Trippin in St Pete

[wxman]

don't you all do the same every day in the scam secions?
and now you scream! look loke double standards

I despise antiscam (or scam) sections and sites. They are filled with nothing but whiners. It holds true whether it is the men or women making those accusations. They need to get a life and shut down all those sites.

[Haseki Hurem]

guys, really - thank you for taking so much care about RW morals. It flatters

[wxman]

don't you all do the same every day in the scam secions?
and now you scream! look loke double standards

Justifying why your site does it because you claim double standard, is just as despicable. Two wrongs do not make a right.

[Haseki Hurem]

wxman

you are right, doing despisible things should be the exclusive right of the rwd  

[wxman]

That's why I said "just as". No one site has sole ownership of being despicable. 

[Jooky]

don't you all do the same every day in the scam secions?

This is most definitely not what we all do every day in the scam sections.

You do realize that the scammers typically pointed out in scam sections are men right? And that the letters posted are typically form letters, mass mailed and also written by men. You know this, right?

[wxman]

Oh no!  You destroyed my illusion of all these gorgeous babes sitting in front on their computer and diligently sending me form letters professing their love for me. 

[Kvinna]

don't you all do the same every day in the scam secions?

This is most definitely not what we all do every day in the scam sections.

You do realize that the scammers typically pointed out in scam sections are men right? And that the letters posted are typically form letters, mass mailed and also written by men. You know this, right?

Dear Jooky, I see how wonderfull you can twist every words you got. But I relly wonder what is your reason to take part in this discussion. As I see those guys that don't feel any inner guilt toward Russian women don't look into this thread

[BC]

don't you all do the same every day in the scam secions?

This is most definitely not what we all do every day in the scam sections.

Kvinna,

Jooky makes a good point here..  I have seen several times where women have been reported on this board as scammers but defended by many members after the story evolved and more evidence came to light.

I know it may be different elsewhere.

As a result, the 'Scam' section here on this board is probably one of the slowest sections around..  Guys (and women) need to usually report something substantial in order for the report to be accepted by members.

I think you will find that RWD is quite 'picky' on this subject..  and that is good imho..

[Kvinna]

I think you will find that RWD is quite 'picky' on this subject..  and that is good imho..

we are also very  'picky', but don't know why most of women  think Bill should memorize on antidate

[Daveman]

And what about the picture with little white band on the eyes... ladies can be easily reconize... remember, the photo's are one of the problem on the antidate topic...

Well, that's something I can't really comment on because I never give the photos more than a passing glance as part of the story, and often times I read the posts without being logged in so I don't see photos at all.  The photos are nice to give a bit of a window to the story, but I wouldn't lose a wink of sleep if there were no photos at all.  From the first day here, I've thought the photos in TR's come across as "Look at the hot girl/s I met" manly chest beating (whether intentional or not), but I seem to be well in the minority with that thinking. 

Like I've mentioned before, I think they do have some valid points that would be excellent to get out into the public concerning respect for FSU women, and exactly how women perceive what we post about them.  This method of making their point, however, just leaves a very bad taste in my mouth.   The extreme wasn't necessary and it certainly did NOT need to be this way.  Extremes are always unhealthy. 

RWD is a different kind of board.  If she or "M" or any lady would have sent a PM to or Dan voicing concerns over the photos in a TR, I bet my right arm that he would have listened, understood the situation and removed them.  If anything, the admins of this board err to the side of caution.

I didn't know his TR was on several different sites, but the original problem was stated as being his TR on this board - basically that he met several different women during his trip, he had condoms in his possession, he had brought these condoms from America rather than buying them in Russia, and his report might encourage sex tourists I guess because he had the audacity to mention the women are beautiful and posted some photos.  Later more items like "slander" were added to the laundry list.  It's a truly ridiculous situation that didn't need to exist.

The cement effect was in full force from the beginning of this fiasco. 

[Jooky]

Kvinna, what words do I twist?

I have seen several times where women have been reported on this board as scammers but defended by many members after the story evolved and more evidence came to light.

I have seen this often.

You are saying that your unjust blacklisting of men without evidence parallels what happens on scam sections of these sites. Eye for an eye.

But that it not what typically happens on scam sections. Either real scammers are discussed, with evidence, or people accuse women of scamming and a discussion ensues.

When you accuse 'us' who are you talking to? I know that I've told men not to post personal contact of women. I've often battled against men who use private investigations and even the flower photo scheme.

I sure don't feel any guilt about anything I've done. I think it's fine for a man to meet several or many women and for a woman to meet several or many men, anywhere in the world, just as Bill did. I don't see anything wrong with two adults consenting to sex even thought that has nothing to do with Bill's situation.

 I see that a man is being unjustly condemned. I see deception and hypocrisy which I despise. That is why I am posting here.

[Kvinna]

You are saying that your unjust blacklisting of men without evidence parallels what happens on scam sections of these sites. Eye for an eye.

