do we really change with age?

[Gator]

Boar wrote, But I would consider it disingenous at best to maintain the fiction that sexuality was NOT part of the equation for men seeking RW . . .

JB can defend himself, but I do not think that is what he implied.  It is definitely part of the equation, and I assert that if sex is bad, move on.  Nevertheless, "think with the big head, not the little head."

[Son of Clyde]

Gator by "dangerous" I was referring to men who live on the edge. I knew a very sweet girl who ended up with a biker, drug addict because she thought she could reform him. She ended up pregnant and unmarried. I see this scenerio time and time again where a woman is questioning where are the nice guys and she has had multiple relationships with violent men , drunks or addicts.

[TexasBoar]

I have the opposite problem where AW are concerned, sort of, anyway.  Women who meet me in social settings, and are attracted to the whole tattooed biker-type thing, always seem to be disappointed when they discover the bookish schoolteacher underneath.  Whereas women who first become attracted to me in more professional settings, where I'm seen as erudite and articulate, are generally more than a little shocked by my ink and the history that comes with it. 

I'm still waiting for the intellectual wild child who'll appreciate both! 

Oh, and to get the thread back OT: she should be young enough to keep up with me, but not so young as to have nothing in common with me. Heh.

~Boar

[BC]

Okay, JB and BC, I understood the mistake I have done. It is first time I participate any forum. Thank you for you indicated me as I should not do.

vwrw,

I can't recall the last time I told someone what to do or not what to do.. Most of what I ever say is either from my direct experience, or a suggestion of what I have learned from the experience of others.

Don't forget though that this is an open forum and not a direct conversation. Replies directed to you usually contain a good bit of 'salt' to pass around to others listening in.  That's the 'nature of the beast'.

For a first time forum member, I'm quite impressed with how you have handled things around here. I think though you might find it helpful to re-read your first post here in which you basically stated that you had no prior relationship experiences with men over 35 and asked advice.

Remember the feelings of uncertainty when you first posted? Compare them with the euphoria you now are experiencing after only 5 days and try to realize that your world is probably a bit distorted at the moment.  By all means continue your relationship and see where it goes, but don't force it anywhere.  I am one that believes that relationships are best left to themselves without artificial outside pressures, thus my suggestions to take the natural course, distance yourselves from this artificial climate and see where the path leads. 

We had another member here in the past that I feel basically talked himself into a relationship.  Advice of others around here that were against his desires seemed only to make him more determined to see it through to prove us wrong.  In a recent post you stated you and Turbo had nothing to prove.. and that's good!.. just don't forget to follow your own advice 

[LatinSwede]

I'm in my early 30's and still have the same music hobby from my younger days.  That's something I'm not going to "grow out of" as previous ex-girlfreinds tried to convinve me to do.  On the other hand, I'll make a fook of myself if I try to dress and hang out like a teenager.  As well I've abbandoned all that starving artist BS, and have grown into a fully functional member of society, I think.

People still think I'm younger than I am though and it's not intentional either.  My parent's neighbors son is several years younger than me.  He look older than I do!  He's been in trouble with drugs and that ages you.

[David1963]

Yes, I read his comments regarding the women he met while on the Jack Bragg social tour.  I also noted that he wrote disparagingly about the women he met, even giving them funny nicknames, i.e., "The Nose" and a few others I won't bother or want to go back and look up.  I knew then that T/G wasn't really interested in following up with the "older" chicks.  He couldn't wait to get off on the trip to Burnal to meet yet another younger woman.  I'm sorry, you members of the cheer leaders squad have your opinion of the facts, I have mine.

After only a few days with vwrw Turbo is talking about a deep and abiding love, to which I say BS~!  No one can know true love in 5 days, they can only see something desirable and wish for it.  The definition of this is lust, not love.

Looks like JB and I have the same view on this.  As he stated, you could see it in the way he posted.  I wouldn't call this a Jack Bragg tour endorsment either.

I am curious what Jack thinks of this.  Supposedly he screens men for honesty and such, now he finds out TG ran off after a younger woman and really had no interest in the ladies that he met thorugh Jacks tour.

[Admin]

Looks like JB and I have the same view on this.  As he stated, you could see it in the way he posted.  I wouldn't call this a Jack Bragg tour endorsment either.

I am curious what Jack thinks of this.  Supposedly he screens men for honesty and such, now he finds out TG ran off after a younger woman and really had no interest in the ladies that he met thorugh Jacks tour.

You raise an interesting point - and my interpretation of the point/question is: What obligation does an agency owner have to screen clients? Of course, the IMBRA legislation provides some guidance - but is it sufficient? I then referenced the newly-published Agency Code of Ethics, to see if there are any provisos which Jack may have violated.

What do you think?

- Dan

[Gator]

I am confused.  I do not know what Jack Bragg could have done or should have done.  If a man wants to meet young women, you grant him his fantasy if the price is right.

Do Jack's webpages encourage men to seek women 30 years younger?
I recall that the women Turbo met at Jack's parties were more "age appropriate".

