Help for a newbie

[adventurer23]

I am just starting my look for a Ukraine Bride. I have read 1 book with another book on the way. I have read many of your forums after I tried Russianbrides.com  a bad mistake. What are good internet dating sites. I am now researching  Elanesmodels and Ukrainebride... Please any advice??

[jone]

Adventurer,

You will get as many opinions on here as there are members.  There seem to be three schools of thought:

1.  Use the websites that you have referred to.  Both are representative of direct contact for a monthly fee type sites.   But do not assume that just because you are talking to someone on one that she is not a scammer.  My personal advice in using these sites is to be honest in your expectations and in what you tell these women.  Do not be set on one woman, but make sure that you communicate with many and you will have an opportunity to find a good fit.  BUT REMEMBER, such a site is used only to introduce you to the lady.  It DOES NOT confirm compatibility.  That only happens with a face-to-face meeting and continued personal interaction.

2.  Go to a city and have a local agency person fix you up with some women.  There are commercial choices on here that fit such an opportunity.  The benefit of this is that you are in the city, and you can have alot of women to choose from.  For a newbie starting out and want to get your sea legs under you, it can be a great service.

3.  Use a service such as Eduard's where you actually have someone who is a native of an FSU (Former Soviet Union) country propose women that they have researched.  Eduard also flies with you to meet these women and is able to massage the relationship to give it a jump start.

Welcome aboard and good luck.  (IN ANY EVENT, DO NOT USE PAY PER LETTER OR PAY TO CHAT SITES. AS BEAUTIFUL AS THE WOMEN LOOK, THESE SITES ARE ALL RIP OFFS.)

-j

[cc3]

Adventurer, I respectfully must disagree with Jone. I used a site, after trying Elena's Models and Anastasia, called Alone angels, a US-based website, to search for and eventually meet my fiancee in Ukraine. Alone angels does not charge a monthly membership fee. You do pay to open every letter from your person of interest, after her first letter to you. But the cost per letter is based upon some weird evaluation of the attractiveness and popularity of the woman in question, so women with enhanced glamor photos, residing in popular cities (Kiev or Odessa), will have higher letter prices (up to $20) than women photographed in more natural settings and facial/body appearances. My fiancee had no lingerie or bikini poses, so her per letter cost was only $4 per letter. After paying for 3 letters from the woman of interest, one is allowed, upon approval of the woman in question, and for a $50 fee, to receive her personal info: email address, mobile number, and address. That's what happened to us, and once we were communicating to our private email addresses, all links with alone angels were terminated. The really good thing about this site is that you can search, and see all info and photos for each woman, entirely at no cost.

[Patagonie]

As 90 % of agencies are between not professionals or totally dishonest it is has become an habit to say in this forum:
" (IN ANY EVENT, DO NOT USE PAY PER LETTER OR PAY TO CHAT SITES. AS BEAUTIFUL AS THE WOMEN LOOK, THESE SITES ARE ALL RIP OFFS.)"

I want to say that the "ALL RIP OFFS" is not totally true, few agencies do the job, and, probably because they are small in size, their only choice to be paid is by letter. I know personally three of them. But more are available for sure.
However for a newbie, who is incapable to sort, the advice is  worth the money.

[Marian]

  Adventurer,and good Luck for your Adventur to find a nice Wife.
I´v got many helpfull Tips from the Members here of this Site on that Day I did my Introducing here.
Maybe it wil help you in the same way it helps me.Just check my Topic there you can find thise helpfull Tips I get.


http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=15357.0

[Hammer2722]

Welcome Adventurer, this here will pretty much sum up what you need:
 
  Pursuing FSUW 101.  Below are the basics.

First, avoid all agencies and any websites that require pay per contacting each woman and/or pay per each letter.

