Dnepropetrovsk trip

[civi68]

Guys,

I just returned from Dnepropetrovsk today. It was a great trip. The woman I met was very interested in me. I met her family, friends, and we did some
interesting things. She stayed in my flat for some of the days and it was
basically like having a live-in girlfriend.
I posted in the past about how I traveled since 1999 using a variety of ways.
I did socials, marriage agencies, and international dating sites. This was my
second trip where I used the WOVO approach. With Skype, good email translation, and my Russian to the level where I don't need an interpreter really added to the experience.
With how things have changed over the years, I have come to realize that
getting real investment from the women before traveling such as weekly Skype and detailed emails is essential. Before using this options and when they were not as widespread, I used agencies to meet women cold without correspondence and then did a follow-up trip for the final one that I seemed to hit it off. I used to do the socials but I think that they were good back then for me because I was in my early 30's. But with how I did it this time, I was able to do much of the leg work at home in finding one that was sincerely interested in meeting.
There was only one guy that I knew of that was also there. The agency I used
seemed to have slower marriage agency business compared to when I was there in 2006. Back then, there were guys rolling in daily and several interpreters there. Now, there is one employee and more of the business seems to be renting apartments to Ukrainians. I also didn't see any of the signs of other men there such as American man/Ukraine girlfriend/interpreter that I have in the past. Maybe there are less guys traveling anymore or they are doing it how I now do it.
Some things I noticed about Ukraine since last being there in 2007 and some
recommendations:
1. Women are still beautiful with few big ones.
2. Little knowledge from most women about dating American men and from some, particularly younger ones, no interest in leaving Ukraine with an American.
3. Still interest from women over 35 in finding an American man.
4. A lot of average Russian guys with beautiful girlfriends. High school would
definitely be a different experience there.
5. Prices for clothes and shoes are comparable to here. Many women think of
cheap when they think of made in China and not a bargain.
6. A lot of new malls, some further from the city center. More focus from some
about wanting money for the extras and not just basic needs. Think, women there are being exposed to advertisements to spend more than they can afford on clothes and cosmetics to stay attractive.
7. Apteka (pharmacies), charge higher prices than here so bring whatever you
need.
8. Invest in a gore-tex hiking shoe for your trip.
9. Use Skype if possible and get sincere interest before deciding to travel
there. From my experience, the days of going there and meeting several women is not always the best way. Try to find one who will take time off of work and consider your trip an event, not just a few dinner dates while her normal life of working and everything else continues.
10. Most women I met interested in an American man wanted an age difference of no more than 10 years. I know, some guys will say, what about my success? But the big age gap is something that I have always found to be a myth when I speak to most people there, particularly when asked about men over 50.
11. Spend a few hours a week studying Russian so you can improve your chances. I use "The New Penguin Russian Course" for years and it teaches a lot of grammar vs. memorizing. This was my first trip speaking Russian more and it helped to develop the relationship.
12. Be honest about your financial situation, particularly what it means for the
relationship if you have a mortgage, car payment, child support, etc. Many of
the women still think that their financial life will dramatically improve with
no worries about shopping. Think, they just don't want a roof over their head
but money for clothes, cosmetics, sending money home to family, yearly trips
back home, etc.
13. Eat yogurt every day and avoid uncooked vegetables to prevent stomach
problems.
I haven't yet decided whether to pursue the visa process but I am a little rusty
about how it works. Can anyone tell me what forms are needed and any websites
that give info? Thanks.

[Daveman]

Hi Civi,
  Welcome back to the mystery and mayhem!  WOVO works when it works and doesn't when it doesn't.  I think we tend to find that whatever is successful for us as individuals is, understandably, "the better way".  I was strictly a WMNDVO (ND=narrow down) man myself...  and it seems to have worked for me as well... on the fifth different lady.      So, I actually did a hellacious WMVM over an extended period of time.  Oh yeah, I spent the time as did they getting to know each other, etc.. and I did not have a bad first meeting... however, 'compatibility' through skype or a great chemistry when meeting doesn't necessarily translate to compatibility living together or sharing a life together.


Your points about skype, etc, time investment, all valid for VO trips - IMO.


You had a great visit.  Was this the second visit with the same lady?  If not I would caution you to slow down just a little on the visa. And here's why.


Had I pulled the trigger on the visas more quickly, I'd have been married all four times prior to finding my wife -- that's how well the first (and sometimes second) visits went -- think about that --- married without ever really understanding that there were some pretty serious hidden issues which all the talk in the world really will not bring to the surface. IMO, only real time together will bring some aspects of people, character, incompatibility, etc to light.


Anyway, i just offer that for what it's worth.


Good luck!
Dave

[ML]

To OP.  Thanks for sharing.  Seems like you are thinking fairly rationally about this process.  I really liked Dnipro as a city.  The river walk is fabulous.

To Daveman.  Good words tof live by.  I have lived with different women for several months before the true self was revealed.  There are no shortcuts to this.

[civi68]

I have thought about the second trip and have always done the second trip in the past. I guess just this time, I felt I got a good feel about things and questioned whether a second trip will tell me much more. I figure I will see what the next month brings and if there are any doubts, a second trip is something I will consider. I am glad I have the experience to not just go by feelings or to get myself caught up in a fantasy. Thanks for the feedback.

[Faux Pas]

I have thought about the second trip and have always done the second trip in the past. I guess just this time, I felt I got a good feel about things and questioned whether a second trip will tell me much more. I figure I will see what the next month brings and if there are any doubts, a second trip is something I will consider. I am glad I have the experience to not just go by feelings or to get myself caught up in a fantasy. Thanks for the feedback.

I have a feeling it will tell you something "else" not necessarily good or bad but, something. First trips especially if you hit it off with all the euphoria and excitement can often disguise something else. I wouldn't advise going the K-1 route without at least one more trip. One week wonders do happen. Some are married after many years, others are not. Just something else to chew on

[CanadaMan]

  I was strictly a WMNDVO (ND=narrow down) man myself...  and it seems to have worked for me as well... on the fifth different lady.      

 In other words you batted .200 ?   

[Daveman]

In other words you batted .200 ?   

LoL.. or perhaps even worse... maybe I got batted .800!   


Now there's an ego buster... gotta spin it better -- yeah, I went 1 for 5 with a slam! 




Civi, just another point to ponder a bit. Is this the first marriage for your lady?  I know doing the K-1 is what most couples probably do, and of course nothing wrong with that.  But, if you can pull it off, maybe you could consider getting married there.  Seeing her glowing radiantly, proudly in front of her family and friends.. her special day of celebration, everyone close to her ooohing and aaahhing, making that fuss over the Princess, toasts, endless shouts of Gorka!  It's an event you'd never forget, and neither would she. 


It's amazingly priceless.  Just something to throw out there to think about.


Thinking about your list... your observations mirror mine over the course of time.  I'll just add a couple of things which come to mind..


6. A lot of new malls, some further from the city center. More focus from some
about wanting money for the extras and not just basic needs. Think, women there are being exposed to advertisements to spend more than they can afford on clothes and cosmetics to stay attractive.


when I first went over, credit was pretty much non existent.  In the last couple of years there appears to have been an explosion of credit on smaller items such as TV's, stereos, computers though actual credit cards seem to be rare.  Living *beyond* their means may well be in their not so distant future. Did you noticed this change?




8. Invest in a gore-tex hiking shoe for your trip.


Not a bad suggestion, but, it would probably be even more helpful to have the pair!


Enjoy the process!
Dave

[civi68]

Dave,

I noticed the change about the credit and saw more people using credit cards. Just a matter of time before they are like everyone else and in debt!