Planning a first visit

[msmob]

I don't know why people here get a feeling that I try to persuade someone to avoid Ukraine. The opposite is the truth. I think it's a great country to visit and Ukrainian women are great too for dating and marriage. I'm just being objective and try to show both sides of a coin.

Because as a westerner I'd advise anyone to go yo Kyiv. first trip - unless there is a pressing reason - in the form of a  specific lady - to go elsewhere..


Kyiv isn't as big and I feel no less safe in either- as a a western chap


I personally prefer Kyiv - having not experienced attempts to rip me off - like I  KEEP experiencing in Moscow


For sure - I'd  not advise any guy to exclude Russia - just avoid Moscow - other than using it as a gateway, perhaps - it is quicker to clear passport control, there, too normally - until you are with your lady.


I prefer SPb ( Piter) any day

[treadmilldude]

My flight leaves for Minsk in Mid-December. I'll be staying 28 days in Minsk, from Mid-December to Mid-January.

Have my Passport and Belarussian Visa. Have had my round-trip plane tickets for quite awhile now. For you folks saying "I cannot travel to Belarus because it requires a Visa, therefore I must travel to Ukraine because it is Visa-Free"......IMO this is pretty silly, as it was extremely quick and painless for me to get my Belarussian Visa with the help of a local company in my city who did both my Passport and Visa and held my hand every step of the way since I had never done any of this before.

I am extremely excited as this is my first time to ever leave the Continental United States. I am also pretty scared as this is my first time to ever leave the Continental United States. Belarussian Women hold a very special place in my heart. I was never treated with anywhere near the kindness by Ukrainian women as I have been treated by Belarussian women. That could be unique to me as, who knows, on average Ukrainian women might be just as kind and loving as Belarussian women. I dunno, never been to Ukraine or Belarus and have no experience in person. But Belarussian women have been extremely kind to me, many have been like Mother Figures to me since they know I don't know what I am doing, I am absolutely clueless in this endeavor, they know I am very green around the ears and when I get off the plane in Minsk the evening of December 11th, they and I both know I am going to have the terrified "Deer in the Headlights" look on my face.

Anyways, Belarussian women have given me so much good advice. I have become pretty good friends with several Minsk women I met on Mamba and VK. Even though with some of these women, we are well aware we are not compatible as a Husband and a Wife and when we meet, it will strictly be as friends, these Minsk women amaze me as they simply want to help me and have gone out of their way to help me..in particular 2 women, whom after chatting extensively with, we mutually agreed we would not be a good Husband and Wife, but would make terrific, very close friends....these 2 girls just took it upon themselves to introduce me to a few of their very thin/skinny/slender and very cute single (no child, no BF, no husband) girlfriends on VK and did all the legwork for me in writing the initial letters to their GF's on VK, telling them all about me, giving them my VK profile so their GF's could decide for themselves if they wanted to give me a chance and get to know me.

I hear all of this talk about Ukraine and Russia. Easily, greater than 99% of Men in this journey travel to either Russia or Ukraine. It is a shame that less than 1% of Men, in my estimation, travel to Belarus. There are a lot of beautiful, very kind, sweet and loving women in Belarus who very badly want to be Wives and Mothers. I think there is a chance that some of these Western men traveling to Russia and Ukraine could have success if they did pursue a Belarussian woman.

2tallBill, MiniMe just keeps getting more and more handsome. I really enjoy looking at all of the pictures you post of your little Boy. It is just always fun for me to look at little kids' pictures. I hope you continue to post pics of your handsome little Son, as it brings a lot of joy, happiness and laughter into my life to look at his pictures. Thank you Bill so much for sharing a small piece of your life with me and the other members of RWD.

Hey, our Guy did it last night! Trump did it! 

[Hammer2722]

Good luck in Minsk. Its a very nice city. Remember that you will have to buy the medical insurance which is located at the window just before you get to passport control. Also remember that you will have to report your passport within a few days of arriving in Minsk. Perhaps one of the ladies you will meet can take to to the proper ministry building to do that.

My girl's dad did that for me since he was the one who sent me the official invitation.

[Hammer2722]

I hear all of this talk about Ukraine and Russia. Easily, greater than 99% of Men in this journey travel to either Russia or Ukraine. It is a shame that less than 1% of Men, in my estimation, travel to Belarus. There are a lot of beautiful, very kind, sweet and loving women in Belarus who very badly want to be Wives and Mothers. I think there is a chance that some of these Western men traveling to Russia and Ukraine could have success if they did pursue a Belarussian woman.

