could you take a city RW and move her to the country

[Blues Fairy]

I am a firm believer that boredom is in the mind of the bored: i.e. some people will be bored wherever they live!

Very true.  But unless the lady is totally satisfied with her circle of communication consisting of tjk and the horses, she'll feel lonely no matter how rich her inner world.  Probably the richer, the lonelier - noone to share it with except tjk and the horses.

Are you an interesting guy tjk?  Do you read a lot of books? Play chess? 

[ScottinCrimea]

I think pk brings up a very good point.  For my wife, as well as most I have read about here, one of the most important things when they first arrived was to improve their English, no matter their prior fluency.  If I had lived in an area where ESL courses were not available, I think it would have been much more difficult for my wife.

So if we look at this one aspect of the transition, living out in the country would provide little or no access to ESL classes and much less opportunity to interact with other people than a big city location.  Now of course you might be able to compensate for this by driving her to classes every day, which may be a considerable distance, waiting for her and then driving her home, and with the distance to neighbors, stores, etc being longer you may need to drive her regularly to these places to give her more opportunities to interact.

Even if you find someone who likes the country style of living, if she has poor English skills and limited access to people other than yourself, she will experience a sense of isolation.  I remember that even though I moved to the downtown area of a reasonably large city in Ukraine, I still felt isloated due to my limited Russian.  The saving grace for me was that I had Russian language classes within walking distance, I had a large number and variety of people to interact with as my language skills improved, I had access to at least some English language materials (movies, books, etc) I had a few other Americans to interact with, etc.  I can't imagine how I would have managed it if I had moved to some small Ukrainian village where none of these were available.

So there are additional difficulties with finding what you seek.  You need a woman with a "village" mentality (meaning would enjoy the country life), who has reasonable English skills (more difficult to find outside the larger cities) and who has the strength to withstand the difficulties of the sense of isolation that will eventually come no matter where she moves to while still feeling comfortable with the total dependence she will have on you.

You have a tough search ahead of you, my friend.

[groovlstk]

Your chief hurdle is not one of city vs. country, but one of perception. Many FSU women equate country life with poverty so your chore is to convincingly demonstrate why that stereotype doesn't really apply to life in the West.

You'll always have two other issues to deal with, as mentioned above: easy access to public transportation and the ability to socialize at a moment's notice with friends and neighbors. 

[Misha]

Very true.  But unless the lady is totally satisfied with her circle of communication consisting of tjk and the horses, she'll feel lonely no matter how rich her inner world.  Probably the richer, the lonelier - noone to share it with except tjk and the horses.

Are you an interesting guy tjk?  Do you read a lot of books? Play chess? 

Communication is important, but how many people do you need? Some people need one good friend while others need hundreds of acquaintances. Besides, Blues Fairy, what do you know about life in the country in North America? In my experience, you have more real social interaction in a small rural setting than you ever will in a big city. This communication will require a knowledge of English, but if you speak English, you will have constant social interaction. You will be willing to drive a few kilometers simply to visit a neighbor and have a coffee. You will have many friends with people that share your interests. You will go shopping and EVERYBODY will know you and will stop to chat. I would argue that the people that are the loneliest are often those that live in a big city.

[Misha]

So if we look at this one aspect of the transition, living out in the country would provide little or no access to ESL classes and much less opportunity to interact with other people than a big city location. 

Even if you find someone who likes the country style of living, if she has poor English skills and limited access to people other than yourself, she will experience a sense of isolation.  I remember that even though I moved to the downtown area of a reasonably large city in Ukraine, I still felt isloated due to my limited Russian.  The saving grace for me was that I had Russian language classes within walking distance, I had a large number and variety of people to interact with as my language skills improved, I had access to at least some English language materials (movies, books, etc) I had a few other Americans to interact with, etc.  I can't imagine how I would have managed it if I had moved to some small Ukrainian village where none of these were available.

So there are additional difficulties with finding what you seek.  You need a woman with a "village" mentality (meaning would enjoy the country life), who has reasonable English skills (more difficult to find outside the larger cities) and who has the strength to withstand the difficulties of the sense of isolation that will eventually come no matter where she moves to while still feeling comfortable with the total dependence she will have on you.

You have a tough search ahead of you, my friend.

