Finding a good flight, what's the secret

[celluloidheros]

I was interested in finding out how much a trip to the UKR would cost.   That's ROC to ODS  airport codes  I picked a date that coincided with a EDC tour date of 3/10-3/18, flying into Odessa and going to Nik.  But i couldn't find any decent flights.     They were long with long layovers.  What is the secret to finding good airfares ?  On the return trip they want me to layover for 12 hours on Chicago.    Does this seem normal flying to Odessa ?  The cost is 1200-1600  does this sound right ?   Thanks, Don


 

[Faux Pas]

I was interested in finding out how much a trip to the UKR would cost.   That's ROC to ODS  airport codes  I picked a date that coincided with a EDC tour date of 3/10-3/18, flying into Odessa and going to Nik.  But i couldn't find any decent flights.     They were long with long layovers.  What is the secret to finding good airfares ?  On the return trip they want me to layover for 12 hours on Chicago.    Does this seem normal flying to Odessa ?  The cost is 1200-1600  does this sound right ?   Thanks, Don

Those tickets sound a bit pricey but, you're trying to buy too far out from departure date. You'll always pay heftier fares doing that just as buying too late. Ideally, buy your tickets somewhere between the 30-22 day window from departure. Also, you're putting the cart before the horse. Find your dates that you will go first. Establish those Then start checking the search engines and airlines.

It's a gamble either way but, it's a pretty safe bet you'll get a seat in the mentioned window at a much lower cost than buying it too early. Know your dates, then start shopping your fares. Currently I'd bet you could fly to UA for $1000 or less, just a guess though

[Anotherkiwi]

I was interested in finding out how much a trip to the UKR would cost.   That's ROC to ODS  airport codes  I picked a date that coincided with a EDC tour date of 3/10-3/18, flying into Odessa and going to Nik.  But i couldn't find any decent flights.     They were long with long layovers.  What is the secret to finding good airfares ?  On the return trip they want me to layover for 12 hours on Chicago.    Does this seem normal flying to Odessa ?  The cost is 1200-1600  does this sound right ?   Thanks, Don

I always use Skyscanner for my initial searches, and then possibly use the airline websites to see if there are special promotions.  The cheapest all-up fare I could find from Rochester (depart 9th March, return 19th) is $1,380 and yes, it does have a 12 hour layover in New York (go sightseeing?  ).  However, if you fly from New York itself, the cost on Turkish Airlines drops to $773 - 14 hours over, 15 hours to get back, with only a 2 1/2 hour stop in Istanbul each way.  The train from Rochester is $59 each way (7-8 hours), or fly with Delta for as little as $258 return.  I'm sure that you could work out what's the best and most comfortable option from this.  Whatever you choose you certainly don't need to go to Chicago!

[LAman]

I use skyscanner also.....but if your dates are for midweek flights, you get best deals for $$$ and layovers. A March 8-19 travel is low $900's and longest layover is 5 hours. At moment, Turkish airlines have low prices but who knows how long that will last.
I agreewith FP, I usually get my tickets 4-5 weeks before.....but it can be hit and miss sometimes. If you get a good price , book it!!!
You do know that some experienced travelers here will tell you to avoid this destination!!!!

[celluloidheros]

I had that tour dates wrong.  The actual  dates of the tours I was looking at are march 23-31 and May 11-19  into nikolaev. I was going to fly to odessa.  So we are npot going to meet women in Odessa, but Niklolaev,  So i would need to be there on those dates. i would need to leave on 3/22 and would return on 3/31 or 4/1.  I'll try skyscanner and see what I find. 

[Killer-B]

Just remember that "shoulder" season (from summer to fall and winter to summer) is AUG/SEPT and MAR/APR and prices typically go up by $500+ per... I fly around the globe - and March 15 is the magical cut-off date for travel to Europe (N. Hemisphere) ... The advice given, is accurate and good... just get 30 days in advance and fly midweek - Go in a day early and a day late if need be... I think you can fly from NYC to ODS for $500 and whatever it takes to get there -

There is a RU Travel Agency in NY that has great deals - but I can't recall their site ATM - I'll try to dig it up for you.. but it's very doable...

