US Citizen traveling to Ukraine using Ukraine passport.

[HiTech]

Is there anything special to know on which passport to use when my wife and I is traveling back to Ukraine.

My wife got her US passport this spring and if we use her Ukraine passport, are there any issues of have to also show US passport when returning?

HiTech

[ML]

I have no experience or knowledge in  this matter, but why  should that stop  me from commenting!

It seems to be the best procedure would be to show the US passport when entering/leaving USA and the Ukraine passport when entering/leaving Ukraine. 
Don't even mention or show the other passport.  This should work as long as both passports are unexpired.

Both set of officials will  be most comfortable with that.

No charge for this advice.

[GQBlues]

It's my understanding from FSU folks that have dual passports they use the US passport to get back into the US while using their native land passports going into their native land/s..

But since Ukraine doesn't require visas for US travelers, why even bother using her Ukrainian passport to begin with? Other than (likely) a shorter line during the passport POEs in Ukraine, I don't see any added benefit for using it. Once she enters Ukraine as a US citizen, she may advantages of assistance from the US in the event something unforeseen happens during her travel in the country.

An aside, my wife just recently picked up her renewed Russian passport in SF. She, along with some of her friends and associates swore they'll never do this again because of the incidence that happened inside the consulate AND the manner in which passport policy renewals are being implemented these days here...

[BC]

Use US passport when leaving the US, Ukraine passport when entering Ukraine.
Ukraine passport when leaving Ukraine, US passport when entering the US.

This applies to Customs and not the airport check in...  when leaving and returning to the US, present the US passport at the airline check in counter.

IMHO....

[Muzh]

Use US passport when leaving the US, Ukraine passport when entering Ukraine.
Ukraine passport when leaving Ukraine, US passport when entering the US.

This applies to Customs and not the airport check in...  when leaving and returning to the US, present the US passport at the airline check in counter.

IMHO....

BC, if she has an expired visa to the US, her UA passport will be worth kakashka when she tries to leave UA.
 
My wife thought about it but let it expire when the UA government made it a tour to hell when she tried to renew it.

[tfcrew]

Do some research...

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/261458-dual-citizenship/

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/262663-dual-citizenship-and-surrendering-ukrainian-one/

There is no advantage to be using the Ukrainian if she has a US.
One extra passport to get stolen.
Will expire [eventually]

[JayH]

BC, if she has an expired visa to the US, her UA passport will be worth kakashka when she tries to leave UA.
 
My wife thought about it but let it expire when the UA government made it a tour to hell when she tried to renew it.

Ukraine does not recognise dual nationality.I would be very ,very carefull in what choices you make .

[ML]

As you can see from later posters, my original comment that I had no knowledge about this . . . was very true!   

[viking]

Your wife is now a US citizen. Just use that one going forward and the other as a keepsake.

[BC]

BC, if she has an expired visa to the US, her UA passport will be worth kakashka when she tries to leave UA.
 
My wife thought about it but let it expire when the UA government made it a tour to hell when she tried to renew it.

At the airline checkin certainly would be a problem with expired visa. She'll need to show the US passport there.  Didn't suggest that.

Some countries (like the US) require you use their passport with entry and exit regardless if dual citizen or not.  Don't know if UA is like this.

[Vaughn]

Ukraine or not, I would suggest looking deeply into the consequences of allowing a foreign passport to expire when the holder is still a property owner in that nation.

[BC]

Ukraine or not, I would suggest looking deeply into the consequences of allowing a foreign passport to expire when the holder is still a property owner in that nation.

Stumbled across this.. don't know how valid the info is.

http://www.ehow.com/info_8560180_pmz-passport.html

PMZ Stamp
The PMZ stamp authorizes a Ukrainian citizen to leave the country and live permanently in another country. Loosely translated, PMZ stands for "Permanent Place of Living". It can also be referred to as a PMZh stamp by the country you are immigrating to. Without the stamp, a former Ukrainian citizen will run into issues, even if a resident status in another country has already been obtained. Also, most countries will not allow you to apply for citizenship without the proper exit stamp on your passport.

Propiska
Propiska requires that all Ukraine residents register their home address. The registration is confirmed through a stamp on the internal passport. While deemed unconstitutional in 2001, the system has not changed. While sometimes called an Informational Registration as opposed to Propiska, it is still required. Obtaining a PMZ stamp revokes the Propiska stamp. For many, this is seen as a revocation of Ukrainian Citizenship, as the Ukraine does not allow dual citizenship.

[JayH]

The last 2 posts say it and raise the issues.
If you do research-- you will see that the ACCEPTENCE of another nationalities passport renounces Ukraine citizenship.
To not advise Ukraine is an offence in itself.
If --if--if--IF--IF-- you still want to try and retain both--take note of what I said above.
If that is the case-- you would need to use Ukraine passport-- with all necessary visas  from port of arrival and SPECIFICALLY to where you are departing to-- plus the internal Ukraine paper work in place.IE-- as if you did not hold US passport.Otherwise-- you will be answering questions when trying to leave.
Anyone disagree with me-I am interested to hear.I am sure the op is not the first in this situation.

[Muzh]

Oh boy, the infamous PZM stamp.
 
My wife is co-owner with her sister of the house in Kharkiv. She has never signed any papers ceding her half to her sister because she feels it is not necessary. That's how much they love and trust each other.
 
Anyway, some years ago my wife did everything humanly possible to obtain that stamp. On her last attempt she demanded to see the supervisor and she dressed him down real good. One of the things she told him was to get a competent clerk instead of the office f**k my wife was dealing with WHILE pointing at her. It was a sight which I really enjoyed. But I digress.
 
It seems that the government's policy is to deny the stamp to those who have moved outside the country because without that stamp, they (government "officials") may scoop that property very easily in the future.
 
