Just go! First trip recommendations?

[TexasBoar]

Based on liberally offered advice to "get my butt on the plane" from Ken, JB, and just about everyone else . . . heh heh heh.

Okay.  Round trip airfare's about a K, rooms/apts anywhere from 50ish a night on up, meals presumably about the same per day, dating, ummmm, variable.  A little less so if I manage to avoid T/G's $500-a-meal gal.

Agency intros, anywhere from $20-50 a shot. Argues for having at least a couple pre-arranged contacts, I'd think.

Question: coming from tropical South Texas, will I stand out in St. Petersburg wearing a parka in July? 

REAL question: What would be a good, doable, not too spendy itinerary that maximized quality contacts while having fun? Say, two-three stops or so? I've already been hipped to the museums via here (and that fits right in with my own interests) but am not really a disco type. 

IOW, if you were heading over for the first time, BUT knowing what you know . . . where would you go?

Thanks, Boar

[catzenmouse]

Well since I have already been marked as an abuser I'll throw out a few quick thoughts:

 Anywhere along the Black Sea as I have seen enough pictures/movies to really want to go there. Tver, St. Petersburg, Cheboksary (for the Beer Museum), Western Ukraine (actually Ukraine in general now as it is easier to get to and a bit closer than most of Russia) but of course the best place of all (throw stones if you want) is Siberia. Yes, it is a long flight but all I can say is that I found the most wonderful woman in the world there so it does, and always will, hold a special place in my heart and soul.

 Overall your cost for meals will be quite small on a daily basis. Each area has plenty of history to see and the people are wonderful once you get past the initial reserve. Sorry, that isn't exactly an itinerary.

Ken

[PeeWee]

I'd think different from Mouse-man. I never had an interest in Ukraine. Russia is vast. Moscow and St Pete will be the most espensive for hotel and food. Do you have any frequent flyer miles banked?

If no FFMs then call or email Red Star Travel in Seattle. I have learned that the best fares come from travel agencys who specialize in travel within a country, as does RST. Also not all airlines are shown with Expedia so you do not always get the best fare. Go the travel agency route.

Would not your itenerary be dictated by where the lady, or ladies, whom you wished to meet lived? If you are going for tour then why not do a Jack Bragg tour? Then all you have to do is to figure out how to get to Jack.

On your own...it will be much harder for you. I almost think that you should have made contact with three or so ladies and then go to where they live and that will be your itinerary. Do you prefer Ukraine to Russia? I tell you something, over the past several weeks I have developed an interest in Estonia. I did not realize that the Scandinavian influence was so heavy there.

It would be cheaper for you to settle on going to just one city, as opposed to more than one, because your travel costs will be reduced and traveling takes up time. Downtime is costly, I think.

Peevee

[ConnerVT]

First trip, keep you itinerary simple.  Things in the FSU don't move with the speed and immediacy that they do in the West.  Sometimes the simplest things take amazingly long to accomplish.

Also, the more complicated your plans, the less time you have for meeting, thinking, and conversing (which is the main purpose of your travel).

First trip -- pick one place/country/city.

[Bruce]

Boar, first trip is special.  You have alot of good advice above.  If you are going to St. Petersburg do see the Hermitage.  Do see the balet.  Do ride the metro around town.  Figure out where you really want to go.  Is it a big city in Russia ie. Moscow and St. Petersburg or Kiev in Ukraine?  Is it smaller places in Ukraine or Russia.  Just reading your posts I know you are one sharp guy.  Chances are you are going to do things on your own or mostly on your own.  Just for the heck of it talk to some of the professionals in the dating industry. Do talk with Marc Dayton.  Do talk with Jack Bragg.   Have no expectations.  Try your best to fit in, be polite, relax  and you'll be fine  .

[TexasBoar]

Ideally, I'd like to spend a couple days in St. Petersburg seeing the sights, but then the rest of my time someplace smaller and cheaper but still interesting, that's reasonably easy to get to from there.  And has pretty women in abundance, of course. 

