Looking for advice concerning Borispol airport, please

[JohnMI]

After exchanging 60 letters via Anastasiaweb (we've already discussed my use of that service here, and I am done with it now), several telephone calls, securing address and telephone information and also sending flowers with delivery confirmation through a service not provided by AW, I have decided to meet Anna from Lugansk. This trip will be a quick one ... just an attempt to assess her intentions and her sincerity - March 13 -16. If everything looks good after that I will return for a longer visit. Anyway, I made flight arrangements that include a plane change at Borispol, and that is the basis of my questions to you all.

Incoming flight from NYC lands at 11:25 and connection to Lugansk takes off at 2:30. I have never been to Kiev's airport previously, and I speak and read no Russian/Ukrainian at all. I wonder whether the layover time is sufficient for such a person to find his way between the two terminals while still negotiating any customs or other intrusions? Also, does the airport have signage in English, or is English-speaking assistance available there if I run into trouble? I've seen Odessa's airport and I know no such assistance is available there, but to be honest that airport is not much larger than the airport my own city of 7,000 shares with a neighboring city of 15,000 so a person should not expect much assistance. I assume Borispol is much larger, however, and maybe even equivalent to the sprawling airports found in the US, and that has me a bit concerned. I note that VIP service is available at Borispol, though I would need to purchase that separately with a telephone call to the airport. Would you all recommend that I make that purchase, or is there enough time and enough assistance otherwise available that I would not need VIP?

Thank you all for any information you might be able to offer!

John

[Turboguy]

I don't think you will have a bit of problem John.   The domestic terminal is right next door to the International terminal.   You just walk out of the international terminal, turn right and go to the end of the building and you will see it set back a bit.    English is very common at the international terminal for signs and announcements but not quite as much for domestic but the announcements are usually in both and finding an English speaking person to help you is easy.

Customs is pretty quick and painless there.   I would not bother with the VIP service if it were me.   

PS, I think the plan sounds like a good one.

[bgreed]

You won't have any problem at Borispol.  It is a small airport by major airport standards.  Figure about the siz of an airport serving a US city of 200,000 or so.  Now way you can get lost.  Just make sure to fill out both sides of the migration card they give you before you get to passport control.  It will ask at the bottom with who you are staying and their address. After that out the front doors and take a right and you will be at the domestic terminal.

[JohnMI]

Thanks Turbo and bgreed. I worried that I would be tied up with customs so long that I would have to rush to the next gate and then not locate it quickly enough to board the plane. I never noticed any English speakers or signs at Odessa (other than the VIP representative), and I wondered whether the situation in Kiev might be different due to its size. I do feel better now so thanks.

Turbo: Hopefully this plan works. The fact I'll be in the air longer than I'll be on the ground in Ukraine seems a bit odd, but I'm pressed for time and have to be in Orlando on the 18th. Returning on the 16th resulted in a $682 roundtrip airfare, while on the 17th the same flight arrangements were a bit under $1900 so the choice seemed obvious to me (plus allowance for any delay in returning to the US)!

John

[Turboguy]

Of course anything can happen but usually the customs goes pretty quickly at Borispol.  I think you will be fine and that seems like a pretty good deal.

Hope you enjoy Orlando as well.   VWRW and I are sitting there right now.  We just flew in from Vegas last night and will be here 6 days for business.   

I made some pretty quick trips to the FSU myself and to be honest some worked better than the longer ones.  Looking to hear how the trip went after it is over.

[docetae]

After exchanging 60 letters via Anastasiaweb (we've already discussed my use of that service here, and I am done with it now), several telephone calls, securing address and telephone information and also sending flowers with delivery confirmation through a service not provided by AW, I have decided to meet Anna from Lugansk. This trip will be a quick one ... just an attempt to assess her intentions and her sincerity - March 13 -16. If everything looks good after that I will return for a longer visit. Anyway, I made flight arrangements that include a plane change at Borispol, and that is the basis of my questions to you all.