God, it is amazing the stereotypes that people have about life in the country! In certain ways, a woman is likely to learn English a lost faster in a small town than in a big city, precisely because there will be fewer Russians. Simply put, a woman will have no choice but to learn English. Yes, in the short term it will be more difficulty, but in the long run it will be more beneficial.

When I went to live overseas, I had taken a few basic Russian-language courses and spoke only a limited Russian. I was living in a Family and had nobody to speak in English with and was totally cut off. Guess what: in three months I was speaking fluently (Russian). My guess is that if you had lived in a small Ukrainian village you would have learned Russian that much faster.

[Blues Fairy]

Blues Fairy, what do you know about life in the country in North America? In my experience, you have more real social interaction in a small rural setting than you ever will in a big city.

I know little, therefore I'll refer to the original poster's description:

As you may or may not know I live in the country with nothing really around me but me, myself and I.

So obviously, unless the author is worldly enough to substitute the entire social network for his lady, she'll wind up depressed in no time.

[tjk]

Very true.  But unless the lady is totally satisfied with her circle of communication consisting of tjk and the horses, she'll feel lonely no matter how rich her inner world.  Probably the richer, the lonelier - noone to share it with except tjk and the horses.

Are you an interesting guy tjk?  Do you read a lot of books? Play chess? 

Hey Blue, I do try to read a little but I have a hard time finding the time for it anymore. I just need to make the time but it seems that there is always something to or that needs done. As far as chess no I never got into that I would not mind learning how to play. I think that it would be a very interesting game to learn with a lot of strategy involved. My son tries to play a little but I sometimes wonder if he knows what he is doing, since he don't like to loss very well.

I understand what you mean with the communication thing. That is one down fall to country life but there are always the neighbors and if you have a job in town as well. This way you would not feel like you was isolated. It would be a lot different that the city as you know not as many options but there is always something to do. That is one good thing about country life is your neighbor's area a close knit community in its self. I admit that I've had a hard time here in Minnesota with getting into that group but that is mostly my ex's fault there I believe because there are not many people that liked her and now I see why   ..

I have lived in the city before when I was in the Air Force and I soon got tired of no matter what you wanted to do it cost money. You just could not go out and play. That and you really had no privacy at all. At first it was fun but then it got old with the traffic and all the people.

[tjk]

Okay I will explain a little more about where I now live, which is a lot different than where I grew up at home. Over here my closest neighbor is only a mile or so away. at least the ones that I interact with. I do have a very good University only 30 Miles away. And the closest town would be 10 miles away. And Yes when you go to town you will always run into someone that you know. The nice thing about country life is that you will know more people who you would talk with, more friends that you would associate with. Unlike when you live in the city where you would not even know the other people that live in your building. Of course there is the down side that everyone knows your business as well. But on the other side everyone will look out for you as well. If you need help with something it is just a phone call away. It is not uncommon for your neighbor to stop in on his/her way somewhere and visit for awhile. We maybe considered to live in the country but it is more like a big outstretched town with a lot of parks in between the houses.

Now where I grew up at my closest neighbor was 5 miles away. And 18 miles to what you would call town. And the closest university would be like 4 to 5 hours away.

[Misha]

I know little, therefore I'll refer to the original poster's description:

So obviously, unless the author is worldly enough to substitute the entire social network for his lady, she'll wind up depressed in no time.

Worldly enough? I believe that you are projecting your own opinions and generalizing them to all Russian women :-) What you are asking is whether he would be worldly enough for you and if you were in the country you would wind up depressed!

[Blues Fairy]

Worldly enough? I believe that you are projecting your own opinions and generalizing them to all Russian women :-) What you are asking is whether he would be worldly enough for you and if you were in the country you would wind up depressed!

Perhaps you are right, but not 100%.   I do not generalize to ALL RW but only to city girls such as myself - and I believe I have enough representative data to do so. 

[Misha]

Perhaps you are right, but not 100%.   I do not generalize to ALL RW but only to city girls such as myself - and I believe I have enough representative data to do so. 

Well, Moscow has a population of 8 - 9 million people. More than half are women. So, my guess is that among the 4+ million women there would be a wide variety of opinions. I do generalize about Muscovites myself, but usually in a negative manner so I tell myself that not all Muscovites fit my representative date lol...

