Stupid but necessary

[IAmZon]

Stupid but necessary question:

In examining many, many, many profiles this weekend,  I began to see that there were home made photos and professional photos.  Some women clearly intended to under emphasize their physical appearance.  Most women clearly intended to emphasize there physical appearance.

Many women wore bathing suits that bordered on tasteful; other wore bathing suits and underwear that I began to enjoy a bit too much.

Some photos rose to the level of Professional Models AND professional photos.

So, is there a clear litmus test for SCAMMERS here???  Has anyone correspondent with a DROP DEAD girl that turned out to be real?

This question exists regardless of age group BTW

[jb]

Has anyone correspondent with a DROP DEAD girl that turned out to be real?

That doesn't happen very often.  I probably know 3 dozen women here who are married to AM, they are all very average in looks.  They are very much above average in intelligence, even superior in traditional family values... but none I'd rate as higher than a 7 in looks.

You seem to still be hung up on good looks and beauty, frankly I think you are barking up the wrong tree.

[Kuna]

You seem to still be hung up on good looks and beauty, frankly I think you are barking up the wrong tree.

I'd agree with jb here...

I think we all need to consider what "real" beauty is.

If we're just seeking physical perfection I think we're much more likely to make terrible decisions.

I've commented before on what I think "real beauty" is, and I'm certain many other qualities are much more important than physical looks.

Question for you Rivardco:  Have you started to write to any of the girls yet?  Have you seen the vast difference in the depth of communication you can have with some?

Kuna

[IAmZon]

JB - I am not hung up.  I am sizing up.  You know ... Preparation, every battle is decided well before if is fought.

With this particular question, I am asking the group for a collaboration to make sure I am on point and not wasting my time with regard to the agencies and systems in place with this FSU stuff.

And for what its worth, I have already received MUCH from this curiosity.  If it all ended right now, I would be better off.  For me it has been an exercise in self awareness.

But ... I'll make you a bet?  One dollar!  I'll post a pic of me with a "objectively" beautiful woman within the next 12 months that fits me like a  glove - p r o b a b l l y from the FSU, but not necessarily.

[jb]

ricardo,

I won't take that bet, not even for a measly dollar.

Odds are you will find a lovely girl,,,, much, much better looking than you, much, much smarter than you, much, much better grounded than you, and much, much more aware of life on it's whole than you.  And you will be that lucky one, of that I have no doubt.  She may even be an American girl, I doubt she'll be a Russian girl.  However, you will sort through a couple dozen more girls before you get close to the point of finding her. And I think the first one you think you are in love with will prolly not be the one you end up marrying. 

Actually, I consider you to be a poor risk when it comes to betting.

The reason for these feelings of mine is that you are not sure,,,certainly not aware, of what you are searching for.  You are too fixated on the physical, and I assure you, a marriage based on physical will not last.

I don't hold out much hope for you.  Your questions thus far have revealed to much of your character.  You are a very superficial person judging from your posts, I see nothing solid and permanent in the making.  I think you'd be better off tieing a string to a $100 bill and dragging it through a trailer park in Little Rock, Arkansas than wasting your time and money going on trips to the FSU.

Sorry, that's just the way I see it.

[BillyB]

Lust is certainly a weakness of most men. The first or even first ten beautiful girls you chase may not be for you. If you choose to write a few of the most beautiful ladies, you probably won't have any success or be disappointed down the road if you do land one of those hard to please beauties. One reason I wrote to hundreds of ladies that were beautiful, in my eyes, was so that I could focus on what's important and find a sincere woman.

Rivardco, there is no true way to tell if a woman is a scammer based on photos unless she/he stole them from a famous woman. But there's really no need to worry about scammers unless you're thinking of sending money when asked.

As far as photos go, if a woman has glamour/studio shots that are probably photoshopped by the agency, then you could expect to be disappointed when you meet the woman since she will not look as good as in the photos. If she posted normal everyday photos, then you could expect her to look more beautiful than her photos if you decide to meet her as she will probably doll herself up at the time.

Women who post photos in bikinis aren't necessarily trying to attract the wrong man but women do know that their beauty can attract men which is their objective if their posting a profile. Some women know the right poses that can get men's attention such as the pose where the woman is bent over and her rear end is pointed up. Hopefully a woman that does that will soon promote the other assets she might possess instead of her body alone otherwise she may not be marraige material.

