A Change of Policy Towards PPL Sites?

[jone]

Let's see now what we know:

1.  The agency closed down a year after Galyna and William met.

2.  The agency was part of the larger, most likely, largest PPL site.

3.  That site is regularly bringing in new agencies - see their advertising from their home page.

4.  On different threads we have seen advertisements like on Yandex.ru, offering employment to women to come in and communicate with men, without any statements that they are there to find a husband.

5.  This offer of employment seems to have been offered to Galyna, but rejected.  But it was also independently confirmed by another member and his friend.

6.  Women are still trying to use the PPL sites to meet men, and we now know (from my own postings) that men can still use these sites to some effect.

7.  Based on the economic model and the sheer number of women that are showing up on the PPL sites, it cannot be discounted that the great amount of money pouring into the coffers leads to an even greater disparity between PPL sites and sites which are subscription.

8.  We recently have had a known attack on a man using the largest PPL site, by the woman that he met.

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Maybe I am really off base here, but I think there might be a modification of policy that we should entertain regarding PPL sites.  We have always gone by ML's list of agencies as being the safest way to meet women.  But I have watched as the number of new additions has dropped dramatically at Bride.RU and Elena's Models.  (Can this be quantified?) This can only mean that either women are no longer signing up, for various reasons, or that the sheer amount of advertising to women being done by the PPL sites is drawing them away from subscription sites.

Should we not, then, begin a series of recommendations for how to use a PPL site to effect rather than blackballing them altogether?  I know such a strategy would be welcomed by the friends of my gal that I met that are still looking.

If Shadow's 'shades of gray' analogy is correct, then we should probably make it our business in the form of a series of rules that will flesh out contact with a PPL site that will get people past the obvious hucksters and scammers and ferret out the possible real relationship seekers.

I have always maintained that corruption and lies, deceit and fraud prevalent on a PPL site mandated a policy of getting them shut down.  But I can basically see that this ain't a gonna happen.  Too much money there.

So what can we do to establish rules for interaction?   What are the successful ways that men navigated these sites and wound up at their destination?  And what advice can we give the women that will prevent them from getting involved with men that are less than honest themselves? 

This is the elephant in the room.  If we disregard it, the scamming goes on and the purpose of this forum, advising men and women on WM / FSUW relationships isn't fulfilled.

[jone]

NOTE:  I moved this over to a new thread because the old one seemed to have a lot of interaction that was not conducive to a good policy discussion like this warrants. 

[Shadow]

The answer to what to do is simple: cut out the middle (wo)man as fast as possible.

It really does not matter how you get in to contact, as long as the contact is direct.
We have a majow advertiser here who has a lack of available men, contrary to other sites where a lack of available women is present.

A man needs to do several things to watch his wallet:
1. Do not react to every letter you receive. Instead send out your own to the profiles that interest you. Most women are like Galyna, and expect the man to make the move.
2. Keep communication as short as possible in number of letters. If you have to pay for direct contact, remember the amount is minor compared to what you will spend on a trip and close to zero on what you spend if you find someone you will marry.
3. Arrange your own trip. Unless she is living in the outskirts of Kemorovo there will be a local business renting out apartments. Our list of service providers is a good start.
4. If you really have to date someone you do not share a common language with, find your own translator. Once again the list of service providers can help.
5. Stop thinking about money. If you have to count every dime, you can probably not afford the whole process anyway and are best diverted back to local women, or virtual girlfriends.
6. Never ever make a first visit with the intention to get engaged or married to the woman you are visiting. It may happen or it may not. Your object is to find out if it may, not to make it happen at any cost.
7. If you are afraid to lose the money you spend, do not even start writing.

[lonedrake]

 Here is my analogy to this.

   Maybe companies should also change their hiring practices. Only hire employees with a lengthy criminal history. Eventually they will find someone who is a good employee.

[alex330]

I thought about this after you brought it up Jone, and the PPL sites are definitely a viable option if you are willing to navigate through the obstacles and be willing to gamble a little money. It is definitely not the best approach for everyone, but can work.

The answer to what to do is simple: cut out the middle (wo)man as fast as possible.

