Why many of us go to FSU to find a wife

[Larry1]

Friends and family have asked me why I decided to go to FSU to find a wife.  At least one FSUW here has asked me the same question.  The short answer is that I found that I could find a nicer, more attractive and slender girl who treated me well and was interested in a long-term relationship leading to marriage in FSU than I could find in the US.

I did online dating in the US and FSU for some years, looking at thousands of profiles and communicating with hundreds of FSUW and thousands of AW.  The difference between the two was huge. The interesting question was why this difference existed.  I came across an interesting blog post that might help to explain why this huge difference exists. It actually only looks at one side of the equation: the dynamics of US online dating.  A guy decided to figure out a few things about online dating in the US (he later expanded his experiment to the UK).  He conducted an experiment by creating ten dummy profiles on OKCupid, a very popular dating site.  Five of these profiles were guys and five were girls, of varying levels of attractiveness.  He attempted to hold everything else about their profiles constant, so that he could discover how much appearance affected the interest the daters' attracted.  Although my experience with online dating confirmed his general findings, even I was shocked by its level:

Cupid on Trial: A 4-month Online Dating Experiment Using 10 Fictional Singletons

Is online dating a different experience for men than it is for women?

To find out, I conducted a 4-month experiment in the US and UK using 10 dummy dating profiles.

The advent of online dating, then, must have seemed like an incredible idea. Whereas in the past the pool of single men a woman could potentially meet and attract was limited by who she happened to physically be around during daily life, now it was exponentially larger. Now the number of men she could date was limited only by how far she would eventually be willing to travel to spend time with them in person. Dozens of suitors turned into thousands, or even millions.

However, things turned out to be more complicated than that. Just as freshly-online businesses, expecting to amass untold fortunes in a new, global market, found themselves in competition with internet businesses that they would never have otherwise had to compete with, so too did online daters face the prospect of having to stand out as special and attractive amongst a much larger pool of singletons than they were used to. Whereas before a man just needed to be the best looking guy at work to get a date with a colleague, now he needed to be in the top 10% of all men to get a date with one of the women in his city.

As you can see from the graph above, the women got many times more messages than the men.

• Each woman received at least one message, but the two best looking women received 581% more messages than the other three combined.

• Only one man received any messages.

... The above graph shows the results after the profiles had spent 168 hours online.

• The most contacted woman had almost 17 times more messages in a week than the most contacted man.

• Three of the men had no messages, despite their profiles being viewed about 25 times between them.

• The women’s messages outnumbered the men’s 17 to 1 (mostly thanks to the two best looking women).

• The two best looking men received 5 fewer messages than the 3rd and 4th best looking women.

In summary, when it comes to receiving unsolicited messages based on gender and photos alone, women wipe the floor with men, and very attractive women sandblast the floor with the fellas. They kill. Their inboxes heave with hellos and how are yous.

http://jonmillward.com/blog/attraction-dating/cupid-on-trial-a-4-month-online-dating-experiment/

If you're interested in this topic I encourage you to read the entire blog post.  The graphics alone convey an interesting story.

The bottom line is that attractive girls receive a staggeringly high level of interest on the online dating sites here.  The result was the same for the UK.

When I was online dating in the US I would sometimes discuss the process with some dates I had.  A number of them mentioned being surprised by how many messages they received when they put up a profile.  After awhile I could predict with decent accuracy how many messages a particular girl would get (2,000, 4,000, 6,000 in a year).  And these were not beautiful girls.  Well, the 6,000/year girl was.

It stands to reason that getting so much attention makes one very picky.  And this was the pattern I found.  After some years I concentrated my attention on girls new to the sites.  Sometimes these girls were recently divorced and new to the online dating world. I noticed that they did not have this tremendous pickiness.  I found that most girls I met on EHarmony likewise did not have this huge pickiness.  I think that's bc EHarmony matches people up and sends them their matches.  Guys can't contact girls on the site (at least that was the way it worked when I used it).

The result of this extreme level of pickiness was that interactions with girls resembled the job interview process rather than a dating and getting to know each other process.  You tried to craft your profile carefully, in order to appeal to girls, like job applicants craft their resumes to appeal to potential employers.  You tried to send an appealing message to a girl so that she would reply and you would have a chance to get to know her.  The opening message corresponds to a cover letter in a job search. It's goal is to get the girl/hiring manager to read your profile/resume.