Cheers,

KB

[celluloidheros]

I have looked pretty good and right now the flights to Odessa are very expensive and terrible connections.  Like a 12 hr layover in istanbul.  I am looking into flying to kiev and then train to pol or nik.    It just seems that a 9 day trip stretches 2 days on each end for travel.  I have to be careful  with my vacation.  Im a working guy with limited vacation (5 weeks).   thanks don 

[SMS60]

If you want to do away with the long layovers you can fly LOT (polish airlines).

The problem is they only fly out of Chicago and  JFK. A flight from ORD to Odessa would be about 12 hours total including the 1.5 hour layover in Warsaw. The return flight would be the same amount of time. No long layovers. All flights will stop in Warsaw from USA.

The flights from ORD usually leave around 4-6 in the evening which means next day arrival. The return flight arrives in Chicago around 6-7 pm each day.

The price for round trip looks to be around $1100.00

Your problem is getting to ORD or JFK with another airlines or some other form of transportation.

With flying LOT to Ukraine you don't have layovers.

[Muzh]

Are you flying out of Rochester? Buffalo? Syracuse?

If you fly out of Boston, it will be way cheaper. Also, the park and ride at logan is about $11/day.

[JR]

There is a RU Travel Agency in NY that has great deals - but I can't recall their site ATM - I'll try to dig it up for you.. but it's very doable...

Cheers,

KB

flyfromrussia.com
 
also known as BrandNewTravel
 

[LAman]

I have looked pretty good and right now the flights to Odessa are very expensive and terrible connections.  Like a 12 hr layover in istanbul.  I am looking into flying to kiev and then train to pol or nik.    It just seems that a 9 day trip stretches 2 days on each end for travel.  I have to be careful  with my vacation.  Im a working guy with limited vacation (5 weeks).   thanks don

Don, doesn't sound like you are  ''all in''. Nine days is very short time frame. There are some things you don't realize. Trains run rather slow in Ukraine, easy to kill half a day!!! Someone will have to buy your tickets, unless you sperak russian, then you will need taxi to and from train stations and deal with trying to find where your train berth is......and your talking about a 12 hour layover??? Anything you do with this journey is time consuming and expensive. Midweek travel is cheapest.......but you have work constraits....sounds like you will have to make a choice......time or money.........or choose another path....

[GQBlues]

....sounds like you will have to make a choice......time or money.........or choose another path....

LOL. How'bout this?

 
 

[celluloidheros]

Are you flying out of Rochester? Buffalo? Syracuse?

If you fly out of Boston, it will be way cheaper. Also, the park and ride at logan is about $11/day.

Rochester 

Boston is about a 7 hrs drive from rochester. 

[mendeleyev]

Very few true "deals" these days. Fly from a major hub as has been suggested by Muzh. Flying on Tuesday and Wednesdays are generally less expensive. Christmas day is the cheapest day to fly anywhere in the world but it seems as if you'll leave before then. 

Compare search engines but it is rare to get a good "deal" that another firm can't match. 21 days is the magic number. More than 21 is okay but less than 21 means the ticket price begins to inch higher.

Combine your frequent flyer miles across carriers as much as possible. I use my USAirways number even when flying other carriers like United, Lufthansa, etc, across the Star Alliance Network. That way they accumulate faster and you will get bumped to first class quicker. I do the same with Delta, using my Delta number for any carrier related to the SkyTeam group, like Aeroflot, American, KLM, Alaska, etc. We've flown 5 times in the past 2 weeks and were upgraded 4 of those times without having to pay for first. Those traveling with you on the same reservation get bumped up if space available because of the "companion" rules.

[Anotherkiwi]

...Compare search engines but it is rare to get a good "deal" that another firm can't match. 21 days is the magic number. More than 21 is okay but less than 21 means the ticket price begins to inch higher...

