Mikhail Saakashvili - Reformer or Looking Out for #1?

[Madlen]

" ...most Georgians had a family member who was locked up when Saakashvili took power...".

Of cource. Georgia was corrupted as well as russia and ukraine, not less.

To heal the body, you need to clean it.

[Boethius]

Fighting corruption.

I wrote about it. And in Odessa (Ukrain) he made the same activity. He destroyed many factions.
Corruption is octopus, it's dangerous to fight against it, but he fought.

Arrest warrants are written not by ordinary people.

I can't speak for Georgia as I don't follow it closely, but in Odesa, Saakashvili brought his gang of throat cutting leeches from Georgia with him.  He was there to enrich himself, not fight corruption.  He was appointed governor of Odesa because the Americans wanted it, not because Ukraine was intent on fighting corruption.

My husband fishes all summer.  He meets many people when fishing, who usually ask him questions on lures.  He was fishing when a man who spoke almost no English approached him.  As my husband couldn't understand him, he asked what languages the man speaks (my husband speaks several languages fluently).  The man was Georgian, so they had a lengthy conversation.  The Georgian told my husband that under Saakashvili, corruption was rampant, and killings were common.  Most of that stopped once he was forced from power.

[mhr7]

The Georgian told my husband that under Saakashvili, corruption was rampant, and killings were common.  Most of that stopped once he was forced from power.

I was working in Georgia in 2012 when Saakashvili was voted out of power. One of the biggest scandals at the time was the torture taking place in Georgia's biggest prison, all of which was caught on videotape.  The opposition exploited this big time.

[mhr7]

I can't speak for Georgia as I don't follow it closely, but in Odesa, Saakashvili brought his gang of throat cutting leeches from Georgia with him.  He was there to enrich himself, not fight corruption.  He was appointed governor of Odesa because the Americans wanted it, not because Ukraine was intent on fighting corruption.

Are you sure about this? From what I've read it seems that Saakashvili was very good at fighting corruption and this was to the dislike of the oligarchs who benefited from such corruption. He then turned his anti-corruption campaign against the government in Kiev, which is what lead to his his downfall.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-ukraine-saakashvili/saakashvili-plans-to-unite-ukraine-opposition-against-president-idUSKCN1BM21Z

[Madlen]

We can talk a lot. Anyway, we do not know the truth (100%). We can only analyze events and draw   our own conclusions.

But....there is reality: how was country and how it is now.

I am sure, there is no one politician, who genuinely fights for improving the life of the country and the people.
But there are people so-so, 50-50 or 40-60. And they make somethinggggg good. It is better, then nothing.


About opinion of different people...

Stalin's death was a tragedy for our people. He was a favorite. My grandfather told me about that event.
But, a lot of people hated him, because their relatives died in a gulag or were repressed and killed by Beria.

So, how we can say: he was good or bad for our country?

I think, he made his mission (unknown for us).

[Madlen]

But we are off topic of Maxx2 .

[Maxx2]

But we are off topic of Maxx2 .

Oh I didn't mind, but on second thought after you brought up the subject on it being "offtopic" might distract from posting all my interesting photos.   Threads like mine can get bogged down with debates on side issues that go on page after page.

Saakaahvili was like Donald Trump if Trump decided to bypass Congress and all the judges and use his Justice Department and being Commander-in-Chief to get things done. He wasn't above threatening a multimillionaire, billionaire oligarch with have all their assets frozen if they decided to not pay a huge fine for their participating in corruption. Of course the participated in corruption because everything in Georgia was corupt. The money going to building projects Saakashvili favored.

I heard the other day from a Russian woman who lives in Batumi is that Saakashvili would fly over Batumi, his pet project city, in his helicopter checking on the progress of the construction. If thing weren't progressing fast enough he wanted to know why. Then he'd clear the road block. The guy was really dynamic.