Incoming flight from NYC lands at 11:25 and connection to Lugansk takes off at 2:30. I have never been to Kiev's airport previously, and I speak and read no Russian/Ukrainian at all. I wonder whether the layover time is sufficient for such a person to find his way between the two terminals while still negotiating any customs or other intrusions? Also, does the airport have signage in English, or is English-speaking assistance available there if I run into trouble? I've seen Odessa's airport and I know no such assistance is available there, but to be honest that airport is not much larger than the airport my own city of 7,000 shares with a neighboring city of 15,000 so a person should not expect much assistance. I assume Borispol is much larger, however, and maybe even equivalent to the sprawling airports found in the US, and that has me a bit concerned. I note that VIP service is available at Borispol, though I would need to purchase that separately with a telephone call to the airport. Would you all recommend that I make that purchase, or is there enough time and enough assistance otherwise available that I would not need VIP?

Thank you all for any information you might be able to offer!

John

It is very easy to transfer, it takes 10 minutes walk...Flight information are both in english and Ukrainian, so you will find your way easy. One time you will be out the borispol airport, just walk on your right to the other terminal, it is a very small place. Instead of paying for useless VIP services, If you travel with aerosvit, try to take economy premium ... just for the lounge. You will wait upstair in a place not crowded and you will be notified of boarding. Other difference I have seen is that you will check in for flight only short time before departure (1h30 max) , so don't be worried if you do not see your flight information when you will arrive in national terminal probably around 12h40.

Boarding in local terminal is not easy for a first travel, you take a bus to the plane so ask to be sure you take the right bus... Lugansk pajalusta ?

[wxman]

I was there just last month and travelled from Kiev to Lugansk. It is quite easy. Just go to A terminal which is just right of main terminal per previous post. You will have plenty of time. "A" terminal has been fixed up a bit and the signs are in English, so you will know when to check your luggage and to go through security. They will write on your ticket what gate. After you go through security, there are about 4 numbered doors, which correspond to the number on your ticket. That is where the bus will be to take you to your plane. Enjoy the ride on that prop plane and enjoy the piece of hard candy they give you for a snack 

On your return trip, you will find the Lugansk airport in a perpetual state of repair. Most peopel would think to enter through the main doors,  but no. Walk down from there and you will see a piece of paper on a door telling you this is the entrance. Sometimes someone will be there and the makeshift counter, sometimes you have to wait a few minutes. Then you go into a waiting area, then before the flight you must leave waiting area, they scan your luggage, check your passport and tickets and then you go back to waiting area. Then you walk to your plane with your luggage and hand it to a person on the other side of the plane, where he then tosses it on the plane.   

[Ronnie]

If time is of the essence why did you decide to go all the way to Lugansk.  You could have maximized you ground time by having her meet you in Kyiv.  Most UW love Kyiv and she would have been happy to meet you there - nice holiday for here.  You would have had a better choice of apartments and other services. 
I don't know if it's still the case but Lugansk used to have a reputation as the scammer capital of Ukraine.

[bgreed]

Customs is pretty lax in Kiev last time there after going through pasport control I picked up my two large suitcases and absent mindedly walked right past customs without even stopping.  walked right by two customs officer who were chatting to eachother.  Passport control is usually the hold up.

[Turboguy]

There are two lines, the red line and green line and if you have nothing to declare you are pretty much supposed to walk down the green line past the customs officers that are chatting to each other and out the door to the hoard of cab drivers.   I am guessing they spot check people once in a while when what they have to chat to each other gets too boring.

[JohnMI]

Thank you, everyone. I will print this page and stuff it into my pocket during my trip as a reminder of some of your tips. And yes, there will be a Trip Report at the end of the day - good, bad or ugly.

Ronnie: I chose to meet her in her city for a few reasons, but mainly because that is where she wants me to go. To me, it is also important that I see her in a place she is comfortable, and I also want to see the environment she is a product of. I understand you cannot always read so much into that, but I think that would be helpful. Also, I like the adventure of traveling to a place off the beaten path. Notwithstanding my gripes about my recent Odessa accommodations (mainly the internet and the lack of customer service provided by the apartment manager), I do this for fun as well. I just think Lugansk 'could' provide a much more interesting tale than Kiev.

wxman: Yes, I noticed the flight to Lugansk is by propeller plane! Several years ago I took a commuter flight from DuBois, PA to Pittsburgh on a USAir prop plane that was incredible -  there were no individual seats facing forward in the cabin, but we all sat on two benches running down each side of the cabin so we faced passengers on the opposite bench. I felt like a paratrooper preparing for a military jump! I'll be looking for that piece of candy you mentioned.

