Dont Believe The Lies About Foreign Brides

[JayH]

Interesting article that seems to fly in the face of the often seen comments.

http://returnofkings.com/4658/dont-believe-the-lies-about-foreign-brides




85%  of marriages succeed  !!

[Welder]

ROK, seriously?  Good Lord what's next, lessons from Roosh?

[TomT]

The claims of an 80% success rate are ridiculous unless one defines "success" as still being married when the ten-year Green Card comes in the mail.

[Daveman]

The claims of an 80% success rate are ridiculous unless one defines "success" as still being married when the ten-year Green Card comes in the mail.

I think it may not be incredibly far from a reflection of reality if ALL nationalities of international marriages are taken into account, as is indicated by his reference to the Swiss.  Still seems high though. 


The cross cultural survey (2008, pre bubble pop) indicates a percentage over 50
http://www.goodwife.com/survey/xcultural_p15.html


With these participating agencies whose members were surveyed...
http://www.goodwife.com/survey/xcultural_p05.html


One thing that may be responsible for the percentage rising over the years is the strengthening of the foreign economies relative to the US.  This condition alone would eliminate a good percentage of the very questionable marriages, e.g., "gimme a mule, any mule...", and perhaps slowed down divorces (merely a wild guess as a possibility).


Also, a good read related to statistical data manipulation is Proofiness The Dark Arts of Mathematical Deception by Charles Seife.

[TomT]

The problem with this type of survey is that those who fail are less likely to hang around to be counted than those who succeed.

[Daveman]

The problem with this type of survey is that those who fail are less likely to hang around to be counted than those who succeed.

True.  This potential flaw may be mitigated with due diligence and higher numeric samples, but always remains a question.

[GQBlues]

I have seen the graphic art used for this column before. I thought, and I may well be mistaken, it belonged to Manny. But that's neither here or there...

As for the topic, one should first consider when they speak of MOB, one needs to remember there are more than a few nations involved in this. AM/FSU is but one of the marriages involved, and as the more recent data shows, that sector represents only 10% of the K-visa that entered into the US - the largest being US/Asia with marriages between US citizens and the Philippines being the largest of the group.

http://travel.state.gov/visa/statistics/nivstats/nivstats_4582.html

*In the middle of the page, titled: Nonimmigrant Visa Issuances by Visa Class and by Nationality. It should open on excel format::::

To note of interest, there's also a data count of visa refusal by country and see the refusal rate per country on K- visas relative to the approval rate, then ensuing acceptance rate change due to waivers:::*


Having said that, most of the K-marriages from the US/Philippines comprised of ex-pats going back 'home' to seek a partner and when marriages take place, considering the divorce rate in the Philippines between Filipinos is one of the lowest in the world - if not the lowest; tends to explain the relatively 'lower' projected divorce rate in the MOB overall.

Therefore, any information resulting from this study should be carefully evaluated by each individual union and where they fall on in the respective groupings.

[LiveFromUkraine]

considering the divorce rate in the Philippines between Filipinos is one of the lowest in the world - if not the lowest;

 I was under the impression that divorce was illegal in the Philippines.  The only situation where it would be legal would be where the Western partner, who is married to a Filipino, had to initiate divorce first before it would be considered valid in the Philippines. 


Am I mistaken in this (which is entirely possible)?

[GQBlues]

LFU-

I've been far too removed from most of the events in the PI. What I do remember is that it is/was in fact against the law to divorce. But there's also the underlying fact that most Filipinos are Catholics and religion play a vital force in marriages. When I left the country as a child, what I remember was *virginity* was still largely deemed sacred. Had they've been 'liberal' since that time, I can only guess. Thus, at the time, being married to a non-virgin would be deemed a disgrace to the family and community and may have legitimate grounds for annulment.

How that is projected through international marriages only leaves me to believe that those married to Filipinos abroad would observe what is traditionally normal in their home country, while those married to non-Filipinos would likely be dictated by that person's values (non-Filipino).

