Re: Why FSUW Look Abroad

[Vincenzo]

Are you kidding?  I live in a city smaller than Toronto, in Western Canada, and, hire admin assistants. 

A year ago, I spoke to a Russian lady.
I asked about her job situation.
She said that she had a degree in Physcology and was looking for an office job. She had sent her resume to hundreds places and the only response was from a placing company 50 miles away.

Her English was so-so. Why would a company hire her as an assistant when there are a thousand women not only with perfect English but also bilingual?

Really, many Russian brides will be looking for these office jobs.

[Misha]

Really, many Russian brides will be looking for these office jobs.

You lost me. I have no idea what point you are trying to make. Your original statement: "I know a few secretaries, tellers, and receptionists in the West. They earn minimum wages, drive very old cars, bring lunches from home and expect to be fired for any remark." Rather than admitting this is wrong, you now move on to some Russian acquaintance that you met online from Toronto looking for a job?!? Immigrants with "so-so" English skills looking for a job are another kettle of fish entirely...

[Vincenzo]

You lost me. I have no idea what point you are trying to make.

A Russian woman earns $300 a month and rides marshrutkas.

One day, she relocates to the West, for example, to Vienna. Every boss is happy to offer her a job as administrative assistant (really, it's difficult for a newcomer to get a better job), and to pay her "very good" money. The next day she settles near the Opera House, drives a Maybach or Porsche, dines at the best restaurant...

[Boethius]

I know a lot of FSU immigrants.  Most work menial jobs (sales clerks, custodial, security guards) unless their qualifications are recognized here (IT, some engineers).  But even the menial jobs pay $30,000 a year.
 
I've only known one FSU immigrant who returned, and it wasn't money that was the impetus for that, it was lifestyle, missing the community connections he had at "home".  I know a fair number of Ukrainians who came here to work illegally, and they do return.  One said life was "too boring" here, he is young and enjoyed not knowing what the next day would bring.  However, he speaks English, and a lot of his work involves fleecing foreigners.
 
Were your assertion accurate, most of these individuals would return to Russia/Ukraine.  That generally does not happen.

[Misha]

A Russian woman earns $300 a month and rides marshrutkas.

One day, she relocates to the West, for example, to Vienna. Every boss is happy to offer her a job as administrative assistant (really, it's difficult for a newcomer to get a better job), and to pay her "very good" money. The next day she settles near the Opera House, drives a Maybach or Porsche, dines at the best restaurant...

Again, still don't know what point you are trying to make. If you think that RW can't be happy in another country, they why are you looking?


I will use the example I know best: my wife. She was making roughly $400 CDN when she left 5 years ago working fulltime. It took a bit of time, but she is now working part-time and making more than minimum wage and is earning close to three times what she made in Russia. This fall, she will start studying at our local university, and she expects that once that she gets her degree she will make much more than she does now, and much, much more than she made in Russia. She has zero interest in moving back to Russia.


Again, what is exactly the point that you are trying to make with all of this?

[Boethius]

Here is the whole quote from Wiki:
 
300,000 legal immigrants enter the country every year; about half are ethnic Russians from the other republics of the former Soviet Union. In addition, There are an estimated 4 million illegal immigrants from the ex-Soviet states in Russia.^[31] There is a significant inflow of ethnic Georgians, Armenians, Azerbaijanis, Uzbeks, Kyrgyz, Tajiks, and Ukrainians into big Russian cities, something that is viewed unfavorably by some citizens.

Yes, Russia is more economically prosperous, particularly in comparison to Central Asia.  Something like one in four persons in St. Petersburg is from Central Asia.  They recently found a huge "underground village" of illegal immigrants from Uzbekistan outside Moscow, I think (may be wrong about the city, I can't remember).

[Vincenzo]

You missed the entire point about a ukranian man not having to worry that any woman marries him for immigration..

They marry all the time. I was in Odessa, met a girl. She said her mother was from Turkey.
It seems the whole city population is mixed.