Turbo: Enjoy your visit to Orlando!

[krimster]

It's Ukraine, anything can happen.  Your biggest worry will be if your flight is late arriving in Kyiv, almost always happened to me.
When you get off the plane you go through passport control (and fill out a customs declaration if you didn't on plane), need to pick the right line based on your passport, might be beneficial to get in front of others , then pick up your luggage, then customs then to next terminal, if no problems, you'll make it in time...

[Taz]

Personally I think your time might be a little short between your flights. Flight delays are quite common. You can't underestimate how long it can take to clear passport control and customs. I was JUST there and I spent almost an hour clearing passport control. By then my luggage was lost. I spent another 30 minutes tracking it down and I speak good Russian.

FYI for others reading this. There are 2 airports in Kiev; Borispil (KBP) and Zhulian (IEV). I am pretty sure the flight though to Lugansk (VSG) is only from KBP. Just something to keep in mind depending on where you are flying to you may have an option of either airport. I know to Simferopol (SIP) you can fly out of either. I don't have a flight schedule handy for Lugansk but I remember their being 2 flights one afternoon (yours) and then one later in the evening.

As mentioned you won't have far to walk at KBP. Keep in mind that 3 hours seems like enough UNTIL your flight is a bit delayed (mine just was), then a bit longer than normal at passport control a few issues and ... you missed your flight. On my trip to Kiev just a few days ago, I wouldn't have been able to make that connection. I would have been able to run from the arrival terminal to the departure terminal and I still wouldn't have made it.

Anyway as mentioned, why not have her come to Kiev? She could be there waiting for you. You'll be dead on your a$$ from the time difference so why add to your travel time? Honestly, 3 days isn't worth it. I travel a LOT and I adjust quicker than anyone else I know to time differences but you'll be jet lagged for at least a day or two minimum. For Kiev it takes me a solid day to adapt and sometimes a bit more. I've seen guys still out of it after 5 days. General rule of thumb is a normal person needs about 1 day for each hour of time change. I find I need about a day for every 5-6 hours. You'll not likely be at your best the first few days. Just something to think about. I'd suggest something like Ambien on the plane so you can have a little rest at least. It's something I've been considering.

Personally I'd still have her come to Kiev. See what she is like "outside" of her element. Besides the plane you'll be on is like a AN-24. It is a total POS!!! I'll never fly on one of them again. Closest in a plane I've ever some to dying was on an AN-24. Only plane I hate more is the Tu-154. I don't mind prop planes but the AN is flying junk heap. I'll walk before I fly on one of them again. They are poorly maintained and have so many hours on the airframe that I wouldn't be surprised if parts don't just fall of them while they fly. I don't really want to get started on this topic but this plane is the equivalent of a flying Lada. I'd rather fly in a Piper Cub or damn near anything else than one of those planes. Take a look at all the fluid leaks, bald tires, missing screws, etc. before you board it. Better yet, put on a blindfold as you walk to the plane. I never seen them pre-flight one of the planes yet. The pilot leaves the cockpit and goes to the toilet to smoke in the middle of the flight.

God help you if you get stuck by the propellers. You'll damn near go deaf on the flight. The seats are like lawn chairs that flex every time you move. Bring your ear plugs for sure. I could write a book on flying on these things. After we all damn near died on a flight back to Kiev, I swore them off for good. Perhaps after being a pilot for too long of a time I am a terrible passenger but these planes are not worth flying for the little time savings you get. Lugansk a boring place anyway. Only plus is the apartments might be slightly cheaper than Kiev. Kiev has a lot more romantic things to do. Go on the funicular. Walk on Kreshatik. Go to the Mikailovsky Lavra. Go to the Gidropark Metro and find a nice place for dinner and some good shashlik.