[LiveFromUkraine]

LFU-

I've been far too removed from most of the events in the PI. What I do remember is that it is/was in fact against the law to divorce. But there's also the underlying fact that most Filipinos are Catholics and religion play a vital force in marriages. When I left the country as a child, what I remember was *virginity* was still largely deemed sacred. Had they've been 'liberal' since that time, I can only guess. Thus, at the time, being married to a non-virgin would be deemed a disgrace to the family and community and may have legitimate grounds for annulment.

How that is projected through international marriages only leaves me to believe that those married to Filipinos abroad would observe what is traditionally normal in their home country, while those married to non-Filipinos would likely be dictated by that person's values (non-Filipino).

It seems the church is still a major force in the country.  There was a divorce bill trying to get pushed through but it ended up getting defeated.  The idea that it was even attempted shows things are moving in a different direction away from the church.



I like to visit a Philippine expat forum since I am interested in visiting. 


Like a lot of forums, I try to cut through the bs which can be difficult.  According to some, on that forum, the men are womanizing drunkards who tend to sit around all day.  Sound familiar?  haha  This seems to be a epidemic of worldwide proportions.


You can still read the same type of stories, on that forum, that you read here.  It is kind of amazing how similar those stories are.

[tfcrew]

ROK, seriously?  Good Lord what's next, lessons from Roosh?

DITTOS
  Site has no links in support of their own claims.

[Slumba]

It seems the church is still a major force in the country.  There was a divorce bill trying to get pushed through but it ended up getting defeated.  The idea that it was even attempted shows things are moving in a different direction away from the church.

I like to visit a Philippine expat forum since I am interested in visiting. 

Like a lot of forums, I try to cut through the bs which can be difficult.  According to some, on that forum, the men are womanizing drunkards who tend to sit around all day.  Sound familiar?  haha  This seems to be a epidemic of worldwide proportions.


You can still read the same type of stories, on that forum, that you read here.  It is kind of amazing how similar those stories are.

There are PLENTY of non-virgins getting married.  Partner count in some cases, would be lower than in the USA.

Once a man reaches a certain social station in life, or has a certain amount of money, it is completely normal and expected that he will have a mistress.  And if he has children with that mistress, they are called "second family". 

So prevalent is mistress-ing in the Phils that the government passed a law a number of years ago laying out the limitations under which a child can use his/her father's last name instead of the mother's should they so choose.

Although Chinese culture is different, you could read The Good Earth by Pearl S. Buck and note the way women are treated in it. I think there is a saying that is used in the book, "women are blades of grass for men to step on" that reflects the lower level that women are placed at during that time.

[Boethius]

most of the K-marriages from the US/Philippines comprised of ex-pats going back 'home' to seek a partner and when marriages take place, considering the divorce rate in the Philippines between Filipinos is one of the lowest in the world - if not the lowest; tends to explain the relatively 'lower' projected divorce rate in the MOB overall.

From what I have observed, single Filipinos usually have a sweetheart who is also either working abroad, or is in the Philippines, and they will sponsor their sweetheart once they have obtained citizenship.  So, in addition to being from a culture in which divorce is rare, the person emigrating is not a "MOB", but someone known to the sponsor and his/her family. 

I know three Filipina women here who sponsored their fiances to Canada, as it was easier for women to enter Canada as caregivers than for men to emigrate, but that is changing.  In each case, the fiance was working in the Middle East.

[GQBlues]

It seems the church is still a major force in the country.  There was a divorce bill trying to get pushed through but it ended up getting defeated.  The idea that it was even attempted shows things are moving in a different direction away from the church....

That may well be the case, LFU. I was recently a 'silent' partner to an established call center in Manila. It was established by my ex-accountant that is a US-born Filipino. He and another bud would always travel to the PI for months on in before, during and after the business establishment. All of this was happening just prior to my time in Slovakia/CR and Russia.

But they did have stories to share everytime and they were telling me that I was missing some zany times there, LOL. So presumably, much indeed may have change in the islands than what I remember. I won't be surpised if so as just like any other Asian country, much of the western lifestyle, especially the US, are largely emulated if not downright adopted.

