Should she report him to Antidate?

[Admin]

I am nor Kvinna but I want to say.

If a man (or woman) chose to be legally married for any reason (society view or whatever) then they have to act as legally married person or look for a partner who doesn't mind to have relationships with married person.

Fiora,

I think we said the same thing. I said that the guy must be honest and forthright about his circumstances, and if so, nobody is being misled or lied to. It is then a matter of conscious choice.

- Dan

[Shadow]

what do you think about such letters
should I mention that one innocent girl with zero English translated pussy as a kitty and was melted about "this nice and gentle man"

It shows the importance of at least knowing some language or getting help from someone who does when starting out. Online translators are good for those who know how to handle them. In general they are like weapons. Effective for those who know how to use them, disaster in the hands of the inexperienced.

[Fiorella]

Fiora,

I think we said the same thing. I said that the guy must be honest and forthright about his circumstances, and if so, nobody is being misled or lied to. It is then a matter of conscious choice.

- Dan

I agree but on the practice not so many men are honestly say about their real plans, many, many of them prefer to promise soon sweet life together with this woman.

[Simoni]

I agree but on the practice not so many men are honestly say about their real plans, many, many of them prefer to promise soon sweet life together with this woman.

Florella...  The reality is that many of us here are making a great life with an fsu woman.  And hundreds more want the same.  Thus, this "sweet life" is not a dream, but reality.

[Admin]

I agree but on the practice not so many men are honestly say about their real plans, many, many of them prefer to promise soon sweet life together with this woman.

Now, it seems, we are drifting toward a condemnation of the fact that some (you say; "many, many" - but I am not sure) men make promises they do not intend to keep. I submit that *some* women do exactly the same thing. I further submit that some married women list themselves on international marriage sites - and I submit that there are an even larger number of women who are living with a man and call themselves "married" while in the FSU, but conveniently drop the moniker when it comes time to list themselves on an agency site.

In terms of common ground, I think we would all agree that to intentionally deceive someone is reprehensible - and that applies equally to men and women. Agreed?

- Dan

[Fiorella]

Florella...  The reality is that many of us here are making a great life with an fsu woman.  And hundreds more want the same.  Thus, this "sweet life" is not a dream, but reality.

I guess you are all married to your fsu women.

[Shadow]

I guess you are all married to your fsu women.

Not yet, but it is getting hard to escape that stage. 

[Fiorella]

Now, it seems, we are drifting toward a condemnation of the fact that some (you say; "many, many" - but I am not sure) men make promises they do not intend to keep.
- Dan

I don't talk about all men involved in international online dating - when I say "many, many of them" - I only mean these men who is still legally married and who is not sure about their sertain plans.

[Fiorella]

In terms of common ground, I think we would all agree that to intentionally deceive someone is reprehensible - and that applies equally to men and women. Agreed?
- Dan

Absolutelly!

[BillyB]

Kvinna, I have no problem with people who are seperated as long as they are honest. I've seen thousands of women's profiles and at least 10 women said they were seperated. It would be ashame if an anti-scam site listed them when they are being honest. Besides reasons Dan listed, sometimes a man or woman may not divorce in hopes that there will be reconciliation with their spouse and they hold out divorcing till the last minute.

Ken, many of us respect Gator and automatically give credibility to the people who associate with the people Gator associates with. Many of us in this thread are respected too but keep in mind, you, Dan, Scott, Gator and I have all married nut cases in the past. We all have the ability to misjudge with painful and expensive results.

Gator, I like what you said, the RW's reports the man, her name could be soiled too on the internet possibly ruining good opportunities with good men. As a matter of fact, it happened to a RW as told in a recent thread when a guy retaliated after finding his name at anti date.

[Kvinna]

Kvinna, I have no problem with people who are seperated as long as they are honest. I've seen thousands of women's profiles and at least 10 women said they were seperated. It would be ashame if an anti-scam site listed them when they are being honest. Besides reasons Dan listed, sometimes a man or woman may not divorce in hopes that there will be reconciliation with their spouse and they hold out divorcing till the last minute.

You know Bill, I think if you received a letter from a husband of a such separated woman with curses or demand to leave his wife in peace you would revise your views on this situation

[Mishenka]

As far as I'm concerned until the divorce is final,  a couple is still legally married and has a chance to reconcile.  Hearts can change. Even then after divorce, I've known 3 couples that were remarried to each other and lived happier the second time around. It isn't over till the paper work is done.  Is it ever really over?  doubtful,  especially if you have joint custody of your kids. 

Any  man or woman who is not legally divorced has no right to wander into someone else's marriage and cause problems.  A word of wisdom to anyone doing this is, stay out of the way, you'll only get hurt and do more harm than good.   I've known many couples that stuck it out and stayed together.   

