Trip Update, Just home from Turkey

[Milz713]

Well I have just woken up after a 6000 mile 27 hour return home from Turkey.  I must say the woman was amazing,  32 years old from near Kazan and never married.  We hit off very very well but I expected that after spending 3 months using video chat in skype,  her English is poor but better than my Russian but we still managed to have a great time together.  Turkey is not at all what I expected it would be especially with the tensions with Syria.  It seems any tension is very far removed from Antalya and Side.  We spent the majority of our time in Side walking up and down the beaches and eating in the local resaurants.  We also took a trip to Pamukkale which was well worth the 4 hour drive just to swim in the mineral pool.  The last day together we spent in Lara area because it was close to the airport.  As I mentioned in another thread I rented a car while there for the entire time which was a very good investment even though we did not use the car everyday it was very nice not to have to try to figure out local travel.  As others have stated the Turks drive like mad men and use every inch of the road and I found it helpful to have spent a bit of time driving in Chicago so it was not too horrible but I would advise to always have another car in front of you when aproaching intersections so you can follow there lead))...  Back to the girl,  she is a amazing woman who is young enough to be full of life and optimism but yet mature enough to know how the Russian man works and know that she wants no part of that in her life.  Many have said in this forum that is almost impossible to develop real feelings for a person through the internet and I still disagree with that.  We developed feelings through the many hours of skype and when we met in person it really validated what we thought from before.  After a few hours of getting over the initial jitters of actualy being in the same room it was like we had been together for months.  Most will say that I am stupid for suggesting this but it is what I think is the best next step for our situation.  We have disgussed it together and have decided the best next step for us will be to apply for a fiancees visa and she will come to the USA and after we live together for a few months we will decide to be married or not.   I know that this is not how the system is supposed to work but I also know I can make several trips to meet her and we will still not know anything until we live together so we will go for it.  If after 2 months we decide we dont want to be married she will go back home.  I expect that before she gets a visa we will meet again in her city but I do not expect to meet her family because she has made the decision not to tell her parents she will be running away to the USA until the day she will leave because her parents will try to convince her it is a bad idea.  She has told her brother about me and I was surprised that he was ok with it and wants her to be happy where ever it is....   I know I have opened up a whole can of responses here and expect a bit of harsh criticism from those who have been around the block but every situation as I see it is different and without great risk we will neer have the chance for great reward,,,,,

[IAmZon]

I have opened up a whole can of responses here and expect a bit of harsh criticism from those who have been around the block

I say GOOD FOR YOU.  People are free to say what they want, but the idea that anybody can jump inside your body or mind is PREPOSTEROUS.

You seem to know your in a high risk situation.  Never discount the power of luck - and determination.

[Shadow]

Reading your report I guess you are very well aware of the many pitfalls you will have to evade, and it is your judgement if it can work.
One tip for the near future: do not start regarding her as a wife and give her a regular maintenance until she arrived with you.
In many other things its a matter of beating the odds, but stranger things have happened.

[newjason]

I don't see anything here to critisize 
If you and she are the same sort of people, skype can for sure be a great tool to assist in building a relationship.  Plus, if you ever are together and feel a little strange with her, one of you can always go into the next room with a computer and you can chat together on skype 

As for the K-1.
Be very very careful.  You are considering committing immigration fraud. That's serious.
If she want's to come and visit for a few months and test the water, then get a visitor visa.
Thinking that you will outsmart immigration is not wise. Keep in mind they do this all day, every day, and they will notice something. If they do notice, she will be denied,  Then what?
When it comes to matters like this, you should think very long and hard about playing by the rules.
It will be much easier for you in the long run. If you are trying to get her to "run off to America" and tell her parents at the last moment, then think about what you would think if you are someday the parent and it's your daughter running off to Iran without telling you......

other than that ,  Congratulations!

[GoodOlBoy]

OWW Train Wreck.
 
GOB

[Milz713]

Well I am actually surprised because I have seen the wolves here rip ppl to shreds in short order)))    Jason I do not feel it is immigration fraud and maybe I worded it a bit incorrectly but she will come here with the intent of marriage but the US says you must be married by the end of 90 days so if things just dont look great at the end of 60 days we could throw in the towel.  I am not asking her to not tell her parents,  it is her decision and I think she should tell them what is going on but she is very against it.    I was actually married to a AM woman several years ago and she was great except her boyfriend didnt like her to drive so far from our house to his so we divorced.  I thought I did everything right with her,  we dated for about 2 years before marriage and everyone thought she was great from a great family.  My point here is we just never know for sure until we are in it with both feet and I am ready to take that chance.  I have traveled and met 3 different FSU woman and talked to countless number on the internet and I really think this could be the one and we both want to do it so we are going to give it our best shot.     I actually had a good scare with this girl as I mentioned a bit in another thread but I kept most to myself until now.  I bought her a ticket and she feared there would be problems with the flight and after I did some more searching and discovered all of the problems with Aeroflot I agreed.  She found a direct flight from Kazan through a travel agent but I could not find this flight anywhere on the net,  I couldn't even find it listed at AYT airport website or any flight similar but I sent her $600 through Western Union anyway knowing I was breaking the number 1 rule about sending money to someone you haven't met,,,,,......  Even up until the day I left I could not find her flight listed until I was standing at the International terminal at AYT and there it was..  A few hours of waiting and she was there just as she promised...   I think the number 1 rule is there are no rules,  sure some get burned but sooner or later ya gotta take a chance,,,,  If it were easy everybody would do it,,,,

