Yulia might go ??

[ML]

Tymoshenko is likely to be in relatively good spirits after hearing Thursday’s (18 October 2013) news that her bitter rival, President Viktor Yanukovich, will sign yet-to-be adopted legislation letting her go to Germany for medical treatment. The news was confirmed on the president’s website.
This, Yanukovich’s first public statement of his intention to let Tymoshenko travel abroad on certain terms, will have gone down well at the EU, too. Brussels has been critical of Ukraine’s “selective justice” since the former prime minister was convicted in 2011 on charges of abuse of office. It says a broader rollback of democracy jeopardizes Kiev’s chances of signing planned association and free trade agreements at a November summit.
Signing the historic and agreements would help to anchor Kiev firmly with the west, loosening Moscow’s pull over its affairs.
The focus now moves to parliament, where opposition and pro-presidential lawmakers are squabbling over details of the proposed legislation. Some Yanukovich allies say legislation allowing Tymoshenko to go to Germany for medical treatment should ensure she serves the rest of her 7-year prison term on her return to Ukraine. Opposition politicians are pushing for a pardon, allowing their leader to return to politics and challenge Yanukovich as campaigning begins next year for the 2015 presidential election.
Meanwhile the clock is ticking, bringing any resolution too close for comfort to the late November summit in Vilnius where, it is hoped, the agreements will be signed.


http://blogs.ft.com/beyond-brics/2013/10/18/ukraine-this-week-good-for-tymoshenko-bad-for-investors/?#axzz2i6952A9m

[lordtiberius]

FREEDOM!!!!!!!

[JohnDearGreen]

Elections would be better off without her.  There is a new leader in the polls.
http://www.democracychronicles.com/ukraine-opposition-presidential/

[Boethius]

LT, please do not compare that drug addicted common thief with William Wallace.


I've seen Klitschko interviews in Ukrainian.  He is not the sharpest blade in the drawer.

[lordtiberius]

I love Mel.

Jailing someone for saying "I disagree" makes you a joke which Yanokovych is.  Ukraine is the only European country that doesn't prosecute rape.

I hope Julia returns to rule.

[Boethius]

Tymoshenko was jailed for theft.  There is substantial evidence of her guilt, as I have posted previously.

[Shadow]

Tymoshenko was jailed for theft.  There is substantial evidence of her guilt, as I have posted previously.

Do not even bother. If someone is labeled as pro-Russian they are part of the Evil empire, and according to action movie rules anyone who disagrees with them is a hero. Regardless if they are thieves and murdered, as any deed that opposes Evil is deemed to be for the Greater Good.

[BillyB]

I've seen Klitschko interviews in Ukrainian.  He is not the sharpest blade in the drawer.

 
If the intelligent people elected in Ukraine aren't getting the job done, I'm not surprised if the not so smart people who shows they care about Ukraine win some elections.

[lordtiberius]

She is no more a criminal than you. The wet behind the years paid man in judicial robes didn't even allow her to defend herself.  She is a political prisoner and its a blight on the Western conscience that the diplomatic community hasn't offered her asylum already.

[Shadow]

She is no more a criminal than you. The wet behind the years paid man in judicial robes didn't even allow her to defend herself.  She is a political prisoner and its a blight on the Western conscience that the diplomatic community hasn't offered her asylum already.

I have got a bidge to sell.

[Boethius]

Exactly, Shadow.


LT, how do you think Tymoshenko became a billionaire?  She even had the chutzpah to steal from the Russian state (from crooked generals).  How do you think her half billion dollar debt to Russia disappeared without her paying a single kopeck?

[Daveman]

If you are wondering if a politician is a criminal you only need ask one question... nevermind.. you already have the answer.

[lordtiberius]

What you have given is not evidence but opinions and theories.  You do not deny that she was not able to defend herself at her own trial.  Gimme a break.  If it wasn't for Yulia Timashenko there would be no Orange Revolution.  Her imprisonment is a national stain.