Here is an excerpt from Nomad-Capitalist:

http://nomadcapitalist.com/2014/12/03/georgia-one-capitalist-countries-world/

It didn’t take long after gaining independence in 1991 for Georgian politicians to realize they needed to do something great to put themselves on the map. After all, fifty percent of the Georgian workforce is involved in agriculture (16 to 50 times the developed world average), while farmland here isn’t as high quality as Ukraine. As a result, workers are gradually moving to the cities. However, many of these workers won’t have jobs waiting for them, and it’s not as if Georgia is as cheap a place to manufacture low-cost goods as, say, Bangladesh.That’s why, in 2004, the Georgia government slashed the number of taxes from 21 to just six in order to stimulate the economy. Gone is the byzantine tax structure that once existed. In its place is a simply, easy to understand tax system that includes just the basics: a flat 20% personal income tax, a flat 15% corporate profits tax, and several other low income taxes. As a result, Georgia has become one of the most capitalist countries in the world. Just walking around the capital city of Tbilisi the last few days has shown an exercise in efficiency. Opening a bank account here is super easy. You can be in and out in less than an hour – soup to nuts – and several of the larger banks offer excellent online banking services, debit cards you can use anywhere on earth, and accounts in practically any currency you want. Want another account once you leave Tbilisi? No problem; just add one in your internet banking. If you’ve ever walked into some offshore bank and been told you don’t qualify to open an account because you don’t have a local job or because you’re a US person, Georgia will come as a welcome surprise. On top of the ease and efficiency of opening an account, the larger banks stay open until 8pm most days. I’m told there are even a few 24-hour options available. And ATMs are everywhere here in the city. So are bill pay machines. All up and down the city streets, you can pay your mobile phone or utility bill at one of an endless number of machines that make the process easy. Everything here runs efficiently. The country’s Public Service Hall, where you can form a corporation or apply for residency, looks more like a well-run airport check-in area than a government office. In addition to cafes and bank branches, this government office has each business function conveniently set up in pods where you take a number, then go to the appropriate area for what you need. Wait times are practically zero, even when the place is teeming with life. While Georgia is not a tax haven and doesn’t have a de facto policy toincorporate companies  in five minutes like The Gambia promises, you can pay more to speed up practically any service. Want to form your company in a matter of hours? A few extra bucks and you’re done. Take the papers, head to the bank, and open your account. You could literally start an entire company, bank account and all, in one day here. All for around $500. Want to apply for a second residency, but don’t want to wait two or three months for an answer? For $100-200 more, you can get an answer within days ]Even citizenship applications can get a guaranteed answer within a matter of a week for a nominal fee. All this efficiency has western businesses taking notice. A recent survey of businessmen suggested that perception of corruption in Georgia is about as low as you can go. In a region that doesn’t have the best reputation, businesses give Georgia high marks. In fact, the country is, by one estimation, the fourth most free market in the world. One example of this is the fact that seemingly everyone here is in the money exchange business. Just walk down any main street and you’ll see signs offering to exchange dollars, euros, Turkish lira, and Russian rubles at close-to-spot rates. Some of these places are your typical money exchange businesses, while others are mom and pop operations. I changed $100 I got out of an ATM (all ATMs dispense cash in Georgian lari or US dollars) into lari in the back of a woman’s clothing store. No paperwork, no passport, no nonsense. Just ultra-low spreads and the free market at work. (Although the ability to speak a little Russian helps at times.) All the good that is above, is in large part due to the efforts of Saakashvili.

[Boethius]

Are you sure about this? From what I've read it seems that Saakashvili was very good at fighting corruption and this was to the dislike of the oligarchs who benefited from such corruption. He then turned his anti-corruption campaign against the government in Kiev, which is what lead to his his downfall.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-ukraine-saakashvili/saakashvili-plans-to-unite-ukraine-opposition-against-president-idUSKCN1BM21Z

Ask yourself what’s in it for him?  Each time, he propels himself to get to the trough.

[Maxx2]

Ask yourself what’s in it for him?  Each time, he propels himself to get to the trough.

That does not mean he didn't do good in Georgia. At one time Georgia was if not thee most corrupt place to do business, it certainly was high up the list. Now Georgia after Saakashvila is considered one of the least corrupt places to do business. I've asked around and I have as yet hear anyone tell me here they have to buy off a politician or pay an inspector a bribe to do business. The government just leaves people, for the most part, alone. Did you know if I over stay my stay (Americans, Ukrainians and others get 1 year residency when entering) there is a small fine of about $40. The border control people do not even make you pay it when you leave. But you got to pay it if you decide to enter Georgia again. The Law is very laid back about the rules, except corruption. The prisons are full of such people that Saakashvila put away. Was he hypocritical and had double standards with his friends? I have read that he was. But, he is still a hell of a reformer. 

[msmob]

Well, he's been deported from Ukraine, again ...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-europe-43048166/mikheil-saakashvili-deported-from-ukraine

"The former president of Georgia was detained at a Kiev restaurant by law enforcement agents in camouflage."