[GoodOlBoy]

I was actually married to a AM woman several years ago and she was great except her boyfriend didnt like her to drive so far from our house to his so we divorced. 

Come again? 
 
GOB

[GoodOlBoy]

Never mind, I got it. 
 
GOB

[GoodOlBoy]

 

....she will come to the USA and after we live together for a few months we will decide to be married or not.   

You really shouldn't post this on the internet guy.
 

You are considering committing immigration fraud. That's serious.

He is and it is serious.
It's a felony.
 
GOB
 

[Milz713]

Ok 1 more time for clarification,  I worded it a bit off,  she will come with the intent of being married,  (not immigration fraud)  but the US says you have to be married at the end of 90 days but within that 90 days if things take a turn for the worst neither of us have to go through with it but she will have to go back to Russia and will not be allowed back on a fiancee visa again to marry that same person..  The intent here is for us to be married and I do not expect anything to go wrong,,,

[Slumba]

 
You really shouldn't post this on the internet guy.
 
He is and it is serious.
It's a felony.
 
GOB

Ummm, I think there is a mis-communication here, or something. 

The fiancee visa allows exactly THIS - "spend up to 90 days in country and either marry, or, the foreigner must leave before day 91" .  What exactly is the fraud in that?

My personal view - visit the family and friends first!

[Faux Pas]

I was actually married to a AM woman several years ago and she was great except her boyfriend didnt like her to drive so far from our house to his so we divorced.  I thought I did everything right with her,  we dated for about 2 years before marriage

Milz
Her boyfriend? Seems there is a lot more you have left out 

[GoodOlBoy]

The fiancee visa allows exactly THIS - "spend up to 90 days in country and either marry, or, the foreigner must leave before day 91" .  What exactly is the fraud in that?

If or when you ever fill out a K-1 application form Slumba to bring over your FSUW, be sure to include this phrase in your application: " ...she will come to the USA and after we live together for a few months we will decide to be married or not."
 
Be sure to come back to RWD and let us know how it worked out for you.
 
GOB

[Slumba]

If or when you ever fill out a K-1 application form Slumba to bring over your FSUW, be sure to include this phrase in your application: " ...she will come to the USA and after we live together for a few months we will decide to be married or not."
 
Be sure to come back to RWD and let us know how it worked out for you.
 
GOB

Sorry, I am right (about whether this is a fraudulent use of a K1) and you are wrong. They have an intent to be married, barring any unforeseen circumstances or compatibility issues.

Talk to a consular officer if you need to know more. 

Sure, you wouldn't put exactly that in the application, but the choices for the foreign person are clear, either marry or leave; neither choice represents a crime or fraud on the part of anyone. 

Anyone can refuse to marry someone for any reason, or no reason at all, you don't have to explain yourself as to why you chose not to marry.

Personally I would strongly suggest the guy meet her family and friends, in her hometown, first. The K1 issue is focusing on the wrong thing.

[Vaughn]

.....and without great risk we will neer have the chance for great reward,,,,,

 
Take the risk and insist on meeting her parents. In Kazan. Otherwise, you risk a lifetime of resentment and alienation by those who know and love her best - her flesh and blood parents, who might just welcome a man who's got the ambition and determination to make their 32 year old unmarried daughter his wife. A trip to Kazan will not only address this issue, you get to witness her interaction with family - rather than just with you in vacation mode, which reveals little of importance when the heat is on.
 
Even if they rejected me for whatever reason, I would feel better knowing I gave them the chance to offer their blessings. Not receiving them doesn't prevent either of you from proceeding with your grand plan.

[IAmZon]

It does not matter what you do ... it matters HOW YOU DO IT.  Never be an American-style pussy-man.   If you don't want to meet the parents, then don't.  But, if you see the wisdom in it, then make Goddamn sure it happens.   You must run much of this program on your own, strict terms.  Otherwise, you will be rolled like a pancake in all likelihood.

[Vaughn]

It does not matter what you do ... it matters HOW YOU DO IT.

 
This is just me, but how he's doing it now is agreeing to marry a woman who's not only willing to deceive her parents regarding a lifelong decision, she likely already has deceived them in explaining away her trip to Turkey.
 
Then again, we all have the right to decide upon which sort of foundation our marriage is to be built.

[GoodOlBoy]

..... she will come to the USA and after we live together for a few months we will decide to be married or not.

