Should you learn to speak Russian?

[Boethius]

O is only pronounced O if it is stressed; hence the last O in молоко is stressed as an O while the first 2 are pronounced like an A.  However, if you go to the southern parts of Russia like Krasnodar, all the O's are pronounced like O's.  I think this may also be true in parts of Ukraine, but I'd refer to Bo's expertise to confirm that.

In the better half's family, unstressed "o's" are pronounced as "a's".  That is the Russian I was exposed to most often.  However, one side of his family is originally from St. Petersburg, the other, Moscow. 


In Kyiv, it's up for grabs if people speak surzhik, but if they are from the city, and went to Russian schools, they would also follow the rule of unstressed "o's".


In Ukrainian, "o" is always pronounced as "o".    But, this typically is not where you would recognize someone from Ukraine.  Typically, their sounds, when speaking Russian, are softer than in Russia.

[Anotherkiwi]

O is only pronounced O if it is stressed; hence the last O in молоко is stressed as an O while the first 2 are pronounced like an A.  However, if you go to the southern parts of Russia like Krasnodar, all the O's are pronounced like O's.

Granted.  The point I'm making, however, which I think everyone has agreed with, is that there are only the four letters which are ALWAYS pronounced EXACTLY the same in Russian as in English.  And yes, Sandro, I could have made that clearer!

[ML]

Granted.  The point I'm making, however, which I think everyone has agreed with, is that there are only the four letters which are ALWAYS pronounced EXACTLY the same in Russian as in English.  And yes, Sandro, I could have made that clearer!

I know nothing about this . . . but I object to your use of 'exactly.'

Even within English itself, the four letters you identify are pronounced differently depending on long vs short sound and other variations.

For instance 'a' in Larry vs Amy; army vs aim; etc.

[Boethius]

Granted.  The point I'm making, however, which I think everyone has agreed with, is that there are only the four letters which are ALWAYS pronounced EXACTLY the same in Russian as in English.  And yes, Sandro, I could have made that clearer!

To add to ML's post, aspiration is not as pronounced in Russian.

[Anotherkiwi]

I know nothing about this . . . but I object to your use of 'exactly.'

Even within English itself, the four letters you identify are pronounced differently depending on long vs short sound and other variations.

For instance 'a' in Larry vs Amy; army vs aim; etc.

Of course, but all are still variants of the letter A - they are not pronounced as different letters.  K and M can each only be pronounced one way, and T changes only if it is joined to H or I.

[SANDRO43]

Of course, but all are still variants of the letter A - they are not pronounced as different letters. 

How about this lot, then :

Face/Fall/Family/Farm

IMO, only one of those (Farm) could be considered a variant of A.

AK, you should not mix phonetics (sound) and spelling (written form) of vowels as far as English is concerned. See a section entitled The 'Haphazardest' Spellings (www.floriani.it/Miscellanea-eng.htm#Haphazardest) on my site for other examples .

[Boethius]

Of course, but all are still variants of the letter A - they are not pronounced as different letters.  K and M can each only be pronounced one way, and T changes only if it is joined to H or I.

In Russian, "a" has endless variations - plakat', dastat', dyelat, bezhat' - it depends on the letters after and before.

K is the same, numerous sounds - soft, hard, or a sound where you can't hear whether it is a k or another letter.

M - a horrible sound in Russian, in terms of variation, from "mama" to "mol'" to "mim".

I suspect you were told "T" changes only after H or I, but that's inaccurate.  The "T' in molotok is different from tyen (shadow - no H or I), or tok (current), or fortepiano, or butelka.  All of these t's have different sounds, very discernable to a native speaker.  To us, generally they sound quite similar.

There also are many words which are spelled the same, and to a foreigner sound the same, but have different meanings, such as "kasa" (braid or scythe, depending on pronunciation).

[Изумруд]

In the better half's family, unstressed "o's" are pronounced as "a's".  That is the Russian I was exposed to most often.  However, one side of his family is originally from St. Petersburg, the other, Moscow. 