One last point. Customs was having about 70% of the people scan their luggage through the x-ray machine on the way out. Going back out, there was an officer pre-screening people even before passport control. I had all my bags checked on the way out even before the actual security check for the plane. Actually they were checked 3 times; all luggage once on the main floor at customs on the way out before check-in, before passport control and at the gate they checked my hand luggage.

Regardless I wish you a safe trip.

Forgot to add, watch the weight restrictions on internal flights. They can really get you on overweight luggage fees. I spent more once on overweight luggage than my ticket price!

[Admin]

Personally I think your time might be a little short between your flights. Flight delays are quite common. You can't underestimate how long it can take to clear passport control and customs. I was JUST there and I spent almost an hour clearing passport control. By then my luggage was lost. I spent another 30 minutes tracking it down and I speak good Russian.

FYI for others reading this. There are 2 airports in Kiev; Borispil (KBP) and Zhulian (IEV). I am pretty sure the flight though to Lugansk (VSG) is only from KBP. Just something to keep in mind depending on where you are flying to you may have an option of either airport. I know to Simferopol (SIP) you can fly out of either. I don't have a flight schedule handy for Lugansk but I remember their being 2 flights one afternoon (yours) and then one later in the evening.

As mentioned you won't have far to walk at KBP. Keep in mind that 3 hours seems like enough UNTIL your flight is a bit delayed (mine just was), then a bit longer than normal at passport control a few issues and ... you missed your flight. On my trip to Kiev just a few days ago, I wouldn't have been able to make that connection. I would have been able to run from the arrival terminal to the departure terminal and I still wouldn't have made it.

Anyway as mentioned, why not have her come to Kiev? She could be there waiting for you. You'll be dead on your a$$ from the time difference so why add to your travel time? Honestly, 3 days isn't worth it. I travel a LOT and I adjust quicker than anyone else I know to time differences but you'll be jet lagged for at least a day or two minimum. For Kiev it takes me a solid day to adapt and sometimes a bit more. I've seen guys still out of it after 5 days. General rule of thumb is a normal person needs about 1 day for each hour of time change. I find I need about a day for every 5-6 hours. You'll not likely be at your best the first few days. Just something to think about. I'd suggest something like Ambien on the plane so you can have a little rest at least. It's something I've been considering.

Personally I'd still have her come to Kiev. See what she is like "outside" of her element. Besides the plane you'll be on is like a AN-24. It is a total POS!!! I'll never fly on one of them again. Closest in a plane I've ever some to dying was on an AN-24. Only plane I hate more is the Tu-154. I don't mind prop planes but the AN is flying junk heap. I'll walk before I fly on one of them again. They are poorly maintained and have so many hours on the airframe that I wouldn't be surprised if parts don't just fall of them while they fly. I don't really want to get started on this topic but this plane is the equivalent of a flying Lada. I'd rather fly in a Piper Cub or damn near anything else than one of those planes. Take a look at all the fluid leaks, bald tires, missing screws, etc. before you board it. Better yet, put on a blindfold as you walk to the plane. I never seen them pre-flight one of the planes yet. The pilot leaves the cockpit and goes to the toilet to smoke in the middle of the flight.

God help you if you get stuck by the propellers. You'll damn near go deaf on the flight. The seats are like lawn chairs that flex every time you move. Bring your ear plugs for sure. I could write a book on flying on these things. After we all damn near died on a flight back to Kiev, I swore them off for good. Perhaps after being a pilot for too long of a time I am a terrible passenger but these planes are not worth flying for the little time savings you get. Lugansk a boring place anyway. Only plus is the apartments might be slightly cheaper than Kiev. Kiev has a lot more romantic things to do. Go on the funicular. Walk on Kreshatik. Go to the Mikailovsky Lavra. Go to the Gidropark Metro and find a nice place for dinner and some good shashlik.

One last point. Customs was having about 70% of the people scan their luggage through the x-ray machine on the way out. Going back out, there was an officer pre-screening people even before passport control. I had all my bags checked on the way out even before the actual security check for the plane. Actually they were checked 3 times; all luggage once on the main floor at customs on the way out before check-in, before passport control and at the gate they checked my hand luggage.