Hey, our Guy did it last night! Trump did it! 

There are a lot of Turkish men and Arabs visiting and even living in Minsk so don't believe that its an un-fished pond......

[treadmilldude]

Hammer, I hope to be as blessed as you some day. Your Belarussian GF (LOL I keep forgetting she is your GF and not your Wife. I just typed Wife, then I had to go back and change what I typed) looks very pretty and attractive. I know you have told me through PM that she is also an extremely kind, sweet, loving woman who brings a tremendous amount of happiness into your life, and without her, your life would be a lot emptier.

I am looking for exactly what you found Hammer, a fantastic, incredible woman in Minsk. I hope to be as blessed as you and find her. There are many excellent women in Minsk. It is all on me to find one and win her heart, make her love me and convince her, with no doubts, that I love her with all of my heart. It's all on me. I have to be better than the men she dates locally in Minsk.

You are basically wrong about one thing. Belarus really is a pond that is barely fished in.   

http://belarusdigest.com/story/why-do-so-few-tourists-visit-belarus-21079   

[msmob]

I hear all of this talk about Ukraine and Russia. Easily, greater than 99% of Men in this journey travel to either Russia or Ukraine. It is a shame that less than 1% of Men, in my estimation, travel to Belarus. There are a lot of beautiful, very kind, sweet and loving women in Belarus who very badly want to be Wives and Mothers. I think there is a chance that some of these Western men traveling to Russia and Ukraine could have success if they did pursue a Belarussian woman.

TMD - you haven't BEEN there- yet are doing your usual - recommendations !


Better wait until you've been to at least one other nation before suggesting a difference in hospitality !


I'd agree that less guys go to BL - so are more of a rarity - as are guys going to other Russian cities other than Piter and Moscow..   


Personally, I think you are brave or crazy to go - so long - for the first time - as you will be a babe in th woods and SO reliant on native speakers to look after you. I can get by in Russian but still find it a 'win' when I catch the right Marshrutka -small bus  or metro (subway) to the right place - without asking for help


I'm not shy and it can be frustrating and boring to have to wait for someone you'll rely on. But then - there's no better way to learn - than to live 'native' !


Good luck!

[treadmilldude]

Thank you Moby. You are one of the guys on RWD I really look up to and respect greatly. You always are very generous and gracious with your time by giving me lots of much-appreciated advice. I especially appreciate your advice because you have so much experience and knowledge about the FSU....and look at you, you are a winner, Moby!! You traveled to Russia and were able to marry a really thin, skinny, beautiful Russian woman.

So you are definitely THE MAN Moby. I am not THE MAN. But hopefully some day soon I will be. 

[jone]

Hammer, I hope to be as blessed as you some day. Your Belarussian GF (LOL I keep forgetting she is your GF and not your Wife. I just typed Wife, then I had to go back and change what I typed) looks very pretty and attractive. I know you have told me through PM that she is also an extremely kind, sweet, loving woman who brings a tremendous amount of happiness into your life, and without her, your life would be a lot emptier.

I am looking for exactly what you found Hammer, a fantastic, incredible woman in Minsk. I hope to be as blessed as you and find her. There are many excellent women in Minsk. It is all on me to find one and win her heart, make her love me and convince her, with no doubts, that I love her with all of my heart. It's all on me. I have to be better than the men she dates locally in Minsk.

You are basically wrong about one thing. Belarus really is a pond that is barely fished in.   

http://belarusdigest.com/story/why-do-so-few-tourists-visit-belarus-21079   

How apropos that you write in the the thread "Planning your first visit". 

[krimster2]

YES/DA/JA/OUI,

“However, when the best selling beer is basically water, you might want to spare me your advice”

The beer market in the USA is highly regulated and controlled.  Some brands have MUCH greater distribution than others (which contributes to their popularity), and mass market brands are also much cheaper than premium brands.  The beer buying habits of a 21 year old college student, or a lower income person, do not favor the consumption of premium brands.  Greater distribution of mass market brands and lower prices equals increased consumption (hence it’s popularity). So you are making a moral judgment about a culture over issues that are driven by economics.  If you think America is such a flawed culture based upon what it’s most often consumed beer tastes like, then why are you using American computer chips in your PC?  I mean why would you trust semiconductors from a country where Budweiser is a popular brand?  Why don’t you use Russian semiconductor chips?  Oh, wait a second, I know why!!  There aren’t any!!!!

