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Author Topic: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married  (Read 5885 times)

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Offline ML

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Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« on: February 06, 2015, 12:04:06 PM »
What's the experience of you guys who have been through this?

I had just assumed we could file a joint tax return like any other married couple.

But, after a little bit of reading; it seems this is not a straight forward automatic process.

Given their status is still non-resident alien (or some such) until what (receiving first 2 year green card) . . . apparently can't just file joint return without some additional paperwork.

Something about a typed and signed statement with joint return declaring that's what we want to do . . . and then face taxation on all income for both anywhere in the world.

I know  I have  a lot more reading to do.

Any experience on this from others?

Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Online Gator

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #1 on: February 06, 2015, 01:07:01 PM »
You can file jointly if you are married as of December 31, 2014. 

If she does not yet have a SS#, you can still file jointly (call IRS to get a temporary taxpayer number).


That's all folks.

Offline Jumper

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #2 on: February 06, 2015, 03:32:22 PM »
We married in (2011) and simply filed jointly for that tax year.

Certainly her AOS was not back yet, just the EAD and AP card.
It was no problem.
Perhaps somethings changed? but that was our experience.


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Offline viking

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2015, 03:51:42 PM »
What Gator said.
Tom Hanks in Castaway: You never know what the tide may bring in.
Viking: But you still need to walk along the beach to find it.

Offline ML

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2015, 05:43:52 PM »
I am sure we all understand that just because someone 'did it' does not mean it was correct.  Many people have claimed animals as dependents on tax returns for many years and have not been caught.

Not saying you all are wrong . . . but

Non-American Spouse Is So-Called “Nonresident Alien”

If the non-US spouse does not have either a green card or “resident” alien status, the individual will be classified as a nonresident alien (NRA).  In this situation, the couple cannot file tax returns using MFJ status.  The US taxpayer cannot automatically file a joint income tax return with the NRA spouse in order to obtain the benefits of the lower joint tax rates, additional personal exemption, and higher standard deduction amounts.  The US taxpayer would have to file using MFS status. In this case, the income of the non-US spouse will not be subject to tax (unless from US sources). It may nonetheless be possible that the US spouse can take a personal exemption for the foreign spouse if the foreign spouse has no US source income and is not claimed as a dependent on another person’s US tax return.

If the foreign spouse is a NRA, it may also be possible for the US spouse to file instead as “Head of Household” (HOH).  When a US taxpayer is married to a NRA and has a “qualifying person” also resident in the home (typically this would be the couple’s child) filing HOH is permissible. Using HOH filing status means that lower tax rates are available, a higher standard deduction amount is available and the income of the foreign spouse need not be reported on the tax return.
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Online Gator

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2015, 05:51:30 PM »
So why are you asking us?  :D

 BTW, I used an accountant and the IRS questioned our return for our first year,  not for filing jointly but something else.   

Offline ML

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2015, 05:57:06 PM »
So why are you asking us?  :D

To see if anyone knows more about this than I was able to find.
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Online Faux Pas

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2015, 09:22:23 PM »
To see if anyone knows more about this than I was able to find.
You need to check the definition of Nonresident alien. If she's lived in the U.S. for more than 31 days in the calendar year or more than 180 in the last 3 years she would classify as a resident alien. If that's the case, what the other gents have told you is correct

Online calmissile

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Doug (Calmissile)

Offline Jumper

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #9 on: February 08, 2015, 10:08:54 AM »
We used a tax accountant versed in various immigration scenarios,,as we  live in an area they would need that knowledge of tax law regularly.

I would imagine you use someone to do your taxes,,make sure they are versed in such scenarios.It's hard to imagine your wife would be considered a NRA,but if you want to be extra safe,, pay extra taxes :)

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Online Wayne

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2015, 08:51:27 AM »
What we did was to request the automatic 6 months extension for filing taxes. Then, they were able to enter USA before the 6 months was up and they received their green cards and social security numbers by then. Of course, you might need to make a payment with the extension.
 
If you have already applied for adjustment of status, you should have that completed in time.

Offline ML

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2015, 10:29:19 AM »
Thanks for all the comments fellas.

SS number is no problem as she has been working under OPT for F-1 students with EAD card.  And even before, F-1 students can work on-campus without EAD, as she had done for 2 prior years.  She was able to get SS card way back when for that.

However, if you read further, F-1 students are one of the exceptions that the 30 - 180 day rule doesn't apply to dictate Resident status.  She is still classified as NR for tax purposes, at least for tax year 2014.

But, we can do the declaration.  Investigating further.
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Online Faux Pas

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2015, 11:10:25 AM »
Thanks for all the comments fellas.

SS number is no problem as she has been working under OPT for F-1 students with EAD card.  And even before, F-1 students can work on-campus without EAD, as she had done for 2 prior years.  She was able to get SS card way back when for that.

