Differences between Russian and Western women?

[FunIndieBloke]

Hi everyone, I'm relatively new to this board, so I was just wondering about some of the differences us men who are new to this whole process should be aware of when courting Eastern European women.  What are the taboos?  Are their values different that what we Western men are used to and how so?  What are they looking for?  Is it exactly the same as western women?

I saw an advert for an ebook claiming to address this very issue, but I'm not willing to pay US $80 to read it!    So I just thought that I'd ask around here for people's experiences.

Thanks!

[PeeWee]

Hi everyone, I'm relatively new to this board, so I was just wondering about some of the differences us men who are new to this whole process should be aware of when courting Eastern European women.  What are the taboos?  Are their values different that what we Western men are used to and how so?  What are they looking for?  Is it exactly the same as western women?

I saw an advert for an ebook claiming to address this very issue, but I'm not willing to pay US $80 to read it!    So I just thought that I'd ask around here for people's experiences.

Thanks!

Is that Kenny? I thought that he was dead. Seems to me that you have so many questions that it might be more efficient for you to start searching the forum. Pick a topic and search. I would venture a guess that all of your questions have been asked and then answered many times over. I may offer to you one beware. That being to beware of the scam.

Peewee

[Jack]

Here, save yourself $80.

One man's opinion as to the difference between Russian and Ukraine women.

Once I remove the ladies from Moscow, St. Pete, Kiev, Odessa and western Ukraine from this equation I can say that in my opinion there is none, or very little, difference between Russian and Ukraine ladies. Ladies from Ufa, from Saratov, are just like ladies from Kharkov, from Krivoy Rog. Small town Russian girls are very much like small town Ukraine girls. Large city Russian ladies (cities of a million people) are very much like large city Ukraine ladies. 

Stalin, in an attempt to Russianize Ukraine forced millions and millions of Russians to relocate to Ukraine. It was either that or the gulag (or worse) so many Russian relocated per Stalins demands. Today in Ukraine MANY Ukraine ladies have grand-parents, great grand-parents who were some of the many millions of Russians who were forced to relocate to Ukraine.

During the cold war many Ukrainians moved to Russia. And of course, although a lot of Russians do not like hearing this, Ukraine is mother Russia.

When I was making my first trips to Ukraine I was not sure if I was to refer to the ladies as Russian or Ukraine women so I asked my future wife to be, amoung other ladies,  "are you Ukraine or Russian girl"? She was born and raised and Odessa and said she, and most all other ladies, considered themselves Russian girls.

I will say that times are bringing on changes and I think many Ukraine ladies will probably start to begin to feel they are more Ukraine ladies, they are now teaching the Ukraine language in many of the schools, well maybe not those in eastern Ukraine, and as such people are feeling more a sense of their own nationality. But when it comes down to the differences between the everyday Russian girl and everyday Ukraine girl, their is very little difference. I think you can love one just as easily as the other and both countries produce the worlds finest women.

[PeeWee]

I think that women are the same world over. They all basicly look the same. Differences may be on how they respond to their culture. Yet no matter where you go you can find a bisexual, bilingual, bipolar, female biped. That is the worst that you could hope to find in either the West or the East. The best that you could hope to find would the bisexual, in my opinion. But the biggest difference that I see between Western women and Eastern women is that Western women tend to wear cowboy boots, cowgirl boots, way more than Eastern women tend to.

Peewee

[Elen]

Here, save yourself $80.

One man's opinion as to the difference between Russian and Ukraine women.

Once I remove the ladies from Moscow, St. Pete, Kiev, Odessa and western Ukraine from this equation I can say that in my opinion there is none, or very little, difference between Russian and Ukraine ladies. Ladies from Ufa, from Saratov, are just like ladies from Kharkov, from Krivoy Rog. Small town Russian girls are very much like small town Ukraine girls. Large city Russian ladies (cities of a million people) are very much like large city Ukraine ladies. 

