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Author Topic: Moderation - or Not  (Read 5748 times)

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Offline Admin

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Moderation - or Not
« on: June 29, 2005, 04:03:04 AM »
Hey Everyone,

Now that the NHB section of the board has been active for a while, we are beginning to see the board settle down a bit.

I need to gather your feedback on the direction of the board so that the community here has a voice in how the board is managed.

Please elaborate on your vote by adding whatever qualitative feedback you care to share - HOWEVER, I will not tolerate the destruction of this topic into a flamefest, so be sure you are addressing ONLY the future management of the board and leave all gripes about past injustices out of your responses.

Thanks!

- Dan

Offline KenC

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« Reply #1 on: June 29, 2005, 04:41:37 AM »
I think you're doing a great job, Dan.  Keep going the way you are.  Just remember that this is YOUR sandbox and you have the right to throw anyone out for any reason you see fit without explanation or justification to anyone.

KenC
You are a den of vipers and thieves-Andrew Jackson on banks
Banking establishments are more dangerous than standing armies-Thomas Jefferson

Offline tim 360

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« Reply #2 on: June 29, 2005, 04:54:48 AM »
Very light moderation is best for comprehensive communication.  I like the way you are handling things Dan,  by keeping moderation light.  There are a number of useless posts which perhaps could be transfered to a "dogpile" category.
"Never argue with a fool,  onlookers may not be able to tell the difference".  Mark Twain

Offline BarryM

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« Reply #3 on: June 29, 2005, 05:59:47 PM »
Active light moderation  in most sections to include selective editing and/or deletion of individual messages, pruning of topics, and suspension and/or banning of members - BUT - I want only a single senior moderator to set the rules for moderation but will allow other sub moderators(on a short leash).

-blm

Offline Turboguy

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« Reply #4 on: June 30, 2005, 07:44:21 AM »
It seems to me that you have three distinct groups of people that 85 % of the people who post here fall into.    It also seems to me that two of the groups really want to take control of the board to some extent and are driving get rid of the others.   I am sure a lot of people will disagree but think about it a little more and I think there is at least something to what I am saying.

Group 1,  Russian Gals.   I really like having the insight from that sector, if it is done with good intentions.   You do have some gals like Elen who sometimes has some good posts but often goes on and on about things that are not relevent or ideas that are way out in left field.  It seems to me that a lot of the gals are trying to make this site a branch of anti-date and to drive away anyone who won't put up with the hairbrainded part of their ideas and their endless prattle.  Some of the gals posts are great.   I could name more in the not so good side but M&M would be a good example of a Russian gal with good helpful posts.

Group 2.  The good guys.   There are a lot of guys who come here with the idea of learning and sharing the knowlege and ideas and experience they have.   They want to help make the lives of those who seek a Russian bride better and to make them more aware of pitfalls and perils and to help them find the results they seek.   I could name tons of people in this catagory.  Photoguy, Son of Clyde, Goombah, Tigerpaws, Bruno, and I will even put Anono in this although at one time I may have not.  

Group 3.  Call them what you want, misfits, rabble rousers or guys who just sorta like to let it all hang out.   Perhaps I am wrong, but I think some of these guys are banned from some other sites.   I am not saying that makes them bad.   I am just saying there are guys who really don't respect people or give any thought to the feelings of others.   I think for a lot of these guys they have such low self esteem that they try to make themselves feel good by making someone else feel bad.   You will find a lot of posts,  even some from today saying that this is what they want.  They want a wide open unmoderated site where they are free to belittle people and critisize them and put them down.

Personally I like this site.  There are other sites along these lines and I rarely visit them.   I hope it does well.

I think over the next 6 months or a year, this site will have an identity.  What I am saying by that is that one of those three groups will win out and drive out the other two.   Either this will be the new branch of Anti-Date, or it will be a place where people with an interest in meeting and marrying Russian gals pool thier efforts to help one another in their quest for happiness, or it will be a place where people meet to pound their chests and put down anyone is nieve enought to wonder their way.  