Not really into doing an agency "social" or tour but wouldn't necessarily turn my nose up if the opportunity presented itself and the price was right, I suppose.  Would like to have some agency support on the ground, and some pre-arranged contacts. And a target-rich environment, of course. 

Great advice, gents.

~Boar

[catzenmouse]

If no FFMs then call or email Red Star Travel in Seattle. I have learned that the best fares come from travel agencys who specialize in travel within a country, as does RST. Also not all airlines are shown with Expedia so you do not always get the best fare. Go the travel agency route.

If St. Pete is a high priority then maybe contact Marc or Richard in Tver which would be quite doable for you.

We also found the best prices through a travel agent. Freewind Travel ( http://www.freewindtravel.com/ ) in MA (Vaughn turned me on to them, Thanks Vau-Gun!) was where we found the best deal.

PeeVee,

 Does Red Star have a web site?   Mouse-man? That's a new one...

Ken

[Manny]

First trip, keep you itinerary simple.  Things in the FSU don't move with the speed and immediacy that they do in the West.  Sometimes the simplest things take amazingly long to accomplish.

Also, the more complicated your plans, the less time you have for meeting, thinking, and conversing (which is the main purpose of your travel).

First trip -- pick one place/country/city.

Good advice from ConnorVT.

Togliatti/Samara can be reached from St Pete in about an hour on the plane! - Recommended by me!

Personally I would forget St Pete for a 1st trip and hit Russia 'proper'

[SANDRO43]

Does Red Star have a web site?   Mouse-man? That's a new one...

If only people would occasionally bother to have a look at the Wiki :
http://russianwomendiscussion.com/wiki/index.php?Agencies
(shame, shame ).

[catzenmouse]

If only people would occasionally bother to have a look at the Wiki :
http://russianwomendiscussion.com/wiki/index.php?Agencies
(shame, shame ).

Guilty! Smartass Sandro! 

[TexasBoar]

Heh . . . I already ordered their brochure . . . from the wiki link . . . 

~Boar

[BC]

Well, the nicest part of teaching is having summers off . . . 

~Boar

Yeah a summer would probably be great for a 'get your feet wet', 'go where the wind blows' type tour.  Maybe there are some educational exchange programs you can participate in.. quick google turned up http://www.friends-partners.org/friends/edusci/educ/exchange.html(opt,mozilla,unix,english,,new)

I'm sure there are more..

Look for unusual ways that can help get you an 'in' with 'normal' local folks via work, studies, hobbies etc.

Follow your interests and you will find like minded souls.

[SANDRO43]

Smartass Sandro! 

Indeed ! You should show more respect for the Unofficial RWD Garbage Collector and Wiki Dumper, though I know you're mostly interested in trash cans and bins, AlleyCatMan .

[catzenmouse]

Indeed ! You should show more respect for the Unofficial RWD Garbage Collector and Wiki Dumper, though I know you're mostly interested in trash cans and bins, AlleyCatMan .

How's this?

[viking]

TB

Having been to SPB several times, most recently last May, may I offer my 2 cents.

Flats are reasonable and most are near Nevesky Prospect, the main drag down the middle of SPB. I can recommend an excellent lady to help you here. She can also help with a car and driver. Not expensive, but not cheap. I can email you some photos of the flat I stayed out. VERY nice. Very western. Be prepared to do a lot of walking.

A lot of nice cafes and resturants every where. Most are fairly inexpensive. Even the better (but not the best) resturants did not go over $125 for dinner for two. If you want a nice place to dance and meet women, go to Rossi's. If you venture outside the city, make sure you find out what time the bridges open or you can be stuck out there for quite awhile until they close again.

If you need a translator or someone to call for assistance I have a very good friend, Lena, who I can put you in touch with. If some flowers are on your mind for a special person, there is Ed, an ex UK attorney who lives there and can help you with that and some other things as well. Real good guy.

