Thought I would share my happy story...

[Cyber]

Well, I am new to this forum in particular. I thought I would do a brief write-up and share my story. It is Labor Day Weekend, 2011. I am in the process of planning my next trip to Ukraine, the city of Kharkov to be exact. The trip is planned for October, 2011 so it is just a few weeks away now. I am going back to propose marriage to my Anna who has faithfully written to me for 3 years now. These forums are great because it helps us (mostly guys) sort the good stuff from the bad on the internet about Russian Women, the possibility of meeting a “good” and “compatible” one versus avoiding being scammed. My story is not that remarkable and mirrors many I’ve read both on this site and a few others.

I was married for 22 years and deliriously happy. My first wife and I met in high school. We were childhood sweethearts in that way, only 16 when we met. I was smitten. We were very compatible and happy during most of those years. She however was a nurse and quietly addicted to pain killers which she hid from us for many years. Later she added alcohol to her chemical choices and it was downhill from there. I did all I could to help her but in the end I was forced to take the children and finish raising them by myself.

I found myself alone in my early 40’s never thinking this could happen to me. What could I do? I never really “dated” because I married so young. I avoided dating at all for 4 years post-divorce intentionally avoiding the “rebound” effect that so often happens to people in my situation. Finally I started inching my way out there only to be thoroughly consternated by what I found.

Our generation (the 40ish to 50ish crowd) has lived through an age of “new womanhood” fostered by the pop psychology of the modern era and which has saturated the minds of Western culture. Nobody wants to prevent anyone else from pursuing a given dream they may have for their life but the prevailing political correctness of gender roll reversals in America and other parts of the West has stunted and perverted the healthy relationships that normally development between a man and a woman who simply want to be a man and a woman then make a life together. A man is not a woman and a woman is not a man and never the twain shall be. However we each possess something the other lacks if those relationships are left to follow their proper course. I’m a guy who loves completely and loved being married. My dear ex and I were very good to each other and we found our comfort together. Today, however, I do not want to “compete” with a woman who is trying to reverse the gender roles in whatever degree that may be.

My dating experience was a disaster. Most of the women I met were shallow, insincere, self-absorbed and willing to take their panties off on the first date.  This was not what I was looking for and while it might sound like a lot of weekend fun to some it is not the way to build a healthy permanent relationship. These women were prowling for the next guy who met all the criteria on their list, drowning in the ideas promoted by romance novels with such an exacerbated sense of entitlement it was like living in a daytime soap opera. Some were nothing more than Harpies with a handbag. There seemed to be no way to please them. I came to believe the available women out there in my age bracket were insatiate.

I did meet a few nice women in all honesty and for that I am grateful. The chemistry was not there or they were not ready for a relationship yet but these were the exceptions not the rule. I dated off and on for 6 years looking for the one who was right for me. Don’t ever let anyone tell you that you are expecting too much from a woman to be honest, communicative and possess a servants heart. She expects that from you and rightly so. However, it is reciprocal and that is part of this problem. If you let someone else create your world for you they will always create it too small.

When I became so frustrated and finally “quit” dating I happened onto this Russian Women idea or dating woman from the FSU. The thought had never crossed my mind. What I had discovered and come to believe is that much of the problem I was having was rooted in cultural dysfunction and was indentured in Western thinking. As I continued to research I began to realize these qualities still existed in people elsewhere but I was going to have to think outside the “box”, way outside the box. Ideas do have consequences. As I read about the cultures in the FSU and their values systems, I discovered what most of you discovered. It really is a fact. These women want to be women and they want their man to be a man. It really is true that many (not all) but many of the eligible women in the FSU are like American women from the 1950’s or 60’s. The “misandry” of the modern day westernized woman is not rooted in normal healthy psychology and is one reason why America is experiencing such a disintegration of the family. I wanted to make a new life and be happy and I did not need a dysfunctional group of sociological experimentalists to tell me what that was. I can decide that for myself. Sadly it became clear that I was in a minority of thinkers on the subject and would have to go it alone or nearly so.