I don't know which one will win.  I really believe there will be a winner and two loosers and time will tell if I am right.  I think I know what Dan's vision is for this site.   It will be interesting to see what the future holds.

Offline Voyageur

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« Reply #5 on: June 30, 2005, 09:43:42 AM »
I think that TurboGuy is right on mark. I visit this board a few times each day, and I have some level of success and failure with RW and UW. But, I post rarely because it is not worth a public battle if my ideas or experiences do not live up to someone else's standards. My approach may not have been perfect, but we all learn from life and I was helped by others (in a helpful way, not judgemental - rude way) on another board and also skewered by some of the folks now on this board.  

I would love to share my past experiences more, but I sometimes feel, why put yourself up as a target, for someone else's biases?  And honestly, in my current relationship, my fiancee does not want any discussion of our situation and I agree with this. But I have past relationships that I have also learned from, and may be of some value to this board. But I do not have ego or need to see my words on a internet site, if I have to defend myself against negative comments and closed thinking.

I thinks some level of moderation is perfect, and should have been exercised when personal preferences of the beauty  of an individual's taste in woman, and his his (and her) chosen profession, was particularly nasty and distasteful.

But, on the other hand, there have been great trip reports that will help anyone starting out - or experienced in this very difficult endeavor. I would hate to see everyone run off by a few male and female bullies.

Offline Turboguy

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« Reply #6 on: June 30, 2005, 09:57:27 AM »
Thanks for your thoughts on this issue Voyager.   Photo guy had asked me to publish a TR on my second trip to see my gal and my feelings were just like yours.   There was no way I was going to load these guys with the ammunition to tear me apart.   That particualar trip we had some issues to resolve.    They would have had a field day.    I will bet if Photo guy had it to do over he wouldn't even tell us he made a trip. 

That is not what it should be.  People should be willing to share and help each other.

By the way good luck on the interview.  My gal not that much before yours and I am already nervous about it.   Sorry we are not going to be there on the same days.  I would have enjoyed sharing a beer (or should I say peeva) with you.

 

Offline Jet

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Moderation - or Not
« Reply #7 on: July 01, 2005, 03:46:51 PM »
As I disclosed when I arrived here, I'm a moderator at 2 other similar sites. Moderation is always a tricky thing, most of the time on the other boards I don't have to do a damn thing (other than pay attention to the area). However, it's been my experience that on the rare occasion I  do need to step in, the worst offenders are typically the first ones to scream "FOUL" when asked to tone it down. There was a particular wordsmith that plagued the forums over at RMP for over a year. He crafted his responses in such a way that while his intent was blatently obvious to all, he never "technically" broke the rules of posting. It was common for me to recieve long winded diatribes about freedom of speech and quotes from the rules, both publicly and privately. Khashyar gave him second, third, fourth, and fifth chances and every time, the offenses got worse and the cries of "I'm being singled out because the moderators don't like me" got louder. (If there was any good to come out of this, it was that I now fully understand why our legal system is so f*%#~ up :P) It was for this reason that I chose active moderation/single moderator above. KenC's post above illustrates my belief well. As the board owner, the buck stops with you, Dan. You say what flies or doesn't and it eliminates a lot of he said-she said, "those guys are pickin' on me" crap.
Every action in company ought to be done with some sign of respect to those that are present. ~ Geo. Washington

Offline Fiorella

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« Reply #8 on: July 02, 2005, 03:15:57 AM »
Quote from: Turboguy
It seems to me that you have three distinct groups of people that 85 % of the people who post here fall into.    It also seems to me that two of the groups really want to take control of the board to some extent and are driving get rid of the others.   I am sure a lot of people will disagree but think about it a little more and I think there is at least something to what I am saying.