Sure, you wouldn't put exactly that in the application,

Stop the Kabuki dance Slumba.
I don't need to "talk" with anybody.
If there is nothing wrong with it, then why not use it in the application and more importantly the letter of intent?

GOB
 

[Gator]

 
Take the risk and insist on meeting her parents. In Kazan. Otherwise, you risk a lifetime of resentment and alienation by those who know and love her best - her flesh and blood parents, who might just welcome a man who's got the ambition and determination to make their 32 year old unmarried daughter his wife. A trip to Kazan will not only address this issue, you get to witness her interaction with family - rather than just with you in vacation mode, which reveals little of importance when the heat is on.
 
Even if they rejected me for whatever reason, I would feel better knowing I gave them the chance to offer their blessings. Not receiving them doesn't prevent either of you from proceeding with your grand plan.

 +1   Completely agree.
 
Has anyone else known of a case where a RW did not want to introduce her fiance to her family?  Perhaps this has happened when the RW was scamming the fiance for a monthly allowance.   However, I don't know of any case involving a sincere RW. 
 
RW are family oriented.  Also, moving is such a huge step with so much to lose that they want to discuss the man's qualities with their mother, father, grandmother, aunt, cousin, godmother, etc.
 
 
 
 

[Gator]

Milz,
 
You can not know a woman in a week, especially if her English is "poor" in your words.  In your lifetime you are allowed only two K-1 visa petitions.   If you are interested in marrying a foreign woman, why risk half of your opportunities on someone you do not know?   The limit of two applications was instituted because of men taking advantage of women, sending them packing after 2-3 months,  and then going back to the FSU to find another two-month play toy.
 
Keep in mind that with only one visit and "poor" English, her visa petition may be denied at the embassy interview.  If you do decide to proceed with this plan, be sure to enroll her in intensive English language lessons.  This will not only help her receive a visa, it will facilitate the two months of shacking up.
 
 

[Steamer]

I expect that before she gets a visa we will meet again in her city but I do not expect to meet her family because she has made the decision not to tell her parents she will be running away to the USA until the day she will leave because her parents will try to convince her it is a bad idea.

Hello Milz,
This is a very bad idea. Her parents will always love her, but if you do not meet them before she leaves and she just sneaks off, you will be seen as the bad guy that talked her into this and you will be sh*t in their eyes forever. This will come back on you in the future when she starts to miss her parents and tries to reconcile with them over the telephone. It's hard enough to get FSU women used to a new life in the US, but if she has to carry around a bunch of guilt because she snuck away it's going to be bad and I'll bet dollars to donuts that she'll blame YOU for causing a breach with her parents because you let her do this. What if this doesn't work out between you two? Now she has to go home to a family that she totally dissed to beg forgiveness.

If she is worried they'll try to talk her out of this then BE THERE with her when she tells them. Even if it gets ugly you'll both know that you did it honestly. Then it will be possible to reconcile with them in the future. Burglars sneak away, upright people don't.
 

[TheTraveler]

i've been there before (not with my dhrw)...

and i laid it out in plain terms: no parents' blessing... no marriage.

this is her problem to solve, and you need to be ready to walk away (i did, thankfully).

if she can't solve this problem, then what kind of wife will she be?

[JayH]

Guys -you are being to straight up and down here-- there is no specific order or way that things need to be done. Each case is unique.
There can be different explanations in each "fact" stated here. Eg  not telling parents-- she may not want to tell them untill  after marriage decision is made( and it is definate)i-- or alternatively she may be planning on having US holiday.Same fact but widely differing conclusions are possible. She may simply be reluctant to say to parents I am going to go and practice being married!!

[Steamer]

There can be different explanations in each "fact" stated here. Eg  not telling parents-- she may not want to tell them untill  after marriage decision is made( and it is definate)i-- or alternatively she may be planning on having US holiday.Same fact but widely differing conclusions are possible. She may simply be reluctant to say to parents I am going to go and practice being married!!

I can understand not telling the parents about a foreign boyfriend until you're sure about things but this is about avoiding giving her parents the courtesy of the truth until the last minute because it MAY be uncomfortable. Is this how she deals with problems, by slipping out the back door? I also understand how a pretty face can turn your brains into boogers. If I were Milz I would slow down and plan on a few more trips to visit her folks and friends before I committed.

[Belvis]

OWW Train Wreck.

+1
Just my view about this women. She is 32 and never married. I assume she looks hot because it seems OP has fallen in love over a vacation trip. She must have attention from locals, for sure in her younger years. Usually such a girl gets in marriage pretty soon, then divorced. She never did this way. Why?
1. The most probable reason is her traits. Of course, RM around her are terrible guys, old story 
2. OK, may she is a  woman with high morale standards and requirements to a future spouse. In such case I can't believe this woman would go in US on fiancee visa after a single vacation trip together. Besides the story with her parents looks very suspicious. More odds she is an adventurous girl than a family oriented one.