Are you asking about an American girl marrying a Russian guy and moving to him? If she's obese and ugly - no chance.
If she has a model look, why not?
Naomi Campbell and her Russian boyfriend. Naomi is learning Russian.

[Vincenzo]

I will use the example I know best: my wife. She was making roughly $400 CDN when she left 5 years ago working fulltime. It took a bit of time, but she is now working part-time and making more than minimum wage and is earning close to three times what she made in Russia. This fall, she will start studying at our local university, and she expects that once that she gets her degree she will make much more than she does now, and much, much more than she made in Russia. She has zero interest in moving back to Russia.


Again, what is exactly the point that you are trying to make with all of this?

My point: you can't compare salaries.

Let's take your figures and imagine that your wife is a single mother with a kid in Canada.
She earns $1,200.
How much will she pay for an apartment?
How much does she pay for the university tuition?
Medicine, teeth, a car (no cheap marshrutkas)?
What about designer clothes?

[Muzh]

My point: you can't compare salaries.

Let's take your figures and imagine that your wife is a single mother with a kid in Canada.
She earns $1,200.
How much will she pay for an apartment?
How much does she pay for the university tuition?
Medicine, teeth, a car (no cheap marshrutkas)?
What about designer clothes?

Hey Vin.
 
What is the point here? I don't follow you. Are you arguing for arguments sake?

[Misha]

My point: you can't compare salaries.

Let's take your figures and imagine that your wife is a single mother with a kid in Canada.
She earns $1,200.
How much will she pay for an apartment?
How much does she pay for the university tuition?
Medicine, teeth, a car (no cheap marshrutkas)?
What about designer clothes?

Sorry, but designer clothes are not my wife's top priorities in life. As for the rest, you have a lot of ambitious, hard-working single mothers in Canada who manage to study and pay the rent. As for medicine, in Canada you only have to pay in British Columbia the B.C. Health Care premium and these premiums are based on salary: you pay less if you earn less. A family of two pays $109 per month and a family of 3 or more pays $121. Based on earned income, you can get a subsidy that will cover from 20% to 100% of premiums. A woman could get student loans to study and if she had good grades bursaries. In other words, she would have to be frugal, but she would get by quite nicely if she worked and applied herself.

Let's compare it to a woman in Russia in the same situation. How do you think she will pay for her costs of life? How will she be able to buy herself and apartment? You assume that she will get an apartment for free or will happily live with her parents. This is not always the case. Many women have to move for jobs and yet other women cannot live with their families. They also have to try and buy a place or pay outrageous rents. They will have to work hard to cover their expenses. Life in Russia is far from the utopia that you seem to want to portray.

[Simoni]

Sorry, but designer clothes are not my wife's top priorities in life.


You assume that she will get an apartment for free or will happily live with her parents. This is not always the case. Many women have to move for jobs and yet other women cannot live with their families. They also have to try and buy a place or pay outrageous rents.

Maybe it's different in Ukraine?  I have been in Ukraine for the last 10 days, and nothing has changed.   Girls are wearing very expensive and beautiful clothes and shoes.  They pay the same price or higher for them than we do in the US or Canada.


How do they do it?  They tend to live at home with parents and spend a big portion of their income on clothes. It's simply their priority.


BTW-- In Ukraine there is an"official" salary that is only part of the money that comes in.  Just the way things work there.  So girls have more money than is being reported.

[Jumper]

A Russian woman earns $300 a month and rides marshrutkas.

One day, she relocates to the West, for example, to Vienna. Every boss is happy to offer her a job as administrative assistant (really, it's difficult for a newcomer to get a better job), and to pay her "very good" money. The next day she settles near the Opera House, drives a Maybach or Porsche, dines at the best restaurant...

 
ok-
 fixed for a more general scenario-
 
A Russian woman earns $300 a month and rides marshrutkas.She's a single mom and struggles quite a bit to make ends meet, no child support at all.Her family helps her, or frankly she wouldn't get by at all.
Her mother has been to a nice restaurant half a dozen times in life.maybe.