Mishenka

[BillyB]

You know Bill, I think if you received a letter from a husband of a such separated woman with curses or demand to leave his wife in peace you would revise your views on this situation

No, I would not revise my views. An incident being deceived by one woman wouldn't make me think all women are like her. Most women who say they are separated in their profiles are telling the truth. The married women who want to deceive men will usually say they are single or divorced almost all the time.

For me, I would call a RW many times before I commit to visiting her. By calling her many times in her own home and at different hours of the day will tell me if there is a man in the house or not or if she was hiding something. If a RW likes you, she would be happy to receive your calls most anytime of the day instead of saying "call back later" all the time. But if I was one of those shy men who does not call but only write letters, there would be a chance to get unexpected mail from a possible husband of the woman I'm writing to. Of course I would think an ex husband has the password to her mail and she's not smart enough to protect her email account or she is actually married as the husband states in his letter, or maybe I was communicating with a man all along and it was a joke. If I had planned on meeting a woman in a neutral country and promised to pay her trip at the meeting, I think I would have valid reasons to back out and cancel if I saw a letter from a husband that states she is still his.

Personally, I would not want to go out with a woman that lists herself as "separated" because I don't want all the extra hassle and drama of her divorce.

But the bottom line is that even if one woman lies about her status as a separated woman, it doesn't mean all women lie when they state they are separated and certainly women or men listing themselves as "separated" don't belong on a blacklist. Look at almost every agency, local and international dating sites and they offer men and women to list themselves as "separated". It's safe to say that most people who list themselves as "separated" are telling the truth.

I know a guy at work who's wife had abandoned him. He hadn't seen her for 7 years after his wife left him for another guy. What triggered him to finally file divorce was that he found another woman to take his mind off his wife. Was he wrong to date this other woman while he was separated near 7 years? Or can we praise him for wanting to make his marriage work and honor his wedding vows under the difficult conditions of abandonment and adultry on the part of his wife? I  think he's nuts for waiting so long but he's not smart and not pretty to look at so opportunities for him to date other women are slim so waiting was not much of an option.

[William3rd]

REMINDER- the ORIGINAL post was about whether or not a RW victim would be advised to report a certain man's less than honorable behavior to Antidate-

The ANSWER to the poll was 80% YES.

Lest we forget. . . . . . . 

[rose]

Lately I thought a lot about the actions we take and about consequences. Why do people blame others for their own mistakes? The discussed situation is just one side point of view, how can we be sure that it happened exactly the way it was described?
A lot of very important details were left out. All this discussion is based on the minimal amount of facts lack of which was compensated by the assumptions. On 10 pages you tried to decide should this girl report the guy or not, but in reality you were judging him for something what he maybe never has done. I'm not trying to defend the guy, I just simply trying to point out that as long as there is no his side of the story we may not come to any conclusion.
Not always what seems to be the truth is the truth.

[Mishenka]

Rose,

we will know more when Gator meets with this woman over the weekend.  Even then, we still only hear one side.  In any court of law you must have at least two wittnesses to confirm an accusation. Without this the court won't hear you.  The guy doing his disapearing act makes me think he is guilty as charged, however, we will never fully know, will we?

Will it make a difference to anyone if he is reported?  will it get back her loss of money? will it heal her heart?  Will it bother the man who for all we know doesnt even exist?  For all we know it could have been an angry wife that did this to get back at her cheating husband.  It won't make any difference. Any energy spent on this is a waste of valuable energy. Cut losses and move forward.

Mishenka

[Mir]

To give an example that I know is on the extreme end, better to have ten  innocent men on sex offender list than to have one pedophile roaming around

As long as you are not one of those 10 men,yes?

[Gator]

Rose, you are a smart woman. Let me summarize.

Lately I thought a lot about the actions we take and about consequences. Why do people blame others for their own mistakes?

This woman accepts responsibility for her gullible actions.  Her friend advised her not to do it, yet she did it in her search for love.  She is too trusting because she made a mistake with another European..

All this discussion is based on the minimal amount of facts lack of which was compensated by the assumptions

.

I reported only basic facts as conveyed to me.  I have met this woman.  She is sincere.  In fact, she is  a very sweet and warm-hearted woman.  To repeat the facts: man and woman say to each other that they want to meet, man will not travel to Russia, man will not send money for trip because of fear of scamming, man promises to repay woman in Turkey, man sends sms at last moment that he will not travel to Turkey, tickets were non-refundable (because she had already changed them once before for him), man will not answer email and sms's, man does not offer to reimburse woman,.

