Should she report him to Antidate?

[Mir]

Maybe he is dead. It happens to folks everyday.

Even if he is not reporting or not reporting on the antidate will not make any difference whatsoever

[Jazzyclassy]

anyway he vanished , not robbed her damaged her life or anything, I never told he did right , he did a Wrong thing, but that thing can not be compared with putting him to that Antidate site which crosses, marks the life of a person for good, labels him forever
what are you talking about, you are supporting the girl , just cos she is a good friend of Gator's girlfriend so what?  Who really can tell that this story is true in the first place, it is just ridiculous how many of you are with double standards,

I really feel unjustice here so just do not try to change my mind, you can defend the girl which is of course also right , but you have no right to just damage a reputation of a person you do not know!

[Muj]

From Gator's info he is definately obliged to repay the amount she spent.  Is there a small claims court in his country or hers that helps her at least compensate her for expenses he comitted to pay?  E-mail provides enough evidence of his promise to repay her.  His wife or gf probably became suspicious of his "business trip" or he's a keyboard romeo or worse.  I vote yes.

[wiz]

Jazzy

I think tonight you have lost it and you don't know what you are talking about!

Gator put out the question about this case and asked us to express our opinion and we did!

After that it is up to that woman what to do..........report him to Antidate or Not.

IT IS NOT ME OR ANY OTHER RWD MEMBER WHO IS GOING TO DO IT!

Mir has also given you his opinion about that site and I happen to agree with him.


Muj

Yes England has a small claims court.

[Muj]

Wiz,
Maybe you chaps can help her.  By far small claims proves the most effective in dealing with the guy.  If he's married then he'll pay to cover up.  If a scam, then the address or name proves false and if he's having hard times then he must explain.  She flushes him out either way.

[KenC]

I voted yes.  If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it is usually a duck.  For those of you that think the guys should be cut some slack I would say "when you hear horse hooves in the distance, expect horses not zebras."  Could it be an incredible sequence of events that forced him to renege on his promises?  Yes, but not likely.  And if that were the case, the guy is still a scumbag for not being man enough to explain himself.

She should report him now and when and if more facts arise, reevaluate the situation.
KenC

[BillyB]

Could it be an incredible sequence of events that forced him to renege on his promises?  Yes, but not likely. 

Ken, I once read on a site that said 60% of the couples who decide to do k-1's never end in marriage. That would equate to a lot of failed commitments. After reading the forums for some time and a 50% divorce rate out there, I am starting to believe there is some truth to it. FSU rookie is one of many who had plans to marry only for it to end due to deception or change of heart.

Technically in most every divorce, there is behavior by both husband and wife that justifies them to list each other on an anti scam site if one existed. How far should we take this guys? Seriously, I see big bucks in that if someone wanted to start a site. Report your ex and bring out the dirty laundry for the world to see.

[KenC]

Ken, I once read on a site that said 60% of the couples who decide to do k-1's never end in marriage. That would equate to a lot of failed commitments. After reading the forums for some time and a 50% divorce rate out there, I am starting to believe there is some truth to it. FSU rookie is one of many who had plans to marry only for it to end due to deception or change of heart.

Technically in most every divorce, there is behavior by both husband and wife that justifies them to list each other on an anti scam site if one existed. How far should we take this guys? Seriously, I see big bucks in that if someone wanted to start a site. Report your ex and bring out the dirty laundry for the world to see.

Billy,
I understand your position, but take a look at this from a different point of view.  What is wrong with reporting the facts?  I know that the "facts" here are unsubstantiated, but let us assume they are truthful.  The guy promised to meet her and did not.  The guy promised to repay her for her expenses and did not.  The guy vanished into thin air, which is not the best evidence of being legit.