From what I have observed, single Filipinos usually have a sweetheart who is also either working abroad, or is in the Philippines, and they will sponsor their sweetheart once they have obtained citizenship.  So, in addition to being from a culture in which divorce is rare, the person emigrating is not a "MOB", but someone known to the sponsor and his/her family. 

I know three Filipina women here who sponsored their fiances to Canada, as it was easier for women to enter Canada as caregivers than for men to emigrate, but that is changing.  In each case, the fiance was working in the Middle East.

That's still a major practice even here in SoCal.

A friend's older brother married one who was the niece of a family friend just recently. I also have a boyhood friend (caucasian) I used to surf with all the time who met a Filipina who was working for PAL (Philippine Airline) when she had a layover and they 'dated' for a while (he'd fly there to see her and surf, or she'd see him when she's in town). Ultimately they married and are still married after 11 years. I think he married her so he can fly cheap to PI and surf (j/k). At least that's what we tell him. Anyway, they have one kid now, 2 years old. Dark hair with deep blue eyes. He'd be a hang-banging surfer stud given a few more years.

Another incidence was when we entered a 'Filipino-only' B-Ball league but wanted to get one of our bud to play with us who was not Filipino. So we used the league's exception and that was, a person need to be married to a Filipina to enable him to join. We arrange one of the guy's cousin to be his quasi-wife (ring and all) and got him in. LOL. The suckers met and actually fell head-over-heels in love with each other. He quit the team midway because she had to leave and he wanted to follow her to the PI . #!#@! ungracious dude. Men.

But yes, what you describe happens all the time. Unfortunately they will still fall into the K-visa category and a casual look at the data, one automatically presume these are MOB-related.

There are a couple more from my social circle who accidentally met and closed the deal.

[lonedrake]

I also know that these women tend to be far more logical than the degenerate whores Western men deal with on a daily basis too

 When I see this...it makes it very difficult to take what he writes seriously.....or believe any of it....even if by chance is true.

[Ooooops]

Countries where divorce is frown upon will have lowest rate of it, duh!  Which doesn't mean that everybody is happily married, it just means that there is no way out.     

[Slumba]

When I see this...it makes it very difficult to take what he writes seriously.....or believe any of it....even if by chance is true.

I wouldn't paint with a broad brush.  However I would say about 50% of the FSUW I met on a recent trip, were decidedly far more in control of their emotions and were almost Spock-like in their application of logic.

[Anotherkiwi]

Countries where divorce is frown upon will have lowest rate of it, duh!  Which doesn't mean that everybody is happily married, it just means that there is no way out. 

Which is why my youngest brother, who lives in Ireland, had to wait until 2007 to marry his lovely sweetheart, who had been waiting more than 10 years for divorce in Ireland to become a fact of life and allow her to become legally single again.

[JayH]

I wouldn't paint with a broad brush.  However I would say about 50% of the FSUW I met on a recent trip, were decidedly far more in control of their emotions and were almost Spock-like in their application of logic.

That is FSUW equivalent of Oriental inscrutability  !!

[ML]

I wouldn't paint with a broad brush.  However I would say about 50% of the FSUW I met on a recent trip, were decidedly far more in control of their emotions and were almost Spock-like in their application of logic.

I have met hundreds of FSU men and women.  Very rare is the application of logic.

[Muzh]

I have met hundreds of FSU men and women.  Very rare is the application of logic.

Heh. Let him believe what he wants to believe.

[GQBlues]

Hard to imagine the prevalence of logic to stem from culturally superstitious minds.

[Boethius]

The better half has a very logical mind. 


Blues Fairy, a RW who used to post here also was very logical.

[JayH]

I have met hundreds of FSU men and women.  Very rare is the application of logic.

No--the logic is simply "different" to how you see the logic.

[lonedrake]

I guess I should be more clear. It had nothing to do with logic....but rather this.

degenerate whores Western men deal with on a daily basis too

 Its just not true. I am currently working in Minneapolis and I deal with women on a daily basis and it is rare to meet one that is even close to this. Granted 95% are married....but in almost all cases they are pleasant to be around and in almost every instance i like them and respect them. They are certainly not degenerates or whores.