DRIVING SCHOOL FOR SCAMMERS

[SANDRO43]

Pointer to a VERY interesting post on Stop Scammers Forum: http://www.stop-scammers.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=577 with the (approximate) English translation of a page in Russian on  http://bemaster.e-karaganda.com/distance/distance.htm

Just to give you a foretaste :
" How to leave in marriage for the foreigner for 30 days "
Correspondence rate (628 pages) - 50 USD
+ 400 patterns of letters in English language
+ 10 magic letters (in English language)
Having sent which your Beloved, one by one, you is guaranteed receive from him « a hand and heart ».

No longer a cottage industry. What next, Scam University, The Institute for Advanced Scam Studies, Nobel-winning Scammers ?

[Shadow]

Good find Sandro. There has been discussion about such training here before, but it is the first time I see this link. I will present it to my fiancee so she can improve her game   

[SANDRO43]

Good find Sandro. There has been discussion about such training here before, but it is the first time I see this link. I will present it to my fiancee so she can improve her game 

Why not present it on ANTIDATE, too ? I am sure Kvinna will have some intelligent comments on this, too 

[Shadow]

I am sure most of the readers already know it....
Perhaps I should copy it and sell it under the name 'How to marry a guy like me' 
Part 2 (getting money from a foreigner) we could sell under the name of Infoman
Part 3 (go to 10 holiday resorts) would be on the name of Turboguy
Part 4 (how to get half the estate) : Maxx is the best candidate for that.

I guess I will have to work on the idea 

[Elen]

Why not present it on ANTIDATE, too ? I am sure Kvinna will have some intelligent comments on this, too 

 It was already there http://forum.antidate.org/index.php?showtopic=3526&hl=

[SANDRO43]

It was already there http://forum.antidate.org/index.php?showtopic=3526&hl=

Elen, thanks for the pointer, the girls there seemed amused (I missed the meaning of their references to yoghurts,  though).

[Elen]

(I missed the meaning of their references to yoghurts,  though).

Me too  something from old stories which I have not read

[Kvinna]

Me too  something from old stories which I have not read

http://forum.antidate.org/index.php?showtopic=3193

[BC]

Anyone have any idea when "Agency in a Box" will be released.. heard they are including 300,000 womens profiles and a pair of Nike running shoes for 99.95.

Just hit install, put on shoes and run as fast as you can to the local WU branch.

[PeeWee]

What they may not be able to teach them with this course is how to answer your questions. I would think that if a guy was sending letter loaded with questions and in the return letter the questions remained unanswered one would get the clue that she was a student at Skru U. 

Peewee

[andrewfi]

Peewee ~ Assuming the woman was genuine, she would probably be answering questions. If she were not and was simply using the patterned letters and other tools to earn a living then she would either simply continuing using letters from the packages until the dupe paid up or gave up. No great amount of time need be involved, there are plenty of free email autresponse systems around. Of course (s)he might choose to answer questions as a part of the program... anda genuine woman may not have the time, ability or inclination to answer lists of questions. There are no absolutes.

[SANDRO43]

Andrewfin & PeeWee
see Questions 3 and 4 on the Scammer Score Card

[antiscam_advise]

In addition to a great scammer score card, here is a similar tool: Anti Scam quiz - which also performs a database search and reports overall score:
http://www.russianscamcheck.org/scam_quiz.shtml

Enjoy!

[SANDRO43]

In addition to a great scammer score card, here is a similar tool: Anti Scam quiz - which also performs a database search and reports overall score:
http://www.russianscamcheck.org/scam_quiz.shtml Enjoy!

Damien, I think the Quiz covers basically (and unsurprisingly) almost the same ground as our Card. However, can you expand on the scamming significance of Questions:

4. Did she send you a copy of her passport without you asking her for it ?
(would scamming be the only explanation for this ?)
5. Does her street address contain: "Lenin street" or "Lenina street" ?
(a well-known scammers' addreess ?)

Question 8 (Is there anyone else in communication chain between you and her) is not covered in our Card, and it could be a worthy addition.

Incidentally, I replied affirmatively to Questions 4 and 5, and asked for the resulting report to verify their impact. I got : Software error: Illegal division by zero at quiz_report.cgi line 398. You may want to have that verified by your SW developers.

[antiscam_advise]

SANDRO,

Thank you for a test drive of http://www.russianscamcheck.org/scam_quiz.shtml  !
I'll look into the division on zero issue thanks for pointing this out.

Let me clairfy on questions 4 and 5:

4. Did she send you a copy of her passport without you asking her for it ?
(would scamming be the only explanation for this ?)
Most of the scammers are looking to prove themseves with some semi-valid docs, that are usually scans of passport.
It's clear that if there is no reason for her to send it (you didn;t ask for it) - why prove anything?
This is just based on the experience...