That's all very well in your situation, mendeleyev, but for ordinary folks travelling to Russia it just won't work.  It's part of the visa application process to show confirmed airline bookings and, if you leave your request to 21 days before travelling you may not get your visa in time to fly.
 
There is also the possibility that you may require other visas and your passport may be delayed in processing.  As an example, New Zealand and Australian citizens still require a visa to travel to Ukraine, and there is no Ukraine Embassy here.  Any New Zealander wishing to go to Ukraine has to send all their documentation to Canberra for processing.  Even assuming that you sent the passport early, there is no guarantee that you will have it back in time to send to the Russian Embassy here.  Although I have a British passport as well as a New Zealand one, and therefore didn't require a visa for Ukraine, I needed a visa for China on my last trip.  I could have had all sorts of problems with my Russian visa if the Chinese Consulate had lost my passport or if the application had simply been held up.
 
And, with most flights these days being non-refundable, you're out of pocket by possibly several thousand dollars if the worst happens - and travel insurance won't cover refusal of a visa.

[Faux Pas]

That's all very well in your situation, mendeleyev, but for ordinary folks travelling to Russia it just won't work.  It's part of the visa application process to show confirmed airline bookings and, if you leave your request to 21 days before travelling you may not get your visa in time to fly.
 

In 7 visa applications I haven't once had to show airline bookings. From this end the Russian consulate doesn't care. It's only an entry and exit date not to exceed 30 days.

Which is a good thing because Mendy is correct IMHO, except I find the purchasing window usually much more defined. "Usually"  29 days or upward the fares are more expensive. At 29 days downward to 21 they get less expensive and at 21 further downward they increase hourly in price.

You Kiwis must have different hoops to jump through than we do. No visa required for Ukraine and no flight plans to disclose, for Americans anyway

[Muzh]

Same for me when UA required visas some time ago. I would indicate around when I was planning to travel out of courtesy.

So, you Kiwis must have pissed off the Russians in some way. 

[Anotherkiwi]

...So, you Kiwis must have pissed off the Russians in some way.

Nah, I think it's just that they haven't yet come to realise how important New Zealand and Australia are!  Certainly, as far as Ukraine goes, it's a real PITA, and this was the main reason I decided to get my British passport.
 
The conditions for a New Zealander to get a tourist visa are:
 

To obtain a visa you should submit to the Consular section :
1. A completed application form, one per person.
2. National passport (original) valid for at least 6 months after the intended date of departure from Russia. At least two pages (side by side) of the passport should be free from notes (additional pages inserted in your passport do not match the size of a Russian visa because they are smaller than standard pages of a foreigh passport).
3. One professional passport sized (3x4 cm) photo. The photo should be stapled to the specially marked place of the application form.
4. A standard tourist Confirmation ("Podtverzdeniye") and a tour Voucher (original of it or the additional proof of payment of the tour is required if it is purchased directly and not by means of a correspondent NZ travel agency) from an authorized hosting Russian travel agency, registered in the Russian MFA. Confirmation and Voucher must be issued in a due form, have a REFERENCE-NUMBER of the hosting company, personal data of each tourist, dates of trip, itinerary in Russia, services paid.
6. Cover letter from your travel agency in New Zealand containing:
- applicant's name and passport data
- dates and points of arrival and departure in and from Russia, means of transport
- itinerary in Russia
- name of the hosting Russian company and its reference number
- payment information (full payment of services provided by hosting Russian agency is required)

Although it doesn't say "airline bookings" as such you can't really have an itinerary without them.  For each trip the Embassy has asked me to provide my international flight numbers, although for the internal itinerary they've been happy with me just advising which cities I intend to visit.
 
For a business visa, we have this:
 

4. A letter of invitation (original only) authorized by Russian Ministry of Internal Affairs or its local offices, of by the Russian Foreign Ministry, or its Regional Representative Offices. Every invitation must contain name in full, date of birth, citizenship and passport number of the applicant, name of hosting organisation, reason and period of visit. Invitation must be signed by authorised person and carry the official seal of Interior Ministry. The Consulate reserves the right to request the original or copy of a cover letter from the Russian host organization with information about the traveler, destinations, terms and purpose of visit.