[Turboguy]

I read something a long time ago that I think has some truth to it.   I am not sure if I can explain it well but I will try.  What I read said that the tighter you pack people, such as in a big city or a big apartment building it will cause a reaction of wanting to create a distance in how they interact with people.   It went on to say that the further you put people apart the more it will create a draw to others.  It was basically a theory to explain why those who live in big cities and not outgoing and friendly and those who live in rural locations are.  Anyone who has visited Minn or S.D. will likely think it is one of the friendliest places they have been and no one says that about NYC.

Trying to tie that into my personal experiences I only live once in a fairly large apartment complex and even though the units were spaced out in my 1.5 years there I only talked to two people and that was fairly briefly.  I lived in one very small town and you could not have asked for a friendlier place.  I lived there two years and probably had 50 friends and some of the best friends I have had in my life.  When I think about my former Ukrainian friend who visited here a few weeks ago and was not too happy with me.   Where she lived was totally desolate, beautiful but to visit anyone you nearly had to drive.   The nearest town was 6 miles and had two or three stores.   Living there she had tons of friends and some that would have given her their left arm.  I would be willing to bet had she moved to a big city she would have had very few local friends if any. 

I have a feeling the hardest parts of TJK's challenges are going to be finding a woman who will accept a life like that and the early period of her adjustments.   Once that is passed I have a feeling she will love it.

[tjk]

I read something a long time ago that I think has some truth to it.   I am not sure if I can explain it well but I will try.  What I read said that the tighter you pack people, such as in a big city or a big apartment building it will cause a reaction of wanting to create a distance in how they interact with people.   It went on to say that the further you put people apart the more it will create a draw to others.  It was basically a theory to explain why those who live in big cities and not outgoing and friendly and those who live in rural locations are.  Anyone who has visited Minn or S.D. will likely think it is one of the friendliest places they have been and no one says that about NYC.

Trying to tie that into my personal experiences I only live once in a fairly large apartment complex and even though the units were spaced out in my 1.5 years there I only talked to two people and that was fairly briefly.  I lived in one very small town and you could not have asked for a friendlier place.  I lived there two years and probably had 50 friends and some of the best friends I have had in my life.  When I think about my former Ukrainian friend who visited here a few weeks ago and was not too happy with me.   Where she lived was totally desolate, beautiful but to visit anyone you nearly had to drive.   The nearest town was 6 miles and had two or three stores.   Living there she had tons of friends and some that would have given her their left arm.  I would be willing to bet had she moved to a big city she would have had very few local friends if any. 

I have a feeling the hardest parts of TJK's challenges are going to be finding a woman who will accept a life like that and the early period of her adjustments.   Once that is passed I have a feeling she will love it.

Yes I agree with you Turbo. The country is really like a small town it is just that your neighbors live a little was from you instead of next door. The small town is one of the friendliest places because everyone relies on one another. And yes I even wave to almost every car that I meet on the road not because I know them just because that is how it is.

I know from my experience in the city from the service that I did not like the idea that I didn't know the people that lived above me or beside me. I thought that was a very strange thing to live that close to someone and not know a thing about them at all. And what was even more strange was that they really did not care who I was at all. I first thought this was very rude behaviour, but that is just the way that it is in the city. So it did not take me long to realize that this was not for me at all. In stead of the friendly how are you it was the what do you want..I will admit that these where not even really big cities, I don't know how I would react to living in a place like that.

One more thing turbo are you holding out on me with this freind of yours....

[BillyB]

Don't know about Adrian, but I am sick and tired of being accused of identity fraud on this forum. One more post like the above and I'm outta here. 

Yo Adrian, goodbye!

Occasionally there comes a few people that want to play games at the forum with dual identities. I suspect Hub is Pike but Hub seems to participate instead of playing games so I don't say much about it. They both came to the forum and getting the members worked up with their seeing many women in their apartment, both been to the same places in the FSU and go there on business trips. They both like women with a breast size no bigger than a B cup and both agree there will be sagging problems in the later years of women with larger breasts. I could be wrong and there are two separate people posting who lived similar lives and think alike.