Second, go to these websites:

http://singles.ru/
http://www.luckylovers.net/
http://www.rbrides.com/
http://www.ukrainedate.com/
http://www.allsinglerussiangirls.com/
http://freepersonals.ru/
http://bride.ru/
http://fdating.com
http://www.1vipdating.com/
http://freeukrainianwomen.com/
http://okfreedating.net/
http://luckylifepartner.com/
http://www.weblovefinder.com/

The below are in Russian language.
 
 http://www.edarling.ru/
 http://vmireznakomstv.ru/
 http://www.your-ideal.com/
 http://www.24open.ru/
 http://loveplanet.ru/
 http://www.maybe.ru/
 http://znakomstva-sitelove.ru/

Go to the above free and monthly cost ($19-30) dating websites.  Make up a nice profile of yourself.  Use the search engines to find about 800 - 1,000 women who are in the age range you want and have the education, height, weight, language, children, drinking, smoking, etc., parameters that you desire and are in a single target geographical area.

Do this screening first rather than look at pictures first.  After you have done the screening; then look at the pictures.

When you are two months away from your trip departure time, then start sending out your first message.

Send a generic but well written introductory message to all with each individual name typed at the top.

Of those  who reply, filter out all who make you worry in any way or give you concerns.

Send second generic but well written letter to all with their individual names typed at the top.  Modify it a bit to answer any questions that an individual woman may have asked.  Yes, this takes a lot of time.

Repeat these procedures over about 6-8 weekly emails and you will have narrowed down your list to 15-30 gals.  You can continue to use a generic letter for each successive mailing, but be sure to modify it a bit to answer specific questions any gal may have asked and to ask specific questions of your own related to the family, interests, jobs, etc., of each individual woman.  Yes, this takes a lot of time, but each week you will be cutting your list down. 

Finalize your trip plans and start scheduling the women into time slots.

If you follow the above procedure, you will not have the need to ask us questions about scammers, etc., as you will have filtered out all scammers.  And if any of the women you are writing to give you any sheeeeet or cause you any concern at all, or ask for money for ANYTHING you simply drop them off your lists and continue on.

[Turboguy]

Great post Hammer but to my mind you left off the best site of all and the one where more men have met their wives than any other by far.  It's also one the OP mentioned in his first post.


www.ElenasModels.com


Other options besides sites to make direct contact would be Eduard's services which are very personalized and seem to be very effective and going on one of Jack's tours where you can meet hundreds of women in one trip.  Jack runs the only tours I would recommend and please stay away from the others.  Jacks info is at www.FirstDream.com

[Hammer2722]

Great post Hammer but to my mind you left off the best site of all and the one where more men have met their wives than any other by far.  It's also one the OP mentioned in his first post.


www.ElenasModels.com


Other options besides sites to make direct contact would be Eduard's services which are very personalized and seem to be very effective and going on one of Jack's tours where you can meet hundreds of women in one trip.  Jack runs the only tours I would recommend and please stay away from the others.  Jacks info is at www.FirstDream.com

All I did was cut and paste ML's thread post to here. I figured that this here was a good starting point for newbies to use to get rolling.

[jone]

cc3,

I went to your website you mentioned.  The first girl I see is 22 years old and advertises for a man between 18 and 60.  Personally, since you have thrown it out there as being great - and that you have become engaged after talking with only one Ukranian woman - I think it would be interesting for all of us here to understand how you consumated your engagement - how long you talked to this woman before you became engaged, etc., how many times you have seen her, in person, etc.

Somehow your posts just don't pass the sniff test.

Please - other posters join in.  Go look at this site.  Am I the only person that thinks it is a rip-off?

[Marian]

cc3,

I went to your website you mentioned.  The first girl I see is 22 years old and advertises for a man between 18 and 60.  Personally, since you have thrown it out there as being great - and that you have become engaged after talking with only one Ukranian woman - I think it would be interesting for all of us here to understand how you consumated your engagement - how long you talked to this woman before you became engaged, etc., how many times you have seen her, in person, etc.

Somehow your posts just don't pass the sniff test.

Please - other posters join in.  Go look at this site.  Am I the only person that thinks it is a rip-off?

