TASHKENT UZBEKISTAN

[BillyB]

I recently came back from Tashkent, Uzbekistan. This was the trip I was supposed to bring Natalia home with me to America on a k-1 fiancee visa but unfortunately she's not coming.

Things didn't go well at her interview last month and she did not get a visa based on a ridiculous reason. When I heard the news from a sobbing Natalia on the phone, I was shocked and angered. Being angry will not solve the problem as I remember one poster here, Neo, who got verbally abusive with the British embassy when they refused his fiancee a visa after they accused her of being a prostitute. The end result was they both had to move to France to be together.

I called and wrote the embassy to let them know I wasn't happy with the decision in a polite way and asked them to reconsider. I spent 4 hours thinking and crafting a letter to make an impact and send to my Congressman, two Senators including Maria Cantwell who was the driving force behind IMBRA, the Vice Prez and the Prez. The letter was designed to get a response by getting to the point and without putting too much emotion in it but enough to show Natalia is very important to me. I got a response from my Congressman's office within a day and have been in regular contact with one of his assistants. There is a possibility that other political figures have taken action but as stated at their websites, they may take action without ever responding back. In my letter I also stated I've served my country on a regular basis as I'm a registered voter, joined the military during the first Gulf War and served on jury duty when called upon. I think this stuff helps as they DO check to see if you're who you say you are. On another note, I did serve on jury duty in January and there was an FSU connection in the jury I was in with one woman being from Ukraine who is now a citizen and an American man who had adopted two Russian children.

In some ways, I wish I was dealing with a FSU government where a bribe or political muscle can make this kind of problem go away. This issue has to be taken care of through the proper channels and done legally by the book. Fortunately for me there are ways of getting around the Consulate's decision. I hired an immigration attorney and I specifically chose a RW out of Bellevue, Washington who studied both in Vladivostok, Russia and America. Because of the ongoing situation and my reluctance to piss the Consulate off, I will not get into the details of why Natalia was refused a visa but I will say she was not accused of the same thing Neo's wife was.

When in Tashkent I visited the Consulate without an appointment. They were courtious and polite and I had a pleasant conversation with them. They even KNEW who I was when they saw my passport so I must have made some good noise with my attorney and Congressman's office writing them. The lady from the Consulate that I spoke to seem willing to help and regretted the decision but what is done is done and they can't reverse their decision. While waiting to speak to someone at the Consulate, I noticed Uzbek citizens waiting on one side of the room with expressions of uncertainty as they await for their interviews on the BIG day. That side of the room was packed while I sat on the other side reserved for American citizens with five empty rows of seating since I was the only citizen there.

Other than the normal crap that happens in the FSU, things are great between Natalia and I. For a moment she thought this was the end and even offered to return all I've given her in the three years we've known each other. Of course I told her it ain't over yet. She's a good woman and I believe she would've done it if I asked for it all back but I chose her instead along with another long wait....

[Shadow]

Billy, sorry to see that there has been another bump in the road. I hope that you will be able to clear it in the future and start living together full-time.

[KenC]

Billy,
I am sincerely sorry for your troubles with this.
KenC

[I/O]

Billy

Hang in there dude, this can be the most unfun thing to do at times. Patience is the only key.

I/O

[myrddin]

BillyB,
I am very sorry to hear about this.  I know you'll get through it, hopefully soon!

[Gator]

Billy,

It goes without saying, but you have my sympathy.  You have always impressed me as a man who is determined, optimistic, and produces results.  You will prevail.

This is just another bump in the road, and you have already leveled a number of them.  Do you need a D9 or D10 to level this bump?

[Turboguy]

Billy, I am really sorry to hear about this. Having gone through difficulties with both K-1's I can relate. From what you have said this was a denial not a 221-G. Don't give up. You will work it out.

[boatguy]

Billy,

I am really sorry to hear about this as well. Hope things will work out soon for you.

Bill

[viking]

Billy

You are one of the good guys. I am sorry to hear this. But hang in there. I wish you the best.

[jj]

Billy B-   I know how discouraged you must be.  I had to finally hire a lawyer in Moscow to get us out of administrative review on the K1 and now a lawyer in case I need one for AOS and it looks like I might if I have to wait much more.  It seems like they can take straight forward cases and make it complicated for taxpaying honest citizens who just want to have happiness and have nothing to hide nor a threat to the country.   Hang in there, and keep all  your avenues open.  You seem like a nice guy who deserves more than the run around. =jj

[KenC]

Billy,
I can appreciate that you do not want to go into the specifics of this latest delay, but it seems like you have been in this stage of the process forever.  Hasn't it been something like 3 years?  Why has it taken so long to finally get an interview?
KenC

[AnastassiaAsh]

Wow, BillyB, I am so sorry! Hold on there, please. This visa thing hurts both AM and RW.
I wonder really why they denied her visa? It is very strange if she provided all the proof of the relationship... Can you reapply? I wonder if it will be ok to marry there at her hometown and go marriage visa route?   