I also think that comparing unsuccessful marriages with a scam in progress is two very different things.  Apples and oranges.  The lady feels misled and I do not blame her at all.  There are many more break ups during the process of finding your spouse.  It can be handled properly with dignity and class and then there is another way.  But in this case we are not even just talking about a break up, we are addressing a series of misleading and dishonest actions which resulted in the lady not only being misled with false promises, but also incurring financial harm too.  Isn't that almost the definition of a scammer?
KenC

[BillyB]

.What is wrong with reporting the facts?[/i]  I know that the "facts" here are unsubstantiated, but let us assume they are truthful. 

I'm all for putting facts on anti date but not listing the man's name at the moment. Just mentioning the incident will teach RW at anti date not to meet a stranger in a neutral location.

But in this case we are not even just talking about a break up, we are addressing a series of misleading and dishonest actions which resulted in the lady not only being misled with false promises, but also incurring financial harm too.  Isn't that almost the definition of a scammer?

Well, the guy could've went on the trip and do a whole lot worse to the woman than just not showing up. The woman was harmed financially but she took a risk. She should've expected the possiblility of the man not showing up and delivering on his word. Certainly there are worse men out there than this man. He is not a proven sex tourist and he could've simply said nothing and let the woman fly to Turkey and remain stranded alone in the street because of his last minute hotel reservation cancellation. Although he is not paying the RW's airfare willingly or based on a situation beyond his control such as a loss of job, he was respectable enough to tell her he isn't going to make the trip. With that, I can't say he intentionally wanted to play games with her. Maybe he's taking a loss with his non refundable tickets too. Or if he had refundable tickets, he might assume the RW had the same and would not have suffered a huge loss either.

The man had nothing to gain by cancelling his trip and should not be labeled a scammer. Scammers are people who wants to gain at another's expense.

[Mishenka]

I feel this woman's pain, Gator,   this happens all to often to men and women.  Here's my testimony:

I went through this 6 years ago with a woman from Sydney Australia.  Except in reverse.  I flew to Sydney, paid for hotel, rental car,  airfare etc, only to find she had lied to me and was still married with her husband living at home.

I spoke to her right before I boarded the plane at LAX,  She asked me if I was ready to move in with her,, if I had packed all my things, did I have the baby clothes for her friend, a Padres outfit because she loved Baseball, so I bought this mini padre uniform for this year old baby.   I bought gifts for her two daughters and of course for her. 

She had the chance to come clean with me on the phone more than 5 or 6 times that week.  We talked daily at all hours of the day and night. I spoke to her kids on the phone and even her parents.  Not once was the man ever in her home.  The day I arrive at Sydney airport, she was not there to greet me,  I spent hours on the phone trying to reach her, leaving messages, 3 days sitting the hotel calling.   Finally her husband answers the phone,,  I wont give details but his message was basically  F off, that she was living in fantasy and I was it. The fantasy is over.   She never expected me to actually show up. Thinking it was a joke and I was teasing her??? 

Long drama short,  3 days later I flew on to New Zealand where I met friends and ended up becoming a resident and staying 5 years.

I know and feel this woman's pain.  I think the man that did this to her needs his neck adjusted. (broken)  Even if he paid back all the money she lost, her heart is so damaged it will take years to trust any man again, if ever......

Mishenka, 

[wiz]

Billy

With due respect everything you wrote in your last post it's in my opinion, suppositions, assumptions and practically wild guesses to avoid calling the man a scammer, because he did not benefited from his actions but the reality is that he is a scoundrel.

The facts are that he encouraged the woman and agreed to go on a holiday and also promised to repay the money to this woman but at the last minutes he told her he is not going and then vanished.

Bottom line is that he a scoundrel, acted Dishonestly when he dissapeared and did not kept his promises, if ever were made!

In this senario the question was.... should he be reported or not?

What label or title the AD women  will give him it is up to them, not my friends as you know.

[William3rd]

HE gained-one way or the other, he gained.

Either through getting his sick cookies off by hurting somebody emotionally or by collecting a few paying women before deciding on which girl to actually see, my opinion is that he gained.