Don't worry Bluesfairy, once you get to about 2000 posts, people will believe you are who you really are. Or simply post a couple of hot photos of yourself and men will believe anything you say.

tjk, hows your search going so far? Are you anouncing to the ladies in your first letter your situation living in the country? If you write anything pertaining to distances in you letter, convert the miles to kilometers so the ladies will understand better. 1 mile equals approx. 1.6 kilometers

[tjk]

tjk, hows your search going so far? Are you anouncing to the ladies in your first letter your situation living in the country? If you write anything pertaining to distances in you letter, convert the miles to kilometers so the ladies will understand better. 1 mile equals approx. 1.6 kilometers

Hey BillyB. I usually have been letting them know in the second letter and instead of miles or kilometers I've been going with minutes. That way maybe they will think a little more in the frame of walking distance instead of being overwhelmed with a distance. Well I guess not walking distance but I say driving minutes.  Don't know if this is a good thing or not?????

Yes the search is on got a few hits and trying to decided if it is a real girl or some smart a@# pretending to be a girl.....Got to love that guy. Would not mind finding him some day would look a little like this   ..

I have stopped looking at the pretty little girls and moved up to the 26 to 38 range. I do not mind if they would have 1 child so that opened a few more doors as long as the child is young. I have been trying to stay with girls that have at least good English, but this is not a deciding factor for me.

[BillyB]

Wow, wow, wow, wow, and wow! After being directed to the photo gallery by Dar to see her and her husband, I found your photo in there too Bluesfairy. You don't look like an Adrian to me in that bikini. With a body like that, all you have to is tell men your mom is sick and they will take out their wallets and send you money. Now we have to accuse you of being a scammer!

http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?ind=gallery&op=foto_show&ida=389

[ScottinCrimea]

God, it is amazing the stereotypes that people have about life in the country! In certain ways, a woman is likely to learn English a lost faster in a small town than in a big city, precisely because there will be fewer Russians. Simply put, a woman will have no choice but to learn English. Yes, in the short term it will be more difficulty, but in the long run it will be more beneficial.

When I went to live overseas, I had taken a few basic Russian-language courses and spoke only a limited Russian. I was living in a Family and had nobody to speak in English with and was totally cut off. Guess what: in three months I was speaking fluently (Russian). My guess is that if you had lived in a small Ukrainian village you would have learned Russian that much faster.

What stereotype?  I have spent enough time living in the sticks to know what is real and what is stereotype.  If you look more closely, you would see that I am talking about the difficult transition period and how much more difficult it could be, not life in the long term as you mention.  Once she learns English than she will be able to interact with all of these friendly people, but in the short term she will feel frustrated and seem more of a curiosity to them than she would in a larger city where people are more used to diverse cultures.  Jut try planting anyone who is different in any way in a small town and see how quickly they are accepted as one of them.

[tjk]

  Jut try planting anyone who is different in any way in a small town and see how quickly they are accepted as one of them.

You do have a point here. I know that when someone new moves into the small town they are classified as the newbie and it takes awhile to get your roots down and spread out to find that group of people that you really like. Of course if you was that single good looking teacher that moved to town well then that is a different story because then you have all your single cousins trying to chase her as well. It is a little hard even for me because I come from cattle country and this is farmer country. But with a little time one can find that groove.

[tim 360]

Boy, this is one funny thread.  TJK, many things are possible I think.  It is a good idea if she loves you.  I have a friend here in VT who likes very much living in a country setting.  She's 25, a real cutie and from Kiev and married a friend of mine.  She loves the snowboarding and outdoor life and fishing and camping too.  And she can gut and clean her own fish and grill it on an open fire.  Of course her English is excellent and she drives her own car and has no problem navigating shopping the big box stores about 15 miles away.  And they take a few trips to Boston every year to soak up the city life and usually a 2 week trip each spring to Kiev.  

This is entertaining reading, but I think FSU big city girls are quite capable and much more resilent than some of you realize.  She met her hubbie while here on a college visa so she already knew where she was moving to.  Of course finding a girl like this may not be very easy.  

[Misha]

What stereotype?  I have spent enough time living in the sticks to know what is real and what is stereotype.  If you look more closely, you would see that I am talking about the difficult transition period and how much more difficult it could be, not life in the long term as you mention.  Once she learns English than she will be able to interact with all of these friendly people, but in the short term she will feel frustrated and seem more of a curiosity to them than she would in a larger city where people are more used to diverse cultures.  Jut try planting anyone who is different in any way in a small town and see how quickly they are accepted as one of them.