[Simoni]

Billy~ I'm sorry you guys have had to experience this, and that your being together has been delayed even more.  All good wishes to it being resolved soon...

~Simoni

[Jazzyclassy]

Oi Billie how I understand you and your fiancee , I was refused two times myself but for UK visitor visa not US fiancee one , but it does not matter it is the same feeling of humiliation the feeling when they bring you down , not knowing you , they refuse you just cos they have such policy and order to do that. It was horrible times for me when they refused me with UK visitor visa to visit my fiancee now husband for his Graduation ,cos it was so important for him and I wanted to be there to support him.
Sometimes you just get there and meet bad luck,  and the entry clearance officer is in the bad mood and moreover if that's a woman, beware for sure

But I am sure Billie you will get there and how I/O told patience is the key , you will cope and get that Visa

I remember how she(entry clearance officer) was explaining why she refused me , told :" you have not got strong bounds to russian , your income is low, you are a student and might want to study in a local UK school "ahhaha yeah sure when I was 22-23 yeah )) I think I already told that

The thing is though be strong, I know how difficult it is now for both of you , but it will make you closer and will give you hope that things gonna change for the better!

[BillyB]

Do you need a D9 or D10 to level this bump?

The biggest dozer I've got is a D8. I hope that'll do.

Thanks guys but there is hope. My attorney told me people have gotten things reversed and their visas over much worse things than why Natalia got rejected. Although Natalia didn't get a complete interview and they didn't even look at out photos/evidence of a relationship, the person I talked to at the Consulate also told me they will issue the visa right away to Natalia once we send them the proper paperwork issued from the proper organization in the States. They were friendly and eager to work with me and I want to keep it that way.

Ken, It's been almost 3 years since I wrote my first letter to Natalia. We decided to get the ball rolling after a year and a half of knowing each other and 4 visits but then she got hospitalized which delayed things and then came a long wait with the K-1 process during a time USCIS reorganized.

Anastassia, I thought about getting married which would make it more difficult for the Consulate to deny a US citizen his wife but that would cancel the current k-1 visa and I'd have to start all over which most likely would create a longer wait than the current path I'm taking.

Jazzy, sorry to hear about your troubles with getting a visa. Just looking at the faces of the people waiting for their interview and hoping to get a visa to America, I could see uncertainty and nervousness. Basically those people are at the mercy of an interviewer who has control over the direction their life is going. To be rejected must be extremely depressing.

Here's a pic of Natalia sitting next to me but I cut myself out and you won't see another pic of me in this trip report. My face was swollen and I had bags under my eyes. From the time I stepped into the Seattle-Tacoma airport and stepped out of the airport in Tashkent, over 30 hours have passed. Then with a 13 hour time zone difference, I didn't know when to sleep or stay awake and of course I had a lot on my mind. With about 5 hours of total sleep in my first three days there, I was burned out. I still don't know when to sleep as I'm back home writing this post after 2AM in the morning. I'm also wondering how Natalia can smile so much when sitting next to such an ugly guy. I know how important it is for some of you to see my photos instead of RW  so you'll have to see me in better days. Click on a couple of my older trip reports here. 

http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=5066.0

http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=1303.0

[bobcat]

Billy,
Chin up and you will be given your just rewards soon. I sincerely feel for you, as a married man I know all that is required to get your love to you. More patience and your life will soon change for the better.
Take care
Tony

[vwrw]

This is sounding exactly like a 221-G which is what happened to me on my first fiancee.   The bright side if it is would be that most all 221-G's eventually turn into approvals.  It is a scary thing when you get that blue slip instead of the visa after all those months of worry and waiting.   Keep your chin up and get them what they need and we are all hoping for a successful end to your quest.

(This is by Turboguy.  I did not notice the laptop was logged in with VWRW's account.  Sorry.)

[KenC]

The biggest dozer I've got is a D8. I hope that'll do.