Alone angels for me looks the same like natashaclub.
But another question.Why so many members are convinced with elena models?I also found many negativ comments about this site on the web.So are all those guys only dissapointed and want to flame their reputation as a serious website?Are some guys her wich found her wife over elena?

[Daveman]

Alone angels for me looks the same like natashaclub.
But another question.Why so many members are convinced with elena models?I also found many negativ comments about this site on the web.So are all those guys only dissapointed and want to flame their reputation as a serious website?Are some guys her wich found her wife over elena?

As I mentioned in your intro thread and Turbo mentions in this one... Going by the married men/women here, the most common website seems to be elenas.  That doesn't mean it is the best, but rather that it appears to be the most common site found here on RWD as the meeting place for couples who develop relationships leading to marriage.


I can understand negative commentary.  This venture -- meeting someone compatible, courting her, developing relations, growing to the point of marriage -- almost always ends with disappointment.  Yes, rarely does any of this lead to marriage (and we're not even discussing divorces).


Most will give up prior to marrying an FSUW.  Some, like myself, are too stubborn to quit so inevitably stumble into the right woman/relationship.  Most will not because they are searching for the quick fix and very few are so fortunate as to bypass the trials and tribulations of the process.


It boils down to:


1)gettin' lucky
2)not giving up until you get lucky. 
3)lather, rinse, repeat


There are decent women on sites such as cc3 mentions just as there are not so decent women also on elenas. 

[ML]

But another question.Why so many members are convinced with elena models?

I also found many negativ comments about this site on the web.So are all those guys only dissapointed and want to flame their reputation as a serious website?

Are some guys her wich found her wife over elena?

First, there are several guys here who state they made contact with their now wives on Elena's.  So  it does work.

Second, despite the above, I would never recommend Elena's because I have not found the site useful to me.

I looked at the site before each of my WMVM trips, but never used it simply because there were far too few women listed there (in my search parameters) in any particular city.  In a WMVM, it is not worthwhile to use a site when there might be only one or two women of interest, compared to the hundreds available (in your target city within your search parameters) on other dating sites as outlined here:  http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=14615.0

[Faux Pas]

cc3,

I went to your website you mentioned.  The first girl I see is 22 years old and advertises for a man between 18 and 60.  Personally, since you have thrown it out there as being great - and that you have become engaged after talking with only one Ukranian woman - I think it would be interesting for all of us here to understand how you consumated your engagement - how long you talked to this woman before you became engaged, etc., how many times you have seen her, in person, etc.

Somehow your posts just don't pass the sniff test.

Please - other posters join in.  Go look at this site.  Am I the only person that thinks it is a rip-off?

You and I make at least 2. This is another 1st International site. No matter how you slice it or how much you are willing and/or able to pay, high percentage of these pay by the letter sites are designed solely to separate the gullible men from their money. That said, yes men meet women from said sites everyday. Some men even get lucky and find a sincere women or a diamond in the rough from these places. Those are the exception and not the rule. If you are feeling lucky, go to Vegas.

cc3, congrats that it worked out for you but as jone mentioned your story would be an interesting one and if you feel your advice is sage, please share the story. Sending newbies to any 1st International sites in all likelihood will be frowned upon by most experienced members here.

[Faux Pas]

Alone angels for me looks the same like natashaclub.
But another question.Why so many members are convinced with elena models?I also found many negativ comments about this site on the web.So are all those guys only dissapointed and want to flame their reputation as a serious website?Are some guys her wich found her wife over elena?

