Just go meet and get to know her now. From your description she does seem like a sincere woman and if she interests you, worth a visit. That's 6 years away. How old will you be in 6 years if you do not pursue this woman? That's right 70.

You seem to be a very consciences sort. If your interaction with her is all as you described I personally do not understand why you felt the need to ask this to the membership here. Unless there is something in your gut telling you this is wrong, pin your ears back and get busy. I would recommend you get over there if nothing more than a few days before September. An additional 5 months is a long time for a long distance penmanship.

Good Luck!

[ML]

I think all this has shocked me more than anything especially with the age difference. I'm extremely active in my business and not sitting behind a desk all the time. I told her I have no desire to retire because I love my work to much and don't won't to be wasting away doing nothing. She laughed and said...sounds ok with me whatever makes you happy.

Like I said...I think maybe I'm in shock especially after my last ordeal in Russia and what I read on the forums.

A few things here.  First, I don't quite understand what  you are shocked about.
Guys in their 40s and 50s (and maybe older) are romancing some of these gals who are in their early 20s.  Not me, but many do.

I don't think a 20 year age gap is any big deal once both parties are past age 40 or so.  Did an age gap cause you problems with the RW before . . . so that is stuck in your mind and leading to your shock?  And if you did have problems with an age gap . . . then why did you get into the same situation again?

Or are you shocked because an attractive woman seems attracted to you?  Well  there are thousands of such woman out there who will be attracted to you . . . even if you were extremely unattractive.  So don't be shocked about that aspect.

Second,  not trying to be negative, but again for a man your age, you seem to be quite taken or giddy (or some such words) when a woman says sweet things such as her "She laughed and said...sounds ok with me whatever makes you happy."

This is all just normal pre-meeting talk and really means very little in the long run.

Sure,  its fun and exciting in the beginning.  But relax and don't get so wrapped up emotionally with this one woman whom you have never met.

And best read some of the horror stories posted here that happen (to your brain and emotions) when you put all your eggs (money and vacation time) into one basket.

[GQBlues]

....Although not in the US and I don't know how easy/difficult it is or how long it takes for the wife to get permanent residence in the US....

If she arrived via a K-1 visa, then she's technically a permanent resident shortly after marriage and their filing of the AOS (Adjustment of Status). Albeit conditionally. She can then lift the 'conditions' and become a full blown PR. after 2 years...a few short months thereafter, while staying married to the man, she can become a citizen if she so desires...

As for Bleau...the Beatles specifically wrote a song about men your age  Good luck with the experiences with this gal. Hopefully it will be fruitful for both of you.

I used to *think* before if I ever found myself single in my 60s, hopefully still healthy, that the last thing I would ever want to do is get married. Rather, I'd travel to different places I have never been to before and stay as long as permitted...then when it's time for me to snatch the proverbial pebble, then I'll leave my wordly belonings to my nieces, nephews and my life-long cherised charity organizations...but, that's just me...

I see no red flag/s for you...If and when it does appear, you have enough life experiences that will alert you, I am sure.

Enjoy....

[Gator]

Bleau,

I think I can help you.  Age?  You and I could have been in the same high school together.     

There appears to be absolutely nothing to stop you from visiting this woman.   Yet, that is only the first step of what I consider a long process of developing your relationship.
You have many hurdles to pass - not about scams, but learning whether the two of you are ideal for marriage.   

I have dated a number of RW in their 40s.  They are the best.   Not all are the same (e. g., while most are patient, a couple wanted to advance the relationship must faster than my heart was moving).  However, there are some near common elements: empty nester (or nearing it), made some personal sacrifices to raise her child, now wanting to enjoy life and to find a good, interesting man with whom to share this better life.  The 40s women have seen a lot of turmoil, stuff that would have sent an AW to three-sessions-a-week psychotherapy.  I am talking mostly about economic and political instability, neglectful if not abusive men, harassment at work, family illness, etc. The RW in their 20s have avoided much of this.   

IMO everything seems just rosy in the beginning with these women, then I realized that the two of us have too many differences to be really happy.  And if I am to marry again in my 60s, I want something really special.  I am not looking for a sexual companion, maid and cook combined in a hot body.   I want someone who is really interesting, someone who makes life fun.  The latter is what I found missing.   

The two of you need to converse in reverse.  Discuss how life would be if you married.  For example, you work, she doesn't.  You are not having babies.  What does she want to do during the day?  When you come home?   

[Jumper]

I hear Doc Woody reincarnated in Gator.. 

Bleau, the converse in reverse is good advice in your situation,

a little amusingly for me, i think your RW is the one most likely to already be doing so..
and every time Doc said that phrase, i wondered just how many  first meetings he had been to
where the RW,whatever her age , (assuming she was really serious about him) dint initiate such..
odds are the western man never gets to start that, he's too busy answering her KGB inspired bright light interrogation
 



GQ is absolutely correct on the GC, and i wouldn't sweat that in any case?
that's the  cart way before the horse..

At 64 you should simply do what you want, it's one of the few the perks of getting  a bit older right?

[bleau]

Well, I would like to thank all of your personally for your input, suggestions and experiences. I've read all and more or less say that I've listened.
Like I said earlier I'm not new to this and have been there done that more than one time.
I had enough sense to see an engagement with a girl in Russia going nowhere so I ended it and we remain friends.