[jb]

Billy,,, I must have missed those photos.

But I agree with you.

[IAmZon]

JB, Your comments add a certain flavor to the soup here.  You are obviously well informed and experienced.

And yes, you are correct I am deeply evaluating many things. And the subject at hand, here, consists of THREE PRIMARY concerns:
1, Physical Appearance
2, Age Gap
3, Culture Shock
Other than the outright fraudulent scams, these three elements are at work in most of the disappointments discussed here. I would rather go through a little bashing back and forth with you, than have my expectations off in the real world.

My questions thusfar, do  not reveal my character; they indicate a stage in a process.
Judging from your posts, I see that you are equally prone to overvalue opinions and perceptions by you and yours, as you are to undervalue opinions and perceptions of others.  As for as me and my approach - GREAT JB - be patient: listen, watch, and learn:)


You are the kind of person that is vital to a good discussion group (please continue giving me your thoughts), but I am very happy not to be your neighbor.

[jb]

1, Physical Appearance
2, Age Gap
3, Culture Shock

You can take these three items and stuff them in a sock, they will not make any part of a successful and happy marriage.  Only hard work can do that.  That's why I think you will fail.

[Gator]

I don't think $100 will work in Little Rock these days.  Clinton has already overfished that little pond.



Rivardco,

There are no guidelines for scammers other than almost all of them are good looking and young.

Go to the blacklist sites and you will see a wide variance of photos but probably a higher percentage of provocative poses and bikini shots that for RW at large.

JB,

I think Rivardco is trying to develop some equation using those three variables to identify high potential for a scam.   I suppose he is considering the relative difference between a RW and AM for each variable.  The old "out of your league" consideration.

[CaptB]

I joined the RWG back in 1999. Eight trips to Russia.....and a nice wife....and wonderful Russian friends and inlaws.....to show for it. I have met many, many men in this process. There seems to be three types of men pursuing RW's. The first group have a fairly full dating life.....but their primary focus is on beauty (armcandy). The second group (a larger group)....had a very weak dating life...less socially confident......and want a "10" to make up for the deficiencies.  The last group (I consider myself and friend jb be here)......are those guys who had a fulfilling dating life, confident.....with at least a modicum of social skills. The folks in this group give physical beauty its due............we want to be attracted to our partner. No scale of 1-10 here..........just....."yes or no".........and then move-on to more important things. Just beauty.....like just intelligence......or just humor.....is a thin string to support the full weight of a relationship.....alone. All these things together.....with alot of hard work......will make for something that will last. A great "inside" really will influence one's outword appearence.......for those lucky folks......with the right pair of lenses.

Capt B

[jb]

Capt B,

As you know, my wife isn't the most beautiful woman in the world.

That's not why I got married.

She's not even a great cook, or a super housekeeper.

I didn't marry her for that either.

She has the world's worst sense of directions, she can get lost in a 4X4 closet.

I didn't marry her for her sexy Russian accent either.

Handy around the house?  This woman doesn't know which end of a hammer to hold.

None of those things.

I married this woman because she understands ME.  She is into pleasing ME.  She is into listening to ME, (if I have something to say).  She is into talking to ME, to let me know how she feels.  She is into *US*, bottom line....  There is no big "I" and no little "U", it's just her and me,,,us,,,,together...  We handle all the world's problems together.  We are the best team imaginable.

If you single, still looking, guys can manage to find a halfway good looking gal who will put up with your BS and still wake up in the morning with a smile on her face, I'd say you've won at least half the battle.  Commit all your search resources to finding beauty only, and I think you'll be the most unhappy man in the world.   

Gawd help ya.

[jb]

For those who don't know, Capt B was at my wedding in Moscow about 5 years ago. 

He's a good guy in the cliches....

[IAmZon]

JB, 

For me, your participation on this thread has been like a nice gift that came in ugly paper:)

Of course, I agree with your last post ... as I do with your insistence on hard work and the inside stuff.  I am not half the ungrounded, unreflective, and superficial Joe you presume me to be.  If I where that man I would not be spending time here...

Thank you BillyB and Gator for your insight.

[jb]

I am not half the ungrounded, unreflective, and superficial Joe you presume me to be.

Then get off this never ending beauty pageant search, and start looking for a woman who matches your own personality.  She's out there, but she may have a little kid, she may even have a facial flaw or two, might even weigh a kilo more than you deem perfect, but you will have to invest more than a week or two to find her.