On this board, I see your antagonism towards anything not Russian, and your obviously false sense of superiority on display, and your feeble attempt at bullying others.  All of that of course stems from a feeling of insecurity and low self esteem, or are you just emulating the people around you?  Either way, the rest of us understands who and what you are, so go ahead make some more speeches, it gives us something to laugh about!!
 

[papakota]

msmob,
Part of the misunderstanding is possibly due to our different perspectives. My perspective is one of a resident of Russia. Hopefully soon I'd be a citizen here. So when we discuss Russia vs. Ukraine, I'm looking at it from that kind of perspective. Most guys here just come for SHORT visits. When I came to Ukraine for the first time after my emigration from USSR I spent 3 months there. And I really felt it was too short.

 

[msmob]

msmob,
Part of the misunderstanding is possibly due to our different perspectives.

))


If you bothered to check I nearly spent half last year in Russia.... I adore living in Sochi - my 'issue; is with folks whose 'perspectives' seem to overlook glaring gaps in ...perspective.




That can be guys who suggest the Kerch Bridges aren't being constructed - linking Krasnodar Oblast to Crimea - or posters who visit Kyiv and persist in calling it 'Kiev'
when they know the difference is highly significant .......

[msmob]

Thank you Moby. You are one of the guys on RWD I really look up to and respect greatly. You always are very generous and gracious with your time by giving me lots of much-appreciated advice. I especially appreciate your advice because you have so much experience and knowledge about the FSU....and look at you, you are a winner, Moby!! You traveled to Russia and were able to marry a really thin, skinny, beautiful Russian woman.

So you are definitely THE MAN Moby. I am not THE MAN. But hopefully some day soon I will be.

'THE MAN' is the guy who receives praise from his long-term partner or kids ..


I am genuinely intrigued as to reading your first impressions and other experiences and wish you well

[danieln_2000]

Hi, I’ve been off busy planning different parts of this trip. I wanted to offer an update and say thank you to everyone who has contributed to this thread. I appreciate your suggestions. I will attempt to thank a number of you here. Whenever, I do something like this, I worry that I may miss someone. So, if I missed you 

Larry1: Quite possibly some members can recommend an interpreter, but if not you can look at fiverr.com.

BillyB: Thank you for advising to stay away from agency translators. And also for the advice to build the friendship with her before by calling or skyping her.

msmob:  thank you for the welcome. This is an interesting trip, as meeting women is not the purpose. However, I’m trying to add that on. Having said that I’ve squeezed on a few extra days to it. Moscow or Kyiv? I’ll actually briefly visit both cities. I’ll be in Moscow for longer, and that is where I am currently planning to meet a woman. I am hoping my visa will arrive shortly. Also, thank you for the additional tips. And your preference for St. Petersburg. Perhaps my next trip I can get over to that city.

oso: Thank you for the advice on meeting women. And, perhaps on a future trip, I will travel west. Also, thank you for the Airbnb tip. I found an apartment that appears to be nicer than a hotel, that had lots of good reviews. Also, thank you for suggestion to order a taxi. I also like the observation to be suspicious of the woman can’t meet me at the airport.

Chicagoguy: For Moscow, I will be in an “American” hotel that I have been told speaks English. And, thank you for the taxi suggestion. And, my plan is to stay in Moscow for this portion of the trip. It is also interesting to hear that you became the guide for Russian women in Moscow. As I tend to spend a little more when I travel, I will definitely look to see if the woman is cheaper than me. I would like to end up with some degree of financial compatibility, and I don’t want a woman expecting me to spend more than I usually do.

Anotherkiwi: I appreciate you sharing your travel experiences. I will see if I can squeeze in the time to learn the Cyrillic alphabet prior to leaving.

papakota: Thank you for sharing your ideas and experiences on both Russia and Ukraine. It is also interesting that you mention Belarus. There are some attractive women there. So, I don’t know where my future travel will end up.

2tallbill: First, thank you for sharing your pictures. It is nice to add faces to discussions. And congratulations on what you have accomplished. And, I wish you all the best for your future. And, I also like that you shared the reason you are here, that is to help others because you received advice when you were searching.

Trenchcoat: Thank you for your suggestions. I’ll be sticking to airport cities on this trip. And, thank you for the travel tips.

Treadmilldude: Congratulations on you first trip out of the Continental United States! If I don’t find Ms. Right on this trip, there is a very good chance I will visit Belarus next. So, it would be wonderful if you could share some of your experiences. That is also very insightful to make some good female friends who are not necessarily a good match to be my wife material. Especially since women love to play matchmaker. I may have to do that one day.

