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Author Topic: Coronavirus, how are you preparing for it and how it is affecting you so far?  (Read 105350 times)

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Online GQBlues

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Lancet and the New England Journal of Medicine published HCQ studies that prompted WHO to suspend clinical trials.  The reliability of the data used in these studies is now suspect.      The discrepancies are so extreme to suggest the data could have been falsified.  Wednesday the WHO announced it would resume its global trial of hydroxychloroquine.

Pharma companies are researching  several promising therapeutic medicines.  None have yet been proven highly effective.  HCQ  could be effective for some categories of patients, perhaps equal to if not better than other medicines now being studied.  Nevertheless, HCQ is not a panacea, and neither is any other drug under consideration.   

Google:  Lancet, Surgisphere and Sapan Desai.   Numerous sources. 

It is alarming the depth of corruption to which some professional people will sink in their zeal to oppose conservative  ideology.  It has corrupted FBI leadership, intelligence leaders, news agencies, and now apparently medical scientists.

I posted a link on a Lancet journal that cited that HCQ do in fact have efficacy as prophylaxis AND the belief there’s a shortage of the medication was rebuffed. It was conveniently hidden from this thread seemingly to remove it from general viewing and make the silly debate stay within the opponent’s POV.

http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=24173.msg536308#msg536308

Quote from: Lancet Journal
The safety concerns raised by Rathi and colleagues include haemolysis in individuals with glucose-6-phosphate dehydrogenase deficiency and QTc prolongation. The prevalence of glucose-6-phosphate dehydrogenase deficiency in India ranges from 0% to 10%, with heterogenous distribution and incomplete penetrance.2 Haemolysis is not clinically significant when hydroxychloroquine is administered in usual therapeutic doses to individuals with WHO class II and III glucose-6-phosphate dehydrogenase deficiency, and the safety of hydroxychloroquine is well established with prolonged use. Furthermore, a routine electrocardiogram for QTc interval is not essential before hydroxychloroquine initiation in clinical practice and is not recommended in any guidelines. Decades of experience with this drug in autoimmune disorders is enough to allay these fears.

• View related content for this article

Concerns have been raised regarding lack of data on efficacy of hydroxychloroquine against severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2. A paucity of data is expected in the first wave of a pandemic caused by a novel virus.

Hydroxychloroquine has been shown to have in-vitro activity against the virus. Recently published human trials,4 along with other unpublished data,5 suggest that it could decrease the duration of viral shedding and symptoms if given early. A study from South Korea shows the efficacy of hydroxychloroquine for post-exposure prophylaxis.6 Historically, many drugs used in the treatment of an infectious disease have also been used for prophylaxis. The pharmacokinetics of hydroxychloroquine, such as its long half-life and high lung concentration (500-times the blood concentration), are ideally suited for use as an agent for prophylaxis.7

The criticisms made by Rathi and colleagues overlook the fact that prophylactic hydroxychloroquine would be targeted to individuals at high risk rather than the general population. Projection of adverse events to the population level causes unjustified alarm. The advisory from the Indian Council of Medical Research includes a section of key considerations that address all such concerns, which have been ignored by Rathi and colleagues. In addition, the argument that there will be a shortage of the drug is not tenable. Production has been ramped up and the Government of India is supplying hydroxychloroquine to more than 50 countries, which has received widespread appreciation.

We are in the midst of a once-in-a-generation pandemic, given the scale of morbidity and mortality. The frontline health-care workers are at great risk of infection; in Italy, 20% of the responding health-care workers have been infected.8 A wide variety of therapeutic interventions are being tried in COVID-19 patients, without any evidence but following a prudent approach. We believe that the hydroxychloroquine prophylaxis in selected groups of high-risk contacts is a prudent approach considering the risk–benefit analysis. Implemented as envisaged in the recommendation document from the Indian Council of Medical Research, evidence will be generated for future recommendations.