But she's out there somewhere, I promise.

[Kuna]

Capt B,

As you know, my wife isn't the most beautiful woman in the world.

That's not why I got married.

She's not even a great cook, or a super housekeeper.

I didn't marry her for that either.

She has the world's worst sense of directions, she can get lost in a 4X4 closet.

I didn't marry her for her sexy Russian accent either.

Handy around the house?  This woman doesn't know which end of a hammer to hold.

None of those things.

I married this woman because she understands ME.  She is into pleasing ME.  She is into listening to ME, (if I have something to say).  She is into talking to ME, to let me know how she feels.  She is into *US*, bottom line....  There is no big "I" and no little "U", it's just her and me,,,us,,,,together...  We handle all the world's problems together.  We are the best team imaginable.

If you single, still looking, guys can manage to find a halfway good looking gal who will put up with your BS and still wake up in the morning with a smile on her face, I'd say you've won at least half the battle.  Commit all your search resources to finding beauty only, and I think you'll be the most unhappy man in the world.   

Gawd help ya.

That is the most human thing I've heard you say jb.

I've gotta say, in many of your posts your comments are more "harsh" than I think is necessary, but with that one post... well, you've earned my respect.

Don't take my comments the wrong way you "Big Ballooka",    but I've finally read somethng I agree can with,  without question.

(By the way, even when the comments are harsh there's still value hidden away if you're prepared to look for it).

Cheers!

Kuna

[Kuna]

Hmmm.. Bullooka?  Pullooka?  Hmmm...  OK.. I'm sure you know what I mean!

 ???

[IAmZon]

I'd agree with jb here...

Question for you Rivardco:  Have you started to write to any of the girls yet?  Have you seen the vast difference in the depth of communication you can have with some?

Kuna

KUNA - I thought we were brothers:)

Yes, there seems to be a great and mysterious difference ...

I was in an high mood - I felt I could take on the world!  Just got out of a very successfull meeting in NYC, could have taken a taxi, I decided to walk.

A couple of blocks went by, and I noticed more young women walking with me than usual.  I looked around and I realized I walked into a city college during class change.  Many pretty girls sat at a bench near a monument.  I bought a dozen long stem roses, and decided to see what would come.  "Hello, beautiful ladies."  I said.  As I handed out the roses until they were all gone.  I did not expect anything but smiles.

But I got more.

The girls spoke in what seemed to me to by a thousand tongues.  The most bold of the group would consolidated their questions and comments, that was Oana.  I had fun with the group for 15 minutes.  Talked to Oana for days.  Loved her for months.

And that lead to Nadia who after only two nights (and for a million reasons that seemed perfectly right) we imagined what our children would look like.  But she had freshly broken off from a fiance', and I was a long distant relationship that her heart could not bear.

And so, about 6 months ago, I began to play on the internet to find more of these woman who seemed so appealing, so different.  I found Anastasia, RussianLoveMatch, and Fiance.com

And, so I wrote and wrote.  I marveled how some Russian scientist invented a way to so deeply and uniquely put words, opinions, ideas in the mouths of so many fake women!  I too the task seriously to trip up the system, the machine. If a woman was a Doctor of the Epidermis; I wrote at length in areas that one like she would know.  If a woman said she liked American literature, so be it. Letter after letter after letter.  And the live CHAT thing really challenged my head.  "Can you touch you nose?"  I would ask.  And touch her nose she would!

And through it all the Russian scientist created a unique person seeminly talking to only me?  The crazy thing was that when I was on real dates ... my mind would drift to the imaginary relationships with Russian women who I had only cooresponded with! 

And then I got a letter from Marina.  My favorite imaginary girl! She said that she had made a very difficult decision to end our correspondence?!?  She said that she had met another man from America and agreed to take that relationship more seriously, to see what would come.  She said it would not be right to split her hear in two.  She kissed me goodbye.

WHAT?!?!?  Your REAL?!?!?  I thought we were ONLY kidding!!!  I WOULD have come to visit you.  You have picked the wrong guy! (I permited myself to say only good luck)

Oh shit!  I better write Dina back -  it had been three weeks!  To late.  She was off the grid. Damn!  I don't know if she would have made a good wife. But I know she would have been worth a trip around the world.