An RWD member was there in the first half of May and it ws cold and snowing. I was there 2 weeks later wearing a T shirt. So check the weather before you. DO NOT go in the winter. Unless you enjoy wind chills in the minus 40 degree range. Brutual.

Traveling there, I took Finnair to Helsinki and then another one hour flight to SPB. Good airline. No problems. As far as dress is concerned, I wore jeans or black pants and no one could have cared less about who I was. Your face is what makes you stand out and they can spot this a mile away. Weird, but that is the way it is.

The ladies are not 'simple Russian women" They are sharp as hell, very western in culture and mind set. But friendly and open for the most part. Everyone seemd helpful to me and I felt very comfortable walking around by myself.

Make sure you have a phone that works over there. Very important if you are going to have appointments. Can recharge very easily at the Nokia center. Let me know if you need anything.

[TexasBoar]

Viking, thank you so much. We just got a substantial raise here in Texas, so I'm going to look at how much I can put aside for a trip. I expect I'll be in touch when the time comes. 

I figure a couple days in SPB will make the whole trip a worthwhile experience, whether I meet anyone significant or not.  It just looks stunningly beautiful, and apparently, "White Nights" season is a good time to go, which works out perfectly for me. From there . . . well, I'll lay some groundwork for the rest when I get a little closer to the end of the school year. 

And again, I really appreciate everyone's input.

~Boar

[PeeWee]

If St. Pete is a high priority then maybe contact Marc or Richard in Tver which would be quite doable for you.

We also found the best prices through a travel agent. Freewind Travel ( http://www.freewindtravel.com/ ) in MA (Vaughn turned me on to them, Thanks Vau-Gun!) was where we found the best deal.

PeeVee,

 Does Red Star have a web site?   Mouse-man? That's a new one...

Ken

Red Star

http://www.travel2russia.com/

Peevee

[Turboguy]

IOW, if you were heading over for the first time, BUT knowing what you know . . . where would you go?

First off I would think about what I was going for and what I was looking for.  If you are going as a tourist St Petersburg and Moscow are the places.  St Petersburg is one of the prettiest cities in the world and the Hermiatage is awsome, and the white nights are interesting.  Nevsky street is a non stop party all night long.   It can be cold there.  You may need the Parka in July but don't forget the 10 gallon hat and the cowboy boots.  Do it right.

If my purpose was to meet women, personally I don't like St Petersburg or Moscow.  Viking does and has good luck there but Viking is from NYC.   I would ask myself what kind of gal I want to meet.  If you want a refined, classy, sophisticated, cosmopolitian woman, then you might perfer SP or Moscow.  Being from the sticks I think a Gal from the big city is going to wander around for a long time looking for the Beaver Falls metro station and be quite disappoined when she can't find it.

The same applies to Kiev but to a lesser extent.   I would not recommend someone going girl hunting in SP or Moscow but I would not rule out Kiev.   I think there are better places though.

I think if I were doing it and Russia was my target I would go to Moscow for a few days and then go to Tver unless I had someone lined up elsewhere.  

If Ukraine was my target country I would go to Kiev for part of the time then pick a city like Dneprpoetrovsk, Kharkov, Kherston or Lviv, but only one.  

If I was going to do a tour I would stay far away from the big agencies but look hard at one of Jack's tours.  (FirstDreams)  I am heading on one in three days myself along with my son.

I am not sure when you are thinking about going but airfares are half price or less in the fall, winter and early spring.   You pay through the nose in the summer.   I am likely to make three trips this fall before winter gets too bad.  Last year I made a couple of January trips in 30 below weather and do not want to do that again.

[viking]

White Nights occurred in May, when I was there.  I don't know if there is another time it may occur, like every 6 months or so. It was very unexpected for me. Strangest thing in the world coming out of a club at 1AM and its sunny out. Blew me away the first time I experienced it. It only got dark for a few hours at night and even then it was not pitch black. Sorta throws your body clock out of sync. But that is what vodka is for.