How do you screen for dishonesty? What is dishonest about Turbo? Fickled perhaps, but dishonest no.  It seems that he met 50 older women, found none of them worthy of followup visits, and quickly returned to his favorite pasttime - young women.

[jb]

hummmm,,,In this case I think Jack Bragg is blameless.  I'm sure he asked all the right questions before signing T/G and T/J up for the tour, T/G himself even said Jack was relentless in questioning him so he could line up the LOI's (Ladies Of Interest) before the tour.  But Jack is also a businessman and has his own bills to pay.   If someone really doesn't have his heart in the right place what can Jack do to offset that?

P.S.  Sorry, Gator, seems we were writing the same thing at the same time, (I got the warning that someone had posted, but ignored it and double clicked on "post")

[Son of Clyde]

I am curious what Jack thinks of this.  Supposedly he screens men for honesty and such, now he finds out TG ran off after a younger woman and really had no interest in the ladies that he met thorugh Jacks tour.

What is Jack to think? I am sure T/G paid for the tour, the same as the other guys, so what does it matter if it was one of the ladies he met through the tour? His obligation was fulfilled. Sorry, but I am seeing this more from a legal standpoint. If there is a code of ethics, T/G did not really renege on any promises because he went on the tour as expected. He maintained his part of the contract.

[Jooky]

Do you really change with age?

Yes. The older you get, the more delusional that you are still young.

[Jumper]

T/G ,
this seems to have developed into not just an age gap thread,
 but a bash TG thread..

for what its worth my comment that you quoted-
 wasnt aimed at anyones situation on this board , just my own.
with 15 years separating my wife and I,
I  have a glass house to throw any *age gap* stones from.
and always feel lifes to short to worry about what anyone else does,
 i have enough stuff going on in my own life to worry about...lol


just a general comments on the topic-

 I do have a buddy who has chased young skirts here, and in ukraine for years and years,,(after a divorce)
 at least 25 to 30 trips,, with some RW also visiting him stateside. never older than 24 and almost always 19 to 22.
he is late late 40's.. and balding, chubby, with a past heart attack and not in good shape.

he is amost always very unsuccessful,, and often gets little more for his time and trouble than feigned casual interest and a peck on the cheek. but lots of shopping and discos right?

I bust his chops about it, and its thrown in my face that i have a young wife, why cant he?

Maybe he is right?
that i'm out of line to give him any grief over it.
maybe i'm inb the same denial as a lot of guys LOL
but  to me i think there is a big difference in our situations ,
 and ask him to look at who he dated locally about 7 years ago and who i dated locally before marriage...
and also does he really believe i would go to the FSU 20 some times strickly chasing young skirts without having a blast, the time of my life,  and reaping the rewards he keeps missing out on? there are differences!  and if the years he is older than me, or just being out of shape,  makes or breaks it for the age group he seems to attempt dating in,, thats life. live by the rules of the game for gawd sakes.

anyway i guess i'll just wish him luck as he is meeting two 19 or 20yo RW in the DR next week or so..


There are couples and individuals that can pull off all kinds of difficulties in a relationship.
Those guys have the confidence and skills to navigate the waters just fine.
They wont need any advice from here.



There are guys like my buddy who honestly headed for a big time trouble,,
blowing tons of cash on a fantasy,Unfullfilled no less..  
and with a lot on the line to lose if one smart girl decides to play him out ..

and those same guys likely will never seek help here, or take any advice given . no matter if its in nice form or a clue bat.
*shrugs*


I do wish either the best of luck, but some guys like my buddy, will need it a lot more than others IMHO.

[Turboguy]

Yes, I read his comments regarding the women he met while on the Jack Bragg social tour.  I also noted that he wrote disparagingly about the women he met, even giving them funny nicknames, i.e., "The Nose" and a few others I won't bother or want to go back and look up.  I knew then that T/G wasn't really interested in following up with the "older" chicks.  He couldn't wait to get off on the trip to Barnaul to meet yet another younger woman.  I'm sorry, you members of the cheer leaders squad have your opinion of the facts, I have mine. 

OK, let me start with the nicknames.   Perhaps you look at them as disparaging.   My purpose in creating the nicknames was to not use real names and to avoid the use of initials which would have been very confusing and also to make them seem more individual and to make it easier for people to follow my story.   The nose got her name because she had a cute nose.  I can't see wonder woman, cher, or the bionic woman as demeaning in any way.   To imply a woman looked like a beautiful actress should not be degrading. 

The women I met on the trip ranged from 25 to 45.  Most were in the 30-40 range.   If you are going to criticize my actions based on my TR you should at least take the trouble to read through the endless words and get a few facts straight.  If you had taken the trouble to get your facts straight you would have found I mentioned several times in my report that I considered it likely I would never follow up on them because there was someone in Barnaul who  had become very special to me.   I have made a lot of trips to meet someone who I hoped would be the one only to be disappointed.   I also said in my trip report that if my trip to Barnaul did not have the results I hoped for that I would be going back to Ukraine in late November or Early December to follow up on some of the women from Jack's tour as well as meet one or two more that some friends from RWD had wanted me to meet.   If I would have gone back the ones I would likely have met were the nose who is 40, the one I mentioned I missed in my trip report who is 31 and quite pretty and the one from Severdonetsk who I really don't remember how old she is because I don't pay that much attention to age.