If you get past this stage you are typically granted a telephone interview with the girl or with the hiring manager in a job search.  If you pass this stage you get a face to face interview/first date.  That's when you have a chance to get more dates, or in the case of a job search a job offer.

But both the hiring manager and the girl from a dating site realizes that they have thousands of other resumes or messages.  So you have to tick every box or you are out.

I have a number of stories from dating here.  People who haven't dated here, or haven't done so since the advent of online dating, find them hard to believe.  Here's one.  A few years ago I met a girl online.  She was 40, had a good job and two kids, was slender and reasonably attractive.  On our first date the topic of "dating tests" came up.  I asked her if she had any.  She responded yes, and that she had ended her last budding relationship because of one.  She was a foodie.  For those of you not from here, a foodie is someone obsessed with food, preparing it, going to good restaurants, etc.  She asked this guy what he would order in a Chinese restaurant (remember, I told you that dates here are often like job interviews; you can't always predict every interview question).  He responded, "almond chicken".  This is a dish that is common in chinese restaurants here.  But this answer resulted in the girl ending things with the guy.  She regarded it as insufficiently culinarily adventurous for her.  I did not make this up!  And it's not an uncommon type of thing when you are online dating here.

I was sufficiently culinarily adventuresome for her but I seemed to have failed some later test.

Another girl I met asked me to answer 6-7 questions before she would even give me her phone number.  These were all essay-type questions.

But getting dates, although not always easy, was not the hardest part of online dating here. I was fortunate bc when I was online dating here I ticked most of the boxes: I was over six feet tall, made a comfortable six-figure income, had a job that was one of the two most appealing to female online daters, and was fairly good-looking, slender, in good shape, and well-dressed. So I had no shortage of dates.  Finding a girl who both treated me well and wanted a long-term relationship with me was the problem. 

So, after a friend of mine related his experience meeting some wonderful FSUW I finally decided to search in FSU.  And never regretted it.

[Vinnvinny]

Larry, I have never been a member of any western dating sites so I didn't read your post in detail as I have no points of reference.

However, I do know that in Ukraine there lots and lots and lots of single and pretty ladies around and where I live there are none. That's why I date there.

[Larry1]

Larry, I have never been a member of any western dating sites so I didn't read your post in detail as I have no points of reference.

However, I do know that in Ukraine there lots and lots and lots of single and pretty ladies around and where I live there are none. That's why I date there.

As usual, Vinny, you take the prize for succinctness and accuracy. You captured in two sentences the essence of what I was trying to describe in many paragraphs.

And congratulations for not wasting years and tens of thousands of dollars/pounds on the Western dating sites.

[I/O]

How much influence on browsers (men and women) does the novelty of chatting up a foreigner have?

[CDW]

That's why I don't look for the hottest possible woman!   Too much competition and I am not interested in wasting my time on them.  These 'hottest' women always keep on looking and look and look until she found Pierce Brosnan / Brad Pitt / Mel Gibson etc.

[Patagonie]

The market mating in europe fits to the stats you gave us.
few attractive ladies flooded with hundreds of mails in the first week. It sticks with what my female friends told me (attractive friends) here in France with the most famous : meeting.
I myself dated on meetic. I can say that i dated the most disabled women statiscally on sites like this one. If i compare to the ones i met usually in my life, the difference was really huge.
The quality was low, and because they were (not beautiful)  just a little more than average they got a lot of attention.
When i compare this world with my last seven years, since i started to really change with the help of the game, i can say there is a huge gap between both. The broken women i met, i met them in these dating sites.
I stoppped to meet on line in my country just after i changed and practiced the game. I applied very specific rules one time to one girl, following some advices from the community. I got an appointement after only few messages. She was very chased. When i met her the excitation falled down very quickly, she was poor and almost out of the society.

As you saw in his trial, even the fattest got 11 messages after 4 months, probably she is a four, maximum, the second one is a five maximum and she got 48 messages, the folllowing one who is not even a seven IMHO got 76 messages.
So in Europe, if you are in the 7+ or 8- you are certain to get few hundreds messages in the month. That is the truth.
It seems to be that it's the same in USA.
I would say that the 7+ and 8- (you would rarely find more than 8- in online dating as 8+ and 9's  DON'T need to go to these sites,  keep barely the same attitude.
The problem is more for all girls in sub categories, and especially the ugliest ones, who suddenly develops a big ego, distorsed to their real COURT.