It really does not matter how you get in to contact, as long as the contact is direct.
We have a majow advertiser here who has a lack of available men, contrary to other sites where a lack of available women is present.

A man needs to do several things to watch his wallet:
1. Do not react to every letter you receive. Instead send out your own to the profiles that interest you. Most women are like Galyna, and expect the man to make the move.
2. Keep communication as short as possible in number of letters. If you have to pay for direct contact, remember the amount is minor compared to what you will spend on a trip and close to zero on what you spend if you find someone you will marry.
3. Arrange your own trip. Unless she is living in the outskirts of Kemorovo there will be a local business renting out apartments. Our list of service providers is a good start.
4. If you really have to date someone you do not share a common language with, find your own translator. Once again the list of service providers can help.
5. Stop thinking about money. If you have to count every dime, you can probably not afford the whole process anyway and are best diverted back to local women, or virtual girlfriends.
6. Never ever make a first visit with the intention to get engaged or married to the woman you are visiting. It may happen or it may not. Your object is to find out if it may, not to make it happen at any cost.
7. If you are afraid to lose the money you spend, do not even start writing.

Shadow has excellent advice. Another couple suggestions.

8. Try to use the chat or video chat features on these sites rather than the letters. You never know who is behind the letters, but many times the chats are the actual woman. She is probably just working and may have a boyfriend, but treat it more like talking to a bartender. The video chats give you more info (whether she is juggling multiple chats, facial expressions, etc) and verifies it is actually the woman.
9. As shadow said keep communication short and simple. Do not spend too much time writing letters or chatting. Make an impression and go visit. Even if you just make friends with the woman she has many friends at the agency. Once you have broken through the agency firewall it is very easy to meet women.
10. Be honest with yourself and pursue women that are close to your league.
11. Visit multiple women with this method. Even if you just made friends with them on the site, they can show you around and begin to introduce you.
12. Be prepared to spend a little more money as Shadow mentioned. In the end it is nothing compared to what lies ahead.

Edit - 13. No gifts when you visit. Maybe something small and simple, but these women are flooded with gifts and I do not believe it helps you with a sincere woman.

[Brianinaz]

I would add: Don't use a site/agency where you can't get/buy direct contact information. Make sure when you visit you are able to use your own interpreter.

[Shadow]

Shadow has excellent advice. Another couple suggestions.

8. Try to use the chat or video chat features on these sites rather than the letters. You never know who is behind the letters, but many times the chats are the actual woman. She is probably just working and may have a boyfriend, but treat it more like talking to a bartender. The video chats give you more info (whether she is juggling multiple chats, facial expressions, etc) and verifies it is actually the woman.

Unfortunately I can not support this 100%. I have knowledge of several low-cost programs that show a woman typing including her reacting on facial expressions and making moves/gestures. For the adult industry they can even go far beyond that.
While I have not done exploration in to that market, software on a professional level or even the free program with an experienced operator might fool you in to thinking there is a woman sitting behind the camera, while Fat Yuri is smiling behind the screen.

[alex330]

Unfortunately I can not support this 100%. I have knowledge of several low-cost programs that show a woman typing including her reacting on facial expressions and making moves/gestures.

Interesting, I was not aware of this. Another hurdle to deal with I guess.

[Shadow]

Interesting, I was not aware of this. Another hurdle to deal with I guess.

Observation, having to do research for business and contact to 'malicious' teenagers can teach you a lot 

[Daveman]

There's always the Kievstar method... he advocated not writing any letters at all but just to show up at the local agency office, make friendly with the staff first and go from there.  Makes a good bit of sense to me.

[alex330]

There's always the Kievstar method... he advocated not writing any letters at all but just to show up at the local agency office, make friendly with the staff first and go from there.  Makes a good bit of sense to me.

Yes, sounds like another good method if you have some time to spend visiting. I would have to agree there is no better way than to be there on the ground.

Some agencies do not have actual offices or the girls work from home though. Some agencies have offices but tend to move them around frequently in order to avoid paying taxes like my wife's former boss. I am not sure these types of agencies are open to walk ins.