Group 1,  Russian Gals.   I really like having the insight from that sector, if it is done with good intentions.   You do have some gals like Elen who sometimes has some good posts but often goes on and on about things that are not relevent or ideas that are way out in left field.  It seems to me that a lot of the gals are trying to make this site a branch of anti-date and to drive away anyone who won't put up with the hairbrainded part of their ideas and their endless prattle.  Some of the gals posts are great.   I could name more in the not so good side but M&M would be a good example of a Russian gal with good helpful posts.

Group 2.  The good guys.   There are a lot of guys who come here with the idea of learning and sharing the knowlege and ideas and experience they have.   They want to help make the lives of those who seek a Russian bride better and to make them more aware of pitfalls and perils and to help them find the results they seek.   I could name tons of people in this catagory.  Photoguy, Son of Clyde, Goombah, Tigerpaws, Bruno, and I will even put Anono in this although at one time I may have not.  

Group 3.  Call them what you want, misfits, rabble rousers or guys who just sorta like to let it all hang out.   Perhaps I am wrong, but I think some of these guys are banned from some other sites.   I am not saying that makes them bad.   I am just saying there are guys who really don't respect people or give any thought to the feelings of others.   I think for a lot of these guys they have such low self esteem that they try to make themselves feel good by making someone else feel bad.   You will find a lot of posts,  even some from today saying that this is what they want.  They want a wide open unmoderated site where they are free to belittle people and critisize them and put them down.


I would call them paranoics looser. By the way, we get lot of support for our position here and on some other boards what we visit. But funny to see - all supporting messages we get privatelly and all harassing,  abusive and mockery we get openly with aprovation of owners. I have one friend who is moderator in other sinilar board, he is very decent and brave man and always support us openly when needed.

Ask yourself - why these guys from group 1 avoid to be open with their real thoughts?

I want to be moderator with privilegy to close insulting topics and ban abusers and harassers.

Offline Bruno

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« Reply #9 on: July 02, 2005, 03:44:22 AM »
Turbo have search these reply... in any case, Fiorella, i don't think that several guys hate you... if i see your post, more that 50% was interesting... in reality, you are attacked because you are linked to anti-date... not because yourself... you need to understand that so site afraid some of the man here...

But about you or other like moderator, no way... Dan have make the needed move with the trashcan... maybe if other attack begin, some other action will be needed but until now, these system is working... Moderator is not specialy something bad... but how it is possible to choose some fully impartial moderator... really, it is not a easy job...

Offline Kvinna

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Moderation - or Not
« Reply #10 on: July 03, 2005, 03:06:00 AM »
Quote from: Bruno
in reality, you are attacked because you are linked to anti-date... not because yourself...
Bruno, in spite of the request of admin to me don't post on this board, I want to ask anyway: what do all these persons have against antidate? why are they scared so much, if they are honest men as they declare this?
« Last Edit: July 03, 2005, 03:06:00 AM by Kvinna »
When they came for the trade unionists, I did not speak out; I was not a trade unionist. When they came for the Jews, I didnít speak up, because I wasn't a Jew. When they came for me, there was no one left to speak out.

Offline Fiorella

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« Reply #11 on: July 03, 2005, 03:17:49 AM »
And why admin asked Kvinna do not post??? What are you all scared to hear from us? The true?

Offline Admin

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« Reply #12 on: July 03, 2005, 05:28:54 AM »
Quote from: Fiorella
And why admin asked Kvinna do not post??? What are you all scared to hear from us? The true?


Fiorella,

What I wrote to Kvinna in a PM is none of your business.

Your implication of RWD members being "scared" to hear the "truth" [sp], is a PRIME EXAMPLE of one of your many posts that fail to make any sort of positive contribution to the board.

Let me be perfectly clear - ALL who come to the board and are interested in making a POSITIVE and WORTHWHILE *contribution* to the board are welcome.

ANYONE coming here to be disruptive or sniping or destructive will be silenced.

As stated in the RWD Rules which you agreed to when you first signed-up for the board, I have the SOLE prerogative to make that final decision - and I will.

I hope I am understood. If not, send me a PM and keep it off the open board.