5. Does her street address contain: "Lenin street" or "Lenina street" ?
(a well-known scammers' addreess ?)
The Lenin sreet is in virtually every city in Russia so many scammers use it because if you were to check arbitarily whether there is such street - the answer would be YES, this street exists...
The trick is that they are not usually smart enough to look up how many building numbers there are and if the number supplied to you actuall even there...
In some cases Lenin street doesn't exist at all, as it has been renamed to other street: often it's the case in post-communist Russia.
Being from Russia originally myself I can tell you that there is no much information about the street addresses in small Russian cities or towns. Moscow and St.Petersburg have more online, including maps etc, yet 99% of scammers choose smaller towns.

We at Russian Scam Check keep track of addresses, statistics of fake addresses used and fake cities choosen by scammer as their address. 2 years ago we dealed with one experienced scammer, later known as Natasha Kornilova who always choosen town of Kstovo, Russia .
Later dozen others used the same city name, and different streets...  We often checked out different streets for our clients.
She scammed around 25 of our clients, half of whom already sent money by the time they had doubts...
Our estimation that just these clients sent her overall $17,000 US dollars. I have a reason to beleive that we saved other 13 clients about that much ...

The imp[ortant point you've missed on Russian Scam Check quiz is:
First and Last Name of Person (first name alone will usually produce false positive matches)
This tool actually searches our database of checked scammers and reports any name matches, which would affect the score... in the case of the positive match.

I hope this helps.
Let me know if you have any other questions or need ckarification.

[Shadow]

My testcase (based on real experience) scored 36 out of 100 and conclusion was a 'possible' scammer.

3. Length of Relationships
We highly recommend to communicate with the lady for at least 6 months prior to making any serious moves, like sending money or making plans to meet her.
Regardless if you would like to get clear earlier: you can order ScamCheck and our agent will personally attempt the delivery of a single rose, will check the lady's identity and attempt to make a picture if she lives there.

I think the general advise of the board is that after 6 months you should at least have already made definite plans to meet, if not already have met.

[antiscam_advise]

Yes, this would be acceptable yet the main goal of Russian Scam Check is not to connect people, but to prevent them from being scammed.
Many posters of this board may have a different goal in mind and that is fine.

This is similar to goal of the security officer in the jewelry store: his goal is not to satisfy your jewelry needs, but to ensure that people do not robe the store ...
Sorry for a weird example, yet everyone has goals in mind...

Way too many men were burned in that first meeting attempt, which was also associated with sending money for her to meet you in airport... or other reasons.

[Shadow]

Yes, this would be acceptable yet the main goal of Russian Scam Check is not to connect people, but to prevent them from being scammed.
Many posters of this board may have a different goal in mind and that is fine.

This is similar to goal of the security officer in the jewelry store: his goal is not to satisfy your jewelry needs, but to ensure that people do not robe the store ...
Sorry for a weird example, yet everyone has goals in mind...

Way too many men were burned in that first meeting attempt, which was also associated with sending money for her to meet you in airport... or other reasons.

The security officer will not tell people to look around in the store, but ask them to either buy something or leave, as his job gets more difficult with more people present. Unlike your business, where the longer people use your service the more money is made.
It is not important if a meeting is succesful or not, what is important is to make sure the people who meet each other are sincere.

[antiscam_advise]

Shadow, you probably do not understand the goal of our business ...
We are not setting up the meetings.
We are guarding customers from costly fantasies.
We are not a dating agency...

[Shadow]

Shadow, you probably do not understand the goal of our business ...
We are not setting up the meetings.
We are guarding customers from costly fantasies.
We are not a dating agency...

I fully understand your business, and it seems you are trying to do a good job.
But your business is about checking people and sending gifts, and the longer the time people write the more they will use your check or gift service 

[Michelangelo]

Six months?  Far too long to write a girl before meeting her.

Serious girls are in more of a hurry than that.  And the danger of writing that long is your investment of time.

Chemisty is needed for a relationship, and often when you have chemistry by letters it is not present in person.

I wrote one girl 2 months and thought we had it made as a couple.  But face to face, we did not click romantically.  We are still email friends, but now when I start writing a girl I want to only exchange 6 to 8 letters and then meet her in person, or in real life ( IRL).

[Leslie]

Writing to a woman for six months before you make plans to visit is an excellent strategy for remaining single. 

Never send money to someone you have not met.  Obey this rule and you avoid all the internet fraudsters.

Get your ass on the airplane!

Always have a back up plan if you are travelling to meet one woman.  Stay in control of your travel arrangements.  Don't depend on someone you have never met!  You have to be able to exit the situation if the relationship does not work out.

Sure you can send a woman flowers.  Real women don't refuse flowers 

Trust your instincts.  If it looks to good to be true - it is 

[antiscam_advise]

Leslie,

Great suggestions!
I may quote yuour post on Russian Scam Check site, if you don't mind.

I agree: 6 months is a very long time, and I agree that jumping on the plane is a good idea as long as you have a backup plan...
I dissagree that time works agianst you.
For truly real intentions - woman can waid and will wait.
Often you may not have a chance to jump on the plane... this is a reality.
And this is also a check if she is serious.