Stalin, in an attempt to Russianize Ukraine forced millions and millions of Russians to relocate to Ukraine. It was either that or the gulag (or worse) so many Russian relocated per Stalins demands. Today in Ukraine MANY Ukraine ladies have grand-parents, great grand-parents who were some of the many millions of Russians who were forced to relocate to Ukraine.

During the cold war many Ukrainians moved to Russia. And of course, although a lot of Russians do not like hearing this, Ukraine is mother Russia.

When I was making my first trips to Ukraine I was not sure if I was to refer to the ladies as Russian or Ukraine women so I asked my future wife to be, amoung other ladies,  "are you Ukraine or Russian girl"? She was born and raised and Odessa and said she, and most all other ladies, considered themselves Russian girls.

I will say that times are bringing on changes and I think many Ukraine ladies will probably start to begin to feel they are more Ukraine ladies, they are now teaching the Ukraine language in many of the schools, well maybe not those in eastern Ukraine, and as such people are feeling more a sense of their own nationality. But when it comes down to the differences between the everyday Russian girl and everyday Ukraine girl, their is very little difference. I think you can love one just as easily as the other and both countries produce the worlds finest women.

You should learn a history of the Ukraina by other books  in order not to sound such "odd" ( or at least prove your knowledges about Ukraina's "Russianize" with maps)

BTW for your inform - just you know such simple things - ukrainian and russian are TWO different nationalities wich could not be changed just by teaching other language ( I suspect a conception of "nationality" ( but not "citizenship@)  is hard to get by americans isn't it? )

PSS about who was whose "mother"  - it was called  Kievan RUS'  and Ukraina just means next to a boder ( of that very RUS' )

[Jack]

Elen did you know that the area where Moscow is today was part of the Kiev-Rus dynasty? Of course Moscow did not exist at that time, it came 500 years after Kiev and the Kiev-Rus dynasty.


And just for the heck of it Elen, I would like to hear your explanation as to where the name Russia came from.

[Elen]

Elen did you know that the area where Moscow is today was part of the Kiev-Rus dynasty? Of course Moscow did not exist at that time, it came 500 years after Kiev and the Kiev-Rus dynasty.


And just for the heck of it Elen, I would like to hear your explanation as to where the name Russia came from.

Yes I do aware that old RUSSIAN ( old slavis if you wish but no way old Ukrainan)  knyazya had residence in Kiev  that why those state called Kiev RUS
 And I can't get why you count Kiev RUS like an exclusive "property" exactly of ukrainians - try to find me a map where word Ukraina would be presented like independent state.
Also I know that now the Ukraina has about 5 times more territory thank to beeing a part of RUSSIAN empire in comparision to what it had had in Bogdan Hmelnitskyi 's times (the most significant times when you could speak about any "independent" ukrainian state)  THAT's the main reasons than there are so many russians at present Ukraina's territory but not due to "Stalin's Russianization "
The history of this territory is too complicate that you could simplify it like you did And anyway that history in VAST majority is  a history of fighting between Poland ( Liutva-Turkey-Sweden- .... and etc )  and Russian empire for domination in that territory but not a history of ukrainians fighting for their freedom  - кишка тонка у них была делать это самостоятельно 

[Jack]

hummmm something does not add up here Elen.   ???   
"Your aware that old Russian knyazya had residence in Kiev and that was why they called the area Kiev Rus", but Elen, how could that be? How could there be a Russian residence 400 years before there was anything called Russia or Russian, 500 years before a city called Moscow?   

Elen we are taking someone's good topic in another direction. Let me start a new topic, Elen's history lesson.

[Elen]

Main Gott  If you really think that Russia started from Moscow then you for sure must take some history lesson

If you want to call something like "mother of Russia" ( in a meaning of appearance the first STATE)  then it's not Kiev at all but NOVGOROD  - Russian city

here for you some short story how Kiev Rus appeared

before IX century there were no something which could be called like state at the territory of modern Russia and Ukraine You would drown in information if I started to name all those old Slavic nations. There were many ( for those time) towns with their own rulers but they could not keep their independence and suffered from forays of Varangians on the north and from  Hazards om the south or just were supposed to render tribute to them. 