Thanks guys but there is hope. My attorney told me people have gotten things reversed and their visas over much worse things than why Natalia got rejected. Although Natalia didn't get a complete interview and they didn't even look at out photos/evidence of a relationship, the person I talked to at the Consulate also told me they will issue the visa right away to Natalia once we send them the proper paperwork issued from the proper organization in the States. They were friendly and eager to work with me and I want to keep it that way.

Ken, It's been almost 3 years since I wrote my first letter to Natalia. We decided to get the ball rolling after a year and a half of knowing each other and 4 visits but then she got hospitalized which delayed things and then came a long wait with the K-1 process during a time USCIS reorganized.

Billy,
I just wanted to share my thoughts with you.  I think it is a crying shame that a guy like you, that took his time to establish a true relationship prior to being engaged, could suffer this grief.  With all the Yahoo's applying and receiving K-1's for women they hardly even know, it is just a terrible injustice that your's was denied.  Sometimes there is no justice at all.

Do you have any estimated time frame for the review?  What does you attorny think?  Was there anything you could have done to avoid this?

I also commend you for your composure at the Embassy. I  know I would not have been able to handle it that well.  And Natalia is as beautiful as ever.  I sincerely hope that your wait is almost over.  Best of luck to you.
KenC

[BillyB]

Thanks guys for the comments. If there's anything good that comes from this, it's our bond for each other that has become stronger. Natalia hasn't said anything but I suspect she respects me more than ever on how I handle a crisis and the fact I didn't meltdown or abandon her.

Do you have any estimated time frame for the review?  What does you attorny think?  Was there anything you could have done to avoid this?

My attorney and the embassy doesn't know the estimated time to get things done as they both don't have much experience pertaining to the particular waiver I need to obtain but my attorney believes it's quicker than doing a k-3 and unlike a k-3, it is guaranteed to get Natalia a visa once the waiver is granted. There's nothing I could have done to avoid this. All my and Natalia's documents were in order.

A few days ago, Natalia was in her first automobile accident. At first I did not understand her as she told me on the phone that "2 machines broke and my head hurts." What she meant was two vehicles crashed into each other and her head got injured. The passenger van she was in was hit by another and her head received a lump after it contacted the wall of the van. It was a minor injury and 3 other passengers were hurt.

Natalia has a cute niece named Alina who is about 3 1/2 years old. She has quite a personality and is happy, positive and full of life. She has yet to notice the hardships of life in Uzbekistan. When I visited her parents home, she knew I was different because I spoke a different language and looked at me suspect but she warmed up to me as I brought her a toy and a doll.

As we were drinking tea Alina's mom, Ira, brought out a children's book that teaches Uzbek, Russian and the English language. Ira points out the animals in the picture and Alina responds with the Russian name of the animal. When Alina spoke the Russian word for "lion", I followed with the English word for "lion". Alina slowly lifted her eyes off the book and look at me and firmly said the Russian word for "lion" as she intended to teach me the correct name of the animal. We went back and forth over the name of the lion 5 times before I agreed with her by repeating what she said. This scenario went on through various animals with me finally having to agree with her.  Some animal names are similar in both languages but the way it's pronounced is different and it didn't make a difference for Alina who knows everything! When we came to the monkey, things changed. After the first time of me saying the English word for monkey, she gets off the chair and walks past me murmuring something that was translated to "I'll show you". She marches in and then out of her room with a stuff animal monkey and stops 10 feet away from me, holds it up and loudly says the Russian word for monkey in an attempt to "show me". I then repeat the English word for monkey. Alina holds up her fist and says(translated) "Do you want to fight?" You can't win against RW so I said the Russian word for monkey in agreement to end the debate.

Later, Alina was showing off running around the playing and fell. Her leg hurt and she started crying and went to her mom. Her mom kissed her leg and she was happy again. Alina immediately ran and pretended to fall again. She smiled and said she was hurt so her mom kissed her leg again. Alina ran again, fell again, smiled again and said she was hurt. Natalia asked her to come to her and get a kiss in which Alina was happy to do. Alina ran and fell again, smiled again looking for a kiss between Natalia and her mom. Natalia said "go to Billy and he will Kiss your leg to make your hurt go away". Alina stopped smiling and then turned to look at me and said(translated) "I'm not hurt anymore". The game ended there.

Alina named the doll I gave her after her auntie Natalia. I asked her if I could hold Natalia and she gave me the doll. I hugged the doll and said "I want to take Natalia home with me, bye bye". Although Alina doesn't speak English, she knew my intentions and started crying. I offered the doll back and she ripped it out of my hands and bear hugged the doll as if she's never letting go again.

