Getting Sole Custody

[XMan]

So what did you gentlemen do who brought a woman with child / children over? 
The custody issue, especially in the notorious Ukrainian justice system, is proving to be problematic. 
Did you bribe someone? 
Pay off the ex? 
Work some sort of mystical voodoo?
I gave up dark magic in 2007. 
If there is alternative course of action, let me know. 
Thanks.
 

[Vaughn]

Well, my wife's not from Ukraine but we did bring over her then-12 year old daughter. For several months I had been encouraging Elvira to approach her ex-husband, who lived locally. When her visa was approved, I was already on my way over for a third visit, so I had to quickly purchase a couple more tickets.
 
On the day before we departed her hometown by train, she made the dreaded call. I say dreaded because she feared her ex would object. Quite the opposite happened. He said, "the news of your leaving for America is all over town - and I wondered if you were going to call me...."
 
He, at that time, was driving a marshrutka and picked her up downstairs. They headed off together to the city center, practically following his regular route - but stopping for no one. Elvira broke out laughing several times along the route as outraged passengers waved their arms when the vehicle sped by them. They returned an hour later with a notarized document from a judge - indicating the ex gave his full permission for his daughter to emigrate to the USA, so long as she retained his surname (which she still has today). This, apparently, was of importance to the guy, and I had NO trouble with his condition at all.
 
In the summer of 2010, I met the man for shashlik one evening in the center. He was quite nice, actually, and has maintained a good relationship with my stepdaughter. I realize ours is probably an unusual situation, what with folks grinding old axes long term....  nonsense, but reality.
 
As an aside, we never once have had to produce that document coming or going, but it sure did offer us some peace of mind in the beginning of our journey.

[calmissile]

I don't remember exactly how the process went with the K-1/K-2 because I had a visa agency handle all the paperwork, including the notorized letter from the father.  I have copies of all the documentation (1/2 inch thick) but it is all in Ukrainian and/or Russian so I can't read it.

As I recall the story she told me, mother, daughter, and father met somewhere to discuss the matter.  I am not sure what my finance may have done to convince him to sign it but I guess there were some not so kind words spoken during the ordeal.  The father was paying about $15/month I think in child support and had not been active in his daughters life for over 10 years.  Whatever it took, she got it done.   I am pretty sure that a bribe was not involved in this case.

[SANDRO43]

I am not sure what my finance may have done to convince him to sign it... I am pretty sure that a bribe was not involved in this case.

Your 1st sentence is at odds with the 2nd one above , unless you really meant my fiancée .

[BC]

We discussed this early on. Wife already had sole custody before we met.

[Gator]

My ex-wife and my Cossack woman both petitioned the court and were successful.  In both cases the father did not visit the child nor pay support. 

[mendeleyev]

I met the man for shashlik one evening in the center. He was quite nice, actually, and has maintained a good relationship with my stepdaughter. I realize ours is probably an unusual situation, what with folks grinding old axes long term....  nonsense, but reality.

Vaughn, hats off to you. I agree, doing so as a stepfather to one of our daughters, and I enjoy a good relationship with her Dad.

[XMan]

From what I have been told, the relationship and communication afterward were equally bad. 
I see little chance of an easy resolution. 

I am encouraged, however, that not paying child support can possibly be a positive thing. 
He is significantly behind, having paid a few months and then never again.
Hopefully it works in her favor. 
But I can guarantee only one thing, and that is it will not be accomplished without a fight.  Or a bribe.

[XMan]

So here is the unfortunate update.
 
Attorney, a stack of paperwork, small bribes to grease various wheels, and dead end.  She has been told that she is pursuing custody "on a whim" and not for a legitimate reason.  ???  He has not paid support in a couple of years.  Doesn't seem to matter.  He is recently remarried and has a pregnant wife, and somehow this is considered to be in his favor (he is a family man, clearly).
 
I never even started the visa paperwork because I wanted to get this resolved first.  No one has any idea an American is involved (I may or may not be correct in my assumption it would only make it worse), or that she intends to leave the country.  She has just been trying to get custody lined up, period. 
 
She missed 2 straight weeks of working just to meet with a long list of people, and is so discouraged and distraught that words do not do it justice.  There is so much animosity (I do not have a full picture of what happened in the past, but it must have been severe) that from the outset she has been convinced that unless forced he will never sign.
 
After recent meetings yesterday (where whomever it is in the court system had some nasty words regarding her attorny), her attorney is saying it may not even reach the point of a court date.  I don't remotely understand the steps required, but thus far it seems it has been extraordinarily complex and collectively a big waste of time and energy and money.
 
So is this it?
Years of searching, literally, and now more of this ...     
 
When I first started searching, I skipped over women with children.  But given the age range, that became difficult.  Then the idea of a woman with a child and having the family I really wanted seemed very appealing.  Now I am deeply invested emotionally, as is she, and she is asking me what to do.  I am telling her not to worry, that we'll figure something out, when the truth is that I have no idea how to fix it. 
 
So, while I can always point out the gentlemen who have been successful in this venture, and all the positives that can come of it, my advice right now would be stay home and date locally, or pick something easier to spend your time on, like fixing the global economy or building a perpetual motion machine.
 
Yes, I'm venting. 
But I am also open to suggestion.

[SMS60]

My guess is the father knows whats going on. Don't think you are a secret.

Which brings me to this point. How would you feel if a Ukrainian man came to your country and had plans to marry your ex-wife and then move to his home country and take any children you might have with them? I know I would fight until the death before that would happen.

Date women with no children or with children who are close to adults. Everybody tries to justify this with how bad the dads are. You only get half the story.