- Dan

Offline Fiorella

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« Reply #13 on: July 03, 2005, 12:23:31 PM »
Quote

Rules and Agreement

You agree, through your use of this service, that you will not use the RWD Bulletin Board to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise a violation of any law. You agree not to post any copyrighted material unless the copyright is owned by you.


A bulletin board, by its very nature, is a public place. Everything you post can be read by anyone who wants to read it, anywhere in the world. We encourage you to use the RWD to share your thoughts, feelings and experiences, but we ask you to use good judgment.

Keep in mind that the opinions expressed in postings on this board are those of the individuals making the postings and thus do not necessarily reflect the views of the RWD board.We each come to this board with different personalities and backgrounds which influence how we see the world.  Appreciation of these differences is one of the goals of this board.


Most states and countries have laws against libel. Increasingly, internet boards have become a battleground for libel claims. Please be just as cautious about making unfounded statements and/or accusations, as you would be when writing that person a letter. An internet board post can have the same weight as any other written document.

Abuse of any sort should be reported to the webmaster at webmaster@russianwomendiscussion.com.
Are that these rules?  Are they valid for ALL members?

Offline Admin

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« Reply #14 on: July 03, 2005, 12:29:28 PM »
Quote from: Fiorella
Are that these rules? Are they valid for ALL members?


Yes Fiorella. All members of RWD were asked to review, and agree, with the terms and rules for posting.

- Dan

Offline Fiorella

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« Reply #15 on: July 03, 2005, 12:56:37 PM »
Quote from: Dan
Are that these rules?  Are they valid for ALL members?

Yes Fiorella. All members of RWD were asked to review, and agree, with the terms and rules for posting.

- Dan[/quote]
Yes? And why then SOME members are allowed to say all they want? And others - no? All animals are equal but some of them are more equal? You are the person from whom I expected it less of all. Why some people can tell openly how much they hate other nations and so on? It is russianwomendiscussion, isn't it?

If I remember right, you was talking about invite here more russian women? And what they will meet here?

Offline Jet

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« Reply #16 on: July 03, 2005, 02:25:13 PM »
As I was saying...

Quote from: Jet
... the worst offenders are typically the first ones to scream "FOUL" when asked to tone it down.

 

:P
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Offline Photo Guy

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« Reply #17 on: July 03, 2005, 02:33:40 PM »
I just read this thread for the first time, and I have to say that I agree with your terms and rules for posting. It made me sick to read the HATEFUL remarks about the French.:shock::(  Crap like that makes the world a more dangerous place. And it violates your rules, Dan. I think Fiorella has a valid point about selective enforcement of those rules.

I understand that moderating some hooligans who probably have been banned from other forums is NOT AN EASY ENDEAVOR. I would not want that job. Members who make personal attacks or insults should be banned, and now I would also add hateful remarks about someone's country should also be grounds for banning. They should be banned after just one warning.

Those guidelines do not, in my opinion, overly restrict the sharing of ideas and experiences here. Those guidelines encourage civility.

I will repost my trip report. I want it to have the effect of a short non-fictional story, without a need for opinions or input. But feel free to dicuss my mistakes, strategies, and ideas, in another thread, ..without trying to insult me. I'll do the same for you.   Doug  
« Last Edit: July 03, 2005, 02:35:00 PM by Photo Guy »

Offline Admin

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« Reply #18 on: July 03, 2005, 05:23:27 PM »
Quote from: Fiorella
I want to be moderator with privilegy to close insulting topics and ban abusers and harassers.


So tell me more about what you want? Are you asking to be a board moderator for the entire board? Do you want responsibility to moderate only a forum or two - and if so, which ones? What policies will you apply? For example - how will you administer the RWD board policy about "insulting posts" - how will you determine who it was that was insulted? Will you ascribe the same sensitivity to insulting behavior to everyone? Do you consider a member who comes on the board and posts only one-line and terse replies that are obviously NOT intended to clarify or seek additional information - rather, they are merely to incite an emotional response - would you see those as "insulting" - and what would you do about them?