I launched into my effort with renewed hope. I did an enormous amount of reading. I narrowed down a few of the internet sites quite quickly, one of which is in fact Elena’s Models. I can recommend it. I think my background in psychology really helped in this way because I was able to winnow out the fakers, liars and cheats fairly quickly. Many of these sites are nothing but lies and head-fakes but most of us know this now.

Gentleman, you must be willing to invest a lot of time and some money if you are serious about finding a wife who is a good woman and will stay with you through thick and thin. When in doubt, trust your instincts. Treat her like the tender flower she is, love her unconditionally and tell her so. She will love that and love you more for it.

I wrote and read a lot of letters. This went on for a year or so. Curiously the first Russian Woman I ever looked at and considered was my Anna (incidentally her name means “She”). We traded a few letters for a while. I continued to correspond with others during this time as well. Something in her conversation captured me. She talked about her daughter, her work, her mother and her God mother whom she and her daughter often took care of. Apparently her God Mother (who is deceased now) had an emotional illness of some kind. Anna would talk about that and her God Mothers’ behavior describing how she would cry after having visited her. Anna described how she would take her food, clean her apartment with her daughter etc. She would describe her day and the things she enjoyed like walking in the park on weekends.

In her letters Anna talks about books she loves and movies she enjoyed. Her conversations are of a 42 year old woman who was living her life and holding on to the dream of being married to a wonderful man who would be a man in her life. She always speaks of preparing dinners, sitting sometimes together and not needing to necessarily talk at all just as long as I am in the room with her. Her letters are consistently filled with these kinds of remarks and are a window into her character and the person she is. I made the trip and visited her after a year of writing. I stayed for 1 week which was hardly enough time but it is what we had. Anna is as beautiful on the outside as the inside. She is humble and never ceases to thank me in her letters for being in her life. She has captivated me and stolen my heart because these are the consistent words and actions of a conscientious person committed to the relationship.

In large part it is the life and environment in which these women have grown up and lived that creates this humility and gratefulness. These beliefs were once abundant in America but not so much anymore. The FSU over the last 100 years has been ravaged by wars and political unrest. Many young men died in these wars. The ratio of men to women is significantly dis-proportionate compared to the West. Many FSU women are condemned to never marry because a good man is so difficult to find and the ones that remain are hard men who drink hard and have many choices of younger women whenever they want. Having a husband and children are what these girls are taught from the time they are very young. It is what they want. It is something that is germane to women in general. If society tells them something else (the usual exceptions duly noted) they spend their lives in a contorted psychological knot.

Anna and I have continued to write and to share and grow closer. I go back and review the videos and photos I’ve taken when I’ve been there and have come to realize this is it.
We finally started discussing and using the “M” and the “W” word in our emails. I’ve made it very clear to her how I feel and what I want. I hold nothing back. She consistently comments how grateful she is for my frankness and honesty. She clearly, being a woman, desires that which is not an abundant quality in Russian/Ukrainian men.

No matter where in the world you travel, a woman is still a woman. There may be some cultural differences but a woman is a woman is a woman. She wants unconditional love from her man and the security that comes from it. If you speak and demonstrate that to a “good” woman consistently she will love you till the end of time. It’s a sowing and reaping kind of idea. Anna’s perceptions and expectations are realistic. She at times has brought up the subject of our first fight and when it happens how she expects us to work through that. All of these are qualities of a woman who is living in the real world and whose expectations, because they are real, will not be overly disappointed nor take flight when the going gets a little rough. That is how it’s supposed to be. I’ve been single now for almost a decade. This is a great choice for me and for Anna. With a bit more hard work and a little luck she will be here early in 2012. I can hardly wait.

[Chicagoguy]

It seems you have found a gem. And the reverse is true also !

[JohnDearGreen]

I am going back to propose marriage to my Anna who has faithfully written to me for 3 years now.

I don't think very many on this forum have emailed for 3 years.  How many trips have you made in those 3 years?

[Vaughn]

Thank you, Cyber, for posting your narrative ~ which proved to be a welcome tonic for my very stressful past two days....
 
You and Anna both seem to be on the same page, and as you and she duly noted there will be challenges ahead. Not being familiar with your exact situation, let me just say that sometimes it will prove to be others on the periphery ~ in my own case, children, blending them and how well they will or will not learn to get along with one another ~ who will test all resilience and determination.
 
