What are the best web sites?

[JustPlaneCrazy]

Curious what the members think are the best Russian dating web sites with the least amount of scammers?

Also, it seems that the biggest area for scammers that I have seen is Lugansk, Ukraine, anyone agree or disagree and why?

I am amazed at how lucky I was 5 years ago, I had just come across 1 Russian web site by accident and emailed 1 woman, we emailed back and forth for about a month and then started speaking on the phone about 5 times a week for another couple months when I decided to hop a plane and go see her (I had never been out of the states before)  and my trip was October 2001 (right after our 9/11 problems)  So, all my friends and family thought I was totally crazy!  But, all was as it seemed with my woman, no scammer and we started our 4 year relations which I visited her many times and we vacationed in Poland and Egypt.  This relation did not work as she would not leave Russia in the end so in the last year I have been looking again but have had little luck like my first girlfriend, most woman tell me they don't have a phone (kind of hard to continue a relation without one of those!)
and most woman seem to only send generic letters over and over, my first girlfriend sent real, personal letters from the start.

[Turboguy]

This should be an interesting question.   I think though you will only be able to get posts about good and bad sites not the best.   For someone to really have a good handle on the best Russian dating sites they would have had to spend a fortune and devoted a lifetime to their seach and done that all in a very short time so thier data was not old.   I will say for web sites, I have been happy with Elena's Models.

Lugansk.   I am not sure there are more scammers there than other places but it is the undesputed world champion of scam agencies

[PeeWee]

This should be an interesting question.   I think though you will only be able to get posts about good and bad sites not the best.   For someone to really have a good handle on the best Russian dating sites they would have had to spend a fortune and devoted a lifetime to their seach and done that all in a very short time so thier data was not old.   I will say for web sites, I have been happy with Elena's Models.

Lugansk.   I am not sure there are more scammers there than other places but it is the undesputed world champion of scam agencies

I had recommended Elena's to iPod as well. Because she tries hard to eradicate the scammers from her site. I signed up the the $95.00 3 month package. After placing my profile in one month's time I had enough emails and profiles from FSU ladies to last me for a while. I was discovered by a very nice lady within the first few weeks and as a result I have not needed to refresh my membership at Elena's. I may have mentioned this but I did receive an email from an RW who lives not more than 15 miles from me. Had that worked out I would have saved myself much time and trouble in not traveling to Russia.

Peewee brain

[Marc Dayton]

This is a good question, are you looking for a slef do it type site or are you looking for an service that dose more for you then here a 1000 letters now good luck.

one big pice of advice I would give is if an service is a scamm then they will never stop a girl from scamming you just food for thought.

I think Jack would be a good person you might ask this question. He has worked with many services on a personal level?

[BillyB]

Curious what the members think are the best Russian dating web sites with the least amount of scammers?

Crazy,

No agency can be scam free though some agency owners try harder than others to keep sincere women out and run a clean operation. It's better for you to list agencies you're considering and then ask the question if they're reputable.

Also, you should not worry about scammers as much as scam agencies. Scam agencies got your money the moment you open a letter that was written by Igor, the employee of the month, on behalf of the women. Find a decent agency and focus on sincere women. You can't get scammed if you don't send money and refuse to write girls who always has issues that are solved with money, period. It's as easy as that.

[Turboguy]

You can't get scammed if you don't send money and refuse to write girls who always has issues that are solved with money, period. It's as easy as that.

BillyB,  This is the first time you have said something that I strongly disagree with but there are lots of scams you can get hit with without sending money.  This is the voice of experience talking.  Trust me.  I have been scammed lots of times but never when I sent money.  I am not saying the rule to never send money to a gal you have not met is not a good one it is.  It just doesn't protect you from being scammed. 

As far as Marc's advice, he is right.  You should decide about the approach you want to take.  Do you want to write to gals and meet the ones that appeal to you.  Then Elena's is a good suggestion.  FreePersonals.ru is good.  There are lots of others.  Merry dating.  A pretty woman, I saw a list somewhere but when I just went looking for it I could not lay my hands on it to add it to the post.  It is here somewhere.

Cross reference the gals you write to to some of the scammer black lists.  I could have saved $ 3000.00 if I had done that in January and I did not send her a penny in advance.   She is posted on the scammer list at RussianTeaRoom.net  Just for reference, this is the one that got me.  http://russiantearoom.net/DELTA/elvira_minachmetova.html  She still pops up on Elenas as one of her most popular gals.    I just saw another I was writing that was wanting me to set up a first meeting in Paris on another scammer list for identity theft and travel scams.  I didn't fall for that one.

Another system that seems to work for a lot of guys is to find a reputable agency.  Go to thier town and have them line up a string of gals until you find a few you like.  It is fast and works. 

Another option is a tour.  I would recommend a smaller one like Jack runs compared to the larger ones like AFA.  I have been on some of the larger tours and think you would be wasting your money.

There are a lot of good ways to meet gals.  Find the way that is right for you even if you have to experiment with different approaches.