We declare no competing interests.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2020, 10:07:07 AM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Online krimster2

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“The discrepancies are so extreme”

BS, they were minor and corrected and the conclusion was still the same
the same conclusion found from every other study, including the one that killed veterans
looks like someone is bowing to pressure....

it is alarming the depth of corruption and LIES, don’t forget the lies to which dumb phuques will sink in their zeal to ENFORCE conservative  ideology
including their own complete destruction
1945 was a terrible time to be a Nazi, and so is 2020...
« Last Edit: June 04, 2020, 07:42:50 AM by krimster2 »

Online BillyB

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There's never been a safe and effective vaccine or treatment created for any coronavirus in history and there still isn't. Although I'm not a fan of WHO, if they or CDC announces one, I'll believe one exists. Everything doctors are using now aren't proven but they are allowed to use certain drugs for emergency purposes.
Do your part to limit the spread of COVID-19

Offline Gator

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Indeed, it is alarming how we, I include myself, have become 'experts' in meds ...

In the meantime, the rumours of HCQs dubious effiacy have caused probs for those for which its benefits outweigh the horrible risks..

http://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/hydroxychloroquine-fails-prevent-covid-19-large-study-shows-n1223921


For sure you are no medical expert, nor even someone who can grasp basic medical terms.  In the interest of helping you to elevate from your state of ignorance,  I highlight two mistakes that shows need for improvement.


Mistake No. 1    

Your source is for use of HCQ as a prophylactic, i. e. whether HCQ prevents becoming infected.   In contrast, my post addressed the use of HCQ as a therapeutic,  i. e., whether HCQ helps the recovery of someone already in the early stages of infection.     


Mistake No. 2  

You wrote HCQ  "have caused probs for those for which its benefits outweigh the horrible risks.."  If you had read your source, you would have seen this nugget:

Quote
  Despite concerns the drug might lead to dangerous heart problems, the researchers did not find that was the case in this study.   



You wrote a short post, yet you made two mistakes.  Imagine if you had written a more comprehensive post. 

Offline Gator

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BS, they were minor and corrected and the conclusion was still the same

You say BS, I call double BS.     Show me your source please.  Here's mine from the WSJ Editorial Board, a mere 19 hours ago.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/the-lancet-hcl-and-trump-11591226880

Quote
   One of the tragedies of the Trump era is how opposition to the President has caused some institutions to drop their standards. The FBI’s FISA warrant abuse is one example, and the overt media “resistance” is another. Now it may have contaminated the fight against Covid-19.

Maybe you should write the WSJ too with your source?

Krimster, try naming drugs that have proven more effective against COVID-19 than HCQ.  Does that say something? 


Quote
it is alarming the depth of corruption and LIES, don’t forget the lies to which dumb phuques will sink in their zeal to ENFORCE conservative  ideology
including their own complete destruction
1945 was a terrible time to be a Nazi, and so is 2020...


You must learn to complete your sentences.  2020 will be a bad year for Comey and many other loyal Obama soldiers who led the nation on an expensive, time consuming and obstructive hoax perpetrated because you could not accept the nation's electorate.   

When you move to Russia will you take your wall poster of Susan Rice and John Brennan?   I suggest only John's because he has voted communist in his  past. 

Your comments says you equate conservative thinking with Nazism.  You must be tired from all of your Antifa terrorism over the past few nights.   How many skulls did you bash in?   Or were you merely delivering caches of bricks.  I don't take you as a looter. 

Offline Gator

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Hey dumb phuque krimster!

This is Lancet's statement issued yesterday:

       “We are issuing an Expression of Concern to alert readers to the fact that serious scientific questions have been brought to our attention. We will update this notice as soon as we have further information."
 

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Sighs

Gator,

Who do you know that has been using HCQ ...  before it was labelled some 'wonder drug' in connection with COVID ?

Unlike you, I DID know the downsides of this drug, given someone I love dearly was taking it, despite the downsides ..