The visit ended on a good note though with I and Alina. Alina's mom asked her to give me a good bye kiss we I was leaving their apartment and Alina came over to me, lifted her head, closed her eyes and puckered up. I kneeled down and offered my cheek.

Alina is half Russian but she looks about 80% Russian. I'd post a pic but she's not my child to do so. I'll post a pic of my own son instead. He's half Ukrainian, 25% American and 25% Vietnamese but he doesn't look Asian a bit. I also have visitation rights with another son who is 100% Ukrainian.

[Jet]

Our thoughts are with you and Natalia. Hopefully you get the required paperwork and that it ends your "limobo" status SOON! As KenC said, it's really frustrating to see the people who try to actually do things the right way get $h!t on, while so many idiots and lawbreakers just sail on through  :burnedup:

Good Luck to both of you...

[Mishenka]

Hey Billy, Best of luck to you and Natalia on this. 

When I asked Galina how she got my visa "good for 1 year" and how she managed to get them to allow me to stay 3 months,  she told me "thats what you asked for so I got it". OK, so if I had asked for a multiple entry visa, you could have gotten that too? she said, yes, but you only asked for single entry.  She now tells me she could have gotten me a 3 year visa with multiple entries. When I told her that it can take two months to get a Russian visa, how did she get the Uzbek visa in my hands in 7 days?  Her answer was she has contacts in the local city Gov and in the Uzbek Embassy who both owe her favors.   I asked, please tell me how you did this? No one gets this kind of visa, and not in 7 days time with only paying the minimum fee. Which is now $130.00 Just went up on March 8th. You can expect all your visa costs to increase now.  Her answer was she brought the woman in the city who did the invitation some jewelery from Avon, there she got the invitation number. She took this to the man at the Embassy to process Uzbek visa #. For the man at Uzbek Embassy she brought cologne and cash. She would not say how much$$. The bottom line is, BRIBES are expected. Its the way life is there. If you expect someone to do their job for the $20 - 40 per month they earn, you are misunderstanding how things are done in Tashkent. Galina's salary as Accountant General at the Airlines is more per month that her employees earn in 6 months or a year. School teachers are earning 20 per month, Doctors even less. So,, her way of getting things done is pay for it in some way or another. She said my invitation and visa numbers were approved the week she applied, the 7 days time was what it took to mail it. She did her part, all I had to do was write a money order for the payment and send it next day delivery to NYC Embassy. She took a whole day out of her life to process a visa for me. She also made my flight reservation for me but I couldn't let her do that too, so I canceled it an got my own.

All I'm trying to say is, this is the way things are done there. She knows how the system works.  She tells me if we get married in the Orthodox Church in Tashkent before her coming to USA. It makes it easier for me to come there on a spouse visa and for her to come here. Galina already has her Uzbek exit visa. She also just renewed her passport.

I will do a trip report starting March 21. My flight is only 19 hours this time, I hope I can survive it. Ive only flown once since I got out of the hospital.  I only have 3 hours between flights in Moscow all in the same international terminal, all same airline, but customs can take 3 hours by itself.  The thing that scares me to death is the average pilot fling those planes are earning $200 per flight. They are shutting down the cargo division of Tashkent airport because of lack of business.  Her Brother Aleksey will loose his job as a pilot soon.  They are shipping by rail and truck mostly. Jet fuel is too es pensive to be cost effective. Many lay offs this month at Uzbek Airways. wages are down and consumer prices are up on everything. People are leaving in large numbers. Galina has already sold her house and car, now its a matter of time till she looses her job and is ready to leave. She will keep her flat she owns for a place for us to stay when we visit. 

Best wishes, and as I said before, let us know if she can help. Galina has a special way about her.

Mishenka

[Voyageur]

BillyB,

Best of luck to you also. I guess the good news is that the elected "public servants" have had some impact in trying to reverse things over there. 

[Serebro]

Oh, Billy, I am very sorry to hear about your situation.
I hope that it will change very soon:)

[BillyB]

Jet. thanks

Mishenka, I wish a little avon would do the trick but what I need to do has to happen in the States, not Uzbekistan. I'll be looking forward to your trip report.

Serebro, something about my situation has change and for the better and that is Natalia has a greater admiration for me. I thought it couldn't get any better!

Voyageur, I'm not sure politicians have helped me a lot because the help I want yields instant results! The process I'm going through has to be done regardless without help from them anyway. But I'm going to keep rubbing elbows with them just in case I do need their persuasive powers in the future. Last weekend I was invited to a town hall meeting with my Congressman Adam Smith and got to meet him. Photo below.