Glad you were perceptive enough to avoid the "rebound" phenomenon - something I myself failed to do. I guess I required that knock on the head to realize the value of self-imposed solitude, however lonely and unacceptable for some that it may seem to be.
 
I wish you a fulfilling next journey.

[Cyber]

@Vaughn,

Yes, that has been one of my challenges as well, the children I mean. They are wonderful young people, well-educated and creating their own success now. None of them are married yet but the oldest is right there. They've just not made the engagement official. Having said that, the children struggled when I made the announcement about Anna. She and I had communicated for a year before I said anything to anybody. Perceptively I anticipated resistance, mostly because of the pre-existing stereotypes. They've struggled with it. However, I am very convincing and do not make rash or baseless decisions. They know that about their father. That is something I learned to do the hard way (like most of us!) They are coming around, especially the oldest. I think this is because she herself is now going through such a decision and she is touched with its significance.


Don't forget that children have an image in their minds formed from their youth about their parents. Familial bonds are strong and the idea of someone else in that role (not their real mother) is difficult enough not to mention a woman from half way around the world and the other “stuff” our minds add to that. I framed it in the context of how I love and accept the partner that they have chosen (or will choose) and that they have the same responsibility to provide that for me.



@JohnDearGreen,

Hi John,
While I elect not to talk about the number of trips I've taken to Ukraine, the fact that they are arduous and expensive notwithstanding, it has been several. It is true there is little substitute for spending real time with someone to get to know them. We (us guys perusing foreign relationships) in most cases do not have the luxury of money, time or both to get this done yet it is still in our hearts. I used a combination of dialogue, life skill analysis and personal experience to "discover" who Anna truly was. It is no doubt, the fact that she is who she is made this possible. This girl is solid to have stayed with it for this long. It is what I was looking for and finally found. Persistence is the key. She did grow weary at one point and stopped writing for a few months. I realized I had a responsibility to step up and do more so I contacted her again and put it all out there. She wrote me back right away and seemed re-enthused. It was a good learning experience for me in this international dating-relationship thing. I was so pre-conditioned to being “scammed” I had overlooked the broader reality of her true circumstances and mine.

She’s never ever even once asked me for money… ever, even to this day. After a year and then my first visit where we met in person and dialogued through an interpreter for a week and I met Vicka her daughter (now 18yrs old) that I was comfortable that she was the real deal. Months later after returning I made the decision to help support her just a bit. It is an insignificant amount of money but I send it every month on time to help with expenses. It’s hers and I tell her so. She’s spending it on English lessons (her choice) and writes to me about it often and how she is doing. This was an additional way for me to signal my intentions and to demonstrate my ability as a provider as well as a faithful person. Think about it, these girls must leave their homes and families to travel to a foreign country to spend the rest of their lives. That is quite impressive if you ask me.

[Lily]

Cyber,

You wrote a very interesting, and a rather true analysis of what made us RW to be the type of personalities as we are now, in comparison to WW. A good read, thank you.

After my first experience of dating in Canada, your revelations about WW and their attitude made me wonder a bit. It is still hard to believe that you made such types of women as you describe. But I take your words, for sure.

Your text made me believe that if a Western woman seems is single, then she may be single for a reason. Which makes me think how do I explain my singleness to potential dates, in case they ask In Russia, it is vice versa! If a seemingly good man is single, then there might be a reason, otherwise he would be taken. But a number of quality women are single in the FSU.

Other than that, I wonder, why do you guys strive to please women? Be yourself and enjoy yourself... IMHO no need to please anyone, potential dates including. If women, or just any person, just cannot be happy themselves, no one can make them happy unless they want and do it themselves!

[Cyber]

Lily,

I think it is because in the West men are culturally predisposed to the idea of winning a woman's heart. This is compounded by the fact that women in the West do have more choices as a general rule of thumb. It also is partially dependent on what you are looking for and "how" you look for it. The sterotype for males is that they first are attracted to a woman because of her looks. While this is basically true some men (like myself) have grown to understand that without character, faithfullness, loyalty and commitment to the relationship itself someone's good looks are meaningless.

"Youth always expires, wisdom never expires..."

