Trip Report, St. Petersburg

[BC]

Not calling any names here but might want to look up co-dependency with google to see if it might apply somewhere in your relationship.

I think many seekers could possibly benefit reviewing the symptoms.

[Sohkay]

Al,
I second Shadow's post. It's just not there. And I'll be even more honest with you. You appear too anxious to hook up. You appear desperate. You've GOT to get that behavior/mindset under control before you can have a healthy functional relationship...whether it is an AW, RW, UW or whateverW.

What does your gut tell you about this relationship?

[jb]

Jumping on the bandwagon here, I think Shadow has the right of it.  This relationship has a long way to go before winning the "Good House Keeping" seal of approval.  The problems will be exacerbated by the long period of separation because Al can't get more vacation time for further visits.  Unless the woman is truly smitten with Cupid's arrow, and nothing Al has written shows that happened, she will slip away. A weeks worth of romance is just too tenuous to be left to rot and whither on the vine for a year.  I'm not a betting man, but if I were this would not be my odds on favorite.

[catzenmouse]

I also agree with Shadow, BC, Sohkay, and jb here. Bandwagon is getting a bit crowded here...

In the end it is up to you Al as to how to continue or not. I think that if you really step back and look at this realistically you will know what the answer is.

Ken

[BillyB]

Bandwagon is getting a bit crowded here...

Any room for me?¦nbsp;

Al-c, When I first visited my fiancee, she paid a doctor for a sick note so she could get time off work for my visit. She paid for my first meal at the cafe since I haven't been to the money exchange yet. It cost her money for my visit and if things didn't work out, she would've been out about $50 dollars I estimate. She INVESTED in our relationship and was a great hostess. When you invest time, money and effort into anything, there is a good chance that you want success! I don't see much investment on her part. It disturbs me that you haven't received a letter yet from your woman. That shows a lack of concern for your welfare. My fiancee always has a letter waiting for me before I arrive home asking if I made it home safely.

One more thing Al-c. NEVER send a 6 page letter to these women. Wise people try to get their point across in as few words as possible. It is not courteous to make someone read all that. And finally, when good or bad emotions are overwhelming you, give it some time to settle. I guarantee if you re-read that letter a week from now, you will realize it was a mistake to have sent all that. I never send more than one page to any woman to read.

[catzenmouse]

It disturbs me that you haven't received a letter yet from your woman. That shows a lack of concern for your welfare. My fiancee always has a letter waiting for me before I arrive home asking if I made it home safely.

 This is a big indication of her feelings, IMO. When I first got back from meeting Elena she called me at work the next day (yes, I was a big dummy for not scheduling a day off after getting back on a Sunday evening, talk about brain damaged!) just to check up on me. Really said something to me that she did that.

Ken

[al-c]

Is this better?



The other photos were group shots.  My avatar was a cropped shot of a larger group picture.  This shot is genuinely of only us.

But yes I agree that her lack of communication is not a good sign.  It was not, however, 6 pages of wordiness.  All of it said a great deal of things, including things about my life she never bothered to ask.  I asked her when I was there if she had any questions about my life, and she said "no", insisting that she already had it all figured out, when she knew almost nothing about it.

I will keep you posted, and I still owe you all a report on other aspects of my trip, which is still coming.

[Sohkay]

Al,
You wrote, "I asked her when I was there if she had any questions about my life, and she said "no", insisting that she already had it all figured out, when she knew almost nothing about it."

I'm actually a little speechless right now.

Wow.

Wow.

[BC]

al,

Judging from the pic she is not into you.

[BillyB]

Is this better?



But yes I agree that her lack of communication is not a good sign.  It was not, however, 6 pages of wordiness.  All of it said a great deal of things, including things about my life she never bothered to ask.  I asked her when I was there if she had any questions about my life, and she said "no", insisting that she already had it all figured out, when she knew almost nothing about it.

Give it some time Al-c. You will agree that what you told about your life in that letter wasn't neccessary. I know you want to open yourself to her freely but if she doesn't have a real interest about your life, she will not receive well what you say. In other words, you wasted time typing. Trying to express yourself too much can be determined on her part as desperation. Trust me on this. Let women come to you. Most  men need to feel wanted though we don't admit it but you have to let the woman herself express her need of you. If a RW likes you, you will know it. As of now, you don't know it. Keep other options open.

Thanks for the photo and continuing your trip report.

[jb]

Al-c,

I hope I can say this in a diplomatic way, but I showed this picture to my wife and her reaction was not good.  First she said that you are a very nice looking, even distinguished and handsome man.  Then she studied the woman, Olga,,, and said simply, this man, Al-c, could do a lot better than her, she's not good looking at all and she does not have an intelligent face.

My wife is rarely wrong in these matters, perhaps you should shop around a bit.  There are many fish n the sea, find one who is really into you and stop worrying about the small stuff.