[Faux Pas]

Geez Xman

Sounds like the exRH knows whats going on. Sounds like you have a couple of approaches to this problem. It's not a deal breaker at this point, is it? It's an obstacle and one that came be overcame. You just have to discover how.

1) Meet him on your next visit. Attempt to open up a positive line of rapport and let him know your intentions and that you'd like to become acquainted with him as the child's father (your only interest being the child) Let him know you are a standup guy and you want to settle his concerns. A mano-a-mano thing. Even if you find him appalling and disgusting, play to him.

2) Make a cash offer. Sounds crass I know but, this might be what he's after.

3) Seek some third party help

It's always a difficult scenario with children involved. If I were him, I wouldn't let my child leave either unless I had some assurances. But, I would be supporting my child so I suppose none of that would apply.

Good luck here guy. Don't give up hope.

[BC]

You always have the option of moving there.

[acrzybear]

Or you could arrange a small fee paid to Yuri & Boris to pay the ex a visit   
 
But seriously I like the mano a mano idea.

[Gator]

LAMan,  You have my sympathy.  Perhaps the father is more connected to "the powers that be" than the mother.  Your RW needs to negotiate something with her ex-husband.

[GoodOlBoy]

I have posted this story before XMan.
 
My neighbor forked over $5000. to get his Russian wife and daughter here in the GoodOl' USA.
 
To this day, it is still up in the air as to whether the Russian father actually got the whole $5000. for his signature.
 
GOB

[Faux Pas]

I have posted this story before XMan.
 
My neighbor forked over $5000. to get his Russian wife and daughter here in the GoodOl' USA.
 
To this day, it is still up in the air as to whether the Russian father actually got the whole $5000. for his signature.
 
GOB

GOB, often when these situations come up on the forum, we assume the RM is a scumbag, willing to take a cash payment. That's not as common I don't think as portrayed here. Although many will, many will not.

Many need assurances, a number of them. And they should get them.

However, if the guy is a scum bag and the fiance has the stomach for it, there's other ways around to cat skinning and usually some stand up guys willing to assist

[Maxx2]

Mother and child could take a vacation to Egypt with a round trip ticket and once there leave for the US. I am not sure if this is possible but it was once considered.

[OlgaH]

 
To this day, it is still up in the air as to whether the Russian father actually got the whole $5000. for his signature.
 
GOB

if any     there are many ways to skin an American cat 

[BC]

Mother and child could take a vacation to Egypt with a round trip ticket and once there leave for the US. I am not sure if this is possible but it was once considered.

IIRC there were some who went this route flying out via third countries.  Then the consulates started requiring either a notarized statement from the left behind parent or their presence at the interview.

With so many parental abduction cases that cause headaches at consulates worldwide, most countries probably require such before issuing a visa.

Here in Italy, they required a notarized statement or court order when immigrating.  Some other EU countries may require the same.

[Gator]

With so many parental abduction cases that cause headaches at consulates worldwide, most countries probably require such.

I am not sure how this is enforced.  Perhaps at both ends.  The US is certainly concerned about parental abductions of American children to other countries, so American policy seemingly would be to require permission for a child immigrating with only one parent.  If enforced at the American POE, an intermediate trip to Egypt is not the answer. 

[Muzh]

Xman, have you considered that the father really knows nothing about you and is just fighting for his child? Just a possibility?

How many divorced fathers here whose ex would go on record to say that you are a: wife beater, child abuser, alcoholic, cheater, etc?

And how many are innocent?

Do you really know the situation well?

Let's say that this possibility (of the father fighting for his child) is correct. Would you marry a woman like that?

Just a couple of questions for you to think about before you submit a K-1.

[GoodOlBoy]

Xman, have you considered that the father really knows nothing about you and is just fighting for his child? Just a possibility?

I think that you are being a little naive Muzh (no offense intended).
You, above all here, should be very familiar with the "Babushka Network"? 
 

He said, "the news of your leaving for America is all over town - and I wondered if you were going to call me...."

I think Vaughn's experience is much more in line with reality.
 
EVERYONE (colleagues, relatives, friends, etc.) knew my wife was leaving and she had no children.
 

Let's say that this possibility (of the father fighting for his child) is correct.

This could be true, except for the fact that......
 

He has not paid support in a couple of years. 

And also this little tid bit......
 

He is recently remarried and has a pregnant wife,....

Leads GOB to believe that $$$ may be what he (RM) is really "fighting" for. 
 
GOB
 
 

[BC]

I am not sure how this is enforced.  Perhaps at both ends.  The US is certainly concerned about parental abductions of American children to other countries, so American policy seemingly would be to require permission for a child immigrating with only one parent.  If enforced at the American POE, an intermediate trip to Egypt is not the answer.

Gator,

Sentence in the wrong place.  I was referring to the consulates requiring permission from the left behind parent before issuing a visa. I'll change it.

Yes an intermediate trip will be quite futile, especially at the American border.

[Maxx2]

I am not sure how this is enforced.  Perhaps at both ends.  The US is certainly concerned about parental abductions of American children to other countries, so American policy seemingly would be to require permission for a child immigrating with only one parent.  If enforced at the American POE, an intermediate trip to Egypt is not the answer.

My experience with the US government and their rules is logic and common sense is seldom a consideration.


I am wondering if the US visa is attached to the RWs passport? If so then Russian passport control you would think would be alerted when a RW and child are leaving the country.

[JR]

So here is the unfortunate update.
 
he will never sign.
 
 
 
Yes, I'm venting. 
But I am also open to suggestion.

Bribe his new wife....flash a few grand cash in front of her to get him to sign. She will have many good reasons to work on your side and few if any to assist in his efforts at being vindictive.