[BillyB]

BillyB,  This is the first time you have said something that I strongly disagree with but there are lots of scams you can get hit with without sending money.  This is the voice of experience talking.  Trust me.  I have been scammed lots of times but never when I sent money.  I am not saying the rule to never send money to a gal you have not met is not a good one it is.  It just doesn't protect you from being scammed. 

If you're talking about meeting and wasting time with insincere women and pro-daters then I wouldn't call that a scam. Just some rotten people out there who is materialistic and selfish but I can't call them scammers. Crazy's question had to deal avoiding scammers in the writing phase. If he asked about how to avoid meeting pro daters and insincere women, I'd tell him to call the woman often. An insincere women could not maintain a high level of enthusiasm for a man very long unless he's speaking through his wallet. A lot of men could have saved themselves tons of money from visiting insincere women and pro daters if they only made a few phone calls. But that isn't getting scammed if he decided to visit a woman he chose to not call. If you know of a way of getting scammed through letters from a woman, not an agency as I mentioned earlier, without spending a dime, I want to hear it so we all can learn.

[Muj]

BillyB,

The scammers, insincere women, and pro daters are all dishonest to the guy seeking a long term relationship and marriage.  All may equally and cleverly rob and steal from a guy the time and money he could spend with a sincere and loving women. 

Justplanecrazy,
I read similar reports on Lugnask and ran into scammers there through correspondence.
Meeting in person by arranging the date through an agency worked best for me .
Good luck!

[Turboguy]

Billy,  no I am not talking about meeting insincere women who where actually just out for expensive dinners and who wasted my time.   I have had my share of those too such as the gal I posted about where my dinner tab was $ 550.00 and my date could have cost me nearly $ 1000 if we had arrived at the place we went after dinner to listen to some music just a little later or earlier.  The admission was $ 250.00 but it had started and we would have had to wait an hour and a half so I used that excuse to bail. 

Mostly the ones I am talking about are resellers.  jb had asked me to do a post for the FAQ section on scams.   Actually the one I described there was the one Elvira pulled on me (the link I posted)  Another that fit that catagory was Lena from St Petersburg.  I had met her at an EC romance tour and had gone out with her one time.  I made a trip back to see her for 5 days a few months later.   My cash outlay on the ground for 5 days was 3 grand.  I figure $ 800.00, or more, of that ended up in her pocket.   With her it was a lot of little things such as she told me she lived way out in the boonies and asked for $ 50.00 cab fare so she did not have to ride the metro late at night.  She would give me a big french kiss each night and head home.  (on the metro with my $ 50.00)  It sort of made me think when she asked for cab fare to get to me so we could spend more time together but we always met her at the metro station.  I got curious so the one night I got my big french kiss, handed her the $ 50.00 closed the door, counted to 20 and followed her, to the metro.  There was another strange $ 500.00 worth of stuff.  Phone calls would not have helped with either.

I do agree that phone calls could help in a lot of cases and that it is a good rule not to send money to someone you have never met.  There is no bullet proof way to avoid being scammed.

[BillyB]

TG, I have heard of resellers but the Crazy's question had to do with avoiding scammers in the writing phase and of finding agencies and I answered accordingly not getting to far ahead and metioning potential issues all the way into marriage. Also the resellers problems deal with the money issues I talked about. Women who are always needing money for something. I can assure you guys. If you find a woman who knows how to take care of herself without your money, you could have found a gem and the chances of getting scammed go way down.

Engaged, I would consider insincere women and pro daters in a different class than scammers. Those women are actually looking for a man but they will usually marry the man that gives or spends the most on them. Did you read the recent trip report in the other forum? The guy wasn't getting along with the woman and she then takes him shopping and asks him to buy the most expensive shoes at $400. He bought it and then dumps her. People are cheering him on that he's a great guy by the way he treats a woman he dumps. He even believed she'll marry him in a week. I called her the pro dater(not scammer) that she was. He willingly, not intentionally, spent his money on the shoes. It would be a scam if she returned the shoes for the cash which is deception but it's hard to return something in the FSU after it's bought and especially if it's used.

[PeeWee]

Other than Elena's Models everyone thus far has seemed reluctant to name any good agency for PlaneCrazy to contact. Am I sensing that none of you feel confident in an agency to post the name as a recommendation? I thought there were a few agency owners that lurked about the forum? Anyway, JPC, you do know that I do know where the best place to find your airplanes are! We just need to find you a good place to find your lady.

Peewee

[Turboguy]

There have been enough discussions about scammers that I will try and not take this off topic other than to say that in my case, I am an over the hill dude who as jb keeps harping about persists in chasing young chicks which does let me run into more scammers than most guys will.  I would suggest to Crazy that he does not spend too much time worrying about something happening to him like happens to me a lot.  Just follow the rule not to send money to someone you have never met.  Sending airline tickets bought with your credit card in her name probably is not real unsafe.

Since we are supposed to be talking about agencies and web sites I will get back on that.  Elena's will have some scammers but all in all seems to have far more people who like it than don't.  I use www.freepersonals.ru   I like the price.  I am a cheapskate anyway.  I have heard good things about Merrydating.  I have heard good things about APrettyWoman  I have used eecl.org in the past which is mostly free.   I think another good one is www.svetlanasbrides.com   It is free to write but if you marry one of her chicks you are to pay her a fee of about $ 400.00 +/-   (Around that but I would need to look to give you the exact amount)   Those are some of the ones I would recommend. 