Back to the trip report.

Traded emails addresses and I made a new friend on my flight from Frankfurt to Tashkent. He doesn't care to search for a RW but every five minutes he kept telling me I'm a lucky guy after looking at photos of Natalia and I. He's an attorney who runs a business in Uzbekistan making electrical wire and re bar. He was going there to meet the President and high level officials and lobby. I asked him how much is this going to cost. He said nothing. He just wants to be seen with them. If he gave them money and there's a regime change that's hostile to the current government, he will be out of business. His company is getting successful and before someone butts in and harasses him, he wants to make some powerful friends.

I met a couple of people who knew Tashkent and Seattle were sister cities. One was my apartment manager who was actually chosen to be part of a group on a visit to Seattle. He drove me all around town one day to help me take care of business and invited me to his apartment for tea. He didn't charge me a dime for this but I gave his grandson, Anton in his early 20's, $20 anyway which is damn good money. His wife happened to be wearing an old Seattle Seahawks(football) t-shirt. He and his wife are 72 years old and have been married 50 years. Anton's dad use to be the apartment manager when I was there last but his dad and mom moved to Irkutsk Russia to work. The four times I've been in Tashkent, Anton's dad and grandfather were eager for Anton to socialize with me to gain life experience. Anton plans on moving to Moscow to work and thinks he'll be happy living a better life but I told him "even in America rich people can be unhappy." I also told him "You just need to surround yourself with good people and you'll live a more enjoyable life."

Here's their site to rent an apartment:
http://www.apartment.sk.uz/

I told Anton I notice a lot of demolition going on and new construction. Anton tells me that big construction companies get permission by bribe from high level officials to acquire land and force people to move even if they didn't want to leave their homes. They may have a week to find another home and move their personal items out. If they don't move out, an excavator will remove the roof exposing the one to the elements and making it easy for people to steal their stuff.

Money is scare around here. Anton says if potatoes cost 500 sums(about 40 cents) at one bazaar and 450 sums at another across town, many people will travel across town to save pennies. The bazaars in Uzbekistan is quite an experience. It's a huge market with just about everything in there such as fresh unrefrigerated meats, bread, spices, vegetables, fruits, clothing, rugs, etc... Each merchant usually specializes in one or few products. It's not unusual to see someone just selling tomatoes and nothing else. The whole bazaar is quite an operation and people must get up early in the morning to make bread and haul their products to the bazaar to sell.

I heard about the fake American products sold in countries like Uzbekistan. I bought Head and Shoulders shampoo in Tashkent. It was nothing like what is sold in the USA. It was watered down and runnier than the cheapest shampoo here and had a different texture.

I snore and Natalia is a light sleeper. I found the solution. This trip I brought soft foam ear plugs. It's my job every night to insert them into Natalia's ears. She thinks they're the neatest things. The first night I asked if she could hear me and she said "what?" I repeated the question and she said the same answer. I smiled because she was having fun with me because she could hear me since the ear plugs reduce sound by just over 20 decibels, not eliminate sound completely.

Congressman Adam Smith and I last weekend.

[myrddin]

Mishenka, I wish a little avon would do the trick but what I need to do has to happen in the States, not Uzbekistan. I'll be looking forward to your trip report.

BillyB aludes to something that probably can't be stated enough: do NOT try to bribe officials in the US.

Voyageur, I'm not sure politicians have helped me a lot because the help I want yields instant results! The process I'm going through has to be done regardless without help from them anyway. But I'm going to keep rubbing elbows with them just in case I do need their persuasive powers in the future. Last weekend I was invited to a town hall meeting with my Congressman Adam Smith and got to meet him. Photo below.

It can't hurt to have politically placed friends, just be sure to avoid the apearance of impropriety. Especially if you bid on government contracts or somesuch.

We're all hoping you get those results soon!

I snore and Natalia is a light sleeper. I found the solution. This trip I brought soft foam ear plugs. It's my job every night to insert them into Natalia's ears. She thinks they're the neatest things. The first night I asked if she could hear me and she said "what?" I repeated the question and she said the same answer. I smiled because she was having fun with me because she could hear me since the ear plugs reduce sound by just over 20 decibels, not eliminate sound completely.

Sounds like you've taken care of this, but anyway: breathe-right strips can help reduce snoring and have the additional health advantage of improving your breathing overnight.

Back to the trip report.

Thanks for sharing, and keep it coming!