In 862 ( or in 842 from other sources)  people in Novgorod banished Varangiansfrom their lands and as there was no good candidate for ruler among themselves they called for somebody "from the seas"  It was three brothers Rurik (got the main town Novgorod) Sineus ( town  Whitelake and Truvor ( town Izborsk)  ( historical argue till nowdays where exactly they came from)
 In 864 Ruric sent his two boyars - Askold and Dir - into marsh to Tzargrad ( other name Constantinople - now Stambul)  - other version those two just got piss at Rurik for something and left him. But on their road by river Dnepr  they met town Kiev and decided to stop there. Like it was wrote in chronicle " They saw a town and asked people whose were they People said " Our town was bulit by three men - Kyi-Tzhek and Horiv but they were dead long ago and now we are nobodies and render tribute to Hazards) So two Novgorod's rebels decided to organized their own kingdom
After Ruric's death in 879 and because of little ages of his son Igor knyz Oleg got a throne in Novgorod. Oleg with little Igor in 882 made a marsh down Dnepr "colonised" all who he met at his trip and in  at least arrived to Kiev and  occupied it too luring out Askold and Dir from  the town and killed them. One version of the story says Askold and Dir were betrayed by their people - no wonder as it seems it's national "Ukrainian" habit - to betray time after time those who ruled them.   
So Oleg moved his residence from Novgorod to Kiev( as it was more close to rich Byzantium - the main trade partner)  and since this time historical started to speak about Kievskay Rus 
So that - let "Ukrainians"  believe that they were the mother of Russia but Russians fail to see their "big" role in building Kiev Rus. - there was no such neither in political matter ( it was not their "Ukrainians" rulers who made efforts to built that Kiev Rus nor in territorial matter as "Russian" part of that Kiev Rus was bigger.

As for name Rus then there are SUCH many arguing among historical where it came from then I don't even want to start this discussion Take that just like a fact that this name Ros-Rus- russich and some other variations was used in historical chronicles and documents before Kiev Rus like a description for unions of nations lived at eastern Europe territories.


As for Moscow then it's role in building Russian state came later when it was a need again to collect separated "kindoms" with a king in each town and fight for independence once more.

[Son of Clyde]

Women are women all over the world, but Russian/Ukrainian women are much tougher and very independent. I think even the most fragile looking RW is tough as nails beneath the exterior she presents. I have seen it in many RW I have met.

They have had to survive communism, living in small villages, eating foods we would cringe if we had to eat, low paying jobs.

Even the women who live in large cities are very strong. 

[Elen]

why would not tell also that the most hard times your women faced were democratic times of 90s When former lifesyle not rich but stable and enough for living (but not for just  survival  like you claim here) communism fell and people just appeared in democratic capitalism with unemployment, two great state bankruptcy wich obliterated all saving of people, with criminal wars and several hot spots of real wars like Chechnya where a lot young males were lost and with others advantaches of democracy in FSU.
 
 If you have a desire to find what made steel characters of your wives in politic systems of FSU then your should be objective after all and don't miss 90s   

[BradSTL]

why would not tell also that the most hard times your women faced were democratic times of 90s When former lifesyle not rich but stable and enough for living (but not for just  survival  like you claim here) communism fell and people just appeared in democratic capitalism with unemployment, two great state bankruptcy wich obliterated all saving of people, with criminal wars and several hot spots of real wars like Chechnya where a lot young males were lost and with others advantaches of democracy in FSU.
 
 If you have a desire to find what made steel characters of your wives in politic systems of FSU then your should be objective after all and don't miss 90s  

Excellent point, elen!   I would like to read much more about the 90's in new russia!