Post Name, address, photos. But, to be fair, give him a chance to respond. I am sure that he has this totally awesome excuse that will just charm the pants off of y'all.

It is more likely that other victims would then come forward with the same experiences.

Hey, any of you  Mr. Scumbag supporters live in LA? Spector is going back on trial soon and he would love to have ya in his jury pool!!!

[Jazzyclassy]

When someone does something much more awful you people say -Oi give poor guy a chance, and when somebody did a wrong thing but this girl can overcome it and move on just be always careful , you are ready to put this person into hell

But that is on your concsience, very quick to judge

I think Gator did a wrong thing that he ever post such info here, like he did not know about the reaction of our all fan's of "justice" supermen.

The thing is first when you come to the forum , you have no clue , who is who , who is who's friend and so on , now it is so easy for me to predict what almost all of you will tell about such case with this guy! It is all predictable but there is no sense in your decision to put that person on  Antidate

only BillyB is trying to say something smart , but it is like a crowd of evil people, who will crash the person till he is dead!

[I/O]

I digress. I have been around (Before marriage) quite a few dating sites and such like and had never heard of antidate, so frankly I am of the opinion that it's reach is far over estimated. My point is that listing him there is certainly not going to stop or even to any extent limit his wrongful actions in any extensive way.

If she feels it will do some good for her and maybe others, listing the facts of the case without the emotional content would be useful, but I highly doubt any person in such situation would be capable of an objective style report.

The next point is that she is a woman who has been mislead, but she is a woman (We assume) and not a child. If she went in blind, she sure has her eyes open now and in a way has been saved from possibly much worse. Sure the money and time is comparitively much bigger in Russian terms than western terms, but ................. she knew the risks and she took one that IMO shouldn't be taken. 

The whole thing cuts right across something I have been dead against from very early on and that is "Third location meetings". Sure, people will say it worked for us, but most I have heard of and seen accurate information about have gone tits up in some form or another.

To be fair, he has been a complete prick and she has been dumb. Report to antidate.........? Yeah, whatever.........!!

I/O

[Jazzyclassy]

  To be fair, he has been a complete prick and she has been dumb. Report to antidate.........? Yeah, whatever.........!!

I/O         

I agree with this for sure, report anything  you consider is right, but the other question is this : will it  bring peace and satisfaction to that lady's feeling?

[wiz]

 

Gator has been around this board plenty of times, since he posted the original post yesterday and he didn't bother to reply to my direct question..

I take it that his question was JUST a Hypothetical one by him which of course brought a lot of free advertising and interest to that infamous and ineffective forum........

Well done Philip!

I propose Kvinna to award you with a free mug of her site........

[Serebro]

I said "yes"
but if the story is 100%true and there are no other "small details"which sometimes completely change the attitude.
"Yes" just because I wouldn't like that story to happen with someone of my friends who have an open heart......

[KenC]

I just don't understand the people trying to protect the guy in this case.  If it were reversed and the guy paid for the woman's trip and she didn't show, but at the last moment told him so, she would be labled a scammer, no questions asked.  His one decent act (of telling her he was not coming) does not counter all his misdeeds.  That is like saying "I'm a schmuck and I have lied to you all through this" and getting some sort of credit for being honest.  Wow, the standards for honesty must have been lowered when I was not looking.

Billy,
What good would it do to report the guy without his name and photo?  As a lesson to learn from?  That is very weak in my mind.  If it is the truth, then his name and photo should be attached.  No one should be ashamed our their own truth.

I will say that I do admire Jack's method of reporting scammers though.  He will not post a scammer unless he receives two reports,  That method does tend to eliminate anyone claiming "scam" out of bitterness of being dumped.

Jazzy,
You have given me a good chuckle this morning. thank you.

only BillyB is trying to say something smart

Is that perhaps because he agrees with you?