Maybe I should remind you story about blacklisting of Robert Mudge on our board and happened after this?
Yes, he was blacklisted without evidence (or proofs) by several of guys from this board
look at mirror

[Jooky]

Ok I look at mirror. I don't see a problem.

I have no idea who Robert Mudge is. If he was unjustly black listed on your site, I hope you unlisted him. Did you? Will you do the same for Bill? Or do you feel that he is a menace to Russian women?

Did I unjustly black list somebody?

You seem to group all men on this board, or it is all men, as one group. We are not all one group. There is not man versus woman battle that requires an Eye for Eye vendetta.

Can you publicly answer my question?

Take a good look at this site and the photos posted in the Gallery section. Tell me honestly whether you think some of the photos posted here encourage sex tourists or not.

When you log in there is a google ad tower advertising well known agencies that promote tours, select ladies based on looks for their sites, and recruit good looking women off the streets of Russia to appear in profiles. Do these agencies encourage sex tourists? Does this site, by allowing those ads in turn encourage sex tourists?

[Kvinna]

Ok I look at mirror. I don't see a problem.

I have no idea who Robert Mudge is. If he was unjustly black listed on your site, I hope you unlisted him. Did you? Will you do the same for Bill? Or do you feel that he is a menace to Russian women?

Did I unjustly black list somebody?

You seem to group all men on this board, or it is all men, as one group. We are not all one group. There is not man versus woman battle that requires an Eye for Eye vendetta.

Can you publicly answer my question?

Take a good look at this site and the photos posted in the Gallery section. Tell me honestly whether you think some of the photos posted here encourage sex tourists or not.

When you log in there is a google ad tower advertising well known agencies that promote tours, select ladies based on looks for their sites, and recruit good looking women off the streets of Russia to appear in profiles. Do these agencies encourage sex tourists? Does this site, by allowing those ads in turn encourage sex tourists?

I said you, yes, those agencies do this. and RWD as well as RWG and many men sites by posting a such trip reports do the same.
Why I works with RWD you asked me? We have a lot of disagreements, but I think sometimes we can find sometiong common that can be useful for both parts, but not in this case with Bill
I think I should stop to take part in this thread because I am sure we hardly can find so called consensus of opinion. Mostly you are not our targeting audience, so I only waste time to trying explain our perspective

[Jooky]

I see, and I'm not twisting your words here:

You are willing to work with the RWD, instead of black listing them, even though they allow activities that you feel promote sex tourism because you find some use for them (what that use is unclear).

You have no use for Bill, so it's ok to unjustly black list him as part of your Eye for an Eye vendetta against Anti-Scam sites that you deplore.

Frankly, your attitude shocks me. Your perspective is clear. It demands no further explanation. I did at one time think you had some positive intentions. I now see that you don't.

I highly question Dan's involvement with your business. The way Tall Bill has been allowed to be mocked and insulted on AntiDate disgusts me. This entire discussion makes me sick. Why? Because I have worked hard on these forums to stop the men who unjustly accuse, slander, spy upon and disrespect women, and I condemn those that do the same to men. There is a better way than Eye for an Eye.

I can't say anymore but that your direct insult upthread to Legal's wife Olga is completely classless, uncalled for and I hope it is not allowed to stand on this board.

[jb]

Dan,

For the record, I did not call for kivnna to be banned, I merely suggested that those men who felt strongly about kivnna not being able to spew her flithy accusations should get together and petition to have her banned.  
  
I said:

If you guys feel so strongly why don't you campaign to have kivinna banned from this forum?  It would at least give her one less outlet for her venom.  Since I'm equally sure she in on every other forum spewing this same sort of hateful anti-man crap she'll still get her message out, just not here.
I, for one would not miss her for a microsecond, she certainly contributes nothing that parallels or adds to this board's agenda.
Petition Dan for relief, report every offensive post to the Moderators, explain why you found the post offensive if it was an out-and-out lie or slanderous.  That's the way you get things done in the real world.

That was over on about page 10, now I see 10 more pages have transpired with no progress being made.   What we are seeing is an increasingly adamant, and stubborn kivnna, who is determined to have her own way.  I sometimes see this trait in my own wife, but not on such levels and certainly not on such issues.  I think it's a Russian cultural trait, some RWs just have more of it than others.

Again, just a suggestion, (short of bannishment), perhaps everyone should just place kivnna on "ignore",  without an audience this thread would not have grown to 20 pages of kvinna rants, ravings, question dodging, and other anti-men garbage.  And make no mistake, that's what it is, just garbage,,, no "good" was done here.

[Daveman]

And make no mistake, that's what it is, just garbage,,, no "good" was done here.

I agree most was garbage.  But, I sure learned something from this.  Let's just say, I now realize that some women deserve even more respect for being classy ladies... while others have *really* opened my eyes to what true treasures these classy ladies actually are.  We have a few of these treasures on this board.