I omitted opinions.  If you want opinions, here is one.  My Moscow woman spoke to her friend several times about this.  My Moscow woman has 8 years experience with communicating with and meeting foreign men ( two as agency interpreter, 4 with me, and miscellaneous).  Plus she has street smarts for evaluating people.  Her opinion is that the man was never serious about traveling - just a "crazy dreamer".  Just an opinion, but she is usually correct.

I just simply trying to point out that as long as there is not his side of the story we may not come to any conclusion.

I would like to know his reasons for cancelling the trip one day before she was suppose to depart.   However, to do that, she would need to release his name.  Then what happens?  With his character, he may charge that she is a scammer and  fabricate some wild story on the internet.   Then an innocent woman would have mud on her good name and she would face a long battle to correct it.   So why risk that?

I reported this true story not to influence this woman to report the man, but to discuss an issue.  We have discussed it thoroughly.  I think it is best to leave it here.

[Gator]

Forgot to add in response to the issue of a man being separated yet not divorced.  We covered this in the Proposed Draft Guidelines for Dating FSU Women.

http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=5853.msg104952#msg104952

When corresponding with a lady it's important to be honest and truthful about yourself.  Use current photographs and tell the truth about height, weight, criminal record and other personal details, particularly your current circumstances and your intentions.

With the disclosed information, the woman can decide whether to continue correspondence. 

I was in the process of a long divorce with my wife when I made my first trip to Russia.  The divorce was as amicable as one could ever expect. In fact, we still lived in the same house (big house) but did not share a bed.  A few RW had problems with my disclosure or could not understand still living together. Yet most trusted my intentions.  I later became engaged to one.

[rose]

Gator,
actually, I was saying that for us there is not too much to discuss. And for her - she needs to decide what exactly she wants: protect others from this man or learn her lesson and move on. The answer if she should report him will follow from her choice.

[Mishenka]

Gator, once again I have to agree with you on this,  as you say, she had the  best advice from your woman and didn't take it. Now it's time to leave it alone.  The only thing that will promote healing and getting her over this is to just move on.  Lessons learned.  Now she can help others by sharing her own experience and I'm sure she will speak loud and clear to WARN THEM.

Just like everyone told me to do with Tanya,  I have taken their best advice on this forum and not contacted this girl all week and it has done me good. I'm well over it now.  Thank you all the the good therapy!

Mishenka

[groovlstk]

You know Bill, I think if you received a letter from a husband of a such separated woman with curses or demand to leave his wife in peace you would revise your views on this situation

Billy is correct, as long as a woman or man is upfront about their situation, who are you to judge their situation or worry about them being threatened?

For the record, my wife was married but separated when we began communicating. She told me this in our very first exchange. I had reservations about it but since we began as friends the only time it was an issue was when we were ready to file our K1 and we needed a divorce decree.

[Kvinna]

Billy is correct, as long as a woman or man is upfront about their situation, who are you to judge their situation or worry about them being threatened?

sorry I have not understood what you scream about?
did I say that we blacklist each separated guy? As I remember I didn't ...
so fifty points from Gryffindor for an preapprehension about the women from Antidate
and again we will blacklist any separated guy whose wife will call or email curses to our women, because at first you have to solve your problem with your separated wife and only after this to start looking for someone else.

And YES, we don't recommend our women to deal with separated men.

[Mishenka]

Billy is correct, as long as a woman or man is upfront about their situation, who are you to judge their situation or worry about them being threatened?

For the record, my wife was married but separated when we began communicating. She told me this in our very first exchange. I had reservations about it but since we began as friends the only time it was an issue was when we were ready to file our K1 and we needed a divorce decree.

Well Groov,, maybe BillyB is "correct" in your eyes,  however, a man or woman who is not divorced is still considered married both morally and by law. Not to mention in God's eyes. Ultimately,  it is Him we have to answer to.  If they choose to start another fling or relationship before its final,  they are committing adultery.  We all have our own convictions and morals or immoral as this suggests.  Divorce happens in the heart long before papers are ever filed or become final.  I'm no one to judge unless they come to me for advice,  at that point I  have to call it as it is.  I have never seen anything good come out of adultery,only needless pain. People need to wise up and spend time healing or they just repeat the same old patterns and mistakes.  

[Gator]

Mishenka,

You are opening a can of worms.  I am hesitant to comment because it touches on religion and morality.  Religious and moral views vary from person to person.  What may be wrong for you may be good for another.  However, some of us could use spiritual guidance and counseling, but not here.

I will attempt to confine this to legal obligations.  Laws regarding adultery essentially are blue laws, are not enforced, and carry no weight.  The laws vary, and in some states your recent and now terminated relationship could be considered adultery.  There are other laws which may address some of the sexual acts you do to express your fond emotions for a woman.  So people can ignore the laws regarding adultery.

How did this thread get here?  If you wish to discuss this in more depth, I suggest that you start a new thread elsewhere.