Regardless I wish you a safe trip.

Forgot to add, watch the weight restrictions on internal flights. They can really get you on overweight luggage fees. I spent more once on overweight luggage than my ticket price!

>>FYI for others reading this. There are 2 airports in Kiev; Borispil (KBP) and Zhulian (IEV). I am pretty sure the flight though to Lugansk (VSG) is only from KBP. Just something to keep in mind depending on where you are flying to you may have an option of either airport. I know to Simferopol (SIP) you can fly out of either. I don't have a flight schedule handy for Lugansk but I remember their being 2 flights one afternoon (yours) and then one later in the evening.<<

In the under-utilized RWDpedia, you will find a Flight Timetable. Just look in the Travel & Transportation section.

>>Personally I'd still have her come to Kiev. See what she is like "outside" of her element. Besides the plane you'll be on is like a AN-24. It is a total POS!!! I'll never fly on one of them again. Closest in a plane I've ever some to dying was on an AN-24. Only plane I hate more is the Tu-154. I don't mind prop planes but the AN is flying junk heap. I'll walk before I fly on one of them again. They are poorly maintained and have so many hours on the airframe that I wouldn't be surprised if parts don't just fall of them while they fly. I don't really want to get started on this topic but this plane is the equivalent of a flying Lada. I'd rather fly in a Piper Cub or damn near anything else than one of those planes. Take a look at all the fluid leaks, bald tires, missing screws, etc. before you board it. Better yet, put on a blindfold as you walk to the plane. I never seen them pre-flight one of the planes yet. The pilot leaves the cockpit and goes to the toilet to smoke in the middle of the flight.<<

All true, however, consider the fact those Antonov planes are still in service and suffer surprisingly few accidents. BTW - here is a photo of the 'Coke' (AN-24) -- http://bearcraft-online.com/museum/museum.htm?mid=7.

The Tupolov seems to share a lot of design characteristics with the Boeing 727, only with distinctly 'drooped' wings. I always hated the boarding process ascending the steps from the rear of the aircraft and right behind the LOUD running engines. Really strange. Here is a photo of the plane -- http://bearcraft-online.com/museum/museum.htm?mid=76.

- Dan

[Gator]

Taz wrote,

Forgot to add, watch the weight restrictions on internal flights. They can really get you on overweight luggage fees. I spent more once on overweight luggage than my ticket price!

This is sadly true.  I balked and complained when the agent told me the excess luggage fee.  It got me nowhere.  Then he would not accept a credit card.   

:brightidea: 

So I demanded a receipt when handing over the cash, but keeping a tight grip.  Surprise, he lowered the fee to 50% if I did not require a receipt!

Wonder how much of the excess baggage money reaches the airline's coffers.  It ain't the West.

[Taz]

The AN-24 was first in service from the early 60's. God only knows how many hours are on the airframes. I can tell you the ones I've flown on were high time specimens. Aluminum doesn't live forever and given their shoddy maintenance, I'll pass on flying them. My undergrad degree is in Aeronautical Engineering so I tend to be a little particular about aircraft. I have a great amount of respect for a lot of what the Soviet aircraft makes have built at times I also know how often they've cut corners as well.

There seems to a AN-24 go down every year or sometimes twice a year. Typically everyone dies on it. It isn't easy to tell if it is just pilot error, hardware failure or what from some of the databases. When I first flew on them in the 70's I hated them and they were pretty new then by comparison to now. I've seen pilots drinking on the flight and a lot of other things I wouldn't want to see in general.

Anyway definitely watch your hand luggage weight. An additional not on this, some airlines exempt the weight of your notebook and its accessories. For example I know Siberian Airlines (code S7) does for sure. I always keep a copy of the rules in Russian to show the gate agent when they try to shaft me. It's saved me a lot of money over the years.

[wxman]

That is correct about travelling to Lugansk from KBP. They use to fly out of the other airport, but a few years ago they switched it to KBP. Sounds like those old prop planes are soon to be history. This is a link that I posted in another thread.

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2008/02/13/221514/soviet-built-fleet-under-threat-in-ukraine-following-decree.html