Hello

[Valkyrie]

Hello.  I am a RW and long time lurker of this forum and registered a new id for a fresh start.

[ML]

Welcome.

What did you learn during your time as a lurker?   

[Valkyrie]

I had another membership while lurking, so read all the forum.   I am maybe pessimistic from my own divorce from an AM but I think many AM want a fantasy. 

[calmissile]

Valkarie
So you are living in the US now?  It might enlighten some of us to know from your persepective why the marriage did not work out.  What were your/his expectations that were not fulfilled?

[Gator]

I had another membership while lurking, so read all the forum.   I am maybe pessimistic from my own divorce from an AM but I think many AM want a fantasy.

  My condolences about your divorce.  I hope the sense of relief and the promise of the future far exceed the pain of broken dreams.
 
Fantasy?  I mistakenly thought the "fantasy" for most men was limited to a woman's physical appearance.    However, I infer from your statement that some AM possibly want a sex slave, maid and cook too rolled up into one woman.    Maybe some other qualities to top off the perfect package such as compliant and frugal. 
 
Why not have such expectations?!   The FSU marriage agencies promised these qualities in their sales hype such as "traditional" woman.   Men believing this crap certainly got a rude awakening when Olga arrived.
 
I hope by now that you have met enough AM to realize many of us are not that way.   You may want to contact another V woman, Vasilisa.  She is a recent divorcee. 

[Daveman]

 
a woman's physical appearance.   

check

sex slave,

check!

maid and cook too rolled up into one woman.   

check and check!

Maybe some other qualities to top off the perfect package such as compliant and frugal. 

check check!


the only thing left is a flat head to sit the beer!

[Gator]

the only thing left is a flat head to sit the beer!

 
Sounds practical but not attractive.  A finely shaped and tight posterior will work if she tilts forward.   Where does the remote control go?
 
Wasn't there a Western Indian tribe called the Flatheads?

[Valkyrie]

We were both to blame.  He was much older and wanted a hot young wife without her own thoughts.  I wanted life outside Ukraine.  I did not love him and thought I would learn love.   But I did not. I now date a RM and it is better for me.

Yes you are correct the fantasy here is not just physical beauty.  I read it in BillyB's thread and now in rivarcardo's thread.  For me it is unrealistic but many here support such ideas.

[Patagonie]

This is interesting, may you tell us more informations about, with your experience now, you consider as fantasy ?

[newjason]

Здравствуйте, Валькирия

Nice to have you here.  I think your viewpoint is very welcome here.

Jason

[Valkyrie]

This is interesting, may you tell us more informations about, with your experience now, you consider as fantasy ?

I will turn it around.  What for you is reality? 

[Spoon]

We were both to blame.  He was much older and wanted a hot young wife without her own thoughts.  I wanted life outside Ukraine.  I did not love him and thought I would learn love.   But I did not. I now date a RM and it is better for me.

Yes you are correct the fantasy here is not just physical beauty.  I read it in BillyB's thread and now in rivarcardo's thread.  For me it is unrealistic but many here support such ideas.

Do you not think perhaps there was an element of fantasy on your behalf also? perhaps life outside Ukraine did not stack up quite like the Hollywood movie? I'm not saying it's the case here, but I do believe quite a few RW have unrealistic expectations too.

It's not always material expectations either; sometimes it's expectations on how a Woman should be treated or interpreted and in many cases an AM may think he is doing everything right, but it's just not the same as a RM would do it.

Welcome BTW

[vwrw]

We were both to blame.  He was much older and wanted a hot young wife without her own thoughts.  I wanted life outside Ukraine.  I did not love him and thought I would learn love.   But I did not. I now date a RM and it is better for me.

Yes you are correct the fantasy here is not just physical beauty.  I read it in BillyB's thread and now in rivarcardo's thread.  For me it is unrealistic but many here support such ideas.

 
How much is much older? what was your age gap?
 
I personally have been avoiding RM ever since i had my first communication with AM. I do not think that RM are bad, I simply think that AM are better because they tend to treat you like a special one, a princess; whereas, RW are pron to take you for granted as a replaceable thing. Yet, as a curious person, i would like to know why dating RM is better for you?
 
It does not really matter what is or isn't unrealistic for you. What maters is whether they believe it is realistic for them. In my life, i saw a few unrealistic relationship working fine for those involved.

How happened that your husband thought that you met his criteria for the right one? How he would conclude that you were hot i understand...why did he think that you are without your own thoughts?

[Patagonie]

 
How much is much older? what was your age gap?
 
I personally have been avoiding RM ever since i had my first communication with AM. I do not think that RM are bad, I simply think that AM are better because they tend to treat you like a special one, a princess; whereas, RW are pron to take you for granted as a replaceable thing. Yet, as a curious person, i would like to know why dating RM is better for you?
 
It does not really matter what is or isn't unrealistic for you. What maters is whether they believe it is realistic for them. In my life, i saw a few unrealistic relationship working fine for those involved.

How happened that your husband thought that you met his criteria for the right one? How he would conclude that you were hot i understand...why did he think that you are without your own thoughts?

I personally have been avoiding AW more and more since i meet more and more RW. I do not think that AW are bad. I simply think that RW are better because they tend to treat  you like a special one, a prince ; whereas, AWare prone to take you as a replaceable thing.  Or to be more accurate AW take you as a center of interest which can change of size,  depending of what she needs at a given time.