TRAGIC and TOTALLY Misleading BOLLOX #1 of yours

"Your source is for use of HCQ as a prophylactic, i. e. whether HCQ prevents becoming infected.   In contrast, my post addressed the use of HCQ as a therapeutic,  i. e., whether HCQ helps the recovery of someone already in the early stages of infection."     


You have posted dangerously inaccurate info as to the role of HCQ in connection with Lupus variants - HCQ's role is to SURPRESS the bodies immune system  - NOT to stop a disease as you suggest  ((

I enclose a US link to educate you .. You REALLY need to READ it

http://www.lupus.org/blog/are-people-with-lupus-protected-against-covid19

TRAGIC and TOTALLY Misleading BOLLOX #2 of yours

" Despite concerns the drug might lead to dangerous heart problems, the researchers did not find that was the case in this study.   "


Again sourced from YOUR nation



http://www.healthline.com/health/hydroxychloroquine-oral-tablet#side-effects





This medication can cause heart disease. Although uncommon, some cases have been fatal.








We'll be back, EU ..and as a certain 'gentleman' couldn't accept my offer to 'bury the hatchet' .. Don't trust a clueless Californian 'business owner' who cannot even quote me, honestly ..

Online GQBlues

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Gator-

PubMed.gov actually released a journal dated April 24, 2020, a period of time that was almost at the crest of the curve in the US,  where they reported two interesting 'findings'...

1. in-vitro clinical studies that showed HCQ delays the viral shedding of COVID-19 and decreases the duration of eventual symptoms in cases where they are administered early. HCQ do have the anti-viral characteristic. This was also covered in Lancet's journal dated May 22, 2020.

2. And probably this other report is more interesting as any clinical trials in comparison: They found that "COVID-19 infections are highly pandemic in countries where malaria is least pandemic and are least pandemic in nations where malaria is highly pandemic. Giving rise to the reason that countries where people are likely to have administered HCQ in its fight against malaria also registered lower COVID-19 pandemic. Countries with lower cases of malaria, also happens to run the higher COVID-19 pandemic numbers.

Those countries are discussed here

Quote
Results: For this study, we identified a total of 09 published articles: 03 clinical trials with sample size 150; 03 in vitro studies and 03 expert consensus reports. These studies were all suggestive that chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine can successfully treat COVID-19 infections.

I do wonder now if what you stated prior re: medical corruption is as noted.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2020, 02:18:20 PM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Gator

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Sighs

I explained in simple terms the two basic mistakes in your post.  Instead of learning from your mistakes, you now choose to introduce something requiring more complicated terms.  You failed at the simple stuff, so why should I even start something more complicated? 

It would be like discussing limnology with a high school student interested in nothing but sports and girls. 


BTW, no where have I said that I believe HCQ is a miracle drug.  However, if I became infected I would consider it in consultation with my physician.  Why?  Because we have no alternative. 

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Authors Retract Study That Found Risks of Antimalaria Drug for Covid-19
Wall Street Journal Article, written by Jared S. Hopkins, Russell Gold


Three authors of a large study that last month found antimalarials provided no benefit to treating Covid-19 infections, while increasing the risk of heart problems and death, retracted their findings.

The authors said in a statement Thursday provided by The Lancet, the medical journal that published the study on May 22, that they decided to issue the retraction after Surgisphere Corp., the private company that provided the research data, refused to share the full, detailed data set as part of a review after outside researchers raised concerns.

“We always aspire to perform our research in accordance with the highest ethical and professional guidelines,” said the authors, Mandeep Mehra, Frank Ruschitzka and Amit Patel. “We can never forget the responsibility we have as researchers to scrupulously ensure that we rely on data sources that adhere to our high standards. Based on this development, we can no longer vouch for the veracity of the primary data sources.”

The authors also said they apologized for “any embarrassment or inconvenience that this may have caused.”