However, if you read further, F-1 students are one of the exceptions that the 30 - 180 day rule doesn't apply to dictate Resident status.  She is still classified as NR for tax purposes, at least for tax year 2014.

But, we can do the declaration.  Investigating further.

It would seem logical to me that the marriage was a game changer for the F-1. Have you file for AOS?

Offline ML

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2015, 11:44:04 AM »
Yes, we sent off AOS packet last week.
She will still be F-1 status until final adjudication.
But that all relates to tax years 2015 and beyond.

However, more to the current point, she was F-1 for entire tax year 2014.

I have already discovered we can disavow the NRA status for her for 2014 tax purposes, if we wish.  It takes a signed statement declaration by both of us.  But there are also some other complications involved which we are thinking through, given her assets held in 3 countries outside USA, etc.

So our situation IS a bit different and not so straight forward as has been for most of the rest of you.
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Online Faux Pas

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #14 on: February 09, 2015, 01:11:57 PM »
Yes, we sent off AOS packet last week.
She will still be F-1 status until final adjudication.
But that all relates to tax years 2015 and beyond.

However, more to the current point, she was F-1 for entire tax year 2014.

I have already discovered we can disavow the NRA status for her for 2014 tax purposes, if we wish.  It takes a signed statement declaration by both of us.  But there are also some other complications involved which we are thinking through, given her assets held in 3 countries outside USA, etc.

So our situation IS a bit different and not so straight forward as has been for most of the rest of you.

Yeah, you're "special". Seek the advice of a Tax Accountant

Online Wayne

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #15 on: February 09, 2015, 01:19:58 PM »
Did she have qualified health care coverage for 2014? See the instructions for form 8965.

Offline Jumper

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #16 on: February 10, 2015, 12:53:48 PM »
Yeah, you're "special". Seek the advice of a Tax Accountant

Hey! That's what I implied!

 :)


All kidding aside, I'd think with ML's holdings,, and his wife's, a good tax accountant would be typical and worth their weight in gold.

Unless one wanted to study the intracacies of tax law themselves.
.

Online LAman

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #17 on: February 10, 2015, 01:22:14 PM »
What's the experience of you guys who have been through this?

I had just assumed we could file a joint tax return like any other married couple.

But, after a little bit of reading; it seems this is not a straight forward automatic process.

Given their status is still non-resident alien (or some such) until what (receiving first 2 year green card) . . . apparently can't just file joint return without some additional paperwork.

Something about a typed and signed statement with joint return declaring that's what we want to do . . . and then face taxation on all income for both anywhere in the world.

I know  I have  a lot more reading to do.

Any experience on this from others?

You ask a public forum??? Why not a tax attorney, I think they would know your tax situation better than anyone here!!!  Why......

"So our situation IS a bit different and not so straight forward as has been for most of the rest of you."'
Life isn't tied with a bow, but it's still a gift

Online Faux Pas

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #18 on: February 10, 2015, 01:48:49 PM »
Hey! That's what I implied!

 :)


All kidding aside, I'd think with ML's holdings,, and his wife's, a good tax accountant would be typical and worth their weight in gold.

Unless one wanted to study the intracacies of tax law themselves.

Nah, he's such a cheap bastid he was hoping to get his answer here for free and when he did get, he had to take a dump on it.  :o

Offline 2tallbill

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Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #19 on: March 22, 2019, 03:25:34 PM »
To see if anyone knows more about this than I was able to find.

I realize that this is very late but newbies might find this information helpful.
What you need is an ITIN an Individual Taxpayer Identification Number.

The forum you need is called a W7
http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/fw7.pdf

Some IRS offices can process them and some can't so find out where you need
to go and bring your information and your tax return along with the form. I lived
in Western North Dakota but couldn't drive to Bismark which was only 90 minutes
away, I had to drive to Fargo which was 4.5 hours away (one way).

They let me have one for Angel Eyes the first year but not smiley girl. They suck.

Your original question was can you file married filing jointly and the answer is yes
if you got married on any day of the previous year. If your wife had children then
you would have other tests to see if you could claim them.


FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Kiss the girl, don't ask her first.

Online Gator

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #20 on: March 22, 2019, 03:37:28 PM »
I realize that this is very late.....


You realize ML is worried about his memory, so you did this years later to test ML's memory.   :D

Offline tfcrew

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Re: Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #21 on: March 22, 2019, 05:26:30 PM »
.... a nonresident alien (NRA). 
We have a whole lot of those down at the labor center...non-resident mujado residents

Offline 2tallbill

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Joint tax return with FSU wife during first year married
« Reply #22 on: March 23, 2019, 11:00:36 AM »
You realize ML is worried about his memory, so you did this years later to test ML's memory.   :D

 :D

Sure, let's go with that.

I commented because it might help guys just now entering the process.


FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Kiss the girl, don't ask her first.

 

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