Tell me more Fiorella.

While you are at it - why don't you also tell me (and everyone) what it is you will include in your "complaint to this site to hosting provider..."

I am REALLY looking forward to seeing that one :shock:

- Dan

Offline Michelangelo

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« Reply #19 on: August 08, 2005, 02:57:21 AM »
I love this board.  It is the only one I am active in, and my central source of advice on the process of traveling to the FSU and finding a girl to spend my future with.

I appreciate the opinions of veterns who have successfully made this journey.  I appreciate the insights I can gain from the trip reports.

My only negative feeling about this site is the hateful attitude displayed from time to time by a handful of posters. And when one tries to defend someone being attacked, you get attacked too!

I'll admit that some of these thread and personal attacks raise my blood pressure and make me angry. So, given that, I'd like the following moderation:

Active light moderation  in most sections to include selective editing and/or deletion of individual messages, pruning of topics, and stopping hate arguements that develop.  I don't believe in banning, becasue some of our members who argue have valuable information to post in other areas.  But I do agree that Dan can't spend all his time deleting posts from the same 4 or 5 offenders that remain.  So I'd like to see banning as an option with the 3 strike concept that Jack mentioned.

Thanks again for those who take the time to share information about bad agencies, air travel to FSU, and the advice about what to do with a given "girlfriend."

Cheers,
Michael
The greater danger for most of us lies not in setting our aim too high and falling short; but in setting our aim too low, and achieving our mark.  michelangelo

Offline Shadow

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« Reply #20 on: August 08, 2005, 04:44:34 AM »
Dan I have some opinions about moderating.

First of all, I think that when you are moderating a board you will have to be present basically every day. If that is not possible (some vacation is allowed) then it is better to share moderation in a schedule that allows a daily review of posts made.

Moderation should be as light as possible, and should be strictly impartial. No matter who crosses the line should be warned, or have posts edited. If it is a longtime poster and friend or a newbie one-poster, the same rules apply. Moderation should be based on the rules, not on the opinions of the poster or their background.

As far as closing accounts and banning is concerned, those who are valuable contributors should get more warnings than first time posters.

Moderation should be transparent. Sometimes a thread is clearly offending, or the topic starter asks for deletion. In this case deletion is necessary. In most other cases, the moderator shoud indicate when he edits or removes (part of) a post and why. Also if a post leads to a temporary or full ban of a member, the moderator could clearly indicate this in the post or a follow-up. Transparency will avoid accusations of unfairness or hypocrisy.

In general I think if this board wants to be an independent source of information and opinions, it shoud contain the opinions of people who do not agree with the mainstream. Most of the Russian women that are 'liked' are the ones that fit the mold of thought. The ones who can show another view are often attacked, while trying to understand their point of view could help avoid major mistakes.
No it is not a dog. Its really how I look.  ;)

Offline corncrowe

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« Reply #21 on: August 08, 2005, 05:05:39 AM »
Quote from: Shadow
Dan I have some opinions about moderating.

First of all, I think that when you are moderating a board you will have to be present basically every day. If that is not possible (some vacation is allowed) then it is better to share moderation in a schedule that allows a daily review of posts made.

Dan,

I agree with Shadow on this point.  But who?  I am not qualified, and many members on this list have already burn a few bridges, so who?  Well, I think we should consider a female from the FSU who doesn't have an axe to grind, is not available to other members for dating, and isn't an agency owner.

Elen!  She gets my vote...but given this she can't suspend or delete a members privilages.  This is something only you should be able to do.

Jon

Offline jb

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« Reply #22 on: August 08, 2005, 05:17:33 AM »
It's Dan's board, let him run it the way he wants to.

For certain, no one can duplicate Dan's thinking, and that's what a moderator would be expected to do.  The perfect moderator would be Dan's clone.

It would be an impossible task to read these posts and not form opinions about the relative importance of a poster's experience and values.  I know I could not be an impartial observer, I've already made up my mind as to who has credibility and who does not.


 

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