So, Vaughn's warning should be heeded.
 
Regarding dual citizenships, I believe it has been discussed somewhere else but I'll say it again. The only way a UA natural can stop being a citizen of that country is by going in person to an embassy or consulate and denounce their citizenship in front of a consular. The consular will then give that person papers attesting to that. SAME for the US. I checked with NYS Department of State and they deal with this quite a bit.

[tfcrew]

That 'PMZ stamp' just might be a contrived scam.
 http://www.brama.com/travel/messages/29492.html

The OP doesn't state that his wife owns land in Ukraine.
The Internal ID [not the international passport] is used for real estate transactions.

If you do research...the ACCEPTENCE of another nationalities passport renounces Ukraine citizenship.
To not advise Ukraine is an offence in itself.

If you could provide such links? 

The official Ukrainian word...
http://www.mfa.gov.ua/mfa/en/publication/content/719.htm

[Vaughn]

My MIL occupies Elvira's apartment, which, up until now, I've been told that Elvira owns outright with no strings attached. Wrong. Although my wife had already planned to visit her Mama this summer, there is some administrative task that will have to be completed involving the flat, although it will not involve any big sum of money, perhaps a small fee. It's so difficult for me to understand exactly what's going on because it could be that this "task", which must happen face to face, is merely a formality of her Republic, and nothing national.Although Elvira and I are both relatively bilingual, there remains a barrier when it comes to legal/medical matters.
 
It is those ex-pats who face dealing with a "privatization" process that stand to spend some real money so as to gain full title to a dwelling, or face losing it to the State.
 
Back on track: My wife and daughter produce their Russian passports departing USA and arriving Moscow, then show their US passports departing Moscow and arriving USA.
 
 

[Faux Pas]

Back on track: My wife and daughter produce their Russian passports departing USA and arriving Moscow, then show their US passports departing Moscow and arriving USA.

Do they never have any questions at PP control as to why the stamps in the passports are only entries? Or, are they?

[Vaughn]

Sorry, FP, I don't quite understand the question....

[GQBlues]

Do they never have any questions at PP control as to why the stamps in the passports are only entries? Or, are they?

Great question, FP as I had asked the same thing just a few days ago with wifey and friends. It struck me somewhat strange that from the US PP control perspective, it isn't questioned why there isn't any 'exit' information or log on the US passport to coincide with the re-entry.

I thought the usual question asked of US citizens, other than if they are carrying banned items, is how long were they gone and which country they were coming from.

Universal Russian response I got was,..."No, that doesn't matter. This is how it is!" LOL. As usual, void of any signifcant explanation.

[Vaughn]

Thanks, GC, for the clarification. Well, it IS a great question. My wife and daughter only gained their US Passports in the spring of 2010 - and have only travelled once using two passports each. So the question might arise when they check in again. Then again, if they acted as I said earlier, the JFK PP control should have asked, "You're coming in from Russia...? We never knew you left in the first place...." As far as I know, nothing like that happened.

[Faux Pas]

Sorry, FP, I don't quite understand the question....

There is an entry stamp and and exit stamp depending on which way the traveler is going. (for the US anyway). Using the passports as you described would only leave your wife's US PP with entries (no exits) and the russian PP with exits and no entry's wouldn't it? It seems like the PP officer would question it. Maybe it's not a deal, I dunno but, I've often wondered about that

[Faux Pas]

Thanks, GC, for the clarification. Well, it IS a great question. My wife and daughter only gained their US Passports in the spring of 2010 - and have only travelled once using two passports each. So the question might arise when they check in again. Then again, if they acted as I said earlier, the JFK PP control should have asked, "You're coming in from Russia...? We never knew you left in the first place...." As far as I know, nothing like that happened.

LOL...yeah that! You posted as I was writing. I've heard of a number of RW/UW traveling just as you described. I've wondered how they do it without questions from PP control. I get grilled each time it seems

[GQBlues]

One of the reasons (or so I thought) that the question "how long were you gone", was to double-check if the passport carrier trying to enter the country is in fact the same person who left. The answer is checked for accuracy in their database.

But if there's no record of 'departure', what are they checking it against?

[Wayne]

Remember, Russia allows dual citizenship--Ukraine does not. What works for Russia does not always work for Ukraine.
 
In Ukraine, a citizen gets their internal passport, usually, at age 16. It is difficult to get an adult, internal passport before age 16. At age 25 and 45, the Ukrainian citizen must renew their internal passport with new information, photograph, etc. It is some kind of crime to not renew the passport. Remember, the internal passport is used for general identification. It has a record of where you live, who you are married to, etc. As I understand it, Ukrainian cirizens are supposed to carry their internal passport with them.
 
So if a Ukrainian citizen enters Ukraine showing their external passport--they still could be asked for their internal passport. Getting the internal passport renewed in USA could be difficult to impossible. Has anyone done this?
 
It seems like if the person already has a USA passport and citizenship, they should just use that for a visit to Ukraine, unless they are planning to stay for more than 90 days.
 
The laws for land ownership in Ukraine for USA citizens are different than Ukrainians. USA or any other country could have their rightful lands taken depending upon who is in charge of the government.  My wife was also saying something about if a Ukrainian citizen goes to live permanently in another country, they should not or can not own land in Ukraine.
 
So things are much more complicated than you think! If would be helpful if we had an Ukrainian Attorney on board!

[Vaughn]

Getting the internal passport renewed in USA could be difficult to impossible. Has anyone done this?

I believe that to be an impossibility, for both Ukraine and Russia.
 
Sure enough, I just checked their USA passports. They entered the USA in August 2010, but there was no stamp for their prior departure. We'll see what happens on the other side when they arrive Moscow in several weeks and there's no record of their 2010 departure. Better keep my cellphone charged that day.