The girl in Ukraine is beautiful, intelligent, well educated and seems to have her head on straight and is of "sound mind", more than I can say for a most girls I've dated in the past. I think we've worn out all the words in the English and Russian vocabularies with our talks and her maturity is above most girls I know.
We've spent as much as 12 hours talking in Skype in one day...talking about brain crashes..WOW!

As far as the age difference, who basically told me I was old at 64 and almost in my grave and suggested I not do this? I have no health issues, I take no meds, I run 6 miles before breakfast and 6 miles after work and could do more if time permitted. I work out in a home gym, I own 3 architectural millwork shops in 3 states and I'm my own working employee with all the other of my employees in the shop. My butt doesn't sit in an office getting fat, bald and ugly..I've got the younger folks sitting in the office getting fat and lazy pushing cad programs and doing programming on our CNC machines. They act much older than me. I told them I was considering putting in a gym in the shop if they didn't get up off their lazy butts and get an active physical lifestyle...scared them.  No pun intended I promise.
But, I could drop dead anytime just like you could at your age be it young, middle aged or my age or older.

I cannot go to Ukraine any sooner than September because of business commitments that pay our bills and keep our employees paid and out of bankruptcy. I'm not like some of you that can jump on a plane and fly off to another country to visit a girl on the spur of a moment. I think it's great that you can do this and you have my blessing in your quest to find that girl of your dreams. The girl in Ukraine also has business commitments and says this will give us enough time to have more than a few days together as she usually takes her vacation in September also.

I have a friend married to a girl from her city, she called her today for me and talked to her for an hour to help us with a few mis translations we think we had. When my friend hung up the phone she said Bleau this girl is for real and you be an idiot if you not go after her. Forget that stupid age difference at your ages, You know well my husband I are 18 years apart and have been married for 12 years and we have no issues and have never had any in our marriage.

I know red flags when I see them and have not seen any with this girl. Thank you guys for your experiences with red flags and telling me about them. We can never be sure that one won't slap us in the faces one day without any warning. I know a guy that's been chasing the skirts of RW-UK women for 8 years and still not found one that....would have him I think or either he's just an adventure with money than I've got to throw away.

I'm going to visit this girl in Ukraine in September and we're going to spend two weeks together. I'm not going with marriage in mind but if all the bells and whistle match and the compatibility is there..why not? She was excited when I told her two weeks.  I'm not afraid of this 44 year old girl and she sure as heck is not afraid of me or I'm a bad misjudge of character and I deal with a lot of funky characters a lot of times it seems.

We're getting ready to start 6 day 12 hour shifts Wednesday until June 1. I'll try to drop in the forum as time permits for me and I hope my past and future experiences can help someone else.

I really thank you guys for your replies and they did mean a lot to me.

Bleau

[Muzh]

Heh, I guess you are one person who can call a 44 yo woman a girl.

Bleau, I second what your friend's wife told you. I guess I already mentioned that to you. I think she is going to be a very lucky girl.

Enjoy. Have fun. Don't look back. etc, etc.

[bleau]

Heh, I guess you are one person who can call a 44 yo woman a girl.

Bleau, I second what your friend's wife told you. I guess I already mentioned that to you. I think she is going to be a very lucky girl.

Enjoy. Have fun. Don't look back. etc, etc.

Thanks for your comments Muzh and was a little funny about calling the lady a girl. I always call a female a girl most of the time. I've found out that works well for most ages. I get called a punk kid in my shop by my two shop managers that are 84 years old and been with my family business for 60 of the 65 years we've been in business. The exec secretary of our business is 76 and been here for 45 years, not very nice to say in public what she calls me sometimes. All three of those will work down any younger person in this building. We asked them one day, when are you going to retire, we need to know so we can start making some plans. What came out of their mouths was a new and strange language for my daughters and myself...we've never asked them again nor will we.
I've got two female cnc operators that are in their early 50's that would tell you they would much rather be called girls than women or ladies, then I've got 2 in their mid 20's and calling then a girl is ok if you're talking to all the females at the same time. It's just something I do. Then again when you get down in that much younger age you might would get your butt busted for calling a girl a girl.

I'm certainly going to Ukraine to meet this..."lady"...and I'm sure we'll have fun together, and she does too.

I hope all is well with everyone today and you've still got your running shoes on today chasing those girls out there...at some point though, and no pun intended just what a girl told a guy chasing her one time, you might want ask yourself why doesn't she let me catch her....go take a good look in the mirror. 
That is humor in case you decide you want to flame my butt.

Bleau

[Gator]

I used to *think* before if I ever found myself single in my 60s, hopefully still healthy, that the last thing I would ever want to do is get married. Rather, I'd travel to different places I have never been to before and stay as long as permitted...

Been there, done that.   My travels filled all pages of my passport with visas and stamps, and it was necessary  to have my passport amended.    That doubled the number of pages, and I nearly filled them. 

It became old.  No comparison to a family with lively wife, laughing kids, playful dog, etc.  Also, the world is round and I ended up where I started.   

[I/O]

the world is round and I ended up where I started.   

Still chasing Russian skirt...........................................?

bleau: Sounds like a lady pretty much at ease with herself.