[Elen]

Nope I forgot those bloody 90s like nightmare ( really I should make effortes to recall how exactly I felt those times - just amnesia )  and have no wish to twist a knife in my own woundopen

[Son of Clyde]

One scene etched in my memory is the mob of people tearing down the statue of Lenin in 1992. The Berlin Wall coming down is another thing I will always remember.

[PeeWee]

why would not tell also that the most hard times your women faced were democratic times of 90s When former lifesyle not rich but stable and enough for living (but not for just  survival  like you claim here) communism fell and people just appeared in democratic capitalism with unemployment, two great state bankruptcy wich obliterated all saving of people, with criminal wars and several hot spots of real wars like Chechnya where a lot young males were lost and with others advantaches of democracy in FSU.
 
 If you have a desire to find what made steel characters of your wives in politic systems of FSU then your should be objective after all and don't miss 90s   

My friend living in Moscow told me that her daughter was born just as the Soviet Union collapsed. She told that food was most difficult to obtain during this time and the she had great stress in her life because she had to worry so much about how to feed her baby. She still does not completely trust the banking system in Russia and tends to keep her savings in her apartment.

Peewee

[Son of Clyde]

Life in FSU seemed to have gotten worse in the 1990's but slowly is improving.
Because a regime collapses (many saw the old communist rule as being more secure) and there is a new found democracy, there still needs to be organization. My stepson said Ukraine will be joining the European Union soon so things are looking better.

[Elen]

One scene etched in my memory is the mob of people tearing down the statue of Lenin in 1992. The Berlin Wall coming down is another thing I will always remember.

Aha  Yeah all we were doing in 90s was dancing at streets

Yes for you foreigners it was a show of ruining soviet epoch symbols but for us it was an attempt to survive on those ruins day after day

 I don't know can you really get what it's to lost a job if ALL your life before an idea that it could happened NEVER crossed your mind You just knew that your job will be always here. Add here that there is just  NO other job because economy is in collapce ( not because its "bad' socialistic economy but because it's "fine" experiments - I till now believe it's just planned crime in order to got property by those who cry more lodly about democracy) in financial system after wich companies even sucsessful ones  lost  working capital) For common people those reforms in financial system looked like frozen savings in 1992 ( later those savings just turned into dust because of inflation) Immagine your bank account is frozen - just so, one day you are told - you would get your money only in don't-know-what future And you in addition lost your job and your wife and parents are in the same ass And you have little kid to take care about. And prices in shops which were constant all your life are rasing each day. ( EACH day is not a metaphora - it really was so)

 Many males just didn't endure and broke - suicides, drown in vodka, left families Many "sucsessful " males who could find themselves in new reality in few years appeared  in graves due to bullet between eyes or after heart atack. I personaly remember TV show about Toliyaty where they shown local chimestry I bet it would make more imppression on you - all those long rows with graves of 20-30 years olds guys  And each such grave meant that something there back in home some woman - mother or wife should somehow  live with that like others whose sons never returned from Chechnya.

  I personaly lost three male friends of my ages in 90s One was killed because was involved in oil business, and two died about heart atacks

That's was a "price" for somebodye's  dancing at streets with silly democratic slogans

Tell me what else happy things you remeber from 90s  and I tell you what crap in every day life was behind TV screen

[Elen]

Life in FSU seemed to have gotten worse in the 1990's but slowly is improving.
Because a regime collapses (many saw the old communist rule as being more secure) and there is a new found democracy, there still needs to be organization. My stepson said Ukraine will be joining the European Union soon so things are looking better.