[calmissile]

Valkyrie,

Thank you for your honest replies to the questions, it is instructive to those men searching for a FSU wife.

I wanted life outside Ukraine.  I did not love him and thought I would learn love.   But I did not.

Your statement is very clear...   It appears that you wanted out of Ukraine and married a man that you hoped you would learn to love.

This seems like a risk that all men take in this adventure.

Did you tell him that you love him?

Did he believe that you were in love with him when you got married, or was he aware that you 'would learn to love him' (after the marriage).

What kind of issues did you have that he did not expect you to have your own thoughts.  Can you give us examples?

What kind of advice/test can you advise Western Men to avoid marrying a woman that wants to learn to love (after the marriage)?

Your honesty and candor  is very valuable to the men on this forum.  Thanks again.

[Gator]

We were both to blame. 

That is almost always the case and it is splendid to see you recognize it.  Many people blame their ex-spouse.
 

He was much older and wanted a hot young wife without her own thoughts.  I wanted life outside Ukraine.  I did not love him and thought I would learn love.   But I did not.

You are not alone.  In the late 1990s there were many instances of AM visiting the FSU and becoming engaged in a week.  KenC called these men "One Week Wonders."  Some actually spent a couple of weeks with their RW before becoming engaged. 

Around 2002-2003 a respectable member (Marty) of a RW forum came across the preliminary results of a scientific study of marriages between RW and AM.   The study was never completed and published because the principal investigator died.   Here were some of the preliminary findings:

-  60% of the women did not love their husbands when they married
-  99% of the men 'loved' their wives when they married.
-  Marriages that result from a proposal during or just after an initial meeting of two weeks or less fail within two years 97% of the time.
 
If true, sounds like many men and women were pursuing a fantasy.

The men and women surveyed were sampled randomly without regard to age or age gap.  The age disparity parameter was not characterized.  Many forum readers questioned the validity of the study, believing it was fabricated.   The investigator participated one day on the forum, and he seemed reliable IMO.  We will never know.

[The Natural]

Valkyrie,

What kind of advice/test can you advise Western Men to avoid marrying a woman that wants to learn to love (after the marriage)?

calmissile,
 
I realize you directed our questions to this lady but perhaps you would not mind me offering my thoughts.
 
I would say to not let lust dominate the initial process, from both sides. The obvious, does she show a deep interest and affection for you? Women advertising on international sites all want to leave for a better life but, you as a man, have to find the one that does so for the right reasons. When a FSU girl really likes you you will know. She will want to talk to you every day on Skype and then meet you. If you click when you meet, you will both know it, there is no science about it. As you know each other more and more you develop a unique communication, you start to emulate her and she you. You develop your own personal language between you two. You just know!
 
Don't be too cerebral about it. When you feel happy when talking to her or being with her, you are there. When you want to work your ass off to provide her and her mother a good life at the same time she don't want you to feel bad working too hard, then you are there.
 
It's relatively easy, but to get there might not be so easy....

[ML]

When a FSU girl really likes you you will know. She will want to talk to you every day on Skype and then meet you.

I find there is a vast difference from gal to gal (and guy to guy) concerning the time devoted to talking and writing back and forth.  And a lot depends on how much time the person must spend on their daily work, their children and other family, etc.

I have had great times with gals when we are together, but when apart they don't communicate much.  Just don't like to write, talk on phone, etc.

And there have been those gals who love to write and talk, but when together they are pretty much of a dud.

[Patagonie]

blank

[Valkyrie]

Do you not think perhaps there was an element of fantasy on your behalf also?

No.

Welcome BTW

Thank you,

[Valkyrie]

 
How much is much older? what was your age gap?

More then 20 years.
 

I personally have been avoiding RM ever since i had my first communication with AM. I do not think that RM are bad, I simply think that AM are better because they tend to treat you like a special one, a princess; whereas, RW are pron to take you for granted as a replaceable thing. Yet, as a curious person, i would like to know why dating RM is better for you?

We think the same way.  He is my other half.  I have nothing against AM but for me this is better.
 

How happened that your husband thought that you met his criteria for the right one? How he would conclude that you were hot i understand...why did he think that you are without your own thoughts?

I do not think he thought that far.  This is why I read BillyB's thread with fascination.  It was similar in viewpoint.

[Valkyrie]

Valkyrie,

Thank you for your honest replies to the questions, it is instructive to those men searching for a FSU wife.

I wanted life outside Ukraine.  I did not love him and thought I would learn love.   But I did not.

Your statement is very clear...   It appears that you wanted out of Ukraine and married a man that you hoped you would learn to love.

This seems like a risk that all men take in this adventure.

Did you tell him that you love him?

Did he believe that you were in love with him when you got married, or was he aware that you 'would learn to love him' (after the marriage).

What kind of issues did you have that he did not expect you to have your own thoughts.  Can you give us examples?

What kind of advice/test can you advise Western Men to avoid marrying a woman that wants to learn to love (after the marriage)?

Your honesty and candor  is very valuable to the men on this forum.  Thanks again.

No, I did not tell him I loved him.  I think he knew somewhere in his heart I did not love him.  I cannot give one example but I was not his equal partner.  What I thought was not important.

I do not know of any test for Western Men.  I think to ask do you love me is one test but a woman can lie if her  goal is marriage.  I think it is important to know your woman or man thoroughly before marriage.