Being young is great but it fades over time. Good looks will not help a couple through a crisis. Only character and faith in God and one another can do that. In modern culture this becomes an increasingly difficult challenge. This is because we've built societies in the West upon creative ideas that we in turn use to substitute for character and hard work. In essence we've become the victims of our own success. A muscle needs pressure to grow. So it is with a person's character.

It is not wrong to pass on a guy you believe may not be right for you. I do agree that first it is important that a person is happy with themselves. This would be the foundation to begin looking for a life partner. Keep in mind there are always exceptions to rules. Cultural mega-trends are expressed in generalities where exceptions always exist. The phenomenon of Western men seeking Eastern women is fueled by several basic realities (which I've already spoken to) as well as sales and marketing techniques propogated by those who stand to profit from the exploitation of anothers misfortune or circumstances. Like many things of this type there is enough truth in it to make it believeable.

When looking for a life partner you must expose yourself to as many candidates as you can. Eventually the law of averages will catch up with you. You must also "fish" in the right waters. If you are looking for a stable, honest hardworking guy to marry it is less likely you will find him in a bar. You will have to fish different waters than that. Look where the kind of person you want generally hangs out. Nothing is as potent as a face to face chance encounter.

[mendeleyev]

I was married for 22 years and deliriously happy. My first wife and I met in high school. We were childhood sweethearts in that way, only 16 when we met. I was smitten. We were very compatible and happy during most of those years. She however was a nurse and quietly addicted to pain killers which she hid from us for many years. Later she added alcohol to her chemical choices and it was downhill from there. I did all I could to help her but in the end I was forced to take the children and finish raising them by myself.

I found myself alone in my early 40’s never thinking this could happen to me. What could I do? I never really “dated” because I married so young. I avoided dating at all for 4 years post-divorce intentionally avoiding the “rebound” effect that so often happens to people in my situation. Finally I started inching my way out there only to be thoroughly consternated by what I found.

Cyber, change a couple of small details and we could be twins! My ex was not a nurse but her modeling career in California introduced drugs and alcohol into the picture and 25 years of marriage eventually went down the drain. She had moved into management of a prestigious agency and her career tanked as well. I do take much of the blame because no marriage fails based on one person alone.

Like you, faith in God sustained me and helped me see areas where I had failed her along the way. Thankfully she was happy for me to take our children and like you, after seeing the dating scene reality in modern times I decided not to date for several years thinking it more important to concentrate on our daughters.

Even thought they met her after their high school years, today Mrs Mendeleyeva and my girls as very close and they consider her to be "Mom" just as I've been blessed with an additional wonderful daughter who I've helped raise. We don't have "her" kids and "my" kids, instead we simply have 3 daughters.

I wish you well in this venture!

[Daveman]

...I wonder, why do you guys strive to please women? Be yourself and enjoy yourself... IMHO no need to please anyone, potential dates including. If women, or just any person, just cannot be happy themselves, no one can make them happy unless they want and do it themselves!

Excellent comment. 


There is a difference between "pleasing" and "adapting" which is sometimes missed.   Sometimes these ideas are confused.  All couples go through phases of the latter but 'trying to make someone else happy" is mostly an exercise in futility.

[vwrw]

Cyber said “My dear ex and I were very good to each other and we found our comfort together.”

I am sorry to disagree but from your writing it seems like your ex was good for you and you found comfort and delirious happiness with her. On her part, she was not happy with her situation and found her comfort in painkillers and alcohol.
I hope you do not overestimate the level of comfort that your new mate finds together with you.

[Boethius]

Cyber said “My dear ex and I were very good to each other and we found our comfort together.”

I am sorry to disagree but from your writing it seems like your ex was good for you and you found comfort and delirious happiness with her. On her part, she was not happy with her situation and found her comfort in painkillers and alcohol.
I hope you do not overestimate the level of comfort that your new mate finds together with you.

Addiction is not so cut and dried.  Nobody is responsible for another's happiness or misery, and Cyber's wife's addiction may have been caused by any number of factors totally unrelated to him or their marriage. 
 
 

[Kineo]

Cyber,
 
You have an interesting story. I wish you all the best in your up comimg journey. And welcome to the forum!