The thing is first when you come to the forum , you have no clue , who is who , who is who's friend and so on , now it is so easy for me to predict what almost all of you will tell about such case with this guy

Uh huh, me and wiz are tight!!  And I am just supporting my "pal" here!
 :selfharm:
KenC

[Jazzyclassy]

I am not gonna mess around with you KenC I already know what will it bring to me, nothing but negative.

the thing is you do not know the whole story and the other part of it but you tend to assume and judge him, when your philosophy is always so generous you always blame people who assume something bad in the first place, so why are you doing this in this case now I do not really understand you, but it is ok I no longer care , it is just who you are and  nothing will ever change you or your opinion , it is never a problem

People should report to Antidate when they are really sure that the guy is a scammer and that they got a lot of evidences to prove him to be a horrible person. Just when you have only minor bad deed and already to report about him to Antidate , then the other guys who are already there should have extreme high rate of being scammers as I suppose they did much more worse , than this guy did to the girl, he should not be trusted of course but it is not a reason to put him on the site.

But I think this story was posted here as a lack of other scandal topics and it is a provoking post ,leading to argues between members of this forum, leads to mass negative and completely wont help this girl to cope with her current situation!

[KenC]

I am not gonna mess around with you KenC I already know what will it bring to me, nothing but negative.

Good thinking and yet you continue?

the thing is you do not know the whole story and the other part of it but you tend to assume and judge him, when your philosophy is always so generous you always blame people who assume something bad in the first place, so why are you doing this in this case now

I agree that we have only one side of the story, but I did preface my comments with the assumption that this woman was telling the truth.  Based on the "facts" as presented the guy made multiple promises that he did not honor.  If that is the truth, it should be reported.  I am not condoning any embellishment of the facts nor am I endorsing any assumptions for the unknown.

I do not really understand you, but it is ok I no longer care , it is just who you are and  nothing will ever change you or your opinion , it is never a problem

And yet you continue?

People should report to Antidate when they are really sure that the guy is a scammer and that they got a lot of evidences to prove him to be a horrible person. Just when you have only minor bad deed and already to report about him to Antidate , then the other guys who are already there should have extreme high rate of being scammers as I suppose they did much more worse , than this guy did to the girl, he should not be trusted of course but it is not a reason to put him on the site.

What is wrong with reporting the truth?  Maybe you are hung up on the label of "scammer?"  Maybe it would be better if it were reported that this is a guy that has misled one woman, so be careful?

But I think this story was posted here as a lack of other scandal topics and it is a provoking post ,leading to argues between members of this forum, leads to mass negative and completely wont help this girl to cope with her current situation!

This is not a "scandal" and not even an argument.  It is a discussion on opposing thoughts on a common subject.  In the civilized world we call it a debate.  Don't get so hung up on personalities or back history, just debate the facts of the issue.
KenC

[Jazzyclassy]

Maybe you are right Ken C , but as you can see no continuation from Gator's side, so  nothing to debate more about it .........

[KenC]

Maybe you are right Ken C , but as you can see no continuation from Gator's side, so  nothing to debate more about it .........

Jazzy,
Gator asked for our input on the subject.  You gave your's and I gave mine.  All is well.  Gator doesn't have to pick a winner or a loser here.  He will probably just weigh the opinions and make up his own mind what is best.
KenC
(Shouldn't you be on your honeymoon anyway?  Nice new avatar BTW)

[Gator]

I knew this issue would make us think, which is one of the reasons I presented it.  I also wanted to demonstrate to the newbies that some RW are very sincere and sweet, and a man’s inconsiderate actions could hurt these RW.

Some more information:

1.   THE STORY IS TRUE.

2.   I have met the woman.  Although intelligent, she is fairly innocent if not naïve and gullible.  She is kind hearted and sincere about marriage to a Western man.  She is “sweet” in the truest sense. Serebro used the term “open heart”, and I think the term is accurate. She is so honest and sincere that she wants to believe everyone.  Ideal wife material, but easy prey for bad men. 