Yes, but the transition will be also hard if she moves to a city. Wherever she goes, she won't be home. The stereotypes: 1) a woman from a large city from the FSU will automatically dislike life in the country in North America; 2) a woman from a "village" in Russia (presumably somehow inferior) will automatically adjust better to life in the country in North America; 3) only women from the big city in the FSU can speak English. And, now the new stereotype: people in small towns are less accepting of immigrants. In my experience, the Russian immigrants that I met living in small towns in Canada did better than those living in Toronto Canada's biggest city. Yes, in Toronto, they had more Russian services, but they ended up being in competition with more people for the same jobs. In the small towns and smaller cities, Russians integrated much more easily into their communities and they actually established career much more easily than many of the Russian immigrants that I met from the big Canadian cities.

[Turboguy]

Personally I think people will be much more accepting of any woman tjk finds where he lives than if he lived in NYC.  Most small town, middle of nowhere people have had little chance to interreact with anyone from Russia.  They will be beating down the doors to talk to her, to ask her about life there to learn how she likes here and will be bending over backwards to be friends and to make her feel welcome.   I saw it here with my former fiancee.  People did things to help her that they would never have thought about doing for someone else.

For tjk when he brings here there it will be like winning the lottery.   He will find good friends who he never knew he had.

In NYC she would be just another of those Green Card RW.

[tjk]

Personally I think people will be much more accepting of any woman tjk finds where he lives than if he lived in NYC.  Most small town, middle of nowhere people have had little chance to interreact with anyone from Russia.  They will be beating down the doors to talk to her, to ask her about life there to learn how she likes here and will be bending over backwards to be friends and to make her feel welcome.   I saw it here with my former fiancee.  People did things to help her that they would never have thought about doing for someone else.

For tjk when he brings here there it will be like winning the lottery.   He will find good friends who he never knew he had.

In NYC she would be just another of those Green Card RW.

You know something Turbo you made me remember a trip my family and me took a couple of years ago to Wisconsin Dells. Really fun place. But there at the Wendy's where we ate dinner one night, was ran with nothing but girls from FSU and I can remember that was very exciting for me, even thou I was married at the time. Anyway everyone was talking to them learning a little more about the mysterious FSU.

One other thought about the immigrates to the small town all most everyone in the small town thinks a immigrate is some one other than white. Not that it is a prejudice thing that is just how they think. Dark skin immigrant, white skin oh well. There have been a lot of immigrants move into this area lately mostly from Asia or somewhere around there. They are getting use to the idea.

[Turboguy]

I think there are a lot of American's who have a certain fascination and curiosity about Russia and Russians.  I think in places where they are not common it will make everyone want to talk to her. 

[ScottinCrimea]

Being a novelty can be fun for a little while, but it grows old quickly.  For people to take an interest in you solely because you are different (which will be the case until they get to know you) can be tough if the interest fades once the novelty wears off.  It's also a little tiring to constantly have others observing you and discussing you.  Fortunately, this goes away as soon as the next juicy topic of gossip emerges.

Hard to say which is better:  to move to a big city and be ignored because you are not a novelty only to later make friends as people get to know you, or to move to a small town and have a lot of attention initially only to see most fade away and be left with only those friends who you actually have something in common with.

[Misha]

Hard to say which is better:  to move to a big city and be ignored because you are not a novelty only to later make friends as people get to know you, or to move to a small town and have a lot of attention initially only to see most fade away and be left with only those friends who you actually have something in common with.

Both will require a lot of effort. Making friends in a city takes time and effort. If getting to know people was so easy in the city you wouldn't have all the dating agencies trying to match people in large cities. Usually, you meet people through work, but even then it is not a given that they will become friends. There is also the possibility that you will quickly integrate into the local Russian community with all the advantages and disadvantages that entails. Likewise, integration into a small town also requires effort in different ways as you rightfully pointed out.

The point that I was trying to make is that you can't simply assume that all women and all Russian women from the city will find the country boring and I do not believe that a city is any more fun or exciting than the country. In both places you will have to make an effort to make friends and keep yourself busy. However, there are stereotypes and TJK will have to explain to any woman what his life is really like and he will have to put in a bit more effort to find someone who is not citycentric.