[Noch1]

ues local dating can hurt the head, it amazing some of the things
I have been asked on the first date, one so far as before the salad had arrived,
asked how much I make, how much in savings, and if I had a mortgage on my house.
Funny, I was still trying to figure out if I like her hair style.
Needless to say, I said next. She was shocked, when I told her.
FSU, be a man, show it, prove it and thats it.

[Larry1]

That's why I don't look for the hottest possible woman!   Too much competition and I am not interested in wasting my time on them.  These 'hottest' women always keep on looking and look and look until she found Pierce Brosnan / Brad Pitt / Mel Gibson etc.

But only none of the girls I discussed in my original post could remotely be considered one of the hottest possible women.  I'm talking about decent-looking to attractive, in a few cases very attractive AW.  As Patagonie points out just above, the heightened level of pickiness has trickled down to many WW who are of pretty much average appearance.

[jone]

Larry, there you go again with the Reaganomics. 

[Larry1]

How much influence on browsers (men and women) does the novelty of chatting up a foreigner have?

I can make a guess as to males.  As most people in this search generally agree, a tiny percentage of guys who use the sites ever get on a plane to visit ANY girl.  So for most guys the allure of talking to a hot girl is probably paramount.  Perhaps it adds to the appeal that the girl is foreign and exotic.

Larry, there you go again with the Reaganomics. 

Ah, trickle-down. 

[JayH]

  I cant understand why guys do not get responses on dating sites. When I first registered  I had 1000's in the first few weeks !!


I am certain the male model whose photos I "borrowed" would have been very pleased !!

[CDW]

But only none of the girls I discussed in my original post could remotely be considered one of the hottest possible women.  I'm talking about decent-looking to attractive, in a few cases very attractive AW.  As Patagonie points out just above, the heightened level of pickiness has trickled down to many WW who are of pretty much average appearance.

When I had a good conversation with a lady in MSN few years ago  (again from other lady in some other time too), her response was very slow.   I asked if she was busy.  She said "No".   I told her why takes so long in responding.  She said "Just checking messages"    I said from 'Cupid?'  She said 'Yes'.     She claimed she was very interested in me.   

The point is that she prefers to check on other men's messages rather than continue to chat with me when I was on MSN with her.

THEN I DELETED HER MSN!!

[CDW]

  I cant understand why guys do not get responses on dating sites. When I first registered  I had 1000's in the first few weeks !!


I am certain the male model whose photos I "borrowed" would have been very pleased !!

When I joined a certain site  (Anasatiaisia Web), without any details, no photos.  Just my username and password.  Within 1 week, I had 110 unopened messages, waiting for me to pay $10 per letter!!!

[I/O]

Perhaps it adds to the appeal that the girl is foreign and exotic.

The reason I raise the question is this - Back in the day, to be frank, I was just messing around really with no particular plan in mind, travelling a lot, dating plenty here and abroad. I'm fairly average I guess, and yet, despite all the arguments put forth about "ordinary" (or worse)  looking women proliferating USA whom mostly have an "attitude", I found very much the opposite - I was never short of hot dates in America who were charming company - is this in part because I was a foreigner?

[Slumba]

The reason I raise the question is this - Back in the day, to be frank, I was just messing around really with no particular plan in mind, travelling a lot, dating plenty here and abroad. I'm fairly average I guess, and yet, despite all the arguments put forth about "ordinary" (or worse)  looking women proliferating USA whom mostly have an "attitude", I found very much the opposite - I was never short of hot dates in America who were charming company - is this in part because I was a foreigner?

Are you Brit or Australian?  Then yes.

[Larry1]

The reason I raise the question is this - Back in the day, to be frank, I was just messing around really with no particular plan in mind, travelling a lot, dating plenty here and abroad. I'm fairly average I guess, and yet, despite all the arguments put forth about "ordinary" (or worse)  looking women proliferating USA whom mostly have an "attitude", I found very much the opposite - I was never short of hot dates in America who were charming company - is this in part because I was a foreigner?