[treadmilldude]

danieln_2000, you come across as a very kind, caring and humble Man. Those are noble characteristic traits. I am a firm believer that when it comes to relationships with women, nice guys do not always get run over and do not always finish last (even though quite a few times I have gotten run over by women for being "too nice" according to girls I have dated). I think quite often, nice guys finish first and they do get the great girl in the end. I have faith in you that you are gonna finish first, you are going to get the great girl in the end. You are going to find a wonderful, sweet, loving young woman in whatever Slavic country/city you visit. I just have a good feeling about you Daniel, the way you carry yourself here on the board, the kindness you express to every member here. I think you are a Good Man and you are going to do very well, I have complete faith in the fact that "nice guys" eventually will find success in the FSU. Maybe not on the first trip. Maybe not even on the second trip. But eventually, "nice guys" like you and I, while certainly not appreciated for being a nice guy by every woman, will eventually find that great woman in the FSU who does appreciate us for being a "nice guy".

I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers, Daniel, to have a lot of success with at least one great Woman on your trip. Good luck, I am praying for you and wishing you a lot of success Daniel !!

By the way, I think you are going to make a lot of friends here on RWD because of the way you carry yourself - with a lot of class and kindness.

[2tallbill]

2tallBill, MiniMe just keeps getting more and more handsome.

Hey, our Guy did it last night! Trump did it! 

Thanks for the compliment and good luck on your trip

How about them Cowboys!!

[papakota]

I prefer SPb ( Piter) any day

Are you aware that in SPb and in Leningrad region HIV rates are about twice higher than in Moscow and Moscow region? It's according to Russian official statistics:

http://hivmo.ru/article/view/3?Type_id=1

[papakota]

treadmilldude,

Good luck in Belarus!

As per Belorussian women and dating in Belarus... Women there are extremely attractive, but my personal experience was that it's harder to get along with them than with women in Russia and even Ukraine. Moldova and Belarus I find the hardest places in that sense in a whole European part of former USSR. Another thing is... If I were you, I would go there for 3 months period (if visa regime allows it). What if you meet someone later towards the end of your one month stay? Of course, same can happen even if you get a 3 months visa (that's exactly what happened to me in Ukraine in 2005), but still...

I think the biggest issue with Belarus is that its government is TOTALLY against their women leaving the country for good (emigrating from Belarus). Interestingly enough, they don't care if local women emigrate, say, to Moscow or to Kiev. Official propaganda calls it an exploitation of women and blah, blah, blah. Lukashenko that way presents himself as a savior of pure souls of local female victims. Of course, it's all BS, but... Just so you know.
In short, if I were you I wouldn't be considering Belarus as some sort of a paradise in that sense.
What's definitely better in Belarus than in Russia is that prices in Belarus are MUCH lower (if it makes you feel better). Try not to break the law in Belarus. I heard that courts there issue very harsh sentences, even comparing to Russia.

One more thing. To the defenders of Ukrainian language (though you can't even speak it), in Belarus there are two official languages - Russian and Belorussian. Never heard any complaints from Belorussians about that. Funny, but I understand not bad Belorussian language, since it's very much like Ukrainian (here we have a Belorussian TV station "Belarus 24").

[msmob]

Are you aware that in SPb and in Leningrad region HIV rates are about twice higher than in Moscow and Moscow region? It's according to Russian official statistics:

http://hivmo.ru/article/view/3?Type_id=1

Dear Papakota


thanks for raising something all members seeing new partners need to remember - when you 'sleep' with someone - you are sleeping with everyone they have sleep with .... there are precautions one can take ..


However, my 'advice' re Spb was related to the 'ambiance' / character of the city and it's interest visually....

[papakota]

Dear Papakota


thanks for raising something all members seeing new partners need to remember - when you 'sleep' with someone - you are sleeping with everyone they have sleep with .... there are precautions one can take ..


However, my 'advice' re Spb was related to the 'ambiance' / character of the city and it's interest visually....

You're welcome! Okay, but you will be visiting SPb not only for sightseeing. This is a dating forum, not a cultural exchange place.

[msmob]

Okay, but you will be visiting SPb not only for sightseeing. This is a dating forum, not a cultural exchange place.

?


This is (was?) a forum discussing 'Russian' women - not just dating 'em, but getting married, life as a married couple and even if it goes 'bad' ..


Along with that came tips on Russian customs. idioms and great places to visit.