[TexasBoar]

Well, summer's when I can go, most likely, although in the future I may be able to work something in during Spring Break. I'm off from early June through the first week in August.

SPB, basically, I just want to see. There are some amazing ladies from there on the agency websites, but . . . sheeeesh.  They'd likely be pretty bored here.  

From there, I'd like to spend about a week in, aaaah, a more target rich environment.   I don't know a lot about travel within Russia, or between Russia and Ukraine, but there's plenty of time between now and next summer.  We'll see.

I was looking at all this, and realized I spend well over the cost of a trip annually in cigars and single malt Scotch alone, lol.  Moving things around a bit, and economizing here and there as needed, opens up a pretty wide world of opportunities.

Viking: the SPB and Russian tourism websites say June 22 is THE night.  I imagine hotels rates double, but . . . it'd be something to see.

~Boar

[BillyB]

Where ever you decide to go, check out a local festivals that might be happening when you're in town, or go to an amusement park. When I was in Moscow, I went to Gorkey park which had lots of people having fun. Go see a circus, you might see a Russian bear driving a motorcycle. If you visit a woman and it don't pan out, and the backup plans don't materialize, then get to know the local ladies, don't be shy. I've read trip reports where guys aren't prepared to fail and they sit in their apartment most of the trip.

[Turboguy]

When I was in St Petersburg for the white nights the hotels did not double their price so you may get lucky there.  I stayed at a small hotel right on Nevsky (the main street)  Check a lot of different web sites for prices.   they change a lot among the sites.

Book your airfare early and you can still get a decent price.   Try last minute in the summer and you will pay through the nose.  www.bookingbuddy.com is a site I have been using lately.  Peak white nights is June 21st the summer solstice.   That is when the sun i highest in the sky.   The days do get long and night almost disappears for a month before and after but there is no night around the 21st.    I experienced something somewhat similar in Regina one year.

Some of the ladies don't do too bad at adapting.  My former fiancee came from a city of 2 million and loved my little town of 16,000. 

[jb]

Boar,

They'd likely be pretty bored here.

Depends on where "here" is.  You've mentioned you live in South Texas, my wife if a Moscovichka and she loves it here in the Corpus Christi area.  She loves that it is not wet, cold, and snowing 9 months a year, instead here, she can go to the beach at Padre Ialand 9 months a year.  While I've never met anyone from St Pete who didn't love their city, I also never met one who wasn't pretty much sick of the weather.

Regards "just get on a plane and go" advice.  Everyone needs a reason to go anywhere, if it's just girl watching you want to do, I recommend Rio, Copa Cabana and Ipanina Beachs are amazing. 

[Turboguy]

I have to agree with jb, because of the weather there your location will be a big plus.  Personally having been in San Antonio a few weeks ago I can do without the 103-107 temps they had while I was there but the FSU women will consider your area a terrific asset in your quest.

[TexasBoar]

I'm in your area and I'M bored here half the time, JB.  

But I love my job, and have family here, so I stay.  I'd like to retire to someplace like La Grange in 12-15 years, though.

Regards "just get on a plane and go" advice.  Everyone needs a reason to go anywhere, if it's just girl watching you want to do, I recommend Rio, Copa Cabana and Ipanina Beachs are amazing.

Oh, NOW you tell me, after you went and started it!  

Seriously, if I'm going to go forward with this, profiles and correspondence will only tell me so much.  I'd like to have a nice, memorable, fun vacation . . . and get my feet wet, as well.  Form some first hand impressions, make some contacts, meet some interesting (and hopefully interested) RW, like that.  I don't want to go WOVO with a full suitcase of high hopes and unreasonable expectations, but I don't feel organized or experienced enough to go full-tilt boogie WMVM, either.

I realize I have to do SOME groundwork, and will, but past a certain point, I just want to be open to whatever happens.  Not that I won't be ecstatic if something wonderful does.

~Boar