I am a proponent of Elenas as well. Not just because that is where I found the lady that is now my wife but, because it is a no-nonsensical way to communicate directly with women without any intervention by an agency. Yes, prior to me discovering Elena's I used a few of the pay by letter sites and one or two others. This was a number of years ago and it was something like $200 bucks for 50 direct contacts. It was well worth it as compared to the other sites. Unlike a few in this thread, I found ample number of women from all over to communicate with. Some with a common language and some not. Language was at times a barrier other times not. Elena's is a good place to start without getting taken advantage of or being ripped off. Unfortunately for me, I found it too late

[Marian]

I am a proponent of Elenas as well. Not just because that is where I found the lady that is now my wife but, because it is a no-nonsensical way to communicate directly with women without any intervention by an agency. Yes, prior to me discovering Elena's I used a few of the pay by letter sites and one or two others. This was a number of years ago and it was something like $200 bucks for 50 direct contacts. It was well worth it as compared to the other sites. Unlike a few in this thread, I found ample number of women from all over to communicate with. Some with a common language and some not. Language was at times a barrier other times not. Elena's is a good place to start without getting taken advantage of or being ripped off. Unfortunately for me, I found it too late

I should read the FAQ of Elena Models before reading bad post about this site.
I dint know that this site has a another Concept.Thougt it is the same like DM or AW.So this is a fact your communicating with the Women and not with an employee of the Agency?
I also had a profile there ,it was a year ago.I wrote in my Profil information "not to send me Letters until
I am a full member of the site and that I´m not active here at the moment."
I was testing cuteonly at this Time and didnt want to have two active Profiles at the same Time.I was suprised to getting Letters from ElenaM so I thouhgt this is also one of those fishing sites where they send precast Letters to make the Members pay for it.It was not a hughe amount of Letters,around 10 or 12 as I can remember.Thats why I thouhgt the Women do not read the profiles on their own and some employees are sending those letters.

[jone]

It is important to understand the difference between a pay-per-letter or pay-per-chat site and a site that charges a blanket fee and allows you the opportunity to obtain direct contact with women.  The PPL and PPC sites try to control the relationship because the more traffic you drive through the site, the more money they make.  That is not the case with Elena's Models or UrkaineDate, etc. and many of the sites listed on the above list. 

For example:  On a PPC or PPL site, the ladies sign a contract that they will not give you their personal information unless a direct meeting is held.  And even then, as others on this site have noted, those facilitating this meeting will discourage longterm relations because if your relationship fails, then you will be back using their service again and paying them additional money - even to the point of lying about the woman's interest.

So, while there may be some dissent as to the effectiveness of Elena's Models or other sites where you can have direct contact with the women, going to a site that does not offer direct contact, or only controlled contact - or monitored contact, is much less effective - almost like hitting your head against a wall, hoping to break it down.

[LAman]

As I mentioned in your intro thread and Turbo mentions in this one... Going by the married men/women here, the most common website seems to be elenas.  That doesn't mean it is the best, but rather that it appears to be the most common site found here on RWD as the meeting place for couples who develop relationships leading to marriage.


I can understand negative commentary.  This venture -- meeting someone compatible, courting her, developing relations, growing to the point of marriage -- almost always ends with disappointment.  Yes, rarely does any of this lead to marriage (and we're not even discussing divorces).


Most will give up prior to marrying an FSUW.  Some, like myself, are too stubborn to quit so inevitably stumble into the right woman/relationship.  Most will not because they are searching for the quick fix and very few are so fortunate as to bypass the trials and tribulations of the process.


It boils down to:


1)gettin' lucky
2)not giving up until you get lucky. 
3)lather, rinse, repeat


There are decent women on sites such as cc3 mentions just as there are not so decent women also on elenas.

I agree very much with your post except for first paragraph. Exactly how many members here have met their wives on EM, since it has been banded about here for much time? A handful out of the over 7000 members just of this site? Just wondering..

[jone]

Thats why I thouhgt the Women do not read the profiles on their own and some employees are sending those letters.

Hey, Marian, if I were a lady, I would have been sending you letters too!