The Lancet said in a statement that it “takes issues of scientific integrity extremely seriously, and there are many outstanding questions about Surgisphere and the data that were allegedly included in this study.”
The peer-reviewed study analyzed medical records of 96,000 patients hospitalized across six continents with confirmed coronavirus cases from Dec. 20 to April 14. Of the total, 15,000 patients were treated with the malaria drugs alone or in combination with an antibiotic.

Its findings indicated the antimalaria drugs, which many doctors have used to treat Covid-19 patients, didn’t help and might even hurt patients.

Following the study, the World Health Organization paused enrolling patients in clinical trials testing hydroxychloroquine, although this week the organization said it resumed the trials.

More than 100 researchers have raised questions about the data behind the study and about Surgisphere, which had supplied it.

Surgisphere said it has petabytes of data from more than 100 million patients, culled from some 1,200 hospitals and institutions on six continents. Yet many researchers and some hospitals said they had never heard of Surgisphere.

The founder of Surgisphere, Dr. Sapan Desai, was the other author on the paper. Dr. Desai couldn’t be reached for comment.


« Last Edit: June 04, 2020, 03:46:31 PM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Gator

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Hey dumb phuque krimster!

You today told me I was wrong about the HCQ data, saying the data discrepancies  were "minor and corrected and the conclusion was still the same."  Then you went on about Nazis and such. 

I asked you for a source of your claim.  You gave none.  So I found one for you, from just 2 hours ago. 

Lancet, New England Journal retract Covid-19 studies, including one that raised safety concerns about malaria drugs

[I know see that GQ has already listed the retraction]

A sane man would apologize. 

You and Moby should get together, look up the definition of retraction, and decide who of you two is the biggest arse. 

Online krimster2

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I don’t feel any regrets, none whatsoever....
but take a look outside your window
20% unemployment and growing and heading into the first depression since the 1930‘s
over 110,000 dead and growing
almost 2 million infections and growing
trillions in new deficits and growing
wide scale civil unrest
and all this just a couple of months after your führer called Corona a hoax
and let’s not forget about other things either
like the failed trade war with China, and even though every economics book will tell you of the effects of tariffs on the depression of 1930, guess what Trump did and is still doing
or the gutting of our national law enforcement and intelligence agencies
or that our allies our backing away from us, while Trump is trying to get Russia back into the G7

do YOU feel any regrets?
of course you don’t
the führer aka “bunker bitch” the bible holding photo opportunist
is here ONLY because of dumb phuques like YOU
and they will be serving ice tea in Hell with a lemon twist
before I ever express any regrets to you...
hopefully, you realize, that if there is a fall/winter peak
then next year, this country will fall far below a mere depression
into a complete economic and social collapse
how regretful that Make America Great, didn’t work out any better than Trump University did
I told ya so...

PS
I am NOT a sane man
cuz if I were, why the hell would I be posting here?
I would think that I should be considered a bigger arse than Moby
at least I try to be
but wait until the collapse comes....
hehehe
and I can come out and play
with dumb phuques
anticipation is building within me
« Last Edit: June 04, 2020, 05:39:37 PM by krimster2 »

Offline Gator

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I don’t feel any regrets, none whatsoever....
      .
      .
      .

NONSENSE
      .
      .
      .

Liar, liar, pants on fire.

You composed fake news to challenge a point I was attempting to share . Unlike your fake predictions, fake news can be fact checked.  And you were found to be not telling the truth.  This has happened before, so when you tell us something, what are we to believe?   

On many occasions I attempted to interact with you in some sort of intellectual discourse.   I give up. 

Got your bags packed yet?


Online krimster2

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" some sort of intellectual discourse"

since when have Trump voters EVER been capable of this, so get real
if there's a second peak, then one of Trump's so called hoaxes
is gonna burn this country all the way to the ground...
nothing left, your social security if it comes at all, won't even buy you a pound of ground beef, even if there was any to buy
take all the hydroxy or bleach you want!!!
might be quicker for you that way, and end your suffering...
may God have mercy on you , for I shall give you and those like you, none at all...
I predicted Trump would destroy America, how far off was I?