[Boethius]

No, there would have been no Orange Revolution without the CIA and US NGO's.


http://www.antiwar.com/paul/?articleid=4135


http://www.utsandiego.com/uniontrib/20041211/news_1n11usaid.html


I, unlike you, followed the trial in real time.  In Ukrainian.  To state it was unfair is inaccurate.

[Boethius]

I posted this history elsewhere some time ago, but will repeat it here, as it is a summary of Tymoshenko's thievery.  -


In the 1990's, Tymoshenko ran the United Energy System of Ukraine.  She was a protege of Pavel Lazarenko, who started the company.  It was a state owned company for distribution of gas in Ukraine.  Lazarenko basically stole and privatized it.  As PM, he could not run it.

Lazarenko eventually was arrested for theft and money laundering.  He fled Ukraine to the US, where he faced trial for money laundering and now sits in a US jail.*  He will be extradited to Ukraine to face charges when released.  As an aside, Lazarenko made the mistake of signing documents, making his arrest easier.  That is a mistake Tymoshenko learned from, and while there was much oral testimony on her orders, she was very astute in not leaving a direct paper trail.

So, at the time Tymoshenko ran UES, she made a deal with Russian Ministry of Defence generals.  Russia would supply gas to UES in exchange for goods for the Defence Ministry - furniture, antiques, etc.  Tymoshenko did not fulfill her side of the bargain.  The gas the Russian generals supplied to UES was stolen.  The Russian government eventually arrested and tried the generals, and issued an arrest warrant (through Interpol) for Tymoshenko for the theft of $500 million of gas. 

Tymoshenko, faced with extradition to Russia, became more involved politically.  As PM, she could not be arrested in Russia.  However, the Russian government said they would be looking for the $500 million, plus interest. 

Years pass.  The gas wars begin.  At that time, Ukraine had a preferential, locked in contract with Russia.  They received gas at a price of about $50 per cubic meter.  The world price was nine times that.  The Ukrainian people were paying $50, but a percentage of the gas was being siphoned and stored.  Then, Yushchenko went to Russia to renegotiate the contract, AT A HIGHER RATE.  Odd, huh?  Well, yes, of course.  The objective was to start a "gas war" (At the time, the press was full of stories of Russia wanting a higher rate, but that is not fully accurate.)  Ukraine shuts down the pipeline for gas, and stored gas is then sold by Ukraine to the EU at the going world rate of close to $500 per cubic meter.  The profit was split among politicians (Tymoshenko was not among them, she was never part of this scheme).

Seeing what was happening, and knowing who was profiting, Tymoshenko then went to Moscow to renegotiate the contract for gas.  Yushchenko said he would not sign the contract she negotiated, and the Rada did not ratify it.   But, when that contract was signed, Tymoshenko's $465 million debt to Russia "disappeared".  Ukrainians paid for that gas all year.  Granted, it was at then market prices (over $400 per cubic meter), but this superseded a contract that provided gas at almost 1/10 the price.  The contract also granted concessions over the Black Sea Fleet to Russia, something which foments discord within Ukraine's borders for a variety of reasons.

Now, in the West, Tymoshenko's actions are seen as trying to cut Firtash out of the supply of gas (his company was the middleman between Russia and Ukraine).  But that is inaccurate.  When gas was sold to the EU, gas Firtash's company had also paid for was sold, by force, as well.  Firtash took the Ukrainian government to an international arbitration (in Switzerland) on this, and won.  Firtash did not have a big role in any of this, other than as a supplier of gas.

When Yanukovich was elected, and started to make pronouncement on signing international treaties, such as on transparency and money laundering (which the Orangistas had refused to do), all hell broke loose.  More than one Orangista "secretary/advisor" etc.  was caught at the border with cashier cheques in nine figure sums, the largest I recall being 125 million euros, being transported by a former plumber who worked for Yushchenko  (Yushchenko's "advisor", Baloga, now minister of emergency situations).  There have also been some stopped with suitcases with millions of Euros/US dollars.  All of this is gas money, with gas the Ukrainian people paid for, sold to the EU by individuals, at a profit they pocketed.