I see Albert and TexasBoar have joined in the fray with this, and as per usual with Albert, sex raises it's ugly head as being his sole reason for marriage.  Boar, I had thought you were different, but that's as you wish.  Let me be very clear about how I feel about that.  Sex is not a reason to get married.  Sex is the icing on the cake, that part that allows two loving people share intimacy and express something much deeper.  After only a few days with vwrw Turbo is talking about a deep and abiding love, to which I say BS~!  No one can know true love in 5 days, they can only see something desirable and wish for it.  The definition of this is lust, not love.

OK, Mr jb,  put your money where your mouth is.    Show me that quote!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!   Half the stuff you post are warped things you pull out of thin air or  out of your imagination.   You say I said that.   

SHOW ME

[Vaughn]

Turbo - as a friend, I urge you to drop all this
immediately. As you know, there are some very
opinionated members here who pull no punches,
and for you to spar with them is pointless. Stay
your course and work at it together earnestly.
Limit your posts regarding her and you to milestones,
as wheelchair generals abound in these parts.

Vaughn

[Turboguy]

Do you really change with age?

Yes. The older you get, the more delusional that you are still young.

Cute Jooky,  I like that. 

AJ,   T/G ,
this seems to have developed into not just an age gap thread,
 but a bash TG thread..

That it has AJ,  I am not sure the over discussed age difference thing was what this thread was intened to be but it does seem to be a favorite topic here.   I enjoyed your post though.  it was pretty neat.

Vaughn,   I appreciate your advice and consider you a friend as well.   I do enjoy all the verbal sparing with jb, but you are right.   It needs to end.  Thanks again.

[Gator]

VWRW seems well adjusted and Turbo a decent man.  From what I read, neither is planning marriage at this stage. 

Turbo has time to travel and they are already planning multiple future trips.  I think they simply are a couple embarking on a journey to learn more about each other and meanwhile enjoy life together.  They seem sufficiently intelligent to make the correct decision, and I imagine that they will spend more time together to decide than the average AM-RW couple. 

BTW, I have been down this path - it started when she was 27, me 58.  Enjoy the journey.

[Turboguy]

Thanks Gator.  I appreciate the nice comments and the good wishes.  It has been very enjoyable so far and I believe it will continue to be so.

[viking]

TG

I agree with BC. Time to go private. Give us a buzz when something happens.

T/G
Let me repeat myself here. You do not need to justify anything. Time to go private. Let this thread die of natural causes.

[Turboguy]

Thanks Viking, I agree.

[jinx13]

Wow Turbo, are you the topic of every thread?    Age is just a number! but having said that, 30 years is a big gap    

 In defense of T/G some men look much younger, and feel younger than their actual age. I am 38, but have had many women tell me I look like I'm in my late 20's. I guess I date younger women because I can. My g/f is 21, but really I don't look at age first, it's the person inside, but I'm not going to lie either, it just so happens that the younger women are usually the most attractive ones available.

 Do we change with age? Of course we do, but some change more than others, both physically and mentally. On the physical side we try to stay the same for as long as possible, as I get older I become more interested in eating right, going to the gym, and trying to look good for myself and for my girl too.

 If you don't change mentally during your lifetime than you have learned nothing from life. Our experiences make us who we are. I would like to think I have learned many things, and still have much more to learn. I am not the same person I was when I was 20, and probably won't be the same at 50. I hope I only get more patient and wise with age, and of course better looking! look out Sean Connery!  

[Turboguy]

Yes, popular, aren't I!     

Funny how when we are very young we wish we looked older and when we get older it is the reverse.

[Son of Clyde]

Turboguy, I did not intend this to get out of hand. You are a good friend and I was hoping to show that because we grow older does not mean we stop living. None of us are ready for the rocking chair just yet. Of any of the guys on this board I can say in truth that you do look 10 - 15 years younger than your true age. On the phone you sound no different than a man of 38. You are in good physical shape, have all your hair, do not wear trifocals. Maybe in a May December relationship it should be life experiences that are the factor. There is much you have to offer from your experiences on this planet. I hope Dan will pull the plug on this thread and we can let you get on with your life. If more guys were to be honest like you and Gator I think we would see that age should not matter. It is what is in your heart that matters.

[Turboguy]

Thanks SOC.  I am sure you never expected this thread to take the turns it has.   Don't worry about it.  I think it is winding down.   My comment about being popular was a joke by the way.   It is not exactly the kind of popularity anyone tries for. 

[Photo Guy]

A couple of months ago, my 78 year old mother told me that inside she still
felt young - not meaning 'lively', but meaning her thinking and personality
were basically the same as many years ago.  -Даг

[Jooky]

Would any of you at age 20 consider dating a 70 year old woman? 60? 50? How many of you now would consider dating a 70 year old woman? Come on now, age doesn't matter.

Of course we change. Nothing wrong with that. Of course age matters. Of course age difference matters. You can make large age differences work, but it ain't easy.