In Kyiv, it's up for grabs if people speak surzhik, but if they are from the city, and went to Russian schools, they would also follow the rule of unstressed "o's".


In Ukrainian, "o" is always pronounced as "o".    But, this typically is not where you would recognize someone from Ukraine.  Typically, their sounds, when speaking Russian, are softer than in Russia.

Yes, that would be the typical pronunciation that I came across Bo; even in Siberia the unstressed O was pronounced like that.  I've only ever been to Southern Ukraine the once and while everyone was speaking Russian, I did notice that it was less guttural than in Russia; although, this is speaking generally.

[Anotherkiwi]

In Russian, "a" has endless variations - plakat', dastat', dyelat, bezhat' - it depends on the letters after and before.

K is the same, numerous sounds - soft, hard, or a sound where you can't hear whether it is a k or another letter.

M - a horrible sound in Russian, in terms of variation, from "mama" to "mol'" to "mim".

I suspect you were told "T" changes only after H or I, but that's inaccurate.

Sorry, Boethius - perhaps I should have clarified that I meant the English pronunciation, not the Russian.

[Anotherkiwi]

How about this lot, then :

Face/Fall/Family/Farm

IMO, only one of those (Farm) could be considered a variant of A.

I think it's fairly safe to include "family" in the variants of A - it's a standard short vowel.  I'll agree that feis and forl could be marked as "indeterminate." 

AK, you should not mix phonetics (sound) and spelling (written form) of vowels as far as English is concerned. See a section entitled The 'Haphazardest' Spellings (www.floriani.it/Miscellanea-eng.htm#Haphazardest) on my site for other examples .

One of these days Esperanto WILL become the one true language! 

[oso]

As an expat I get a different view about things.  Not the same as a tourist. One of the biggest gripes I hear from wife's, GF's and others is they think western men are lazy that they don't learn the local language...Just thought I would share

[mhr7]

As an expat I get a different view about things.  Not the same as a tourist. One of the biggest gripes I hear from wife's, GF's and others is they think western men are lazy that they don't learn the local language...Just thought I would share

I hear similar complaints but mostly from taxi drivers who always want to impart their wisdom to me

[Anotherkiwi]

As an expat I get a different view about things.  Not the same as a tourist. One of the biggest gripes I hear from wife's, GF's and others is they think western men are lazy that they don't learn the local language...Just thought I would share

Do they quantify this?  I made sure that I learnt the alphabet, some key phrases, and some of the language before I made my first trip.  I found that the locals appreciated the effort that I had made, and some certainly seemed to open up more than others.  However, I do agree with ML to some extent when he maintains that there is no point in learning the language if you're only going to visit.  If you DO manage to land an FSUW, she'll have to learn (or improve) her English, because that's what she'll be speaking pretty well anywhere if she hooks up with most on this forum.  Once you have caught your prey, so to speak, you should then start learning a bit more, so that you could impress your future in-laws with a bit more than just "where's the toilet?" 

[ML]

As an expat I get a different view about things.  Not the same as a tourist.

Of course.  I always qualified my "don't bother to learn the language" comment that it didn't apply to those who were actually going to live in the foreign country.

[mendeleyev]

Very few if any of the men here are going to learn Russian past the basic cave man
level. Russian is too difficult and too different from English and the men here have jobs,
and girls to chase.

I am with Larry, Bill, etc. Learn some basics as it gives you a huge advantage over other guys fishing in the same pond. During the hunting phase it allows you more independence of movement, association, etc. After marriage it means that at least on some elementary level you can sort of follow along with conversations others are having with your wife.

Experts claim that it takes 9 years on average to achieve some level of fluency, however many have done so much quicker with intense focus. To that end, perhaps fluency is not a priority.

I enjoy speaking to my wife in Russian as one's birth language is the language of the heart. When I speak in endearing terms, she enjoys either, but especially enjoys hearing those comments in Russian.