« Last Edit: June 04, 2020, 07:21:37 PM by krimster2 »

Offline fathertime

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I predicted Trump would destroy America, how far off was I?
Trump is doing a terrible job in the most recent crisis.  Supporters like 'gator' will back up trump no matter what, and will denigrate former members of trump's team such as Mattis and Kelly who are now speaking out.   

Fathertime! 
I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Online msmob

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I explained in simple terms the two basic mistakes in your post.  Instead of learning from your mistakes, you now choose to introduce something requiring more complicated terms.  You failed at the simple stuff, so why should I even start something more complicated? 

I have noticed you have started suggesting folks can't understand your posts and must 'lack in English skills / intellect ' when your posts are busted ..

It's not the wisest tactic

Your 'points' were rebuffed by someone that has a vested interested in the side effects of HCQ and for a LOT longer than your recent interest..

BTW, no where have I said that I believe HCQ is a miracle drug.  However, if I became infected I would consider it in consultation with my physician.  Why?  Because we have no alternative.

If you already know it's not a 'miracle drug'.. ask your physician to enroll you on a trial, now and good luck with your 'health'
« Last Edit: June 04, 2020, 11:48:26 PM by msmob »
We'll be back, EU ..and as a certain 'gentleman' couldn't accept my offer to 'bury the hatchet' .. Don't trust a clueless Californian 'business owner' who cannot even quote me, honestly ..

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  Why?  Because we have no alternative.

We do have alternatives Gator, but we're passing them off right and left.

We can beat the bug at its own game as many nations are doing.
We can learn from the Germans about how they handled cases, their admittance criteria and supportive treatments they are using.
We can hunt and seek infected and asymptomatic folks along with their contacts.

But alas, it is all too much for us Americans, living in the richest and most powerful country on the planet.

Our exceptionalism is again killing us.

 

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We'll be back, EU ..and as a certain 'gentleman' couldn't accept my offer to 'bury the hatchet' .. Don't trust a clueless Californian 'business owner' who cannot even quote me, honestly ..

Online Faux Pas

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We do have alternatives Gator, but we're passing them off right and left.

We can beat the bug at its own game as many nations are doing.
We can learn from the Germans about how they handled cases, their admittance criteria and supportive treatments they are using.
We can hunt and seek infected and asymptomatic folks along with their contacts.

But alas, it is all too much for us Americans, living in the richest and most powerful country on the planet.

Our exceptionalism is again killing us.

What are the alternatives BC? Sitting in our homes waiting for a vaccine from a bug that has what appears to be a .02% (influenza is much worse btw) mortality rate? A bug that over 98% of those infected will recover completely on their own without any intervention. There is much still unknown about covid and there is no cure. The scientific community cannot agree on the approach to this bug. Perhaps we should have ignored it initially letting it spread treating it as another influenza strain? Essentially, that's what it is

Online GQBlues

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What are the alternatives BC? Sitting in our homes waiting for a vaccine from a bug that has what appears to be a .02% (influenza is much worse btw) mortality rate? A bug that over 98% of those infected will recover completely on their own without any intervention. There is much still unknown about covid and there is no cure. The scientific community cannot agree on the approach to this bug. Perhaps we should have ignored it initially letting it spread treating it as another influenza strain? Essentially, that's what it is

At least for now we know we have HCQ. It doesn’t cause heart disease and no danger of inventory shortage either. ;)
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Online Faux Pas

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I have noticed you have started suggesting folks can't understand your posts and must 'lack in English skills / intellect ' when your posts are busted ..

It's not the wisest tactic

Your 'points' were rebuffed by someone that has a vested interested in the side effects of HCQ and for a LOT longer than your recent interest..