[LAman]

I am a proponent of Elenas as well. Not just because that is where I found the lady that is now my wife but, because it is a no-nonsensical way to communicate directly with women without any intervention by an agency. Yes, prior to me discovering Elena's I used a few of the pay by letter sites and one or two others. This was a number of years ago and it was something like $200 bucks for 50 direct contacts. It was well worth it as compared to the other sites. Unlike a few in this thread, I found ample number of women from all over to communicate with. Some with a common language and some not. Language was at times a barrier other times not. Elena's is a good place to start without getting taken advantage of or being ripped off. Unfortunately for me, I found it too late

FP, are you saying all ladies on EM have their own computer and/or have direct personal email through EM and never enter into a local agency office?

[Marian]

Hey, Marian, if I were a lady, I would have been sending you letters too!

HaHa  (i love this emoticon).But how do you explain such Letters?Unserious Profiles on EM (as we know they can be everywhere) or the Ladys didnt understand what I have written there.

[jone]

But how do you explain such Letters?Unserious Profiles on EM (as we know they can be everywhere) or the Ladys didnt understand what I have written there.

I have not used Elena's models, but, understanding the MOB type of site, it probably means that they have selected a profile type to write an invitation to communicate with, much like is described above (originally by ML).  By casting a wide net, they then can refine their search down to the chosen fewer.  You didn't respond so there was no further interaction.  The interesting thing about the Elena's Models and UkraineDate is that women actually do proactively search and communicate.  You shouldn't have put that picture of you on your profile in your Speedo.

[LAman]

You and I make at least 2. This is another 1st International site. No matter how you slice it or how much you are willing and/or able to pay, high percentage of these pay by the letter sites are designed solely to separate the gullible men from their money. That said, yes men meet women from said sites everyday. Some men even get lucky and find a sincere women or a diamond in the rough from these places. Those are the exception and not the rule. If you are feeling lucky, go to Vegas.

cc3, congrats that it worked out for you but as jone mentioned your story would be an interesting one and if you feel your advice is sage, please share the story. Sending newbies to any 1st International sites in all likelihood will be frowned upon by most experienced members here.

While I agree with you many of the PPL sites are separating gullible men from their money. I wonder why even send any newbie to any site. Is that really helping them? I think it would be more helpul to ask some pertinent questions and have them read the many excellent threads here to gain some knowledge to be better prepared in this endeavor.
Personally, I would never recomend this journey to any of my friends, in fact I would be more adapt to discourage anyone from trying( if I was a true friend). Of course down the line if one really wants to try, I will certainly try to help them.

[Hammer2722]

 There WILL be scammers and pro-daters on ALL of these sites. No single site is going to be free of them. Its up to YOU to be educated and wary enough to filter them out during your search. Just common sense....

[LAman]

.

Welcome aboard and good luck.  (IN ANY EVENT, DO NOT USE PAY PER LETTER OR PAY TO CHAT SITES. AS BEAUTIFUL AS THE WOMEN LOOK, THESE SITES ARE ALL RIP OFFS.)

-j

I got a laugh from this Jone!!!
From my experience, the ripoff are from the lonely desperate delusional guys that fall in love with a photo....
It can be very easy to part with one's money and complain later when you don't  get expectations met.
In fact, I tell many guys thatmaybe it is just entertainment....

[Turboguy]

, I would never recommend Elena's because I have not found the site useful to me.

I looked at the site before each of my WMVM trips, but never used it

I have no problem with the fact that you would never recommend Elena's but have never used it.   There are sites on the list that I have never used and unless I have heard enough good things I try not to recommend something I don't know either.


I had two platinum memberships to Elena's  (one after the other, not at the same time)


That allowed me to make direct contact with as many or all of the thousands and thousands of women on Elena's.  I am not sure where you are going that you couldn't find women.  I made a business trip to Baku, which isn't the most popular of places and thanks to Elena's managed to find women I could meet there.  Over the span of my membership I contacted and met a lot of ladies who were real ladies and mostly looking for a good man to marry.  I also met my wife there and it is the singular most common place that I hear men say they met their woman.  I think if we ever did a poll it would probably have created as many marriages as all other similar sites but together.   So, yes, I am a fan of Elena's.