All of the above is based on paper trails, so it is accurate.  My sense (just a sense, there is no proof) re the West is they don't want a lot of this paper released, because some of this was put together based on Western intelligence sources.  Some of that information was contained in the wikileaks documents, but most was not.  I think Western governments do not want their documents becoming part of the public domain (this is the only part of the above that is not "provable" by independent, verified sources).

Throughout her term in office, Tymoshenko stated she owned no property, and was practically destitute.  She paid no taxes.  Her mansion is owned by someone else.  She claimed she owns only her original Soviet era apartment.  But during her trial, her VISA bill was released, showing in less than a year, after her renegotiation of the gas contract, Tymoshenko  personally spent over $1 million in Moscow alone.


*Since the original posting of this synopsis, Lazarenko has been released from prison in the U.S.


Oh, and BTW, here is a good analysis from the period:

http://original.antiwar.com/justin/2004/11/29/the-yushchenko-mythos/

[lordtiberius]

Yanokovych has a very articulate advocate on this forum.

[Boethius]

You need to go back and read some of my posts.  I did not support Yanukovych, and I happen to be a pro Ukrainian language advocate.  However, he has surprised me, to some degree, in terms of the progress his government has made in spheres such as money laundering and adhereing to EU principles on banking.  Is his government completely honest?  No, of course not.  His son has profited from Yanukovich's presidency, and he has an imperial style which most Western leaders do not.  However, the large scale theft that occurred under Yushchenko has not occurred under Yanukovych.

[lordtiberius]

You didn't support Yanokovych then but you do now.  Ah ok

Looked at your source material, do you belong to the lawyer's guild and other pro   communist or OWS organizations too?

[Boethius]

I never posted I support Yanukovych.


Given I am a direct victim of communism, and you are not, knock it off.

[lordtiberius]

But you do support Yanokovych now.  You posted a pro-Yanokovych article penned by Ron Paul.

I live in Barack Obama's America.  I know a few things about communism. 

That said the rap sheet on Obama trumps anything you accused Yulia of doing.

[Shadow]

What you have given is not evidence but opinions and theories.  You do not deny that she was not able to defend herself at her own trial.  Gimme a break.  If it wasn't for Yulia Timashenko there would be no Orange Revolution.  Her imprisonment is a national stain.

If the Dutch National Football Team would have done better that year at the European Championship, there would not have been an Orange revolution.
As they totally failed, someone needed to find a market for a lot of orange fan materials.

[Boethius]

But you do support Yanokovych now.  You posted a pro-Yanokovych article penned by Ron Paul.

The article by Ron Paul was not pro Yanukovich.  In fact, Mr. Paul made a point to note he didn't support either candidate.  His objection was to American taxpayer money being used to influence the presidential result in another country.

[BillyB]

Mr. Paul made a point to note he didn't support either candidate.  His objection was to American taxpayer money being used to influence the presidential result in another country.

 
I'd have more respect for him if he called for all people's, including Russia's, taxpayer money not to be used to influence in other country's elections.

[Muzh]

I still say Yanukonvikt is a thug and a goon exploiting Ukraine, however, I have to admit that he held the "line" when Putina thought he could absorb Ukraine. I think Goldilocks would have take the first deal from Putina and sell her 'Motherland' to him. She is such a whore.
 
Regardless, Ukraine is being consumed by this cancer and it sees no way out. Unless...
 
Anyway Boe, why are you arguing with the clown? Specially when he is not taking his medication.

[Daveman]

If the Dutch National Football Team would have done better that year at the European Championship, there would not have been an Orange revolution.
As they totally failed, someone needed to find a market for a lot of orange fan materials.

HAH! 


The Dutch influence and imperialism still going strong!