[catzenmouse]

Part of the problem with recommending an agency is that you may have had great luck with agency A and the next guy will scream scam agency about the same place. For the most part you will find good and bad girls on every site. The biggest thing (mentioned earlier) is to stay away from the agencies who are scam to begin with.

Check out some agencies and see which ones you like then ask about any experiences the members have had with that agency.

Ken

[JustPlaneCrazy]

There have been enough discussions about scammers that I will try and not take this off topic other than to say that in my case, I am an over the hill dude who as jb keeps harping about persists in chasing young chicks which does let me run into more scammers than most guys will.  I would suggest to Crazy that he does not spend too much time worrying about something happening to him like happens to me a lot.  Just follow the rule not to send money to someone you have never met.  Sending airline tickets bought with your credit card in her name probably is not real unsafe.

Since we are supposed to be talking about agencies and web sites I will get back on that.  Elena's will have some scammers but all in all seems to have far more people who like it than don't.  I use www.freepersonals.ru   I like the price.  I am a cheapskate anyway.  I have heard good things about Merrydating.  I have heard good things about APrettyWoman  I have used eecl.org in the past which is mostly free.   I think another good one is www.svetlanasbrides.com   It is free to write but if you marry one of her chicks you are to pay her a fee of about $ 400.00 +/-   (Around that but I would need to look to give you the exact amount)   Those are some of the ones I would recommend. 

I was speaking of sites to email women, not agencies to go on tours.

I found my first girlfriend on A Pretty Woman, I was just wondering everybodies opinion which I appreciate much!

I will try Elena's like Pee Wee, but I am also a cheap skate and haven't ponyed up the $95.

I am like you Turbo, I like the younger ones......LOL!  I'm 45, I look at 26-35 yo women.......
Had a couple 18 year olds email me but I shut that down real quick as I would never be able to explain that to family and friends

All kidding aside, I would really like to find my one and only, I'm real tired of this email dating stuff.....
Would like to find a real, honest loving Russian woman and head over their this year to spend time.....I had a great time over 4 years with my last girlfriend and I saw many things I had never seen before, loved Poland and Moscow, would love to visit St. Petersburg...Took my woman to Egypt, it was OK but American's were not very welcomed there and it was hot and dirty! (most everyone thought I was Russian as I was on a Russian tour)

[Turboguy]

There are some free sites you can have fairly good results with.  I mentioned freepersonals.ru but sometimes the problems with sites like that is there are too many cheapskates like you and I and the girls can get buried in letters.

St Petersburg is great.   Hope you make it there. 

[Muj]

TG, I have heard of resellers but the Crazy's question had to do with avoiding scammers in the writing phase and of finding agencies and I answered accordingly not getting to far ahead and metioning potential issues all the way into marriage. Also the resellers problems deal with the money issues I talked about. Women who are always needing money for something. I can assure you guys. If you find a woman who knows how to take care of herself without your money, you could have found a gem and the chances of getting scammed go way down.

Engaged, I would consider insincere women and pro daters in a different class than scammers. Those women are actually looking for a man but they will usually marry the man that gives or spends the most on them. Did you read the recent trip report in the other forum? The guy wasn't getting along with the woman and she then takes him shopping and asks him to buy the most expensive shoes at $400. He bought it and then dumps her. People are cheering him on that he's a great guy by the way he treats a woman he dumps. He even believed she'll marry him in a week. I called her the pro dater(not scammer) that she was. He willingly, not intentionally, spent his money on the shoes. It would be a scam if she returned the shoes for the cash which is deception but it's hard to return something in the FSU after it's bought and especially if it's used.

Sure BillyB, all expectations involve behaving as gentlemen and ladies.  Didn't read the post though.  The guy wastes time and money on any of the 3 cases we mention here, other than the sincere woman of course.  All 3 cases cheat not only the guy but also a sincere woman in meeting a descent man.  If she will actually marry a man than she is not insincere but picky.  If she knows in advance the guy earns to little for her to marry him but still dates him for gifts and and expensive dinners in lieu of marrying him than she's a scamming pro dater.

[BillyB]

Engaged, I used to call a pro dater's scammers too. Most normal people like the majority of men and women here understand what it is to be a gentleman or a lady but I have come to realize some people, men and women, actually think it's normal to shop/receive for the most expensive gifts on dates. Some women actually believe they are doing nothing wrong when seeing "how much" a man love$ her. After calling the woman in question a "pro dater" in the other forum, I got ripped by some people and some people classified her as a "princess" because she's used to that treatment from men as if it's no fault of hers. That woman may have thought she's acting like a lady with sophisticated tastes without the intent to scam. But regardless, some call her a scammer, some call her a pro dater, and others call her a princess. Go figure? A RW has even complimented on the man's generosity in that thread.

Crazy, A pretty woman has a decent reputation if you choose to go with them again.

[Muj]

I see your point BB.   But $$'s or shopping sprees...