[Zhena]

Honestly,I didnt read Al-cs report but read the last comments and quite understood what about its here.
You expressed yourself as much as you could but she didnt. Also ,she doesnt write to you when you get home. Of course,its not good,but...
For example me never wrote the letters-I am not strong in it. But I can chat and get much more info from it...I can feel a person. If you will ask me to write a letter-I dont know what about to write People are different. I suppose,your girl is not an extravert. Also she doesnt know from what to start as its something new for her. Another menthality etc. I suppose also that shes not too muc after you RIGHT NOW-not yet. She needs a time. She didnt understand you yet. If you like her-continue to write to her-not too big letters,about 1 page will be good. If after some time you wont feel that she answers-look for another girl. There are many of them. IMHO.

[BC]

fiancee... a quick call to make sure he made it home ok would be in order... or? .. much better than silence.

[Zhena]

fiancee... a quick call to make sure he made it home ok would be in order... or? .. much better than silence.

totally agree-but dont want to piss off a guy before a time.

[Sohkay]

Off topic, for just a moment.

a fiancee'...you are a beautiful slavic woman. Do you have a man in your life? I assume from your name that you are engaged to be married, yes?

[Vaughn]

jb: "I hope I can say this in a diplomatic way.....she's not good looking at all and she does not have an intelligent face."

  Keep hoping. There are a dozen reasons why I know al-c should move on
immediately, but someone else's assessment of her physical appearance
is not among them.

Vaughn

[Killer-B]

Al, since there's no room left on the bandwagon, I just follow behind and clean up the horse shit

BillyB - I disagree about a well written and articulate letter - and if it happens to be 6 pages... She would be lucky to have a guy that's willing to invest that kind of time in "getting to know her"...  If it's 6 pages of dribble and demands and the likes, then I'm with ya - I think every woman (and man for that matter) is different - One gal in Odessa used to stay up till 2 in the morning handwriting me 4 page letters - I was flattered... She really wanted to "know me"... and I her... It CAN be a good thing (vs. the one liner "thanks for the flowers")  LOL

As to appearance - I don't have a dog in this fight - but Vaughn, I think the poster was ORIGINALLY referring to her body language... Al-C is definitely digging on her - and "leaning" into her... OTOH She is giving us the "let's get this over with ASAP!!!" look... But agree that ones "appearance" (as to whether she's "attractive" or not) is irrelevant...

I can't believe I'm about to say this... But Al, you've been home now what - about 5 days? She's not making the effort man! - I sensing another photoguy in the making!  ... I pray that's not the case!! Listen to these guys - A pic is worth a 1000 words.

Just my $.02 cents

Good luck!

KB

[Jet]

Don't worry about walking behind Killer, I'll go ahead and hook up a trailer to the bandwagon so we can all fit 

BillyB - I disagree about a well written and articulate letter - and if it happens to be 6 pages... She would be lucky to have a guy that's willing to invest that kind of time in "getting to know her

Killer,
I'm going to side with Billy here and I'm basing it on personal experience as well as the knowledge I've gained hanging around these forums since 2002. If she's not interested, the 6 pages will never get read; if her language skills are not at least 4/5, it'll never get read. If she "never bothered to ask" then it's not important to offer at this point. Common courtesy also dictates that a letter be no longer than 2 pages MAXIMUM. If you have more to say than that, break it down into several installments over a period of time.

OTOH She is giving us the "let's get this over with ASAP!!!" look...

That is EXACTLY the first impression I got. There can be a wide variety of reasons a photo turns out sub-par (wind,sun in her eyes, etc...) but if this is one of the better shots Al-c has, sadly the body language speaks volumes.

As others have already attested, my wife ALWAYS called to make sure I arrived home safely, every trip and especially the first one. She made $100 a month, but it was IMPORTANT to her to find out that I was back on the ground safely, even if the Int'l call was expensive.

Al-C,
I know this has got to be feeling a little like "dogpile on the rabbit" right now, and I'd like to commend you for sharing your adventure even though the responses may be difficult to stomach. In the end you have to do what you think is right for you, but understand that the guys on the outside looking in are trying to objectively put your best interest first based on the information you've provided us with. Personally nothing would make me happier than for every first meeting to lead to the happiness that I've come to know through my marriage to a Russian Woman, but unfortunately it's not always the case. Trying to "shoehorn" a fit that isn't really there, will make the discomfort you feel whilst reading these negative responses seem very tame by comparison. If right now in your heart you're not absolutely sure she's "into you" then you can be sure that she's NOT.

[catzenmouse]

Al,

 You've gotten (IMO) some excellent responses here. So for what it may be worth I hope that you can take some time to do an unbiased and deeply serious look at the actions and reactions of you and her during your trip (and now) as well as re-evaluating what you truly want and need for your future health and happiness. To go into any relationship with any color flags but green increases the chances for difficulties and/or failure. My impression of your posts here is that there are some flags here that deserve a second, third, and fourth look.

 I don't know if you are in contact with any of the members here with whom you can have a heart-to-heart with but if you are it may be a very good sounding board and reality check to help clear the way to some big decisions.