It's entirely possible that your accent was part of your appeal to AW.  But your success may also have been related to the period when you were dating in the US.  In the pre-Internet days things were much easier.  And by "pre-Internet days" I mean before many people had signed up with the big online dating sites.  In those days I would go about my daily activities, often chatting up attractive girls wherever I came across them, looking to see if they were wearing wedding rings, getting the phone numbers of those who weren't wearing wedding rings (and sometimes failing to get them), and going out with them.  There was nothing of the job interview process that so much online dating seemed to entail.

I noticed a substantial difference in dating before I was married, the early 1990's, and the next decade. I think the blogger whose post I quoted above hit on the correct explanation for this:

Just as freshly-online businesses, expecting to amass untold fortunes in a new, global market, found themselves in competition with internet businesses that they would never have otherwise had to compete with, so too did online daters face the prospect of having to stand out as special and attractive amongst a much larger pool of singletons than they were used to. Whereas before a man just needed to be the best looking guy at work to get a date with a colleague, now he needed to be in the top 10% of all men to get a date with one of the women in his city.

[JayH]

The reason I raise the question is this - Back in the day, to be frank, I was just messing around really with no particular plan in mind, travelling a lot, dating plenty here and abroad. I'm fairly average I guess, and yet, despite all the arguments put forth about "ordinary" (or worse)  looking women proliferating USA whom mostly have an "attitude", I found very much the opposite - I was never short of hot dates in America who were charming company - is this in part because I was a foreigner?

Being "exotic" is a 2 way thing-- someone from somewhere else always has initial advantage. The fundamental interest in basic story creates interest and easy opening!!

[CanadaMan]

The thing that I always get a kick out of, is when women from a major city less than an hour away from where I live tell me "I live too far away." They aren't interested in a  long distance relationship.

That's when I tell them, "Long distance, you call that long distance; how about Ukraine or Russia?" 

[Gator]

I'm fairly average I guess, and yet, despite all the arguments put forth about "ordinary" (or worse)  looking women proliferating USA whom mostly have an "attitude", I found very much the opposite - I was never short of hot dates in America who were charming company - is this in part because I was a foreigner?

In part, yes.  More likely it is the fact you are a real man plus Ozzies I met do not lack for charm.

[Gator]

Why would someone want to date an AW if this is an indicator?

[Some of these women are Euro, but most seem AW, albeit young such as university girls on spring break, some from soft porn sites, etc.]

http://webcafe.net.hr/forwarduse/video/inner.html?select=201307130004503

[Larry1]

The thing that I always get a kick out of, is when women from a major city less than an hour away from where I live tell me "I live too far away." They aren't interested in a  long distance relationship.

Ah yes, the 467 bullet point checklist.  That is yet another example of the heightened level of pickiness WW have developed.  They don't tend to compromise because they don't have to compromise.  If they're above average in looks and aren't overweight they know they have an incredibly large choice of guys.

[JayH]

Ah yes, the 467 bullet point checklist.  That is yet another example of the heightened level of pickiness WW have developed.  They don't tend to compromise because they don't have to compromise.  If they're above average in looks and aren't overweight they know they have an incredibly large choice of guys.

How many are seeking economic enhancement? Given that most have no issues to stay in US-- what is priorty?

[I/O]

In the pre-Internet days things were much easier.

I used the net for almost every meeting - all roughly 10 years ago.
 
 

[southernX]

I/O
maybe you got lucky with the crocodile dundee syndrome in the US ?

id think there would be something to the ''foreigner '' novelty for sure 

SX 

[Larry1]

How many are seeking economic enhancement? Given that most have no issues to stay in US-- what is priorty?

My recollection from reading the excellent analysis of online dating done by Dan Ariely and several colleagues* was that it helped a guy to make more money than average, but as long as he made an income in the six figures ($100,000 - 150,000) the vast majority of girls were satisfied with his income.  Most girls were much pickier about the guy's appearance and height.  A large majority of girls were much more interested in guys who were six feet tall or taller (which is less than 12% of the population, if memory serves), no matter what the girl's height was. Many girls wanted a guy who was in the top 5% for attractiveness.  This surprised the researchers so much that they dubbed it "the superstar effect".


* What Makes You Click:
An Empirical Analysis of Online Dating
http://www.aeaweb.org/assa/2006/0106_0800_0502.pdf