Hopefully, we can get back to that as it is nearly two years until the next US presidential selection process starts....

[Nightwish]

?


This is (was?) a forum discussing 'Russian' women - not just dating 'em, but getting married, life as a married couple and even if it goes 'bad' ..


Along with that came tips on Russian customs. idioms and great places to visit.






Hopefully, we can get back to that as it is nearly two years until the next US presidential selection process starts....

Really? Could have fooled me 

[treadmilldude]

papakota, thank you for the good luck wishes. I am excited yet apprehensive, so I need all the luck and prayers I can get. I will shoot you a PM this weekend. Your information about Belarus is very interesting, and also very critical to me, so I have a bunch of questions to ask you. Don't wanna ask them on the open board so I will send you a PM or 2, if you don't mind answering them.

Yes, your information concerns / worries me, but I am not chickening out now. My plane tickets are non-refundable, as is my Visa and Belarussian Passport as well as my apartment on airbnb. Plus, I have committed to see these women, and a man is only as good as his word. Life is already difficult in Belarus, socioeconomic conditions, while not nearly as bad as Ukraine, are still not good in Belarus. And these women have difficult lives. I will not make their lives more difficult by not showing up. Plus, I am genuinely excited to go. I have been treated so kindly by every, and I mean every, Belarussian woman I have ever dealt with, that if I don't meet my future Wife on this trip, it's OK. I know I will make some very good friends at the very least on this first trip, that I can visit on subsequent trips to Belarus. I think it is OK for me to be nervous, it's OK for me to be a little scared. The thing that counts is I am "Getting my ass on a plane" as about 65,000 members here on RWD have told me is the most important piece of advice they could ever give me. Hopefully, on my second trip, the butterflies in my stomach will not be as bad when I step off the plane at Minsk airport.

I am very lonely. I hate not having a Wife. I hate not having Children. I do not enjoy the life of a Bachelor. I do not enjoy being childless. And I am not going to screw this up with the woman I meet and fall in love with. They have already asked me about sex on this 1st trip, and I have told each woman it is my desire to wait until my 3rd trip or even our wedding night before we are intimate for the first time. Some were relieved when I told them this. Some were upset and let me know in no uncertain terms this was not acceptable to them, that they wanted intimacy on the first trip because they do find me very attractive. Ultimately, it is THEIR decision, not my decision. I'll let the woman decide if we will be intimate on the first trip. She is the Woman, and thus she gets to make that decision. But I am hoping her decision will be to wait until our wedding night. I have screwed some relationships up by having sex too early on in the relationship. I am an old man and I am not getting any younger. I do not want to screw things up this time with the Belarussian woman I spend 28 days with in December and January. I am just too old to screw it up this time with sex. Mistakes are fine when you are in your 20's. Repeating the same mistakes you have made when you are 38....that is not good. Not good at all.

So I'll shoot you a couple PM's about Belarus this weekend. Thank you in advance for taking your time to answer my questions Papakota. I know you are a very busy man, your time is very valuable, and I am very grateful for your time to help me. (Did not know the word grateful is spelled grateful..spell check told me greatful is the wrong spelling. I never knew that!!  )

2TallBill, yes Our Cowboys are playing well. Dak is having a great year (#2 ranked QB in the NFL according to QBR). Our Offensive line is really amazing. Teams are consistently putting 8 men in the box on 1st and 2nd down...you are not supposed to be able to run the ball when the defense stacks 8 men in the box.....but Dallas is very unique and is probably the ONLY team in the NFL that can consistently and successfully run the football with 8 defenders up near the line of scrimmage. Not only are we able to run the ball when teams completely sell out on Defense to stop the run, but Ezekiel actually leads the NFL in rushing....as a rookie!! Our offensive line is our MVP so far this season IMHO, not Zeke and not Dak, as great as they have both been. No, IMO, our offensive line is our MVP. I am worried about the left side of our O-line at the moment, as Tyron and Ronald are both injured at the moment (Tyron has had a herniated disc in his back since about week 4 and has been playing in chronic pain - he is our BEST OLineman IMO. In the offseason, Tyron will definitely require surgery on his back. I know all too much about ruptured and herniated discs in your back...I had to have a lumbar hemilaminectomy on my lower back in 2000 from blowing my back out from extremely deep free weight squatting in the gym. I had a herniated L4-L5 Disc and a ruptured L5-S1 disc. It sucked, I lived in terrible, chronic, constant pain for about 10 months from the sciatica, until I just couldn't take it any more, my physical therapy exercises stopped working to modulate some of the pain, and I just gave up and had the surgery. Tyron will definitely get much better after the surgery.)