Is your stepson  somebody who has the  decisive voice in decision about Ukraine's membership in EU?
As far as I know there is NO huge desire of the EU in that matter - if softly to put what EU know "promices" Ukraine  There are only talks about join NATO - nothing more


Also that period of gotten worse was about 15 years and there is not much improves now- too many "lost in survivings" years for one life time actually to be grateful for "democracy"

[Nando]

Is your stepson  somebody who has the  decisive voice in decision about Ukraine's membership in EU?
As far as I know there is NO huge desire of the EU in that matter - if softly to put what EU know "promices" Ukraine  There are only talks about join NATO - nothing more


Also that period of gotten worse was about 15 years and there is not much improves now- too many "lost in survivings" years for one life time actually to be grateful for "democracy"

Being an economist I don't think that being part of the EU is such a great thing to say the truth...
Many cars and Plasma Tv maybe look as an improvement, but with all the company bankruptcy due to competition of foreign firms and Chinese products doesn't seem a good notion of economycal improvement...
I am talking of my country of course...

[Son of Clyde]

Elen, in the US major companies are known to layoff (or even fire) hundreds of employees because it is not economically feasable to keep them.

Men over 50 are practically unemployable in certain job markets because they are considered over the hill.

I am saying people in the US can seem to have everything and can also lose it in the blink of an eye.

[Elen]

Elen, in the US major companies are known to layoff (or even fire) hundreds of employees because it is not economically feasable to keep them.

Men over 50 are practically unemployable in certain job markets because they are considered over the hill.

I am saying people in the US can seem to have everything and can also lose it in the blink of an eye.

  I know But like I said you probably can't get what it is to be fired if ALL you life you had not such problem
Now we used in some way to that but in 90s it was real SHOCK I don't even remember those empty shops - I know they were empty but now it's just no memories about it in my mind But lost a job - and not only a job but the very real prospect to work in that sphera where you worked and for what you were trained for 6 years in Univ - that's hard ( in psyhological meaning)  till now

And in addition you see we now have ALL faults of your capitalistic system but we still had not time to built any protection - insurance, credit system health care - tha's all are still in "deveping" so to say And I just don't want to think what wait for me if something real bad illnest happens Also they changed pension laws 3 or 4 times and you never could be sure what you get for your work And so on

And it's me who lives in MOSCOW But what about life in deing towns and villages It's 10 times harder in Russia to move to new place in seaching new job than in the USA And I just have not idea how people surveve there.

 Really I can't get why you foreigners areso exited that socialist system fell in our country It brought so many problems - real problem wich could cost you life  - wich we had not before.
 

[Jet]

   and not only a job but the very real prospect to work in that sphera where you worked and for what you were trained for 6 years in Univ - that's hard ( in psyhological meaning)  till now

This was EXACTLY my wife's situation, after investing 5 years in University education to be scientist, she woke up one day to discover there was no longer any need for new scientists. 

Really I can't get why you foreigners are so exited that socialist system fell in our country It brought so many problems - real problem wich could cost you life  - wich we had not before.

This is something that's been incredibily fascinating to me - learning just how much bullsh!t our gov't fed us through the "cold war" years. It's not so suprising that the communist party has such a large following, even today. To be fair, in our conversations, I've also learned that Russians were fed their fair share of BS too, but the bottom line is that for the *average* citizen, life was not nearly as bad as our gov't and news media made it out to be. It was different, but I don't think worse.

[PeeWee]

I am saying people in the US can seem to have everything and can also lose it in the blink of an eye.

Enron.

peewee

[PeeWee]

That's was a "price" for somebodye's  dancing at streets with silly democratic slogans

Tell me what else happy things you remeber from 90s  and I tell you what crap in every day life was behind TV screen

My friend Lena told me that within one year that her son became 5 years old, she divorced with her husband, the Soviet Government collapsed, and her mother died.
No dancing in her home as she then moved to live with her father.

Peewee

[PeeWee]

 Really I can't get why you foreigners areso exited that socialist system fell in our country It brought so many problems - real problem wich could cost you life  - wich we had not before.
 

I think it was the realization that an enemy had been defeated and that the threat of a nuclear holocaust had been eliminated that made us most happy, or releaved. No thought was given to what the internal struggles of the common Russian people might me. We may have saw them as fortunate to be released from the bonds of Socialism and government oppression.

Peewee