3.   In her zeal to find a Western husband she has made mistakes, not just with this man but with another, a French man. 

4.   I do not know the man’s name, nor do I want to.  I agree with Dan that she alone should decide what to do.  I am not advising her, and am getting the story through my Moscow woman.

5.   I do not know the particulars in what he and she said to each other and what was exactly promised.  My Moscow woman said he was suppose to repay her.  To me the precise wording does not matter because 1) although she is fluent in English, there is a language difference, 2) intent is obvious and 3) everyone knows about the economic situation of RW.  Nevertheless, my Moscow woman says that many European men, unlike American men, expect women to pay their share. 

6.   The man could have been more of sleaze ball and not say a word and just let her show up in Istanbul alone.  So give him credit for that.  My Moscow woman believes he never intended to travel and was just playing games.  However, like many RW, she is a full-blooded skeptic.

7.   The man’s photo in his profile made him look decent.  However, his correspondence photos seemingly were of a different man.  My Moscow woman described him as acceptable in his profile photo, but dog ugly in his last photos (so much that she questioned to herself why her friend would consider marrying him, fearing that the baby might look like him).  Notwithstanding his looks or lack thereof, the photos have mixed implications regarding his character.

Will she report him to Antidate?  I don’t know.  I doubt it because kind hearted people rarely seek revenge.  While blacklists are informative, there is an element of revenge.   I think she wants to forget about this episode and move on.

BTW, the woman is attractive and she has other suitors.  She is definitely a WOVO woman as she focuses on one man at a time.  A good looking American now has her full attention. In fact, she is too enthusiastic, saying that she could live near my Moscow woman if she married him.  Here we go again? 

[wiz]

People should report to Antidate when they are really sure that the guy is a scammer and that they got a lot of evidences to prove him to be a horrible person. Just when you have only minor bad deed and already to report about him to Antidate , then the other guys who are already there should have extreme high rate of being scammers as I suppose they did much more worse , than this guy did to the girl, he should not be trusted of course but it is not a reason to put him on the site.

Well Jazzy

You obviously missed the thrust and main theme of this question and story.

Gator has taken the care and said that this in not a scam..........but insincerity actions by the man, which cost lots of money to a Russian foolish woman. Please read the original post and try to understand it better.

Antidate does not only report and display SCAMMERS, men who taken by deception money from women or benefited something out of them, but also men who meet a few Russian women and they call them either sex Tourists or Trip reporters.

Did you know what I was accused off and caused big scandal there?

That I am a sex trip reporter, because I made a post over here last year when I went on holiday with a Russian woman in Kos and they made big song and dance because I  mentioned in my post that we had sex. Additionally after the "Dilemma" they attacked me about a lot of indecent things in my behaviour and some pratts still mention my name many times there.

Did their comments and accusations had any effect in my life? Not a jolt.

Did they stop me finding the right woman? Not a sausage.

Did I cared about their comments...... Not in your nelly

.....and I insulted them back many times, when I realised that reasonable discussion was out of the window. Finally gave them the only Medicine they cannot handle.

IGNORE THEM..... and guess what?.... they lost interest....HA HA HA.

My ex went there yesterday and tried to start something again..... and they shut her up!

Mir has told you Antidate is not important and has not great effect in anybody's life. It is only a handfull of women who write to eachother and look around all the boards to find something about sex to write.

Back on Topic.

Did the man promised to pay her costs for the flight? Yes

Did he Vanished? Yes

Guilty Your Honour!



and for you flower... look forward to see you in England!

 

[ScottinCrimea]

I've been thinking about how many times members of this board have given the advice to never pay a woman's travel expenses upfront.  They are told to ask that she pay and then reimburse her on her arrival.  They say that this is a good way to prove a woman's sincerity.  So now when a woman actually does this, we call her gullible and foolish.  Just maybe a woman has heard of episodes like this and rather than showing her insincerity by not paying up front, she is showing her common sense.  How many here would have labeled this woman as a scammer and dumped her if she had refused to pay her own travel expenses?