If you already know it's not a 'miracle drug'.. ask your physician to enroll you on a trial, now and good luck with your 'health'
Gator explained it to you quite succinctly. You are just too thick to "get it". There is no cure and HCQ isn't it. HCQ has proven helpful to alter the course of covid if started early enough.

Your daughter taking HCQ for Lupus does not make you an authority on HCQ. Your are as dense on HCQ as you are most all subjects you insist on posting on.

There is no shortage of HCQ, in this country anyway. It is a low cost and highly available drug. The short term side effects differ from the long term but not enough to warrant not considering it for covid treatment. There are the facts. I know you'll argue with them so, help yourself. You can't possibly make yourself look anymore ignorant on the subject than you already have

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. Perhaps we should have ignored it initially letting it spread treating it as another influenza strain? Essentially, that's what it is

Like THAT is working so well for Sweden and the UK  ...too late to save many folks who would still be around ..


Sure, get back to normal and catch that second wave ..    I get it ... no one you know and thought was healthy has died .. 

Please explain how you think 'flu has killed more people in this century..



 

..
We'll be back, EU ..and as a certain 'gentleman' couldn't accept my offer to 'bury the hatchet' .. Don't trust a clueless Californian 'business owner' who cannot even quote me, honestly ..

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At least for now we know we have HCQ. It doesn’t cause heart disease and no danger of inventory shortage either. ;)

Repeating nonsense making you FEEL 'good' ?

Another recent supply chain issue article ( this time UK ) to remind us that GQB and facts are frequently at variance

http://www.pharmaceutical-journal.com/news-and-analysis/news/manufacturer-to-move-hydroxychloroquine-production-to-the-uk-to-avoid-shortages/20207948.article

The UK has already faced supply shortages ....
We'll be back, EU ..and as a certain 'gentleman' couldn't accept my offer to 'bury the hatchet' .. Don't trust a clueless Californian 'business owner' who cannot even quote me, honestly ..

Online Faux Pas

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Like THAT is working so well for Sweden and the UK  ...too late to save many folks who would still be around ..


Sure, get back to normal and catch that second wave ..    I get it ... no one you know and thought was healthy has died .. 

Please explain how you think 'flu has killed more people in this century..



 

..

Oh yeah the all dreaded "second wave" declaration from the experts. Likely the same ones that predicted "millions of deaths" in the US alone.  If a second wave is coming it will infect just as the first wave did. We can't stop it. Some of us will have antibodies and some won't. If as some of the experts say it returns yearly it will claim more lives, like guess what? Influenza. How's life in your mothers basement working out for you anyway?

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  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
I have noticed you have started suggesting folks can't understand your posts and must 'lack in English skills / intellect ' when your posts are busted ..

In your case, you do  not lack in English skills.  Intellect could be questioned, yet I attribute any deficiency to your 1) lack of thoroughness and 2) an extraordinary degree of stubbornness.       


Quote
Your 'points' were rebuffed by someone that has a vested interested in the side effects of HCQ and for a LOT longer than your recent interest..

I wish her well. 

Quote
If you already know it's not a 'miracle drug'.. ask your physician to enroll you on a trial, now and good luck with your 'health'

Why?  HCQ is apparently not a prophylactic, although some doctors on the frontline were using it as such on themselves.     

Are you angry or just trying to tease me?   I will play along - your comment is puzzling as if you have the neurological side effects from taking mefloquine (a drug used in the Army instead of cloroquine to prevent malaria, because the latter was not effective against resistant strains).   Google that one for some juicy stories. 

BTW, 50+ years ago as a soldier in Vietnam, the Army gave anti-malaria drug to me and everyone else.  Was it HCQ?  Maybe that explains my growing number of disorders?   Or was it Agent Orange?    BTW, over 20,000 US troops contracted malaria in the Vietnam war, required convalescence, and later returned to duty.    A few died. 

 

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