They think that Ronald will be able to play on Sunday against Pittsburgh (concussion from last Sunday's game). This is the official report from ESPN as of about 10:30 AM this morning: "Cowboys left tackle Tyron Smith is expected to do more in practice today but he is dealing with a hip flexor strain in addition to the back tightness he has been working through. Left guard Ronald Leary has been cleared to practice after suffering a concussion last week." So Ronald, it sounds like, will definitely play, and Tyron, as he is thankfully a very tough guy, I think will play as well. But we will have Chaz Green waiting in the background in case Tyron's herniated disc and the accompanying sciatica flares up during the game. Just saying the words "Herniated discs" brings back terrible memories for me. 

Bill, MiniMe is so handsome, he is adorable. I am envious of you Bill, I would be on top of the world if, in maybe 3 or 4 years, a wonderful girl from Minsk (I marry) and I have a beautiful little baby boy like MiniMe. You said he is 18 months-old. Is this your first child Bill? You mentioned your lovely Russian Wife is 41, is this her first child? If so, I think that is very cool as each of you had your first child together!! That is the fairy-tale romance / marriage Bill.....meet a lovely Russian woman, court her for a couple years, marry her, and have a beautiful, healthy child together. You could not possibly be any more blessed in life, Bill. 

Would you mind PMing me the link of Angel Eyes's pictures? Thank you Bill, I appreciate it. I have read bits and pieces of your incredibly long trip report, but it is just so long, I have not gotten around to reading all of it. Maybe 40% of it. It is very funny, I laugh my head off as I am reading it. I think you and ML have the 2 best senses of humor on RWD. ML likewise makes me laugh non-stop with his posts. I just cannot stop laughing at ML's posts, I love that guy. I think if I met ML in real life, he would have me doubled over in stitches. Anyways, I have searched all over for Angel Eyes' pictures, but I still cannot find them anywhere. I have never even seen a picture of Angel Eyes. You are a handsome guy though Bill, so I have no doubt she is a lovely lady.

Thank you Bill for your warm wishes and kindness. You have always been incredibly kind to me, both on the open board as well as through PM. Your kindness is very much appreciated, thank you. I plan on using a lot of the knowledge I acquired in your trip report to my advantage in Belarus, Bill. So thank you as well for your excellent trip report!! Hopefully a lot of newbies, not just me, can read and learn a lot from your trip report!! Thanks so much Bill. 

treadmilldude

By the way, as much as I like little boys, my dream has always been to have 2 little girls. Little girls are the best IMO.

[papakota]

treadmilldude,
Sure, you can ask me anything you like. I never said that you shouldn't go. I just told you stuff that I think could be useful for you to know. If I were you I wouldn't wait with sex. 'cos it's pretty much the only way to know if she's serious. I'm not saying it must be on your first date, of course. The only problem with sex is that you might meet a serial dater, a slut who would bang you for a few days and then she would disappear. So it would be very hard if you had feelings for her. That's what happened to me in Ukraine. One young woman came to me (she even had to travel for a few hours on a bus) and she went straight to bed with me, hardly had time to take a shower after a long trip. She spent couple of days with me, mostly in bed and then she left and disappeared. For her it was just some fun to fxxk a foreign guy, kinda exotic, that's all. But it's unlikely you'd meet someone like her. Usually if a lady is willing for sex, it means that she takes you seriously and she hopes it works out with you. Just don't push it. Give it time.

[ML]

Delaying sex with a woman/man until after marriage is pure foolishness.

Sexual incompatibilities (not talking about physical) are a leading cause of divorce.

And, the incompatibilities will not even be revealed by just a few 'standard bangs.'

I hear some talk that sex has ruined an otherwise good relationship.  I can't understand or relate to that at all.

And note:  I am not saying that sex has to be on first, second, third or on any given number dates.

But it must occur many, many, many times before marriage or even engagement.

[papakota]

Delaying sex with a woman/man until after marriage is pure foolishness.

Sexual incompatibilities (not talking about physical) are a leading cause of divorce.

And, the incompatibilities will not even be revealed by just a few 'standard bangs.'

I hear some talk that sex has ruined an otherwise good relationship.  I can't understand or relate to that at all.

And note:  I am not saying that sex has to be on first, second, third or on any given number dates.

But it must occur many, many, many times before marriage or even engagement.

Very true!
Why do you spell "great" as "grate"?