Dave

[Bruno]

You have no use for Bill, so it's ok to unjustly black list him as part of your Eye for an Eye vendetta against Anti-Scam sites that you deplore.

Don't worry... in short time, Bill will be forget... on the same AD topic, some ladies have find new victims... Tigerpaws, Wiz, Albert... In short time, every men who have go near a RW will be reviewed... and if they say something bad for the RW reputation, they will be black listed ( don't care if what is say about RW is true or wrong )...

They have start a pool :

должны ли люди, которые рушат нашу репутацию и оскорбляют нас быть размещенными на Доску Позора?

result for now : 6 yes, 1 no... since i am the 1 "no", everybody other have vote "yes"...

Now, what mean give a bad reputation to RW ? Let take the Bill case... in his trip report, he wrote that he have refuse to have sex with a married RW... wrong, since now married RW will have the reputation to have sex with other that the husband... Bill have his ticket for the black list... don't care if what he say is true...

On these forum, i have explain that my ex-russian wife have ask the divorce the same day that she have receive her green card... wrong... i give RW the reputation to be CGC... don't care if it is true... Hmmm, maybe i can send one of my photo to Antidate, so they will be able to black list me in a easy way...

Edit : the time i make these post, one more "Da" in the poll...

[Daveman]

Well, Bruno,

If what you are saying here actually represents their true attitude, then their credibility will soon become so laughable that for a man to be placed on their blacklist will be a badge of honor.

I am sure there are good women over there who realize what nonsense this actually is. They'll make a stand eventually as good people always do.  If not, I wouldn't be interested in knowing them even as friends and much less as a possible life partner (even if I were looking for one).  I now have considerable doubts that any intelligent Russian women (without a vendetta) take that dribble seriously.  If they do, I don't want to be involved with them on any level anyway. They're simply not in my league.... yours either.

Dave

[2tallbill]

Bruno, I was the other Da in the poll. LOL

I had all the offending photos removed from all the sites.

I think that they will remove my photo from the page but I also think they should remove the links to my profiles on Elena's models etc.

They wrote quite a bit of vile things about me that are quite frankly completely ugly and untrue.

Bill

[Daveman]

Bruno, I was the other Da in the poll. LOL

I had all the offending photos removed from all the sites.

I think that they will remove my photo from the page but I also think they should remove the links to my profiles on Elena's models etc.

They wrote quite a bit of vile things about me that are quite frankly completely ugly and untrue.

Bill

Bill,
I agree they should remove the links..  I can't believe this happened over such an innocuous trip report.  Hopefully it will not have an adverse effect on your future search for a real life partner.  One day you can hold your dream girl in your arms, look back on this nonsense and laugh... it COULD happen! 

Dave

[Gator]

Daveman wrote,

Let's just say, I now realize that some women deserve even more respect for being classy ladies...

Well Dave, I think if you treat each and every woman with utmost respect, you may indeed inspire her to behave as a classy lady.  If not, politely walk away.

The issue with AD apparently is not whether Bill slept with anyone, it is whether he showed proper respect for RW.   

I doubt the "AD image police" read all lengthy T/Rs carefully, so I suppose the photos set off the AD alarms.  I personally found the white dots very weird, certainly not conveying a joyful mood, and even suggesting the women were conquests. 

Alarmed by the photos, the AD women combed through Bill’s report and distorted anything that could possibly resemble disrespectful behavior, even if it was a great stretch of imagination (e. g., backup plan, bringing condoms). 

What I find despicable by AD is that they overlooked the evidence that says he was respectful (similar to Durham District Attorney Mike Nifong).  That makes AD, in my opinion, much more disrespectful than Bill.   Worse, it is intentional disrespect unlike the unitentional disrespect Bill showed. 

Those wrongfully accused by Nifong had recourse and justice eventually prevailed.  Is there justice at AD?

[Daveman]

Well Dave, I think if you treat each and every woman with utmost respect, you may indeed inspire her to behave as a classy lady.  If not, politely walk away.

Point taken.  Completely. 

[LEGAL]

OK, guys, Kvinna has came to her own conclusion  about American men. I think it says enough.

http://forum.antidate.org/index.php?showtopic=6484&st=350
"Кстати, знаете к какому выводу я пришла пришла, вступив в ту дискуссию по поводу Билла на hDL/ Не дай Бог никому выяйти замуж за амера, все, чему их научили - это играть со словами, и переворачивать смыслы. В итоге вам докажут, что это вы во всем виноваты, а потому по скончаю браку вы останетесь должны и заставят расплачиваться даже по их собственным кредитам

By the way, do you know what a conclusion I come to associating on the occasion of Bill on hDL/? God forbid! to be married to amer (American man).   All  they have been taught is to play with the words and twist a sense. As a result they will be proved you that you are guilty of all,  therefore on termination your marriage you will be a debtor and have to pay off their debts".



Olga.