One day, she relocates to the West, for example, to Europe.
She has a good husband who adores her, with a decent job and income. He takes great interest in her son and really becomes a positive influence in the boys life.
  Really, it isnt that difficuilt to find a decent job as her english is good and she studied very hard for a year to be fluent in german.The firm  pays her a normal salary for the  job and area.
With thier family income they do well, buy a nice house in a nice district, have new cars and dines at the nice restaurants when they wish....and her family visits somewhat often.
Her life is completely different in two years time, and so is her sons,his future prospects and outlooks are far better.
She truly appreciates the situation and likes pretty much everything better abouit her new area, once past the very hard struggle of adjustment,and of course homesickness.
 
now ,why on earth would she look abroad?
 
 
I still do not understand what point you are making?
 the sacrasm did not clear it up.
 
My only guess is you are addresing economic disparity, or lack of .
Since salaries are lower and also cost of living lower, you feel it equals out?
 
I wouldn't debate that there is some truth in that?
 
and if you feel there is no ecomoic disparity at all,
so be it.
Keep googling and reading wiki.

 I've lived in the FSU, you certainly arnt going to google something that shows me the way the average person lives.
It is not a bad life, but it is different.
 

[Misha]

How do they do it?  They tend to live at home with parents and spend a big portion of their income on clothes. It's simply their priority.

Sure, but not all women have this luxury. Some are forced to move for jobs. It may be from the village to a regional city or from a regional city to Moscow. When they move, they can't live with their parents and their priorities change.


In other cases, there may simply be enough apartment to go around: to many people, too few rooms... This was my wife's story: her sister moved back after her divorce with a child and did her best to drive my wife away, letting her know that their mother's apartment was going to be hers. My wife's priority then became buying her own place. Consequently, she passed up on clothes.

BTW-- In Ukraine there is an"official" salary that is only part of the money that comes in.  Just the way things work there.  So girls have more money than is being reported.

My wife's official salary was her salary. However, she did a lot of extra work whenever and wherever she could: working freelance in her profession and even taking up a second profession (manicure/pedicure) to earn more money evening and weekends.

[Vincenzo]

Let's compare it to a woman in Russia in the same situation. How do you think she will pay for her costs of life?

How? That's the reason I adore Russian women - they do many things themselves.
I cook myself and know how much money it saves directly and indirectly - restaurant food is usually full of fat.

The girl I'm contacting sent me a photo of her catching fish on the lake Baikal and the final dish. Wow! I don't think I'll be hungry with her.

[Misha]

How? That's the reason I adore Russian women - they do many things themselves.
I cook myself and know how much money it saves directly and indirectly - restaurant food is usually full of fat.

The girl I'm contacting sent me a photo of her catching fish on the lake Baikal and the final dish. Wow! I don't think I'll be hungry with her.

Again, what is your point? Many Canadians that I know also fish....

[GQBlues]

....The girl I'm contacting sent me a photo of her catching fish on the lake Baikal and the final dish. Wow! I don't think I'll be hungry with her.

Oh, so there you go!
 
All you'll have to do is get her a rod and reel for her wedding present, then park her somewhere by the waterside. Then just pick her up at day's end and take her home so she can cook the day's catch.
 
What a set-up! 

[Maxx2]

Oh, so there you go!
 
All you'll have to do is get her a rod and reel for her wedding present, then park her somewhere by the waterside. Then just pick her up at day's end and take her home so she can cook the day's catch.
 
What a set-up! 

You're starting to think like me and that should worry you!

[GQBlues]

You're starting to think like me and that should worry you!

 
 
That depends, maxx. Daiwa or Penn?   

[Jumper]

you're on a budget , and not wasteful after all ,
 so  Shimano, Johnson or Zebco