That is when I met Ludmilla who, despite her name, was PERFECT in every way.  My heart told my head to get the hell of its way from the very first.  She was graceful, sophisticated, pretty, and playful.  I was ready.  When can we meet, I asked.  Can I have your telephone number, I asked.  Soon, she said.  Here's my number.  I have to go to Egypt tomorrow. Be back in one week. 

A week goes bye; we talk again.  She says maybe I am Mr. Right.  But she has to go to Portugal for a week.  She will call when she gets back.  She is a model, you know. 

And that is when I first ran into a web site that discussed SCAMS.  My head took over from there.  That was 5 weeks ago.

[Michelangelo]

Riv,

Here is the bare truth.

Serious girls who encounter a man who writes for months but never visits dump you.  They decide you are not serious.

Letter writing and video chats are not reality.  You have to meet the girl in person if you want to hold her.

Get on the plane, man.

[Mir]

One problem with that:Sometimes when you get off that plane she is nowhere to be found (gone to Egypt or Portugal etc.)
I know have a plan B, but that feels like cheating and can be dangerous.

[jb]

That is the most human thing I've heard you say jb.

I've gotta say, in many of your posts your comments are more "harsh" than I think is necessary, but with that one post... well, you've earned my respect.

Well, thanks,,, I think.  Talk about a left handed compliment...

Ya wanna know something?  I'm the happiest guy around when I see two people meet and learn to love each other, get married and create the so-called "cozy home" together.

It's all the stumbling and bumbling about that drives me nuts.  A lot of you guys are making far more of this project than is necessary.   Finding a good woman in this great big wide world is actually pretty easy, it's when you couple up some outer world fantasy to the search process that makes things go haywire.  No woman is ever going to be able to fulfill your every fantasy.  They are only human.  It doesn't matter if she's American, Australian, Russian, or Ukrainian, she has to be like a comfortable shoe you love to put on when you get home from a stressful day.  And you have to be that same comfortable thing for her.  If you can put that together you'll do fine.  However, when you start to assign superior criteria to your requirements, then you'll wind up with the wrong woman every time.

Almost none of the readership here are spring chickens themselves, yet I see middle aged man after man reject the 30-40 y.o. woman.  What's wrong with you guys???  Unless you are living in Hollywood, starring in films, real named Mel Gibson, and making 6 figures a year,,, you are probably pretty ordinary yourself.   There's very likely a very nice, but ordinary, woman just waiting for you to show her some attention.  You can believe me on this, after 5 years of marriage, what she looks like won't matter too much anymore.  They all wake up with dragon breath and look like re-fried dog turds until the magic of makeup gets going.  You have to be able to love them before mascara and lipstick to make a marriage work.

[Gator]

"Dog turds"?

You had some of these men believing you until that analogy.  Waking up next to a long-legged 20-something has never been comparable with a dog turd.  That is until you start to converse over morning coffee.

I asssume Etna does not read RWD. 

By the way, how is her Mama?

[Patrick]

One problem with that:Sometimes when you get off that plane she is nowhere to be found (gone to Egypt or Portugal etc.)
I know have a plan B, but that feels like cheating and can be dangerous.

  You know Mir, that was one of the best quotes that I have ever heard. I have had the same thoughts. It kind of makes you feel guilty just thinking about it when you have put a lot of time and heart into one lady. Thanks Patrick

[jb]

By the way, how is her Mama?

Momma has her good days and her bad days, yesterday and today were bad days.  She is scared out of her mind and she doesn't fully understand what's happening to her very frail old body.  Apparently the cancer is far enough advanced that the doctors are fearful of doing anything else beyond keeping her comfortable.

Thanks for asking after her.

[jb]

BTW,,,

I assume Etna does not read RWD.

Etna reads whatever she wants to read.  RWD is not among her fav's.  She thinks most of the guys posting here are raving lunatics.

Etna and I have a deal, we say what is on our minds, honestly, and as much as is possible, in a non-hurtful way.  If she cooks something that tastes like crap, I simply tell her that this dish is not going to be one of my favorites and she needn't do it again.  She knows that I think it tastes like crap without my having delivered the insult.  By the same token, if I give her a gift and my taste in jewelry is not to her liking, she simply asks if I was thoughtful enough to save the receipt.  I know she doesn't especially like the item, but she didn't bust my balls about it either.

It works for us.