 Ken

[Jumper]

al-
you had a medicro trip, and are probably feeling  a bit beat up from the advice and opinions here.Hey only you (and her) really know how you two interacted ,and if there is any need to carry on with a relationship of any kind.
but certainly from what you provided
 there was a case of you being into her even before arrival,,
and even thinking about commitment, and K1 !!
and her just meeting a man for the first time,because it would be interesting,
but  that she isnt sure she is into.
you had what would seem a normal experience for that scenerio..??
even the "fight"
which by the way lets you learn how the two of you resolve problems so is a good thing actually..
 Anyway, you got exactly what would be expected.???
you simply met someone , and from there can decide if you want to corresponde or see them again.
and they can decide the same.

You are the one who was putting more emphasis into the weeks meeting , than that.

And since you refer to having been thru all this before, it troubles me
why you would go into a meeting with any RW with all this self imposed pressure?
with thoughts of "willingness to spend a lifetime with her" ??
and so she should do this or that?
she "should" do those things if she is into you!!
and I COMPLETELY agree!
but you just met?
 she was at a stage of just geeting to know you, and you were expecting reactions of someone who already *cared*
It's why you became angry if she dint show the same level of interest.

I do think you were putting /feeling the pressure of knowing wether you had a realtionship in this one weeks window of opportunity.
Mostly  because you dont have siufficiant vacation time..

if you honestly had the time to visit every other month,
would you have reacted the same way? or been more likely to simply allow the relationship to develop, or NOT develop ,over time?

The next time you meet a RW (if there is one )
 Why not look at it as just a meeting, if she isnt as interested..fine move on..
 if she is into you, and shows it by her actions,, you have the beginings of something..just like anywhere else in the world.
 
To try and force things because of time /schedule conflict is a road to disaster..IMHO.
and this may come off harsh ,
but honestly it doesnt seem you have the time to develop a long distance relationship..you have a one trip shot per year.. ?

if you DO meet someone, someone special that really shows you genuine interest,, and then it takes a year to meet again,
its no wonder K1 is what is running in your head even before the trip!!!!!!
 That whole mentality frightens me..
and it "seems" you've been down the road before and it dint work.. ???

if you try the same things , the same way,
 and expect different results...

I honestly feel badly for jumping in on this,,since you got beat up already by your RW experince, and the board..

 but look real closely before continuing with-
 not only this woman, but this pursuit..

My lousy advice:
try to keep your expectations of meetings as close to the same as if you met a RW from brighton beach..
yeap really. just like a date with a local lady.

yes she should be nice to you, (not demanding)
yes you should enjoy spending time with each other
(and therfor MAKE time for seeing each other a priority)

yes there should  be clear signals on both sides you really LIKE each other ..
( simply making sure someone got home ok, is normal )

no,she may not have any idea she wants to marry you in that weeks time frame..
and a man  shouldnt be expecting it either!!!

yes there are cases of really hitting it off and KNOWING this is the person you want to marry,  in a week!!
it happens locally too!
but i wouldnt  go into a these type of meetings expecting such!!
 or even hoping for such !!
 you just put too much pressure on an already difficult situation?

[Zhena]

Off topic, for just a moment.

a fiancee'...you are a beautiful slavic woman. Do you have a man in your life? I assume from your name that you are engaged to be married, yes?

Thanks for a compliment-yes ,I am engaged

[Sohkay]

You're welcome.

And this is the question I really wanted to ask. It would be educational for the forum, I believe.

I believe you first posted your photo yesterday. And here is my question.

Since the time you have posted your photo, have you received an increased number of messages and emails from members of this forum?

[Zhena]

Maybe you will be surprised,but honestly-no Only from my fiancee who made me a compliment too

[Sohkay]

I am pleasantly surprised.

Thank you for being open.

The best of luck to the both of you.

[Killer-B]

I HATE when this happens LOL

I'm going to side with Billy here ... If she's not interested, the 6 pages will never get read; if her language skills are not at least 4/5, it'll never get read. If she "never bothered to ask" then it's not important to offer at this point. Common courtesy also dictates that a letter be no longer than 2 pages MAXIMUM. If you have more to say than that, break it down into several installments over a period of time.

Jet - I did not disagree with this - if it was "dribble" or demands... And TOTALLY understand that if she's "tuned out" or is not fluent in English, it will fall on deaf ears (or eyes!) 

My point was, as to the gal in Odessa, her English was fluent - She had a HUGE heart - and really ENJOYED my lengthy missives - And she answered EVERY question and comment into the wee hours of the morning (I laid off after awhile, cuz I felt bad/guilty she was loosing sleep over me!) - But as I also mentioned, not everyone is the "same" - Some want short letters (or no letters) - Others soak up the attention and "interest" - Maybe what I had there in Odessa was more the exception, than the rule?

Point was - we were talking about Al-C, and if he's getting NO response (or interest) then yeah, I concurr that this was a total waste of time -

Peace!

KB-