As you can't apply for a visa earlier than 30 days before arrival, and original business visa invitations can take up to three weeks to arrive, you really start to sweat. 

[Faux Pas]

The conditions for a New Zealander to get a tourist visa are:
 
Although it doesn't say "airline bookings" as such you can't really have an itinerary without them.  For each trip the Embassy has asked me to provide my international flight numbers, although for the internal itinerary they've been happy with me just advising which cities I intend to visit.

It sounds like you are confusing the invitation with airline itinerary. They do ask for an itinerary but it's not "airline" itinerary. Just itinerary of places to visit. They ask for entry and exit dates.

 

For a business visa, we have this:
 
As you can't apply for a visa earlier than 30 days before arrival, and original business visa invitations can take up to three weeks to arrive, you really start to sweat. 

I can't speak of a business visa as I've never applied for one. I speak only in terms of tourist visa for Russia from US. I have applied and received one well over 30 days out. I've been on the other end of that spectrum and received it the day prior to boarding the plane too. The Russian consulate in the US really is only concerned with entry and exit days and they're not overly concerned with it as long as the visa is valid

[Anotherkiwi]

It sounds like you are confusing the invitation with airline itinerary. They do ask for an itinerary but it's not "airline" itinerary. Just itinerary of places to visit. They ask for entry and exit dates.

Read what I wrote -

For each trip the Embassy has asked me to provide my international flight numbers.

I agree with your last two sentences, as I wrote in my previous post.
 

I can't speak of a business visa as I've never applied for one. I speak only in terms of tourist visa for Russia from US. I have applied and received one well over 30 days out. I've been on the other end of that spectrum and received it the day prior to boarding the plane too. The Russian consulate in the US really is only concerned with entry and exit days and they're not overly concerned with it as long as the visa is valid.

Interesting - I may try this on my next trip (if there is one) and see if our Embassy is this kind.

[Faux Pas]

Read what I wrote -
I agree with your last two sentences, as I wrote in my previous post.
 
Interesting - I may try this on my next trip (if there is one) and see if our Embassy is this kind.

I read and understand what you wrote. I'm not arguing or disagreeing with you. I don't know what is on the Kiwi Russian visa app. Just offering you what is on the Russian US app or isn't as this case may be. Flight itineraries aren't required or asked on the U.S. application. I've never heard of any Brits mentioning this. Yes, it would make it a pain in the ass to have to do so and likely cost more money.

Do they put your flight number on the visa? I'd say unlikely thus, just find flights on your expected day and use those.

[tfcrew]

FAA forecast: High air fares most of this decadeThe price of oil is expected to remain highUpdated: Thursday, 08 Mar 2012, 8:59 AM EST
Published : Thursday, 08 Mar 2012, 8:59 AM EST
 

• JOAN LOWY,Associated Press

  WASHINGTON (AP) — Air fares are likely to stay high throughout this decade, as passenger travel grows but airline capacity shrinks, according to a government forecast issued Thursday.
In its annual economic analysis, the Federal Aviation Administration said travelers won't get much relief until airlines start getting more competition, which is years off. The FAA predicted that more airline mergers and consolidation will shrink the number of cities served and the number of flights available in the nation's air travel network.

http://www3.wdtn.com/dpps/money/business_news/faa-forecast-shows-high-air-fares-most-of-this-decade-nt12-jgr_4098115

[rambler]

Well you can get a return flight from London to Kiev for example from only $300 and there are deals to London.  Internal flights in Ukraine are about $100 or trains/buses  about $ 30-50 between Kiev and Odessa/ Kharkov etc.
Just never pick anything up that seems to have been "accidently" dropped in an airport or sidewalk. It's scam to accuse you of stealing "the other $100" or the cell phone when you only picked up a charger etc.,  and its the police pulling the scam.